Amway/Quixtar

[cbs102]

My FI recently got back in touch with a friend from high school. a couple weeks ago we were invited over for the afternoon to hang out...i was cool with that--i am pretty new to the area, so i was looking forward to meeting the guys wife and chatting... the afternoon was really pleasant, i got along well with this couple.

so monday night FI got a call from his friend inviting us over for dinner. while at the dinner table, the friend whips out his laptop and starts going through a power point presentation on their new business venture...Quixtar aka Amway. i literally sat there speechless. first, was he really doing this at the dinner table, and second..what kind of set up was this!?

Now i strongly back the "to each their own" policy...but what is the real deal with this. Is anyone involved in this??? is it fraud?

Fi and i talked about it when we got home and it seems so shady. and i feel like we were completly taken advantage of. thoughts?

 

[MichelleCarmen]

You were totally taken advantage of. How can someone invite you over with the understanding that your having dinner as friends and then proceed to sell you on Amway/Quixtar? After not seeing a person for years (I take it?), having them shove that stuff down your throat is entirely in the realm of using you.

I''m sorry to say that.

With ventures like that one, it''s common courtesy to inform guests ahead of time that they will be discussing products, not engaging in casual friendly chit chat.

 

[cbs102]

yes.. i agree with you. my Fi is all bummed out because we realize that he was not interested in a friendship---they just wanted to us to sign up. my mom was like..oh my god amway is a cult!! and they seemed SO normal!

 

[bensbride]

My FI was approached about this when he was in college, and still talks about how it rubbed him the wrong way. From what he heard, it sounded a lot like a pyramid scheme...even though they told him it wasn''t. He knows several people that have invested their entire livelihood into this and are now living out of their car. They even convinced him to go to one of their big gatherings in St Louis or Kansas City, I don''t remember which. He said it was a lot like a cult, in his opinion.

 

[neatfreak]

Date: 12/10/2008 1:32:37 PM
Author: MC
You were totally taken advantage of. How can someone invite you over with the understanding that your having dinner as friends and then proceed to sell you on Amway/Quixtar? After not seeing a person for years (I take it?), having them shove that stuff down your throat is entirely in the realm of using you.

I''m sorry to say that.


With ventures like that one, it''s common courtesy to inform guests ahead of time that they will be discussing products, not engaging in casual friendly chit chat.

Agreed. How weird and creepy. Just run away fast!

 

[purrfectpear]

It''s the closest thing to a quasi-legal pyramid scheme that exists.

It''s also a sure fire way to end up friendless. Your own relatives will run from you

 

[Lauren8211]

Thought it was quite amusing that this is listed in the FAQ section on Amway''s website:

I''ve heard rumors that Amway is a cult. Is this true?

No, Amway Corporation is a business and, similar to other large and established companies, has a distinct environment defined by shared business goals. Shared business philosophies, encouragement, support, and a common vision should not be misinterpreted as a cult.

Amway is part of a group of companies that manufacture and distribute quality products and services and in its most recent fiscal year (2005) generated global retail sales of $6.4 billion. Amway offers a business opportunity that is open to all, regardless of religious beliefs, race or gender. Amway really is a microcosm of the world, with more than 3 million business owners worldwide representing nearly every culture, ethnic background, and political and religious belief finding in the Amway business a way to meet their goals.

While unique as individuals, Amway Business Owners share a desire to succeed in a business of their own and recognize Amway as an excellent opportunity to achieve their goals. New Business Owners receive training, motivation and support in building independent businesses, and are rewarded for their achievements.

 

[laurel25]

I''ve lived in Grand Rapids, MI (where Amway is based) and I can tell you there is definitely a reason that the Van Andels & DeVos'' (the two families who own Amway and own a LOT of downtown GR) are called the "Dutch Mafia" (both families are of Dutch descent). It is basical a legal pyramid scheme and a lot of the products are junk, although some - the cosmetics for instance - are really nice (I''ve never bought them, but worked in fundraising and attended a lot of events where they were the main sponsors and we received goody bags from them). They use really strong-arm techniques to keep people in the group and while it isn''t a cult, it certainly has cult-like aspects.

That really sucks though how that "friend" pulled that on you guys. I would be really disappointed and hurt too if that happened to me. People who do that really bother me.

 

[cbs102]

I am having FI call tonight and tell them thanks but no thanks...it has given me a very bad taste in my mouth.

 

[ang3199]

I actually did Quixtar for a while recently. My DH and I were introduced to it through my supervisor at work at the time ( I no longer work there for other reasons) and considered us good friends. I loved it at first. Everyone made you feel invincible and that you could be rich. Granted, some people strike it big and I''ve met them, but they are few and far between. Their whole selling point is you buy what you need to buy and show other people how to do it.

Well, DH and I were spending a minimum of 300 bucks a month to get a kickback check of like 15 dollars. We showed, or THEY showed, the business to come of our friends that we were pressured into calling and got some people into our ''leg''. Well, DH and I realized that it was too much crap for us. Hidden shit we weren''t told in the beginning. And now my ex-supervisor and very good friend (I went to see his wife''s baby when she was born right after delivery--that''s how close) don''t even CALL us anymore.

So I feel, honestly, that you will succeed if you push stuff, both products and the business, on people. That''s not me or DH, so we were out.

If you have any more questions just ask! I"ll tell you all I know about my experience!

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 12/10/2008 1:25:45 PM
Author:cbs102
My FI recently got back in touch with a friend from high school. a couple weeks ago we were invited over for the afternoon to hang out...i was cool with that--i am pretty new to the area, so i was looking forward to meeting the guys wife and chatting... the afternoon was really pleasant, i got along well with this couple.

so monday night FI got a call from his friend inviting us over for dinner. while at the dinner table, the friend whips out his laptop and starts going through a power point presentation on their new business venture...Quixtar aka Amway. i literally sat there speechless. first, was he really doing this at the dinner table, and second..what kind of set up was this!?

Now i strongly back the 'to each their own' policy...but what is the real deal with this. Is anyone involved in this??? is it fraud?

Fi and i talked about it when we got home and it seems so shady. and i feel like we were completly taken advantage of. thoughts?

yes, just another pyramid scheme.tell your FI to give him the middle finger !!

 

[perry]

cbs102:

I am so sorry that you had this experience - and unfortunatly it demonstrates that these people are not the kind of people to get into business with.

Amway/Quixtar is actually one of about a dozen (or so) very legal multi-level marketing organizations that operate on a personal multi-level marketing basis. They have been arround for a very long time (many decades) and are not going to vanish on you.

The unfortunate thing is that many people abuse things and present things incorectly. This is not unique to Amway/Quixtar as I cannot tell you the number of times I've been prospected by various people from various organizations. Out of perhaps 50 times - only two people were open honest and upfront about what they were offering a business oportunity.

It can be done honestly and ethically. Just like any other business oportunity out there.

However, multi-level marketing has a very low entry fee. Typically a few hundred dollars (or less) where franchises and other businesses often cost at least $10,000 and usually a lot more.

Thus, on the order of a million ordinary people can get into multi-level marketing while on the order of ten thousands get into more formal businesses in the same timeframe.

Then, most people see it as a way to make a quick buck... (and in many cases that is what they were presented with), and many people personally believe in using people (or can easily be influenced that way).

The result is that so many people have such a bad image of multi-level marketing (and Amway/Quixtar - and some others get a bad name: Amway/Quixtar more often becasue it is so huge).

It does not have to be that way - and it can be done differently. There are people who make good money in the legal multi-levels without "using" people - or inviting people under false pretense. There are also a number of people just market products. I'd suggest that if you are interested in a personal cosmetic or nutrition business this is clearly one of the companies you should check out as an option. The trick is finding a sponsor who operates ethically and is interested in building your dreams and goals to your levels - and not theirs (for whatever organization you get involved with).

As far as this being a pyramid. It only appears that way on the surface. It is not, nor are many of the multi-levels, in practice.

Ray Kroc was accused of creating a pyramid marketing scheam when he developed the concept of franchising for McDonalds. Ray faught the battles and got a Federal law passed in congress and signed by the President legalizing franchising as a legal business marketing stratagy. Now franchising dominates the US consumer marketplace.

Amway was accused of being an illegle pyramid when it got big, and they faught the battles and got multi-level marketing declared a legal business marketing stratagy (by the US Supreme Court).

In both cases there are rules that must be followed to in fact be legal - be it franchising or multilevel marketing.

I wish you, and any others, well who wish to build your own business. Just be sure that you are personally working with an ethical group or franchise (and there have been problems in both sectors).

I also note that in all the major multi-levels that there are different organizations that provide training and support. The methods of the different organizations do vary. You should shop arround to find not only the company you want to be involved with (be it Amway/Quixtar, Marry K, Tupperware, etc) but also for the support organization that is best for you. That takes some work - just even to identify the different support/training organizations. But, it can make the difference between your being successful or not.

I note that Robert Kiyosaki - of the Rich Dad Poor Dad fame (and many other business books for ordinary people) does recommend that for someone who is just starting out to build a business to join one of the good multi-level teaching organizations to learn about and be mentored in business concepts as it takes time for people to learn this stuff (the schools do not teach it).

Truth be told - the first time I was prospected for Amway the person outright lied to me about why we were gettting togethe. I thought I was going to a job interview (I drove 1.5 hours to get there all dressed up). Needless to say - I not only called him on his lie midway through his presentation - I also threw out all the materials and product samples that he insisted I look at and try. I've actually been propected multiple times from people associated with Amway and have experienced some of the same and other horror stories.

I also note that of the two people who honestly approached me about a personal business oportuinty with a multi-level that one of them was associated with Amway; and while I did not get involved with him - his honesty and willingness to answer questions and provide support did lead me elswhere. I note that he was not bothered by that either - and we often talked for years afterwards until he and his wife retired and joined the roaming fleet of elderly traveling the country in RVs.



Perry

 

[mia1181]

Ha ha Amway!!!!! DH and I got suckered into meeting up with an Amway couple. DH was in the small business aisle of Barnes & Noble when a nice looking guy about our age struck up a conversation with him about business ideas. They chatted for a few minutes and it seemed they had a lot in common. He suggested that the four of us meet up for lunch. We all seemed to hit it off so why not? UGH!!!!!! We were totally clueless! I don''t even remember how we got out of that lengthy sales-pitch! I still tease DH for getting us into that mess! They looked so normal too! Total cult though. They gave us a CD of one of their conventions, it totally sounded like preachers in a church!

 

[Clairitek]

I have good friends who are very involved with this organization. They tried to get me into "the business" (as they call it) but I politely declined. Not only am I HORRIBLE at advocating for myself and selling stuff (I hated recruitment time in my sorority because I always felt like I was selling something) but I also totally disagree with the causes that Amway/Quixtar supports. I just couldn''t whole heartedly be part of it. I do buy stuff from my friends once in a while because (as someone else mentioned) their cosmetics are quite nice.

I did go to some of the meetings and a holiday party and I certainly got a strange feeling from it. I just did my best to enjoy what I could out of respect for my friends. One of the gentleman who was running the first meeting I went to was a former NFL player. He was wearing his one Super Bowl ring (he played for the Raiders) and a Hall of Fame ring from his university (Miami).

CBS- I''m shocked that your friends did that to you! At least when my friends wanted to show me "the business" they did it in an honest manner.

 

[Clairitek]

Date: 12/10/2008 11:09:51 PM
Author: mia1181
Ha ha Amway!!!!! DH and I got suckered into meeting up with an Amway couple. DH was in the small business aisle of Barnes & Noble when a nice looking guy about our age struck up a conversation with him about business ideas. They chatted for a few minutes and it seemed they had a lot in common. He suggested that the four of us meet up for lunch. We all seemed to hit it off so why not? UGH!!!!!! We were totally clueless! I don''t even remember how we got out of that lengthy sales-pitch! I still tease DH for getting us into that mess! They looked so normal too! Total cult though. They gave us a CD of one of their conventions, it totally sounded like preachers in a church!

This is not the first story I''ve heard about seemingly casual conversations struck up in a store leading to a Quixtar sales pitch. I met these people at one of the meetings who got "picked up" in a Pier 1 Imports.

 

[EricaR]

What a terrible way for you to have been treated!!! Even if they were trying to "recruit" you, I think tricking you into having dinner with them is the best way to alienate you.

 

[bensbride]

I think of it this way...if people have to resort to basically soliciting other people they don''t know in bookstores and the like, they obviously aren''t getting rich off of this. I believe the ones that benefit the most are the ones at the top....nobody joining at this point will ever make any money.

 

[Deelight]

Date: 12/10/2008 11:17:56 PM
Author: Clairitek

Date: 12/10/2008 11:09:51 PM

Author: mia1181

Ha ha Amway!!!!! DH and I got suckered into meeting up with an Amway couple. DH was in the small business aisle of Barnes & Noble when a nice looking guy about our age struck up a conversation with him about business ideas. They chatted for a few minutes and it seemed they had a lot in common. He suggested that the four of us meet up for lunch. We all seemed to hit it off so why not? UGH!!!!!! We were totally clueless! I don''t even remember how we got out of that lengthy sales-pitch! I still tease DH for getting us into that mess! They looked so normal too! Total cult though. They gave us a CD of one of their conventions, it totally sounded like preachers in a church!

This is not the first story I''ve heard about seemingly casual conversations struck up in a store leading to a Quixtar sales pitch. I met these people at one of the meetings who got ''picked up'' in a Pier 1 Imports.

Yeah it happened to me where I work, customers seemed lovely albeit a little creepy (my spidey senses were tingling) having a chat then I got a call from them later at work wanting to talk to me about a business op, URGH.

 

[perry]

After sleeping on it I thought I''d post again.

The fact is that experiences like many told in this thread personally irk me.

What I don''t understand (well really I do understand) is that all Amway/Quixtar, Mary K, and many other long term sucessful Multi-level marketing companies offer is a business oportunity.

Just like any other business oportunity it must be determined if it is something that you are interested in if you are interested in starting a company.

Just like any other business oportunity there are standard rules of business that apply.

Few businesses in any industry survive long based on misleading approaches to attract customers.

I would like to say that few businesses survive based on misrepresenting products - but the jewelry industry has many cases of that (and I still remember vividely when I started looking at diamonds - and before I found Pricescope - sitting in a jewelry store and from 3 feet away - looking through the glass case - and plastic envelope I could see large blacks spots in a diamond that was labeled as "SI-1" - and yeh, those were inclusions in the diamond as we pulled it out for very close inspection).

In the end - just like any other business people do make money if they treat it like a business.

What boggles the mind is how many people do not try to learn and understand that long term business viability and noticable business profitability - of any business based on repeat customers - depends on certain codes of conduct to attract and retain those customers. In the case of multi-level marketing - the downline is part of your client/customer base.

Just like there are diamond vendors who give the industry a bad name - so to are there MLM participants who give the industry a bad name. It it true in any segment of business.

But, there are also people, companies, and vendors who do it right.

Of interest in this case. Probably still buried in a box in my basement is a newspaper article from about a decade ago where an investigative reporter studied various business models that an average person could buy into without a substaintail investment (I believe the cutoff was something like less than $10,000).

The conclusion was that the Amway system had created more millionairs - and more individual businesses who made more than $50,000 a year in profit than any other system out there (and I think it also concluded that the numbers were on the order of as many as all the other systems combined). Now those businesses were not built by misleading people or customers - becasue people don''t stick when mislead.

However, it also needs to be stated: Building and running a business - any business - takes time and effort. There are no ligitimate get rich quick business models that I am aware of (and I sure studied enough of them).

What boggles my mind is how can people really think that they can attract people to their business - or to join them in any business oportunity - by misleading and tricking people.

Perry

 

[CJ2008]

The same thing happened to my DH (my fiancee at that time) and I about 5 years ago. DH accepted an invitation to go out and have dinner with a guy he knew (a helicopter pilot) and his wife. We were looking forward to it, DH really liked and respected this guy and I was excited to meet them. I thought it was really nice, too, that they insisted on coming over our home (they lived about 45-60 minutes away) rather than us driving over to them. So we''re waiting for them, dressed and all, they get there, and we invite them in for some appetizers and stuff. I mentioned a few places where we could go for dinner but they seemed completely uninterested, which of course was weird, since that was the whole reason for their coming out. About 10 minutes into being there, sure enough, he pulls out a notebook (a paper one) and starts telling us all about Quixtar. They were there for about an hour and a half or so, I can''t remember for sure, but that''s what we talked about for 90% of the time. I didn''t say anything out of respect for DH and faked some interest but obviously I was not interested in the business or in ever seeing these people again - I remember thinking that a lot of the things they said sounded cult-like and creepy - like how all of their friends were Quixtar people. I forget a lot of the details but it was definitely weird - they were completely uninterested in anything other than Quixtar. What was most upsetting and disturbing for me was that I felt DH was tricked by someone he really liked and admired. I think we ended up going to dinner just he and I after they left, and I''m pretty sure they didn''t even mention the dinner or made any excuse for not wanting to go to dinner. Very strange. And once DH told this guy he was not interested in Quixtar the guy seemed to lose interest in keeping in touch.