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another newbie with another diamond question!

atp223

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
290
Hi All! I've been lurking for quite some time - the information on this site is really great!

My boyfriend (soon to be fiance) and I have been looking at lots of different companies and lots of diamonds. I wanted one that was cut really well. I was also really hoping for it to be 2 carats :). We have decided to buy this one, and to me it seems like a great compromise, but I guess I am looking for affirmation/approval from pricescopers that this is a good idea!

The stone is AGS1 instead of 0 - the light performance and symmetry are ideal, but the polish is "excellent". I read an article on truth about diamonds that it is ok to have "excellent" (AGS) or "very good" (GIA) polish, and that it should not affect the brilliance of the diamond. Is there anyone out there who can tell me if that is true? ALSO if a reputable pricescope vendor has said that it is eye clean from the top and from the sides (after checking at my request), does that mean that we don't have to worry? Or should we have the stone shipped to us before it is set to double check...

Due to being stuck at home from hurricane irene, I figured now was as good a time as any to post :).

These are the specs:

Shape: Round
Report: AGS
Carat: 2.047
Color: I
Clarity: SI1
Measurements: 8.14×8.16×5.01
Lab Cut Grade: Excellent
Light Performance: Ideal
Polish: Excellent
Symmetry: Ideal
Table %: 56.3
Depth %: 61.5
Crown %: 15.0
Crown Angle: 34.7
Star %: 55.0
Pav Angle: 40.7
Pavillion %: 42.9
Lower Girdle %: 76.0
Girdle Min-Max %: 1.8-4.0
Girdle: Thin to Slightly Thick Faceted
Culet: Pointed
Fluorescence: Medium Blue
Lab Comment: Additional twinning wisps and surface graining are not shown.

I can try to post the idealscope and ASET (if I can figure out how). Also this is the AGS report no: 104047808003. Can any of you tell me what you think???? Thanks!
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Looks great to me. If I had to compromise on something -- polish at excellent instead of ideal would be it. I think an I SI with medium blue is a great buy at 2 carats. Looks like you guys have picked a real winner.
 

yssie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
21,117
atp223|1314497380|3003087 said:
Hi All! I've been lurking for quite some time - the information on this site is really great!

My boyfriend (soon to be fiance) and I have been looking at lots of different companies and lots of diamonds. I wanted one that was cut really well. I was also really hoping for it to be 2 carats :). We have decided to buy this one, and to me it seems like a great compromise, but I guess I am looking for affirmation/approval from pricescopers that this is a good idea!

The stone is AGS1 instead of 0 - the light performance and symmetry are ideal, but the polish is "excellent". I read an article on truth about diamonds that it is ok to have "excellent" (AGS) or "very good" (GIA) polish, and that it should not affect the brilliance of the diamond. Is there anyone out there who can tell me if that is true? ALSO if a reputable pricescope vendor has said that it is eye clean from the top and from the sides (after checking at my request), does that mean that we don't have to worry? Or should we have the stone shipped to us before it is set to double check...

Due to being stuck at home from hurricane irene, I figured now was as good a time as any to post :).


I can try to post the idealscope and ASET (if I can figure out how). Also this is the AGS report no: 104047808003. Can any of you tell me what you think???? Thanks!

http://agslab.com/reportTypes/pldqr.php?StoneID=104047808003&Weight=2.047&D=1
http://www.agslab.com/pdf_sync_reports/104047808003-PLDQR.PDF

Please do post IS/actual ASET photo if you have them - actual pictures are much preferred to the AGS scan simulation. You can embed them as pictures - use the picture of a diamond under "Insert" when you reply to a post.

Numbers and report indicate it should be a very nice, sparkly stone. I think it's a great find - AGS0 carries a premium, you avoid that w/o sacrificing in appearance/light return by choosing a stone w/ overall cut grade lowered for polish.

Regarding eyeclean - specify what distance you want the stone to be clean from, and from what angles - face-up? face-up and sides? And have them vet the stone to your requirements. It's a larger SI1 - so I would not expect eyeclean from the sides. The main inclusions are wisps - these can be fantastic or horrible grade-making inclusions to have: I had a 2ct SI2 that had white wisp inclusions that was completely eyeclean to my requirements, and that did not in any way affect the brilliance, another poster some time ago had a wispy SI w/ black wisps that she found were very visible in some lighting types.

Honestly - yes, I trust my vendor, but MY eyes need to love the stone, MY eyes need to love the type of light return - all the nuances that various proportions can result in, and MY eyes need to be okay with the colour and inclusions, and no other person, professional or not, has MY eyes - with something this pricey I would strongly recommend spending the couple hundred to have it shipped out to see in-person before having it set.
 

yssie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
21,117

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Yssie|1314498677|3003153 said:
atp223|1314498184|3003135 said:
Thanks to both of you for responding so quickly!!

This is the link to the stone: http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=BLAGS-104047808003

IS/ASET look fine.

Have BGD confirm eyeclean to your specifications. They state on the page that the wisps don't affect brilliance, but if it was me dropping 20k on it I'd ask them to re-confirm and reassure me anyway.
Give them a call to confirm as Yssie says... I had nominated this stone to someone in another post and thought it was a great choice then. How are you going to set it?
 

atp223

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
290
Thanks guys! I will definitely call to confirm. Brian had said it was "a great performer" and also that it was eye clean from the top and the sides, but I will check about the brilliance thing. I thought very hard about going smaller and with something in their signature line, but the BGD blues just seem so cool. And if the performance is as good or almost as good, my rationale is why not?

We are planning to have BGD set it - I want its profile to look like the first picture I'm attaching, but with their novela pave (but not the actual novela-style shank, if that makes sense). The novela team is apparently backed up at the moment, so I was thinking of having them ship it to us during the wait time anyway so we can check it out. like%20this%20with%20the%20truth%20head%20on%20it.jpg shape%20of%20ring.jpg

ok i tried to add the pictures and i am NOT sure if it is going to work...this is complicated!!!

yssie and gypsy, do you have any other suggestions about what I should ask/look for/potentially be concerned about?

Thank you so much for all of your help!!! :)

-Alexa
 

Gypsy

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Aug 8, 2005
Messages
40,198
Ask him about the Brilliance, but put it on hold or buy it cause Brian is very picky and I don't think he'd put his name on a stone with a brilliance issue.

So you want the Truth head on a rounded shank but with Novella pave? Cool beans. PLEASE post pics when you get the completed ring.
 

atp223

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
290
Thanks Gypsy! I definitely will post pics when it is finally in my possession (though I have no idea of that timeline as it is up to the bf).

And we already bought it, but Brian and Lesley have been so great at bearing with us while we changed our mind about 3 times. But I think this is finally the one!! I may ask them to ship it to us during the downtime between now and when they can set it...part of the deal with my boyfriend was that I could be involved in the choosing and design but then can't know anything else about it or see it till he officially gives it to me, so it would be nice to see the diamond myself before the window for changing it expires.

Thanks again for the help, everyone!
 

atp223

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
290
Yssie - I have a question for you! Are you around??

I was doing more lurking, and I saw that for other questions by other people about SI1 diamonds, you have said the same thing about it being hard to find SI1s that are eye clean to personal standards from the top as well as all the sides. I haven't looked at enough diamonds in real life!! When we first started looking, I saw EGL Israel diamonds (we NEVER were going to purchase them; we just used Charleston Alexander as a starting point because a lot of people recommended it) that were VS2 (which means they were maybe worse than that, right?) and I could not see the inclusions...loupes give me a headache and I never quite figured out how to use one in focus. I also saw an F S1I at Quest last weekend (but was just comparing color and size), but did not see any inclusions that jumped out at me. I also read somewhere else that BGD's SI1s are usually eye clean from 6 to 12 inches (I think that was on their website - I know, I know, conflict of interest). But I have trouble focusing on things closer than 6 inches, so it seems like eye clean from 6 inches would be sufficient...

So I guess my question is, what makes you say (or at least imply) that eye clean SI1s are hard to find? I have only looked at diamonds those two times in real life (plus when we got a different BGD one appraised, that we ended up not going with, but that was VS1), so I only know what I read, but it seems like a lot of people on here have good luck with SI1s. I would love to hear your perspective on this, though, because you are totally right (I think it was you who said this) - we don't want to spend 20k on a stone that has visible inclusions.

I suppose I will either be able to verify or refute your position as soon as I see this diamond IRL - But can you elaborate on why you think SI1s are not usually eye clean?? Or maybe why "eye clean" does not mean "can't see any inclusions at all"? You have freaked me out a little :). Would your personal preference be in the VS range or higher? Help please!!!!
 

yssie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
21,117
atp223|1314718816|3005397 said:
Yssie - I have a question for you! Are you around??

I was doing more lurking, and I saw that for other questions by other people about SI1 diamonds, you have said the same thing about it being hard to find SI1s that are eye clean to personal standards from the top as well as all the sides. I haven't looked at enough diamonds in real life!! When we first started looking, I saw EGL Israel diamonds (we NEVER were going to purchase them; we just used Charleston Alexander as a starting point because a lot of people recommended it) that were VS2 (which means they were maybe worse than that, right?) and I could not see the inclusions...loupes give me a headache and I never quite figured out how to use one in focus. I also saw an F S1I at Quest last weekend (but was just comparing color and size), but did not see any inclusions that jumped out at me. I also read somewhere else that BGD's SI1s are usually eye clean from 6 to 12 inches (I think that was on their website - I know, I know, conflict of interest). But I have trouble focusing on things closer than 6 inches, so it seems like eye clean from 6 inches would be sufficient...

So I guess my question is, what makes you say (or at least imply) that eye clean SI1s are hard to find? I have only looked at diamonds those two times in real life (plus when we got a different BGD one appraised, that we ended up not going with, but that was VS1), so I only know what I read, but it seems like a lot of people on here have good luck with SI1s. I would love to hear your perspective on this, though, because you are totally right (I think it was you who said this) - we don't want to spend 20k on a stone that has visible inclusions.

I suppose I will either be able to verify or refute your position as soon as I see this diamond IRL - But can you elaborate on why you think SI1s are not usually eye clean?? Or maybe why "eye clean" does not mean "can't see any inclusions at all"? You have freaked me out a little :). Would your personal preference be in the VS range or higher? Help please!!!!

Haha I'm always around :halo:

My personal standards for eyeclean are pretty lax I think, compared to most PSers (I don't care about the side view at all). I have a 2.7ct SI2, my personal preference is for 'eyeclean' not 'mindclean', and I don't really care how it's eyeclean (my not-eyeclean-to-my-standards main inclusion is under a prong, and thus I happily forget about it ;)) )

I think there's some confusion here. In my experience (others obviously may feel differently) SI1s, SI2s can certainly be clean from the top from close range - and I'm quite myopic - so loupe vision! From the SIDE though, it's a needle in a haystack.

So I'm not saying that eyeclean SIs are hard to find at all, actually. I'm saying it depends entirely on *your* personal definition of eyeclean. If you are judging solely from 8" from face-up (which I believe many vendors do) an eyeclean SI is certainly possible, not hard to find, I think, especially in the sub-1ct, 1.5ct-ish sizes - and bigger, if you're willing to wait and dig more. If your personal definition of eyeclean includes clean from the *sides* though, I strongly recommend VS or higher.

Hope that clarified things. I'm sorry I freaked you out!! I didn't mean to scare anyone off SIs - quite the opposite, in fact, I think they can be great value for money if they're what you're looking for. I'm glad you're having the stone shipped out to look at loose (is my understanding correct?) because I do think it's really important to look at the stone with YOUR eyes and make sure you adore it before you have it set. When you get it be sure to inspect it in a variety of lighting types (direct sunlight, indirect sunlight, diffuse office lights, in the dimness under a table, spotlights in the kitchen...) to check that
-You like the light return & facet patterning that your stone shows off in a variety of light types
-The stone is eyeclean to your specifications in a variety of light types (some types of light make some inclusions more visible than others, best to check)


ETA: re the twinning wisps - I would ask your BGD rep to have the stone pulled and looked at, and have them confirm the wisps don't affect the brilliance of the stone. If they say they don't, then I wouldn't worry about it any more - BGD does vet their Blue line stones before listing them I think, but I would recommend that one step of caution anyway. Again - wisps can be great grade-making inclusions or terrible grade-making inclusions, it depends entirely on the stone and the only way to judge is by having someone look at it - the inclusion plots won't tell you anything useful wrt this.
 

atp223

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
290
Thanks Yssie!! Sorry for my delayed reply...the BF and I decided to go to Vegas for the long weekend at the very last minute, and just got back.

I spoke with Lesley about it again last week, as well as our appraiser, and Lesley reassured me again that there were no visible inclusions, and the appraiser also said that as long as they thought it was fine, it probably was. The appraiser actually recommended we NOT have the diamond shipped to him or us prior to it being set - he was that sure it would be fine. I thought that was interesting. Brian also said the light performance was great, so I think that means brilliance shouldn't be an issue?

So the plan is to continue with having the ring made (I saw the CAD last week and it is simple but very pretty!), and then just check it very thoroughly/take it to the appraiser right when we get it (and are still in the return period). Since I don't think my BF plans to propose immediately, I'm not sure if I am going to look at it first. I didn't want to, and his eyesight is better than mine anyway, but I don't know! For this much money maybe I should take a peek? Is that horrible? Does it totally ruin everything to see the ring before the actual proposal?

BGD has a few other stones that seem near our price range and that would make me very happy, so if there were any issues with this one, the next step would probably just be to fly to texas and look at a bunch of them in person, and pick a new one. But hopefully this one works out! Thanks again for all of your help! I promise to not drop off the face of the earth, and to report back as soon as I have seen it! (whenever that may be...)
 
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