Any advice would be nice

[TJPo]

Dear people that are much more knowledgeable than me,

I'm new to the diamond shopping arena, and therefore looking for a little advice from anyone willing to help. I'm a first time diamond buyer, looking for a diamond for an engagement ring. I've done 10 or 12 hours of research about diamonds, so I have a decent baseline of information to go off of. I've also gone down the typical avenues of asking friends and family for advice and some of that has been really helpful. One of them suggested I make a post on here to see if I can get some help from people that are really knowledgeable about diamonds.

I haven't gone into any stores to look at diamonds firsthand, but plan on doing that sometime next week. I'm not sure where I'll end up buying a diamond (in person or online) but I've read a few articles that buying online can be my best bet. I live in Dallas, and I'd assume that there is a significant demand for diamonds in the area, so I was thinking I'd be able to get a comparable rate in person that I would online.

On to the Questions:
1) Does anyone have an opinion on value of buying in person at a “wholesaler” vs buying online? Like most people, I'm wary of potentially getting taken advantage of due to my lack of knowledge on the subject. It seems that online might be easier to do the research as you're buying the diamond. I would also think the markup on the Online options would be a lower.
2) I have a general idea of my parameters for what I'm looking for. Does anyone have a suggestion on a diamond that would suit my parameters below?
Cut – Round
Color – Near colorless or better
Clarity – Eye clean
Carat – I am wanting to get atleast a 1.6 carat diamond.

I’m hoping to spend around $15,000 for the diamond. If it comes down to one aspect or another, I’d say size is probably the most important thing to me.

Thanks, I appreciate any and all advice!

 

[drk14]

Have you tried the diamond search tool?

Here are three quick options to get you started:

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3508574.htm?source=pricescope
http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3488754.htm?source=pricescope
http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/1.84-carat-i-color-vs2-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-631111

All of these are cut to so-called "Hearts and Arrows" specs, which apparently carries a premium of $2k-4k in this size/color/clarity range. BTW, Whiteflash is in Houston, so you could see the first two diamonds in person if you wanted to take the drive.

Good luck!



ETA: Since you said you cared most about size, here is an SI2 60/60 stone that is 2.41 ct:

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut/2.41-carat-j-color-si2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-384245

 

[drruby]

16K is a sizable investment in common carbon (diamonds).

I guess if you consider the marketing of the cartel De Beers you probably consider the 2 months of wages is what you need to give.

That means a 16K E ring comes with a 100K a year salary of the giver, USUALLY.

That being said, the industry is run by usually 2 groups.

The mines are almost 50% controlled by De Beers.

In the USA the GIA lab is the holy grail to most on diamond lab certificates, it usually ensures the buyer of a fair approximation of the grade of the carbon, which is only an 'opinion'. But GIA's opinion is greatly respected by most even though they had a grading scandal involving the FBI in 2005 where GIA graders were caught selling 'bumps' in grades (pay for higher grades).

Have the jeweler you use to start to LOOK at stones lend you their loop so you can verify the surface carving GIA does on carbon where they put a serial number of their grading report on the waste area of stone, the girdle, where the top of the diamond (table) meets the bottom (pavilion) that is the 'girdle' and that is where you look to see that GIA and their report number matches the cert you are looking at.

Use the search on this site to look for

1.5 to 1.75 ct
D and E color
VS1 grade
Cut Excellent

There are almost 100 stones that match this search criteria

For that level of investment I would want at VS1 since the VS2 usually has near enter minor imperctions.

Do not look at SI do not go lower than G color.

You can find what you want online, but do shop locally so you can see how perfect this level of stone looks and don't be shocked when you see retail prices of 25K or so in the finer jeweler stores in Dallas since that is 'retail' on this level of stone.

A diamond dealer would pay 13K or so to buy this type of stone and they are listed from 13K to 28K on this site via the excellent search database this site has.

If you choose to buy 'online' to save some dough, the top online seller of E rings is a public company on Nasdaq known as BLUE NILE and you can see them show up on this site.

Other dealers are reputable on this site, and BN is a drop shipper that uses a large network of large dealers to offer you a wide range of prices in this type of stone.

Once you start to look at D and E color at this grade you will not as a novice see any difference in your untrained eye.

Graders have to use lab equipment and long periods of time in looking at these level of stones to make a final determination if it VVS2 or VS1 or VS2.

If 16K is more than 2 months of your wages, you may want to consider that level of gift to your special one.

Weddings come with lots of costs, and newly weds usually have a home purchase in their near future so unless you have already purchased your own home, such a large investment in a 'gift' may be reconsidered by you.

So search online here and see you can obtain the grades I suggest which are elite level stones and then see them in person in Dallas and if you can find a local dealer to compete with the dealers on this site then use the local dealer.

The best prices are on this network.

I suggest this high level of grade since if your marriage lasts your special one will want UPGRADES in the future and this level of grade and size will be easy to TRADE to the dealer you upgrade with.

GOOD LUCK

 

[sugarski]

another idea:
http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamonds/diamond-details/1.902-j-si1-round-diamond-ags-104080668015

 

[UrsTx]

Welcome to PS!

drk14 gave some great leads. You have a great budget and should be able to find some beauties.

I just wanted to comment that by "cut" the industry means a grade like Ideal or Excellent, which is what most PSers aim for when purchasing. What you listed is shape (round) which is important too.

With the specs you listed, I've been successful with VS2 and select SI1s being eye clean but you do need to ask/research a little more on the SI1s. I also like G for near colorless.

Also look for GIA or AGS certifications who are reliable labs.

I echo visiting Whiteflash and Brian Gavin (BG is by appt only). They're awesome!

 

[TJPo]

Thank you for the all for the advice to get me started. It's definitely nice to know about the search tool. I've used the BN search tool, but its good to have many different sources.
I'll shop around a little online before I go look at diamonds in person next week.
Thanks again and I'll follow up on here as I'm getting closer to buying.

 

[TJPo]

UrsTx I definitely knew that cut and shape are 2 totally different things. It seems like everything I've looked at online is either Ideal or Excellent, and it's really hard to understand how the variances in those categories will effect the diamonds brilliance.
I have read that there is a tool to input the dimensions of the diamond to further evaluate the cut. I'll look into using that.

 

[drk14]

I have read that there is a tool to input the dimensions of the diamond to further evaluate the cut. I'll look into using that.

This is what you're looking for:
https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca

Also, if you haven't already, read through the Diamond Guide and Advanced Tutorial under the "Knowledge" tab above.

 

[AdaBeta27]

Try to look at some Hearts on Fire, or Crafted by Infinity. Those will be some of the best-cut hearts & arrows diamonds that you maybe can see in person. If your or she likes antique diamonds, Good Old Gold offers "August Vintage" round and cushion diamonds that are modern diamonds in terms of performance, but with the chunky facet style of Old European and Old Mine cut diamonds.

Take a look at the niceice.com site "5 minutes to success." He gives you some parameters to look for when buying H&A RB diamonds over the Internet.

If the stone has an AGS report and the cut grade is 000, you don't need to run the HCA tool because the AGS 000 stones will all pass that test. Not all GIA excellent cut stones are good performers. The GIA ex cut grade is a much broader range, and includes stones that are steep/deep, or relatively poor performers. Look for HCA 2 or less, if you want the best light performance. It's just a rejection tool, and .8 is not better than 2. You just want 2 or under.

 

[craiguk]

As has been suggested you're close enough that you could visit Whiteflash. They hold a good online inventory and have now started adding videos of their stones to take the risk out of buying sight-unseen.

It is suggested further up to look on Blue Nile. Personally, for your budget, I think that would be lunacy as it's largely (if not exclusively) all virtual stock. With one of the well known vendors (of which there are many) commonly referred to here you don't need to take on any risk of buying a virtual stone. At the very least you will be able to get ASET and IS images and some also provide highly magnified videos.

Also suggested is to look for H&A stones. Whiteflash, Brian Gavin, Infinity to name but a few all carry H&A stones which are cut to much tighter tolerances than a general GIA Ex stone. Some are graded by AGS (again, ignore the comments to look solely for GIA stones).

Good luck in your search. Having been in your position I'd just say read, read and read. There's loads of info out there.

 

[TJPo]

I had the chance to visit a couple local shops. They were suggested by people I know or had a really good rating on Yelp. My experience was okay, the people I talked to were helpful, but it didn't seem like they had many good options in the store. And the items I did see were either not great cuts or seemingly overpriced.

I am starting to get a better idea of what I'm looking for, and definitely can see the value and difference in a well cut stone.
After looking a little more into settings I think I'm going to try to save a little more money on the diamond. Now I'm thinking I'd rather spend between $13K and $14K on the stone.

Does anyone have any suggestions between the $13K and $14K price point?

I've found a couple stones that I am considering, I'll post some pictures later.

 

[craiguk]

A touch over but it's a starter at least

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3377987.htm

http://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3521173.htm

 

[TJPo]

Here are a few pictures of 2 diamonds that I found. Unfortunately they didn't list the crown or pavilion angles so I don't know if it will fall into the ideal proportions range. They did have a H&A pictures so I would think there can be some information gleaned from those. Does anyone have an opinion either way on either of the 2 diamonds below?
Diamond 1: 1.69 ct, I color, VS2

Diamond 2: 2.01 ct, I color, SI1

 

[craiguk]

You'd need to get the full specs before anyone could make a judgement I think. The first doesn't look H&A to me - but then I'm just a novice. The second may not be eye clean.

Are you comfortable with an I stone? Your original post said near colorless or better. Also, looking at 2 ct compared to 1.6ct is going to throw up a whole load of different options. I think you need to decide on fixing your parameters to be honest. Other than the colour the two specs are quite different.

 

[frugalfw]

Dear people that are much more knowledgeable than me,

1) Does anyone have an opinion on value of buying in person at a “wholesaler” vs buying online? Like most people, I'm wary of potentially getting taken advantage of due to my lack of knowledge on the subject. It seems that online might be easier to do the research as you're buying the diamond. I would also think the markup on the Online options would be a lower.
2) I have a general idea of my parameters for what I'm looking for. Does anyone have a suggestion on a diamond that would suit my parameters below?
Cut – Round
Color – Near colorless or better
Clarity – Eye clean
Carat – I am wanting to get atleast a 1.6 carat diamond.

I’m hoping to spend around $15,000 for the diamond. If it comes down to one aspect or another, I’d say size is probably the most important thing to me.

Thanks, I appreciate any and all advice!

Hi TJPo - Best wishes on your upcoming engagement!

I have recently shopped many of the locally owned larger stores in DFW myself (Markhams, Diamond Doctor, etc. that have reputations for primarily selling only GIA and AGS stones, along with nice collections of designer settings) and can tell you that while they are great places to get ideas on settings and figure out what I liked, I could not beat the prices I found online (by thousands of dollars!). I don't fault the bricks and mortar stores for being overpriced -- they likely have lots more overhead to keep their operations going than the online stores. I just didn't want to pay that overhead myself. I will admit that it did take a little more work and patience to shop online, but it was a process I enjoyed and was very happy in the end -- I love my diamond and know that I got a great price for an excellent diamond (I had it appraised and recommend you do the same if you buy online).

I would also recommend that no matter where you buy, learn all that you can on this site before spending a dime anywhere. There are great resources and the people here are so knowledgable, helpful, and wonderful...they will help guide you. $16,000 is a nice budget, and the diamond is something your future wife will have forever...you want to be sure to get the best diamond for your money (and you should be able to get a really beautiful, diamond and exactly what you are looking for with that budget).

If you decide to buy at local stores, I will advise that you do not give them your top budget...most will ask (a fair question, but likely every diamond you are shown will be at your budget or more....they will be happy to help you spend every dollar, when you might be able to find something you really like for less). Also, most of the "bricks and mortar" stores seemed to work like buying a car...the salesperson gives you a price for a diamond and/or setting, and if you do not choose to buy at the first price given,"magically" their manager can work you a better deal if you buy today (do not fall for that...those deals typically don't go away if you walk out the door). This was consistent with most stores I visited, to the point it became amusing. : ) I found that even with these so-called "manager" or "gemologist deals," the loose diamonds were still thousands of dollars overpriced for what you could get online through Pricescope vendors. Also, avoid the mall stores entirely...they are often called "maul" stores on here for good reason. The only diamond stores in DFW that I visited that did not feel like a car sale process were Grayson Allen in Southlake and Haltom's....both good experiences & the only ones who fully gained my trust locally (but still felt overpriced compared to online).

And, if you decide to buy online, I would strongly recommend that you stick with the trusted Pricescope vendors (You can see a list here: https://www.pricescope.com/featured-sponsors). Reach out to a few of them and get a feel for who you might like to do business with. Most of them have access to the same online stones...it's a virtual inventory that is shared by many of these vendors.

I hope that helps!

Edit: I would also add that another new diamond shopper & PS Poster, D_ put together a very comprehensive list of diamond shopping questions/requirements over here:

[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/checklist-questions-to-ask-before-purchasing-a-diamond.215242/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/checklist-questions-to-ask-before-purchasing-a-diamond.215242/[/URL]

You might find this list of questions along with the comments & additions from many PS experts very helpful in your quest.