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Arrrggg...thought I knew what we wanted

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lonebrave

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Messages
18
Ok, I''ll make every attempt to keep this from just being me rambling on. First, wow, so much information around here and so much I don''t know.

So by gf and I started looking at rings and diamonds about 6 weeks ago. We went to about 10 different jewelry stores, from family-owned, one location to nation-wide, well recognized names. A couple had very helpful sales people. A few were pushy...trying to tell us they had a perfect ring without even talking to us about what we liked. A few acted like we weren''t good enough for their store. So we found the "perfect" ring at one of these nation-wide chains. It was one of their "standard" 3 stone rings, but the stones weren''t the quality we thought we wanted.

My original thought on budget was 3500-6000 range. I really had no clue. I still am not sure what my final budget will be. It depends on what kind of deal I can get.

So I went to a few of the store we looked at plus a couple others, since I knew what we wanted. Anyway, to get to the point, we thought we wanted:
~.60 VS2/SI1 F/G GIA Ex with ~.50 tcw similar quality side stones in a 3 stone basket setting with a single prong on the outside of the side stones, white gold or platinum

One of the stores I stopped in today, which we hadn''t been to before, was a HoF dealer. We hadn''t seen HoF before, nor had anyone mentioned H&A to us at all. That jeweler (as well as my favorite from another store) strongly suggested we go with a standard basket setting versus the single prong on the outside for safety/security of the stones.

So now I''m trying to learn about all the H&A stuff (I''ve been staring at this site for about 6 hours already tonight), but I have a couple questions based on what the HoF dealer said.

A HoF stone at H, for instance, will look the same as a non-HoF at F.
A HoF stone at SI2, for instance, will look the same as a non-HoF at VS2.
HoF are graded on all 58 facets, as opposed to only 17 facets for all other stones.
HoF are cut under 100x magnification versus 10x for other stones.

How true are all of these statements? I''ve seen posts indicating that the first two may hold some truth due to the level of perfection in the cut, but is it really 2 levels of color and clarity?
What about the last two points?

Anyway, we''ll be going back to look at some loose stones and ask about H&A and AGS gradings and stuff after we get a better understanding of it from around here.
 

plg_cp

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 15, 2005
Messages
88
The first 2 statements (regarding color and clarity) could be reworded as follows:

An ideal cut and/or GIA/AGS at H, for instance, will look the same as a non-ideal cut and/or EGL/IGI at F.
An ideal cut and/or GIA/AGS at SI2, for instance, will look the same as a non-ideal cut and/or EGL/IGI at VS2.

i.e. the dealer may have been referring to the fact that most chain stores, etc. provide EGL or IGI or similar reports, if they provide one at all. These reports will be softer on color and clarity grading than GIA and AGS. This also means that they''ll be priced according to the falsely inflated grades. Also, HoF or not, an ideal cut stone can face up with less color than a more poorly cut stone.

HoF will carry a premium for the brand, but some here feel it''s worth it.

Mark
 

JulieN

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jul 25, 2005
Messages
13,321
Sure, an F might look like an H face up if cut to the wrong proportions. HOF doesn't have exclusive rights to those proportions.

An SI2 look the same as VS2? Sparkle can mask inclusions, but you will not always be in a lighting environment that shows off sparkle at its best.

What you want is very possible in your budget.
 

Regular Guy

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jul 6, 2004
Messages
5,951
For a couple of options, see this one from GOG, and this one from WF. I know the rings better at WF, so will point you to this one as an option.

There's advantages to shopping locally, vs on line, with price & quality more readily following on line, and with see, touch & service comforts following local, among others.

BTW, I don't know that the options from GOG & WF are identical in quality to HoF, but many others who write here are comfortable with knowing this, as you can read here in past threads.

And...while I'm at it, since shopping on line could allow you to modify requirements consistent with your budget, although I like your color and clarity preferences, your obvious variable could be size. Here's one you could think about, consequently. A tool like the search by cut db is an easy one to experiment with for other options.

Also see below my signature for shopping suggestions.

Welcome to Pricescope, and good wishes!
 

lonebrave

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Messages
18
Wow, I didn''t expect such a quick response as Mark and Julie. Thanks to everyone for the info so far. Thanks to Ira for the links.

I''ve spent a good portion of last night and today reading through the Tutorial, trying to absorb as much information as possible. I''m learning, that is for sure, but I think it probably best to post my thoughts and questions to a different thread as they''re more general at this point.
 

Paul-Antwerp

Ideal_Rock
Trade
Joined
Sep 2, 2002
Messages
2,831
Date: 12/11/2006 12:49:59 AM
Author:lonebrave

So now I''m trying to learn about all the H&A stuff (I''ve been staring at this site for about 6 hours already tonight), but I have a couple questions based on what the HoF dealer said.

HoF are graded on all 58 facets, as opposed to only 17 facets for all other stones.
If grading here is refering to the grade on cut, it was such that all labs would grade the cut of diamonds (whether this brand or any other), based upon the averages of the main 17 facets, up to the beginning of 2005.

In 2005, AGS launched its new cut-grade, and all stones receiving such a grading-report are graded upon a full 3D-scan of the complete stone. This is not different for any brand, so no exclusivity.

And beginning 2006, GIA launched its cut-grade, and they grade all facets, albeit with averages and rounding.

Result: False statement.


Date: 12/11/2006 12:49:59 AM
Author:lonebrave
HoF are cut under 100x magnification versus 10x for other stones.
Diamonds are not cut under magnification. And if they were, would it alter the cutting process? After cutting, they are checked and then it depends whether one uses a loupe (10x or 14x or 18x) or a microscope (100x or more). There is definitely no exclusivity to using a microscope.

Result: False statement.

Live long,
 

lonebrave

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Messages
18
Date: 12/12/2006 6:31:53 AM
Author: Paul-Antwerp
Date: 12/11/2006 12:49:59 AM
Author:lonebrave
So now I''m trying to learn about all the H&A stuff (I''ve been staring at this site for about 6 hours already tonight), but I have a couple questions based on what the HoF dealer said.

HoF are graded on all 58 facets, as opposed to only 17 facets for all other stones.
If grading here is refering to the grade on cut, it was such that all labs would grade the cut of diamonds (whether this brand or any other), based upon the averages of the main 17 facets, up to the beginning of 2005.

In 2005, AGS launched its new cut-grade, and all stones receiving such a grading-report are graded upon a full 3D-scan of the complete stone. This is not different for any brand, so no exclusivity.

And beginning 2006, GIA launched its cut-grade, and they grade all facets, albeit with averages and rounding.

Result: False statement.
Thanks for the info. That is good to know that AGS and GIA are using all facets to grade the cut!


Date: 12/12/2006 6:31:53 AM
Author: Paul-Antwerp
Date: 12/11/2006 12:49:59 AM
Author:lonebrave
HoF are cut under 100x magnification versus 10x for other stones.
Diamonds are not cut under magnification. And if they were, would it alter the cutting process? After cutting, they are checked and then it depends whether one uses a loupe (10x or 14x or 18x) or a microscope (100x or more). There is definitely no exclusivity to using a microscope.

Result: False statement.

Live long,
Again, good info to know.

Thanks everyone! It is much appreciated!
 
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