AGS Ideal vs Branded Super ideal H&A?

[jaysonsmom]

Hi I''m in the market for a RB around 2ct, and I''m trying to decide whether it''s worth the premium to get a branded H&A vs, a AGS ideal or GIA Ex/Ex stone? Can a non-branded non-H&A ideal cut be just as beautiful? Opinions?

I think for a branded H&A which no one would know but me, I''d have to drop the size of my purchase to a 1.7 ish stone.....

 

[yssie]

Date: 4/20/2010 1:09:28 PM
Author:jaysonsmom
Hi I''m in the market for a RB around 2ct, and I''m trying to decide whether it''s worth the premium to get a branded H&A vs, a AGS ideal or GIA Ex/Ex stone? Can a non-branded non-H&A ideal cut be just as beautiful? Opinions?

I think for a branded H&A which no one would know but me, I''d have to drop the size of my purchase to a 1.7 ish stone.....

Yes.


Having a H&A stone is A) mindclean, B) a great way to get a top-of-the-line stone easily, without having to dig through inventory. An excellent "near H&A" stone will be indistinguishable from a true H&A IRL, IMO.

 

[Lorelei]

Hi Jaysonsmom, its great to see you back!!!

A non h&a diamond can be as beautiful as a h&a assuming both have great proportions, ' true'h&a have crisp and precise optical symmetry which is responsible for the h&a patterning so if you had a ' near' h&a there might not be much visual difference unless you were looking for it with the patterning at close quarters, the overall performance again if the proportions were good could be comparable.

If you like, give us an idea of your budget and we can have a hunt around for you?

 

[HVVS]

Some of the "unbranded" ones might actually be superior symmetry and performance to some of the branded ones.

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Date: 4/20/2010 2:51:30 PM
Author: HVVS
Some of the 'unbranded' ones might actually be superior symmetry and performance to some of the branded ones.

Which symmetry are you talking about optical or physical?

What performance are you talking about?

Which brand are you questioning as being worse than some generics?

 

[Lula]

Date: 4/20/2010 4:15:22 PM
Author: ChunkyCushionLover

Date: 4/20/2010 2:51:30 PM

Author: HVVS

Some of the 'unbranded' ones might actually be superior symmetry and performance to some of the branded ones.

Which symmetry are you talking about optical or physical?


What performance are you talking about?


Which brand are you questioning as being worse than some generics?

Ditto CCL's questions.

Also, branded cuts (BGD Select, WF ACA, GOG Select, Crafted by Infinity-sold through vendors) provide the consumer not only with the assurance of top-notch cut, but also extra benefits, such as lifetime trade-in policies, buy-back policies, full data on the stones, including Sarin and Helium, as well as all images.

Beauty, of course, is in the eye of the beholder, but in my opinion, the larger the stone, the more top-notch cut "shows" because so much more of the structure of the stone is visible without the aid of a loupe (e.g., the structure of the arrows is clearly visible without magnification).

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 4/20/2010 2:51:30 PM
Author: HVVS
Some of the 'unbranded' ones might actually be superior symmetry and performance to some of the branded ones.

Hi HVVS

I just saw the comments above and was curious as to what you meant exactly? If you are referring to the brands often seen here such as Infinity, ACA and so forth then normally the reverse is true, these diamonds have both superior lab graded symmetry and optical symmetry patterning compared to non branded stones, however although it is true some non brands can also have excellent symmetries and performance, normally the branded stone will surpass these.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 4/20/2010 1:09:28 PM
Author:jaysonsmom
Hi I'm in the market for a RB around 2ct, and I'm trying to decide whether it's worth the premium to get a branded H&A vs, a AGS ideal or GIA Ex/Ex stone? Can a non-branded non-H&A ideal cut be just as beautiful? Opinions?

I think for a branded H&A which no one would know but me, I'd have to drop the size of my purchase to a 1.7 ish stone.....

J'smom...buy a well cut stone with the option to upgrade

cuz you AIN'T gonna stop till you reach 3+ct.

 

[Dreamer_D]

If I was not committed to branded cuts for my upgrade, I would *definitely* be going with a non H&A with ideal proportions. The savings are totally worth it.

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 4/20/2010 10:58:26 PM
Author: dreamer_d
If I was not committed to branded cuts for my upgrade, I would *definitely* be going with a non H&A with ideal proportions. The savings are totally worth it.

I can say this I believe without violating forum policy, if not, the moderator will kindly remove this post.

Several times we have sent diamonds to be compared to other diamonds, some much less expensive unbranded diamonds. When presented to the client without saying which is which, almost always our diamond is picked for its beauty. There is a benefit to a strictly produced branded diamond, and that is in both the consistency of the cutting and thus the beauty, and the value added benefits to the brand, such as trade up and buy back policies.

Value is more than just the price, it is the whole package.

Wink

 

[Karl_K]

Date: 4/20/2010 4:30:32 PM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 4/20/2010 2:51:30 PM

Author: HVVS

Some of the ''unbranded'' ones might actually be superior symmetry and performance to some of the branded ones.

Hi HVVS


I just saw the comments above and was curious as to what you meant exactly? If you are referring to the brands often seen here such as Infinity, ACA and so forth then normally the reverse is true, these diamonds have both superior lab graded symmetry and optical symmetry patterning compared to non branded stones, however although it is true some non brands can also have excellent symmetries and performance, normally the branded stone will surpass these.

HVVS is correct.
Not all brands are at the Infinity/aca/gog level
Even they can be matched by unbranded diamonds but it is much harder to do/find.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 4/20/2010 11:47:45 PM
Author: Wink

Date: 4/20/2010 10:58:26 PM
Author: dreamer_d
If I was not committed to branded cuts for my upgrade, I would *definitely* be going with a non H&A with ideal proportions. The savings are totally worth it.

I can say this I believe without violating forum policy, if not, the moderator will kindly remove this post.

Several times we have sent diamonds to be compared to other diamonds, some much less expensive unbranded diamonds. When presented to the client without saying which is which, almost always our diamond is picked for its beauty. There is a benefit to a strictly produced branded diamond, and that is in both the consistency of the cutting and thus the beauty, and the value added benefits to the brand, such as trade up and buy back policies.

Value is more than just the price, it is the whole package.

Wink

I actually I agree with you Wink, as evidenced by my purchase history. I overstated my point

My frugal moments -- which I was feeling when I posted -- make me want an unbranded cut. But I do adore my own personal branded cut and the policies that are associated with it.

That said, I suppose each buyer needs to weigh their own particular needs when deciding whether to buy and H&A or a non H&A. If I had a tight budget and wanted more than I could realistically afford, I would personally consider a non H&A diamond as one way to get there. But I would buy from a vendor who still offered upgrades etc. on such a stone.

 

[jaysonsmom]

Thank you for all your feedback. I tend to be the type that goes to professionals no matter how much more premium I have to shell out, that being said I'm not the Do-It-Yourself weekend home improvement type.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I would probably have more confidence in a branded H&A because I don't think I'd have the patience, and knowledge to sift through a ton of stones, and ESPECIALLY if I"m going to buy something sight unseen, I'd want to see as many reports and test results as I can. That being said, I'm leaning towards something like this BGD signature http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/diamond/diamond-detail/?product_id=AGS-1040397620032

I forgot to add, I have about a 20K budget, but would rather spend 15K, and buy dh somthing with the other 5K

 

[jaysonsmom]

Date: 4/21/2010 12:27:04 AM
Author: dreamer_d

That said, I suppose each buyer needs to weigh their own particular needs when deciding whether to buy and H&A or a non H&A. If I had a tight budget and wanted more than I could realistically afford, I would personally consider a non H&A diamond as one way to get there. But I would buy from a vendor who still offered upgrades etc. on such a stone.

Can you suggest a few PS vendors who offer upgrade policies on all their stones instead of only their branded H&A''s?

 

[yssie]

I believe JA will allow upgrade on all stones, but you have to spend a certain amount more?

 

[Dreamer_D]

Date: 4/21/2010 2:03:29 AM
Author: yssie
I believe JA will allow upgrade on all stones, but you have to spend a certain amount more?

Yes, double.

Expert selection stones from WF are also eligible for upgrades etc and are non H&A are they not?

 

[yssie]

WF will also still allow upgrades on certain virtual stones, but it's on a stone-by-stone basis and the upgrade policy may be conditional

 

[ChunkyCushionLover]

Date: 4/20/2010 4:25:50 PM
Author: sarap333

Date: 4/20/2010 4:15:22 PM
Author: ChunkyCushionLover

Date: 4/20/2010 2:51:30 PM

Author: HVVS

Some of the 'unbranded' ones might actually be superior symmetry and performance to some of the branded ones.

Which symmetry are you talking about optical or physical?


What performance are you talking about?


Which brand are you questioning as being worse than some generics?

Ditto CCL's questions.

Also, branded cuts (BGD Select, WF ACA, GOG Select, Crafted by Infinity-sold through vendors) provide the consumer not only with the assurance of top-notch cut, but also extra benefits, such as lifetime trade-in policies, buy-back policies, full data on the stones, including Sarin and Helium, as well as all images.

Beauty, of course, is in the eye of the beholder, but in my opinion, the larger the stone, the more top-notch cut 'shows' because so much more of the structure of the stone is visible without the aid of a loupe (e.g., the structure of the arrows is clearly visible without magnification).

Size matters, and ~2ct is certainly a size where IMO the differences should be noticeable.
I think the OP's question is a very valid one though if the price difference between the two is signifcantly large is it?
The question maybe should be Near HA (with complimentary PA/CA, TIC proportions and negligible leakage in Idealscope) from a PS vendor versus one of 5 PS vendor's HA branded lines.

Then I'm not sure what the answer would be and how many would see a significant difference and a Probable Premium Appropriate (PPA).

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 4/20/2010 11:56:39 PM
Author: Karl_K

Date: 4/20/2010 4:30:32 PM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 4/20/2010 2:51:30 PM

Author: HVVS

Some of the ''unbranded'' ones might actually be superior symmetry and performance to some of the branded ones.

Hi HVVS


I just saw the comments above and was curious as to what you meant exactly? If you are referring to the brands often seen here such as Infinity, ACA and so forth then normally the reverse is true, these diamonds have both superior lab graded symmetry and optical symmetry patterning compared to non branded stones, however although it is true some non brands can also have excellent symmetries and performance, normally the branded stone will surpass these.

HVVS is correct.
Not all brands are at the Infinity/aca/gog level
Even they can be matched by unbranded diamonds but it is much harder to do/find.

I know Pal, I meant if HVVS was doing a general comparison to the known brands here.

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 4/21/2010 12:27:04 AM
Author: dreamer_d

Date: 4/20/2010 11:47:45 PM
Author: Wink

Date: 4/20/2010 10:58:26 PM
Author: dreamer_d
If I was not committed to branded cuts for my upgrade, I would *definitely* be going with a non H&A with ideal proportions. The savings are totally worth it.

I can say this I believe without violating forum policy, if not, the moderator will kindly remove this post.

Several times we have sent diamonds to be compared to other diamonds, some much less expensive unbranded diamonds. When presented to the client without saying which is which, almost always our diamond is picked for its beauty. There is a benefit to a strictly produced branded diamond, and that is in both the consistency of the cutting and thus the beauty, and the value added benefits to the brand, such as trade up and buy back policies.

Value is more than just the price, it is the whole package.

Wink

I actually I agree with you Wink, as evidenced by my purchase history. I overstated my point

My frugal moments -- which I was feeling when I posted -- make me want an unbranded cut. But I do adore my own personal branded cut and the policies that are associated with it.

That said, I suppose each buyer needs to weigh their own particular needs when deciding whether to buy and H&A or a non H&A. If I had a tight budget and wanted more than I could realistically afford, I would personally consider a non H&A diamond as one way to get there. But I would buy from a vendor who still offered upgrades etc. on such a stone.

Now that I can agree with!

Wink