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Antique Cushion - What do you think?

cookiebuttermonster

Rough_Rock
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Purely by chance, I was putzing on the James Allen site looking at cushions late last night, and amidst all the crushed ice, this one jumped out and smacked me around:

http://www.jamesallen.com/loose-diamonds/cushion-cut/1.02-carat-e-color-vvs1-clarity-sku-839272

carat weight: 1.02
color: E
clarity: VVS1
polish: Very Good
symmetry: Very Good
Fluorescence: None
l/w/d (mm): 5.95*5.93*3.96
l/w ratio: 1.00
depth %: 66.80
girdle: Thin
table %: 53.00
certificate: GIA

I'm totally enamored of the facet pattern and I went ahead and placed it on hold over the weekend. It's the perfect square I'm wanting, I don't think the facet pattern could get any prettier, and I lovelovelove the round culet. Unfortunately it is not located in NYC so they can't do a gemologist analysis with ASET etc. 2 different associates I talked to assured me that the black facet on the right of the culet is a camera artifact and not a dead facet.

Is it possible to tell how it will perform without seeing it in person? Is there a way I could get an ASET of it done somewhere while I'm still within the 30-day return window?

The only thing so far is that the color is so high! I'm a bit worried it will be too white. I was planning to look for something in the H/I range for a bit of warmth, and want a rose gold setting. Will the E color affect the pastels effect, or is that purely dependent on cut? Will it look okay with rose gold?
 

Resonance.Of.Life

Brilliant_Rock
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Rose gold is a purely personal preference so that would be up to your S/O. I love rose gold and feel that very white diamonds pop in rose gold :)


As for the cushion, if the facets turn on and off in the video, it's not a dead facet ;-) The facets tend to pick up the colors around them, especially in antique cuts-- so it is reflecting the camera based on my experience with cushions and antique cuts. But your eyes will tell you whether or not you like it.
 

foxinsox

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I love the flower pattern under the table. It looks gorgeous. Also, am I seeing it right and you've got kozibe around the edges? :love:
 

cookiebuttermonster

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ResonanceOfLife, I was just admiring your 4ct antique cushion yesterday. Gorgeous pastel light play! I'm hoping this one has a similar pastel effect. Yum. Is it just a matter of seeing it in person?

Foxinsox, Yes kozibe! I love the flower pattern too, it's the best of both worlds -- flower facets of an OEC, and cushion shape of OMB. And the round culet is so lovely, the antique cushions I've seen have a square or squashed culet. I like this round one much better. I just hope it performs nicely.
 

cookiebuttermonster

Rough_Rock
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I love the AV Stars! I have been strongly considering doing a custom cut with GOG, and will very likely go that route if this stone doesn't work out.


New dilemma -- I had reached out to Jewels by Grace about having antique girdles polished, and she just informed me that this is not an actual antique stone, but an antique style cut. No wonder it is so perfectly symmetrical with such high color and clarity! I thought I had stumbled across a needle in a haystack with a real antique stone. :oops:

I wasn't aware of anyone but GoG and VC (and possibly ERD?) doing new cuts in the antique style. Does anyone know more about this?

This is making me reconsider this stone. I don't need/want such a high color and I could live with a lower clarity. If this was a real antique stone I'd have been happy to pay a little more for higher qualities than I need/want in return for such a lovely cut. But since it's a new cut, I don't know if I want to pay the extra for the high color especially.

This stone was right at the very top of my budget. But the cut is still really pretty. Everything about it is pretty much perfect and just what I'm looking for apart from the color. But I do love GoG and have been very happy with my communications with them, and their upgrade policy is better. Hmm.
 

Resonance.Of.Life

Brilliant_Rock
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Aww thank you :)

Brilliantly Engaged has newly cut antique styled cushions if interested too.
 

acaw2015

Brilliant_Rock
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763
I think it looks really beautiful, very similar to my own (newly cut) cushion! I think my cushion was defined as a gog platinum/premium cushion. It shows pastel colors beautifully.
I havent got any advice re aset for this cushion or if it will perform well, but I think it is always wise to check out other vendors too...
 

foxinsox

Ideal_Rock
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I think if this has the facet pattern which sings to you, you should get it. At the very least get it to have a look given that you can return it without issue within 30 days. Schlep it round some shops which have settings sorta like what you're after and see how it looks. And see how you feel about the colour in person, under trees, in halogen lighting etc.
Looking around, you don't have much choice for a flower petal pattern under the table in a cushion. All the newly cut vintage cushions favour a maltese cross-style centre.
This August Vintage Star which was the closest I could find for comparison and it's lower in colour and clarity. Plus I don't think the faceting is as clear under the table as the JA one. It's slightly larger but also not as square.
What price do JA have for the stone?

I can totally get wanting an antique stone and feeling like the E, VVS1 would be bonuses in an antique where they feel like they're overkill in a new stone but... you're looking at a getting custom cut new stone anyway. How does this differ?
 

diamondseeker2006

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Pretty sure the source BE and LM use for newly cut antique style stones are the same (and the ones like that on JA might be from the same source?). They are usually not cut to ideal optics like Good Old Gold's and Victor Canera's, though. I like the JA stone, though! But with any diamond other than maybe an ideal cut round, you have to see it to know if you love it.

One thing I will mention, though, is AVC's often face up larger than some of these other newly cut antique cushions. For example, this AVC 1 ct H VS2 is 6.16 x 5.98mm while the 1 ct E from JA is 5.95 x 5.93. I have no idea of the price of the JA stone, but just keep your eye on diameter because every bit helps in cushions.

http://www.goodoldgold.com/ecommerce/1-00ct-h-vs2-august-vintage-star-cushion-diamond.html

another

http://www.goodoldgold.com/ecommerce/1-02ct-g-vs2-august-vintage-cushion-diamond.html
 

cookiebuttermonster

Rough_Rock
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Mar 11, 2016
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Foxinsox, That is really solid advice, thank you. The flower facet pattern in a cushion is something I didn't even know I wanted until I saw it lol. I've been admiring OECs and antique cushions (and AVCs/AVRs) for a few years now and I've always preferred the OEC flower pattern over the Maltese cross, but prefer the cushion's square shape to the round. So I've gone back and forth over the years about which one to get. If this stone's facet pattern appears like a flower in person, it would be the best of both worlds. This stone was listed at $9,690 and is $9,545 after the wire discount.

The fact that it is a new cut took me by surprise, and makes it a different decision making process than if it were a true antique. So it was a bit of a jolt and it's taken me some time to adjust my expectations, switch gears, and re-evaluate the decision in this new light. And, shouldn't it be listed somewhere that it's a new cut and not antique? The report lists it as an Old Mine Brilliant. And neither of the reps I talked to mentioned anything about it being an antique style cut. So it doesn't feel very forth-right. Makes me a bit grumpy. I know part of it is my own ignorance and wishful thinking, but still. This is a big purchase and I almost missed a very important detail.

For a custom cut, the only thing I'd have changed for sure is the color. I'd have requested something in the G/H/I range. I'd have hoped for VVS clarity but would have been content with an eye-clean VS2. I'm still not sure on the color, I like a bit of warmth and am concerned it will be too icy. But, I'm not sure if a custom cut could replicate this facet pattern, since it differs from the Star. I also would have liked to request the rough be from Canada or Russia, but GoG was still looking into whether that would be possible.


Diamondseeker, You and Fox are definitely right, I will have to see it in person to know for sure. For performance, for color, and for facet aesthetics. Returning it will be a hassle, so I'd like to avoid it if possible. Especially because they told me that since I'd be paying via wire transfer, a refund check would be issued which could take a couple of weeks. So that would tie up my funds if a different stone should happen to pop up.

But everyone seems to agree that it has potential to be a very nice stone, so it seems worth giving it a go. ::)

The bit of face-up size difference isn't a real concern for me. I've actually been wearing a 6mm fake the past few days to try to get used to something that big lol!

I've been looking at that H Star, but it just isn't speaking to me. Maybe because it's not quite square enough, but I really can't put my finger on it. It's in a couple of GoG's videos and it isn't as appealing to me as the other Stars in their videos.
 

Resonance.Of.Life

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cookiebuttermonster|1459062317|4011603 said:
...The flower facet pattern in a cushion is something I didn't even know I wanted until I saw it lol. I've been admiring OECs and antique cushions (and AVCs/AVRs) for a few years now and I've always preferred the OEC flower pattern over the Maltese cross, but prefer the cushion's square shape to the round.

This is exactly what I was looking for in a cushion too and I finally found mine :) I can't reveal it just yet but I can say it is a true antique cushion and in the exact flowery pattern it seems we are both describing. After 4 diamonds (and almost 5 years of searching), I can finally say I found my "holy grail cushion." Do not give up ! :)
 

cookiebuttermonster

Rough_Rock
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Messages
94
ACA I just looked up your Star and it's so beautiful! Did you ever find a setting you like?

I'd looked at GoG, VC, and ERD/BE. Nothing in stock really jumped at me. VC has a nice J that I was strongly considering, but their upgrade plan is restrictive, and I wasn't sure about the tint of the J. GoG has the H Star that Diamondseeker mentioned, but it's not grabbing me for some reason. ERD/BE's stock didn't impress me. Whereas I saw this one at JA and it just reached out and shook me lol.
 

cookiebuttermonster

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Resonance.Of.Life|1459062522|4011604 said:
cookiebuttermonster|1459062317|4011603 said:
...The flower facet pattern in a cushion is something I didn't even know I wanted until I saw it lol. I've been admiring OECs and antique cushions (and AVCs/AVRs) for a few years now and I've always preferred the OEC flower pattern over the Maltese cross, but prefer the cushion's square shape to the round.

This is exactly what I was looking for in a cushion too and I finally found mine :) I can't reveal it just yet but I can say it is a true antique cushion and in the exact flowery pattern it seems we are both describing. After 4 diamonds (and almost 5 years of searching), I can finally say I found my "holy grail cushion." Do not give up ! :)
Oh wow I can't wait to see it! It must be stunning! Congratulations! I don't think I have the patience to wait another 5 years though lol.

I'm not too hung up on having a true antique, to be honest they make me a little nervous. If I damaged a beautiful piece of history, I would feel awful, so I'd feel obligated to have it bezeled by default. I just want to know what I'm getting when I buy it and not be taken by surprise like I was here.
 

Resonance.Of.Life

Brilliant_Rock
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Haha I didn't know what I was looking for for half of those years ;-)

You will find it, rest assured. Just be explicit in what you want and don't want and the right stone will make you gasp! My husband, who isn't really into diamonds, LOVES this new one. So that says a lot. Reach out to several vendors and see what they come up with and have pictures readily available depicting what you are looking for. Patience can pay off.
 

MollyMalone

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cookiebuttermonster|1459062317|4011603 said:
* * * The fact that it is a new cut took me by surprise, and makes it a different decision making process than if it were a true antique. So it was a bit of a jolt and it's taken me some time to adjust my expectations, switch gears, and re-evaluate the decision in this new light. And, shouldn't it be listed somewhere that it's a new cut and not antique? The report lists it as an Old Mine Brilliant. And neither of the reps I talked to mentioned anything about it being an antique style cut. So it doesn't feel very forth-right. Makes me a bit grumpy. I know part of it is my own ignorance and wishful thinking, but still. This is a big purchase and I almost missed a very important detail. * * *
Oh, it saddens me that your delight in this stone (which I think is quite charming) has been diminished by the fact that it wasn't actually cut "back when." But I hope you will cut James Allen some slack. GIA's Old Mine Brilliant designation is because the stone falls within its parameters for that shape-cut classification in which age plays no part. JA itself describes the stone -- in both the listing header & the Diamond Specifications box -- as simply a cushion. And unlike, e.g., Adam of Old World Diamonds, who's built his business around offering these "niche" stones, James Allen has never held itself out as a purveyor of vintage diamonds; I imagine that the vast majority of their prospective customers have no interest in one. So I'm not raising my eyebrows at the fact that the JA sales reps didn't think of the possibility that age might matter to you & consequently volunteer the information that it's a recently cut stone.
 

cookiebuttermonster

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Messages
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MollyMalone|1459071938|4011618 said:
cookiebuttermonster|1459062317|4011603 said:
* * * The fact that it is a new cut took me by surprise, and makes it a different decision making process than if it were a true antique. So it was a bit of a jolt and it's taken me some time to adjust my expectations, switch gears, and re-evaluate the decision in this new light. And, shouldn't it be listed somewhere that it's a new cut and not antique? The report lists it as an Old Mine Brilliant. And neither of the reps I talked to mentioned anything about it being an antique style cut. So it doesn't feel very forth-right. Makes me a bit grumpy. I know part of it is my own ignorance and wishful thinking, but still. This is a big purchase and I almost missed a very important detail. * * *
Oh, it saddens me that your delight in this stone (which I think is quite charming) has been diminished by the fact that it wasn't actually cut "back when." But I hope you will cut James Allen some slack. GIA's Old Mine Brilliant designation is because the stone falls within its parameters for that shape-cut classification in which age plays no part. JA itself describes the stone -- in both the listing header & the Diamond Specifications box -- as simply a cushion. And unlike, e.g., Adam of Old World Diamonds, who's built his business around offering these "niche" stones, James Allen has never held itself out as a purveyor of vintage diamonds; I imagine that the vast majority of their prospective customers have no interest in one. So I'm not raising my eyebrows at the fact that the JA sales reps didn't think of the possibility that age might matter to you & consequently volunteer the information that it's a recently cut stone.
You're right, I wasn't expecting JA to carry antique cuts at all, whether antique or antique style! It was a real surprise to see a cut like this there. I'm glad to hear that JA did everything by the book, so now I can move forward with this stone with no misgivings about the vendor.

Thank you for your empathy, it's very sweet of you. :)) Don't be sad anymore, I'm getting excited about it again. ;)) I was mostly grumpy at myself, I feel a bit silly and like I should have known better. Doesn't help that I started coming down with some random upper respiratory plague yesterday, so I'm a bit grumpy in general right now lol. We were supposed to go to the zoo today for Easter and instead I'm sitting at home popping cough drops. My young toddler doesn't yet understand that when mama is sick, I can't play as much!

It's still the prettiest facet pattern I've seen in either a true antique or new cut. I would love for my diamond search to be over so quickly and painlessly, so I am hoping I like it as much in person as in the picture. I just need to get in touch with my bank tomorrow and arrange the transfer, and then it will be on its way. Eek!
 

cookiebuttermonster

Rough_Rock
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Resonance.Of.Life|1459063993|4011607 said:
Haha I didn't know what I was looking for for half of those years ;-)

You will find it, rest assured. Just be explicit in what you want and don't want and the right stone will make you gasp! My husband, who isn't really into diamonds, LOVES this new one. So that says a lot. Reach out to several vendors and see what they come up with and have pictures readily available depicting what you are looking for. Patience can pay off.
I'm still hopeful that this stone will be a winner in person! But if it isn't I will definitely be reaching out with pictures of this facet pattern. That's very helpful advice, I'm glad to know it's okay to be discerning about the facet pattern in old stones.

So is it okay to reach out to several vendors at once for the same request? That's not bad etiquette? Instead of picking one vendor and sticking with them. I've actually been wondering about this in regards to a custom setting.
 

Resonance.Of.Life

Brilliant_Rock
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No, a wider net will be cast and I've worked with multiple vendors at once in my search. Everyone has their own sources and some may overlap and some may not.

I've chosen to work with very specific vendors this go-around for my "holy grail" cushion and have choosen a specific hand-forged vendor for the ring. I've worked with Jewels by Grace, Old World Diamonds, and Single Stone.
 

acaw2015

Brilliant_Rock
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cookiebuttermonster|1459063171|4011605 said:
ACA I just looked up your Star and it's so beautiful! Did you ever find a setting you like?

I'd looked at GoG, VC, and ERD/BE. Nothing in stock really jumped at me. VC has a nice J that I was strongly considering, but their upgrade plan is restrictive, and I wasn't sure about the tint of the J. GoG has the H Star that Diamondseeker mentioned, but it's not grabbing me for some reason. ERD/BE's stock didn't impress me. Whereas I saw this one at JA and it just reached out and shook me lol.
Thank you! :appl: :wavey: Well, I am no expert in avc or avc stars and the only gog cushion I have seen IRL is my own and it is, technically :naughty: not a star although it is inscribed august vintage. Being what it is, all I can say is that the facet pattern of mine is basically exactly the same as your JA cushion. That does not mean that they will look the same though. Mine has ideal light performance in the AGSL report and a great aset... Like ROL I had searched for some time before finding my cushion and I have to say I would definately use gog again if I ever upgrade my stone to avoid all the headache in finding a good performer myself, but that is only my personal opinion. I think some people may even love the hunt!

Mine is a J and if you are color sensitive and color would bother you, I would probably stay above J personally. I love it and would never trade size for a higher color, but I am rather color sensitive and do see the color sometimes but it truly doesnt bother me at all.

I dont know about the avcs or "real" stars, but in my cushion the cross in the "maltese cross" is not pronounced at all. It looks a lot more like a flower with 8 petals and the culet forming a lovely center. The cross is almost always visible in pictures though. I'll try to show this and how hard it is to photograph the cushion with some pics if that may help you in some way re your decision. I guess you will have to find out how your cushion performs and if there is a cross, nothing, mush or a flower by seeing it IRL!

thank you for asking about my reset! I have a new ring in the morks right now, will hopefully have something to show in a couple of weeks. :appl:




hope this helps! :wavey:
 

cookiebuttermonster

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aca|1459112791|4011805 said:
Thank you! :appl: :wavey: Well, I am no expert in avc or avc stars and the only gog cushion I have seen IRL is my own and it is, technically :naughty: not a star although it is inscribed august vintage. Being what it is, all I can say is that the facet pattern of mine is basically exactly the same as your JA cushion. That does not mean that they will look the same though. Mine has ideal light performance in the AGSL report and a great aset... Like ROL I had searched for some time before finding my cushion and I have to say I would definately use gog again if I ever upgrade my stone to avoid all the headache in finding a good performer myself, but that is only my personal opinion. I think some people may even love the hunt!

Mine is a J and if you are color sensitive and color would bother you, I would probably stay above J personally. I love it and would never trade size for a higher color, but I am rather color sensitive and do see the color sometimes but it truly doesnt bother me at all.

I dont know about the avcs or "real" stars, but in my cushion the cross in the "maltese cross" is not pronounced at all. It looks a lot more like a flower with 8 petals and the culet forming a lovely center. The cross is almost always visible in pictures though. I'll try to show this and how hard it is to photograph the cushion with some pics if that may help you in some way re your decision. I guess you will have to find out how your cushion performs and if there is a cross, nothing, mush or a flower by seeing it IRL!

thank you for asking about my reset! I have a new ring in the morks right now, will hopefully have something to show in a couple of weeks. :appl:



and a pic I got from gog



hope this helps! :wavey:
Oh my goodness it's even prettier in these photos! Look at how it glows with pastels. If GoG had had this one in stock it would be a done deal for me. Wow I want to reach out and pet it. :bigsmile:

It really does look just like the JA stone with the petal facets. The culet even looks round too. I'm not going to settle for mediocre light performance when the JA stone comes in, not when I now know the GoG Star can have an identical look!

I can't wait to see how you set it, it will be so pretty!
 

acaw2015

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Thank you!! :bigsmile:
I removed the last picture because I felt bad posting someone elses pic. :saint: But I'm happy you had time to see it!
I think maybe the stars arent all exactly the same re facet pattern, but I am not sure. If you are interested you will have to ask gog...
Best of luck and I look forward to seeing what you find! :wavey:
 

foxinsox

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Oh holy moly aca, your AVC is delicious. The petals are beautiful and the colours it throws off are glorious.. How are you setting it? If that's a "standard" AVC, I can see the fuss all of a sudden. All the vendor photos really play up the cross in the middle but you get those delicate petals, wow :love:
 

acaw2015

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foxinsox|1459157779|4011958 said:
Oh holy moly aca, your AVC is delicious. The petals are beautiful and the colours it throws off are glorious.. How are you setting it? If that's a "standard" AVC, I can see the fuss all of a sudden. All the vendor photos really play up the cross in the middle but you get those delicate petals, wow :love:
Oh thank you foxinsox! And then you havent seen it in the shade under a tree! I have never been able to capture that fireball of rainbow colors. :appl: Feels like I made a bit of a threadjack here, sorry. :shifty:
I think it is really difficult to take a good photo of it showing what it *really* looks like! The four smaller "flower petals" in my stone easily reflect the black camera (phone) and I have to hold the camera really close to the stone in order to get a sharp pic... something to consider when shopping for a diamond! I mean, we dont wear black cameras in front of the diamonds normally (unless we love cameras too!). ;))
I am having it set in a simple solitaire setting, four prongs, split claws, red gold band and platinum head. Really hoping this jeweler will manage to do it properly... The ring is custom made, inspired by the classic six prong tiffany. Kind of like the ring in your recent thread, without the parallell bar and with a more tulip shaped head... hard to describe, but I will post pictures when I get it! :appl:


edited to add, oh I see now that it wasnt your thread, sorry! You had only posted in that thread, my mistake. I meant this one: [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/antique-cushion-cut.221743/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/antique-cushion-cut.221743/[/URL]
 

cookiebuttermonster

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ACA, We must have very similar taste because a simple solitaire in rose gold with white prongs is my end game goal too. Great minds think alike! :sun: :dance: :clap:

You should post these pics in the Show Me Your AVC thread, there is only 1 Star posted there so far I think! People would love to see it. [URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/show-me-your-avc-avoec-diamonds.123446/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/show-me-your-avc-avoec-diamonds.123446/[/URL]

I'm so glad you replied to this thread, because I do think the E will turn out to be too starkly white for my tastes even if it does perform well. Now I know I can get the same look with a GoG Star and I won't feel like I have to settle just because of the facet pattern. :halo:
 

acaw2015

Brilliant_Rock
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Well, it is certainly nice to be able to go lower in color if you dont feel you need a higher color!

That's great, I really look forward to seeing your finished ring too!! :appl: :dance:

Oh yes, I would have posted my ring in smtb if I was happy about it... but I didnt like the setting from the moment I saw it and that feeling never changed no matter how hard I tried. I will post there when I have my new ring! Unless I need a third reset first...!! :errrr:

//aca :wavey:
 
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