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Any game of thrones fans here?

whitewave

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Arya seemed very much over death and I kind don’t think she will kill Dany (someone else will). I hope she goes to storm’s end, but I suspect she will be a recluse for a while.
 

carbonfan

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But the biggest death by far has been the quality of writing. The cinematography and music have been superb, faultless, but the character storylines have just collapsed into insipid heaps of disappointment.
I couldn't agree more. The first five or six seasons were absolutely incredible, and this season (and to some extent the last one) have really suffered. I didn't mind the first few episodes this season, but I thought last night's episode was practically a sacrilege... it is difficult to watch all of the intricately woven storylines and character development that were invested over the years dissolve into thin dialogue and meaningless plot twists, not to mention straight up gratuitous violence. Honestly, my husband and I agreed that the only thing that could redeem this season at this point would be if the final episode revealed that everything that just transpired was all a crazy dream sequence (likely Dany's), and the reality would be Jaime offing Cersei (Tyrion or Arya offing Cersei would have been poetic justice as well) and returning to Brienne, the innocent civilians being spared, and while we're at it maybe we could go back in time and spare Missandei and Ser Jorah as well. And of course Arya and Gendry could live happily ever after. But of course that is not going to happen. Up until this season it really has been a fun ride, and I am sorry to see a show of this caliber end this way. Although it really feels like the writers have been phoning it in over the last few episodes (dialogue? what dialogue?) I am nevertheless curious to see how they wrap things up next week!!
 

JPie

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It won’t be easy to take Dany down considering how much damage just one dragon can do. It’d be great if Bran helps out by warging into it.
 

canuk-gal

Super_Ideal_Rock
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HI:

deus ex machina

cheers--Sharon
 

telephone89

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@carbonfan I sooo agree with you. I'll be honest, the first season I was not into the show. It was slow, overly detailed, and so intricate. I pushed through, and then got hooked. The first few seasons were so meticulous and detailed, and now they are rushing to finish it off.

I'm not sure why they (the show) took such a short season, but it's impossible to wrap up ALL the story lines properly within 6 episodes. They easily could have taken another season, or AT LEAST a few more episodes (you KNOW HBO would have given them at least 10!), but for whatever reason, they are choosing to rush through it just to wrap it up. So many threads left hanging. So much of the previous seasons feel so pointless now.
 

voce

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Also, GRRM is an executive producer of the show. Can't put all the blame on the others when he is right there in the thick of it :rolleyes:
I didn't like this episode at all. 4 and 5 are about the same for me. GRRM is AN executive producer, not the only one, and I remember back in 2017 he was arguing with Benioff and Weiss, but B&W talked him into letting them do the ending they want.
 

cmd2014

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I have heard that the show producers asked HBO to shorten the season because they really want to end the show and focus instead on the prequel. The one that doesn't matter anymore because they managed to mangle and ignore all of the legends, prophesies, and historical mysteries that made the show (and the books) so interesting.

This episode was an atrocity. So we've gone from the scorpions being a deadly threat to the dragons (poor Rhaegal) to nothing touching Drogon in the half dozen times (at least) he was well within range. They killed pretty much everyone in the most ignoble way possible (seriously, the battle of the Cleganes was so painfully bad I fast forwarded through it - despite waiting years for it to happen, the fight between Jamie and Euron was just stupid and totally out of place, and the Jamie/Cersei storyline was just bad writing and wasted so much opportunity for Jamie's redemption arc not to mention fulfilling the Valonqar prophecy that made her hate Tyrion all these years). Then the random horse in the middle of the turned to ash street just so Arya can - what? - go try to kill Daenerys I would assume. Plus, I have no idea why Tyrion ratted out Varys, except possibly so that we could show her burning him the way she promised to (seriously, Tyrion had absolutely no reason to tattle on his friend - it's clear at this point that he pointedly does NOT still believe in Dany, that he is afraid of her, and that Jon would make a better ruler with the better claim to the throne). GRR Martin has been making efforts to avoid interviews, because despite being an Executive Producer, he has repeatedly said in the past that he has such little power anymore over the show that they could put aliens in it and he couldn't stop them. This may very well be the ending he imagined (Daenerys going mad-Queen on everyone) - but he would make it so that there was so very much intrigue, weaving of various interests and influences, and subtle character development that it would make sense. Not just a "screw it, we need to finish this show....the dragon's cool - let's make it wipe everyone out." Gah! I want my 8 years of watching this show back.
 

chemgirl

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I think I’m the only one out there who liked Jaime going back to Circe. Not because I thought it was a good idea on his part, but because it’s believable. It’s a toxic, but addictive relationship. Don’t we all have that friend who’s on the relationship roller coaster? You think they’re finally out, they’re with a new person who is perfectly nice, but then the next thing you know they’re posting photos with the crazy ex? You’re like “What? he spent all of your money on drugs and you’re back with that loser? Are you forgetting all of the drama? You belong together? Ok then.”

It’s probably just me.
 

partgypsy

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I am disappointed in this ending. I know that GRRM is very much anti-war (he was a vietnam war protestor) but at the same time, to say it doesn't matter who is on the throne, everyone is bad, simply goes against his own history of the 7 kingdoms. There have been good rulers, and bad rulers. Why now throw that all under the bus as if to say none of this mattered?
Also, it does strike me as a sexist (even if unintentional). My oldest daughter (16) she hasn't been watching but I've been talking to her about the series, when I told her about the latest twist, points out that throughout history whenever a woman is in power she is maligned that she is crazy or otherwise unfit to rule. So, they did the exact same undermining to their heroine. Almost as if they can't help themselves.
My main disagreement is that it just doesn't make sense. The idea is that Cersei by defying her and killing her companion make her basically psychotically break. But instead of losing it and flying straight towards the Redkeep, which wasn't even protected by a single scorpion or anything to get to Cersei and punish her for what she does, flies around apparently for hours torching her now subjects. she never did anything remotely similar to that, and had a huge soft spot for the downtrodden and the innocent, even when her advisors said it wasn't militarily or diplomatically strategic.
Motivation wise it doesn't make any sense.
 

LAJennifer

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I thought it was perfect!
 

Matthews1127

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I thought it was perfect!
Jon kills Dany. Dany is swept away by Drogon. There’s no reunion between Dany & Khal Drogo or her son, in the afterlife. What did the old witch say?? When she crosses over into the afterlife, only then will she see him, again. That was one of the most dramatic, beautifully moving, and CRITICAL moments in the entire series!! Who else was waiting for the return of Khal Drogo, when Khaleesi fell???

Where was Jon going, once the gate to Castle Black fell??? To join the Free Folk? Was that the plan, all along? Bran would know; he’s the 3 eyed raven. Did he send Jon back to the wall, only to free him??

There are so many questions left unanswered. There were so many missed opportunities to tie the rest of the series into the finale & COMPLETE it.
I’m so damn disappointed.:nono:
 

Octo2005

Brilliant_Rock
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Jon kills Dany. Dany is swept away by Drogon. There’s no reunion between Dany & Khal Drogo or her son, in the afterlife. What did the old witch say?? When she crosses over into the afterlife, only then will she see him, again. That was one of the most dramatic, beautifully moving, and CRITICAL moments in the entire series!! Who else was waiting for the return of Khal Drogo, when Khaleesi fell??? YESSSS!!!!

Where was Jon going, once the gate to Castle Black fell??? To join the Free Folk? Was that the plan, all along? Bran would know; he’s the 3 eyed raven. Did he send Jon back to the wall, only to free him??That is how I took it. I think they were setting him up as the new Mance Raider type leader of the free folk

There are so many questions left unanswered. There were so many missed opportunities to tie the rest of the series into the finale & COMPLETE it.
I’m so damn disappointed.:nono:
I couldn't agree more! I kept waiting for Jon to get on the dragon and ride off.

It felt like a completely different show. This is game of thrones, there is no "riding off into the sunset" ending! It all felt like set-up for spinoffs.
 

redwood66

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Well I am not sure how I feel about it, though it was a bit of a let down. Jon killing Dany was not a surprise but Bran becoming king sure was. What kind of nepotism is it to let the North be its own kingdom with Sansa as queen? I was glad to see Bron back. But the scene in the dragon pit felt like a curtain call with no wrapping up for the characters. :confused:
 

lyra

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Jul 13, 2007
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It was rushed. This season needed more episodes. It could have been done better, but I'm satisfied with the gist of it all. If this is approximately where the books will go, then great. I'll read them anyway. Yes, it would have been nice to see more of a "Six Feet Under" finale, with Dany being reunited with Drogo. That would have been a nicer end to her character. She had to go, but it was anti-climactic again.
 

autumngems

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I was surprised Dany was killed so close to the beginning, I felt maybe it would of been towards the end. Jaime and Cersei, come on, they deserved a better death than rock falling on them:(
Arya had so many near misses I couldn't keep up. The finale, let's just say it, it SUCKED!!!!!!
It left too much open, it felt like there was more to happen and we know they aren't going any further, now it's off to a prequel.
Where is the dragon? left open
Why have all that bit with the council at the end, Master of Coin and all? left open
Arya taking off to past Westeros? left open
John supposed to go to the wall, he gets there and then leaves, left open
I feel like I was watching a show and the TV went off in the middle, there was no proper finale really.
IT SUCKEDDDDDDDD
As my hubby said, new show last night: LAME of Thrones
 

carbonfan

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I have so many thoughts about this... I totally agree that this season felt rushed and to some degree forced. The writers could easily have added another handful of episodes to tie things together more artfully. To say that this season was not the best is an understatement of epic proportions...

As far as the finale, overall I was disappointed, but there were parts that I enjoyed. The scene between Jon and Dany got me only because I thought he was going to get sucked into her spell once again (I guess I was the sucker there!) and then wham! But it seemed more like the scene that should have occurred between Jaime and Cersei last week. That would have been a more fitting end for Cersei (and come on, they were buried under like 6 inches of rubble? My husband joked that if they had run in basically any direction they would have survived that!). I would have been happier with Grey Worm seeing the light and taking Dany out, just so that Jon could stay in favor and be the chosen one. Bran was the dark horse that I didn't see coming, but having him take over was my personal equivalent of eating melba toast... he was there all along, but no one particularly noticed him because he didn't really bring anything to the table, so he was a 'meh' choice (my sincerest apologies to any melba toast fans out there!). I mean, they spent many, many seasons bringing Jon's redemption arc to fruition and having him discover his true identity, and for what? So he could be exiled and Bran could take charge? Or were they just trying to select the least expected ending, because everyone was expecting it to be Jon and maybe that might have felt cliché? IDK...

There were some salvageable moments sprinkled in as well... Drogon liquifying the Iron Throne was poetic (and the prediction that no one would ever sit on the Iron Throne came true!). Also, the scene between Jon and Ghost was heartwarming, and there were other enjoyable surprises in the mix (particularly Tyrion surviving and Bronn and Sam making reappearances). And I did think it was neat that the siblings (Bran, Sansa, Arya, and Jon, although not by choice) each went to blaze their own trails in different regions. I would have loved a Garya redux, but that would probably have been the most out of character choice for Arya, even as fine as Gendry is! But that would have been fun.

So all in all, I guess they did the best they could in the absence of having the book to draw from, and in a series with such complexity there is no finale that could possibly please everyone. I know there are prequels in the works and the finale definitely left a lot of room for sequels/spinoffs, all of which I would probably watch in hopes that Benioff and Weiss could resurrect the mad writing skills they displayed in Seasons 1-5!
 

Matthews1127

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I have so many thoughts about this... I totally agree that this season felt rushed and to some degree forced. The writers could easily have added another handful of episodes to tie things together more artfully. To say that this season was not the best is an understatement of epic proportions...

As far as the finale, overall I was disappointed, but there were parts that I enjoyed. The scene between Jon and Dany got me only because I thought he was going to get sucked into her spell once again (I guess I was the sucker there!) and then wham! But it seemed more like the scene that should have occurred between Jaime and Cersei last week. That would have been a more fitting end for Cersei (and come on, they were buried under like 6 inches of rubble? My husband joked that if they had run in basically any direction they would have survived that!). I would have been happier with Grey Worm seeing the light and taking Dany out, just so that Jon could stay in favor and be the chosen one. Bran was the dark horse that I didn't see coming, but having him take over was my personal equivalent of eating melba toast... he was there all along, but no one particularly noticed him because he didn't really bring anything to the table, so he was a 'meh' choice (my sincerest apologies to any melba toast fans out there!). I mean, they spent many, many seasons bringing Jon's redemption arc to fruition and having him discover his true identity, and for what? So he could be exiled and Bran could take charge? Or were they just trying to select the least expected ending, because everyone was expecting it to be Jon and maybe that might have felt cliché? IDK...

There were some salvageable moments sprinkled in as well... Drogon liquifying the Iron Throne was poetic (and the prediction that no one would ever sit on the Iron Throne came true!). Also, the scene between Jon and Ghost was heartwarming, and there were other enjoyable surprises in the mix (particularly Tyrion surviving and Bronn and Sam making reappearances). And I did think it was neat that the siblings (Bran, Sansa, Arya, and Jon, although not by choice) each went to blaze their own trails in different regions. I would have loved a Garya redux, but that would probably have been the most out of character choice for Arya, even as fine as Gendry is! But that would have been fun.

So all in all, I guess they did the best they could in the absence of having the book to draw from, and in a series with such complexity there is no finale that could possibly please everyone. I know there are prequels in the works and the finale definitely left a lot of room for sequels/spinoffs, all of which I would probably watch in hopes that Benioff and Weiss could resurrect the mad writing skills they displayed in Seasons 1-5!
EXACTLY!!!

But....Khal Drogo & Khaleesi’s reunion moment is forever missed. There is no way of continuing, or spinning off to allow their reunion to take place. At least, not in a way that makes sense or has the same effect.
Their Union was incredible. Unexpectedly so, which is what made their marriage so beautiful. This is the ONE portion of the series that moved me, and really made them REAL. I am supremely HOT under the collar that the scene did not involve Drogo. She dreamed of seeing him and her son, again. I’m very heartbroken over it.
The rest, I can handle. I’m good with spinoffs. I’ll be looking for more.
Sam has a baby on the way. Jon is off to start a new life with the Free Folk. Arya will have more adventures (and may fall in love) in the West. Sanse will rule well, at Winterfell, and Bran will be a great King. I’m certain they can pull off a mini-series or 2 on all of that.
However, the story of Dany & Drogo has ended, with no possible way of reuniting them.
That leaves a very sour taste in my mouth.
 

Matthews1127

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This is why Khaleesi deserved a reunion with Khal Drogo:


 
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carbonfan

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EXACTLY!!!

But....Khal Drogo & Khaleesi’s reunion moment is forever missed. There is no way of continuing, or spinning off to allow their reunion to take place. At least, not in a way that makes sense or has the same effect.
Their Union was incredible. Unexpectedly so, which is what made their marriage so beautiful. This is the ONE portion of the series that moved me, and really made them REAL. I am supremely HOT under the collar that the scene did not involve Drogo. She dreamed of seeing him and her son, again. I’m very heartbroken over it.
The rest, I can handle. I’m good with spinoffs. I’ll be looking for more.
Sam has a baby on the way. Jon is off to start a new life with the Free Folk. Arya will have more adventures (and may fall in love) in the West. Sanse will rule well, at Winterfell, and Bran will be a great King. I’m certain they can pull off a mini-series or 2 on all of that.
However, the story of Dany & Drogo has ended, with no possible way of reuniting them.
That leaves a very sour taste in my mouth.
I could not agree more... I would have loved to see that as well! The Khaleesi/Khal Drogo love story evolved in a refreshingly unexpected way, and seemed so genuine. Her mourning of his death and their stillborn child was heartwrenching as well, and I wish they had portrayed some reunion in the afterlife. That really was a missed opportunity!
 

carbonfan

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I don't think she gets a happy ending in the afterlife after incinerating over a million civilians. :whistle:
This angle occurred to me as well, and yes, she probably didn't deserve a happy reunion after what she did to the civilians of Kings' Landing, but I for one wouldn't have minded just one more appearance by Jason Momoa! But then, why did they go to all of the trouble to lay the groundwork for the prophecy in the first place? That aspect just felt a bit sloppy.

Honestly, though, the singlemost confusing thing about this show has been the writers' treatment of Daenerys' character... she evolved from a relatively naive underling to a strong, empowered humanitarian heroine, only to ultimately turn to the dark side and become power-hungry and hell-bent on destruction. That was what bothered me most about last week's episode... the torching of Kings' Landing didn't need to happen. And in addition, we were groomed to love Dany throughout the history of the show, and then her character was almost irreparably tarnished last week, which was equally unnecessary. The writers kind of soured her character in the end, which was a shame, because they didn't need to go there, and once again several seasons had been invested in developing her character arc. But one thing is for sure: Emilia Clarke did a slam dunk job of portraying Daenerys! Can't wait to see what she does next!
 
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lyra

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I think it would have been a more meaningful death if Dany and Jon actually had some chemistry. There was not a lot of angst in it IMO. It was bland instead of heart wrenching. Jon didn't seem too heartbroken.
 

Octo2005

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This angle occurred to me as well, and yes, she probably didn't deserve a happy reunion after what she did to the civilians of Kings' Landing, but I for one wouldn't have minded just one more appearance by Jason Momoa! But then, why did they go to all of the trouble to lay the groundwork for the prophecy in the first place? That aspect just felt a bit sloppy.

Honestly, though, the singlemost confusing thing about this show has been the writers' treatment of Daenerys' character... she evolved from a relatively naive underling to a strong, empowered humanitarian heroine, only to ultimately turn to the dark side and become power-hungry and hell-bent on destruction. That was what bothered me most about last week's episode... the torching of Kings' Landing didn't need to happen. And in addition, we were groomed to love Dany throughout the history of the show, and then her character was almost irreparably tarnished last week, which was equally unnecessary. The writers kind of soured her character in the end, which was a shame, because they didn't need to go there, and once again several seasons had been invested in developing her character arc. But one thing is for sure: Emilia Clarke did a slam dunk job of portraying Daenerys! Can't wait to see what she does next!
Agree, but I think that she was probably always meant to go there. It just wasn't believable the way that they led up to it and jumped head first. It should have been more subtle build up over the course of many seasons with moments that give you pause as to her true nature.

I also agree I would have loved to see Jason Momoa again, but after last week I think we are to assume she did not find peace and happiness in the afterlife.
 
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