Advise about MIL

[allycat0303]

Hey ladies,

I need some opinons of something that has been ongoing since February. In early February, my grandfather passed away. This was a really hard time for me. A few days after his death (before the funeral) my husband and I went over to MIL''s house for the 1 year anniversary of FIL''s death. We were supposed to have dinner with his family. I really don''t know how the conversation started but his mother and sister started really getting on my husband''s case about BIL (he was not there at the dinner). BIL had a plan at that time which included going to Russia to pick up a mail order bride. Which my husband and I, and my other BIL thought was completely crazy. On a previous dinner, we had expressed our opinon. MIL and SIL were REALLY getting at us, saying we were disrespectful and should support BIL''s decision. In any case, most of it was directed toward my husband.

I got REALLY angry. First of all because BIL in question is totally racist. He''s made comments about black people, immigrants (as in ME) should not be allowed in this country. He is an uneducated, close-minded bigot. And I dislike him intensely. In any case, as MIL and SIL were going at my husband, I had ENOUGH. I can''t stand to be there when people are yelling at him. I can''t stand it when people attack him. In addition, my grandfather just died, and they said maybe 2 words about it (i.e sorry he died) and that''s it. I was not feeling up to this conversation. So I leaned over (we were at the dessert faze) and told my husband that I wanted to leave. IMMEDIATELY. Because I could feel myself losing it. He insisted that we stay until he finished his coffee.

About 5 minutes later, I lost it. I didn''t scream or anything, I just got up and told them I would be heading home, and that my husband could continue this conversation if he wanted. MIL and SIL said something in the sense that I was acting immature. Anyways we left. My grandfather''s funeral passed without a word from them. And then my birthday passed without a word from them.

And I am progressively more angry. For one thing, I realize that it was FIL''s anniversary of passing, but I feel that since my grandfather had just died, it merited a little more then "sorry''s he''s dead". In addition, we spent the dinner being yelled at because we didn''t endorse BIL''s plan to pick up a mail order bride (and any sane person would???? Incidently of COURSE that fell through and he was stuck with a plane ticket to Russia.

So my MIL has since apologized to my husband. And this weekend she is having yet another 1 year anniversary dinner for FIL (he passed away in February, but they are doing it again). And my husband was going to go. And honestly, I feel betrayed by this. One of the main reasons being that, what initially made me angry was that they were being unfair to my husband! And I got mad on his behalf and he''s now saying that "everything is fine" I feel like I was loyal to him in that moment, and he''s not returning the favor. And now he says things like, "Oh my mother is freaking out if I don''t go." Well. I told him he could go, but there''s a part of me that believes that if he does go, it will say a lot about our relationship. I think I will feel like it is a betrayal. Incidently, I think this is all manipulation on MIL''s part. I mean one of the BIL was NOT at the real 1 year anniversary dinner and nobody minded. I just feel like she''s trying to get between us.

So what do you think? I''m being a witch? Unreasonable? Where should I even go from here?

Thanks ladies, it''s been a very stressful situation for the past few months.

 

[junebug17]

I'm a little confused as to what you would like your husband to do. Do you want him to skip just this dinner, or do you want him to cut off all ties with his mother? I don't know ally, I know you came to his defense at the dinner and I admire you for that, but it sounds to me like this is more between him and his mother. She did apologize to him, and it sounds like he wants to maintain a relationship with her. I know you stuck up for him, but I don't know that he should have to choose between you and his mother for it. I'm thinking you may have to respect his wishes on this, and not take it personally that he still wants to see his mother. These are just the thoughts I had as I read your post, just my opinion given the facts you presented. I truly sympathize with you, his mother and sister don't sound like very pleasant people to be around, but they are your husband's family and you may just have to deal with them as best you can. Just my 2 cents.

eta: I am so very sorry about the loss of your grandfather.

 

[allycat0303]

Junebug,

I don''t want him to cut off ties to his mother, but I also don''t think it''s fair that he goes to dinner when I''m not invited/welcomed. I don''t even know HOW to deal with it. Basically originally it was a fight between him and his mother and sister. Then I got involved, and stuff was said. Now HE''s decided to kiss and make-up. And I''m left standing here at odds with his family. And they didn''t care enough to acknowledge a death, or apologize. I don''t know, it strikes me as unfair. Am I expected to apologize now?

But I do get your advice. I just don''t exactly know how I''m supposed to "deal with it as best I can".

 

[junebug17]

Date: 5/13/2010 5:15:21 PM
Author: allycat0303
Junebug,


I don't want him to cut off ties to his mother, but I also don't think it's fair that he goes to dinner when I'm not invited/welcomed. I don't even know HOW to deal with it. Basically originally it was a fight between him and his mother and sister. Then I got involved, and stuff was said. Now HE's decided to kiss and make-up. And I'm left standing here at odds with his family. And they didn't care enough to acknowledge a death, or apologize. I don't know, it strikes me as unfair. Am I expected to apologize now?


But I do get your advice. I just don't exactly know how I'm supposed to 'deal with it as best I can'.

Ok, in your first post you stated that you stood up and said you wanted to leave, and now you are mentioning that stuff was said. It's starting to sound like words were exchanged between you and them. Since I don't know what was said, only you can decide if an apology on your part is warranted.

Were you specifically not invited to this dinner? Was you husband told "Don't bring Ally, she's not welcome in this house"? If that's the case, then something definitely needs to be done to straighten that out, because that can't continue. You are his wife, and should be included. I'm thinking out loud, but you and your husband and his mother may need to sit down together and clear the air.

When I said deal with them as best you can, I basically meant that you are going to have to drastically lower your expectations of these people. I think it's awful they weren't more sympathetic to your loss, they sound insensitive and mean-spirited. But Ally, you can't change that. And I don't think your husband can either. These people are who they are. You are only setting yourself up for disappointment if you expect more from them. The only thing you can control is your reaction to their cold behavior, and you may just have to learn not to let them get to you. I know it's easier said than done, but for your own peace of mind you need to try.

eta: I don't think your husband should attend this dinner unless things are worked out from the last dinner.

 

[allycat0303]

June,

Well they called me immature for walking away for the conversation. They also said I was disrespectful (to my departed FIL) for leaving. There was also a sarcastic "Goodbye, don''t come back" at that point my husband became really angry and he said, "don''t talk to Ally like that" That was it. I didn''t say anything to this. I was on the verge of tears and left. Honestly, I think the situation was out of control. MIL was yelling at us, and she slammed dishes 3-4 times.

Since then, MIL and I have not spoken. SIL told my husband I was not welcome at their house (for the dinner or ever again). The last few months, I''ve been thinking about this, and our future. I''m not going to apologize. It would feel like begging for forgiveness when I don''t think I should be. I''ve actually been trying to map all of this out. I think my husband should go visit whenever he wants. But if we have children? She''s a very manipulative woman. I don''t want her saying bad things to me. Ugh. I have a headache just thinking about it.

 

[junebug17]

Oh, ok, thanks ally, I understand things a little better now. I''m so sorry things got that ugly, and that you are in this position. I understand now why you are so upset about your husband going to the dinner. How is your husband feeling about all of this? Is he upset about this estrangement? Maybe he can speak to them and try to at least get things to a point where everyone can at least be civil to one another. Someone will eventually have to make the first step. I agree that this situation will get even more complicated when you have children. It''s not helping that you are dealing with people with difficult personalities. Again, I''m so sorry about all of this, and hugs to you.

 

[Dannielle]

Hmm.. I would be quite irked at your husband. His family has clearly stated that you will never be welcome there and he doesn''t have an issue with that?

It seems to me that your MIL and SIL and trying to drive a wedge between you and your husband, and it hasn''t been hard to do.. I am all for trying to make family relationships work, but when one person (i.e MIL) explicitly states that you will never be welcome in her home again its hard to grin and bear it. Especially when in the future children may be involved.

His family are your family for as long as you are married, and it seems that they really have no clue how a family treats one another.

 

[Lilac]

Oh, Ally. I''m so sorry you have to deal with a MIL like that. Trust me, I absolutely know how difficult it is.

DH and I have been together for almost 6 years and we got married last year. My in-laws were never nice to me. I always put a smile on my face and tried my best to be friendly, nice, and the perfect daughter-in-law. I always figured at least I could say I tried my best to make it a decent relationship and if they didn''t want to put in the effort it was their own fault. DH completely agrees that I have done everything I can and beyond to have a relationship with them and they just simply aren''t nice. Since we got married we had a fake happy relationship with his parents (we act all smiley and happy, but they talk about us behind our backs and they are passive-aggressive and critical, so when we hear they do those things, DH and I get upset). As sad as it makes me that we will never have a genuine good relationship, the "fake friendly" worked for us. It was certainly better than ignoring each other or being outright mean and hostile.

Then around two months ago my MIL caused a ton of trouble. It''s a very long story, I would rather not go into details (it would take me an hour to write it all out). She did and said a whole lot of things, DH got upset, so she decided she wasn''t speaking to him. In the middle of all of that, I got into my top choice grad school and she never called me to congratulate me. She also didn''t acknowledge our anniversary and then blamed *us* for not calling them. When she finally called to say congrats on getting into grad school (after being asked to multiple times by DH because he said I was hurt that she hadn''t called) I had had enough. It had been 6 weeks since she found out I got in, and after 6 years of putting up with her, I had just had enough. I stayed very calm, kept my voice at a regular level and did not raise it at all, and simply stated to her that if she had really wanted to congratulate me on getting in, she would have called when she found out 6 weeks ago. MIL completely LOST IT when I said that. She started screaming and yelling, *shrieking* at me "how dare I be so disrespectful" and she has always been so wonderful to me and I''ve been awful and I never cared about her and I "stole" her son away, etc etc. She told me to "stop this crap" and cursed at me multiple times. She essentially went on to blame me for everything that goes wrong in everyone''s lives and she even managed to insult my mother in the process of her ranting and raving. I made sure to keep my calm and I did not once raise my voice, I pointed out to her that she was screaming at me and I didn''t think I deserved that, and I said I needed to go because I had nothing left to say.

FIL called my husband that night and lectured him saying he should talk to me about what happened because "how dare his wife speak to his mother that way" and that MIL was "recovering from the verbal beating I gave her."

DH said there are two sides to every story and he won''t listen to anyone talk about me that way and he ended the conversation.

After going back and forth for a long time, finally we "resolved" things. I put that into quotation marks because I don''t really think anything is resolved but we are back to the "fake friendly" relationship we used to have. She demanded an apology, I refused. My husband told her to stop asking for one because I shouldn''t have to apologize nor would I apologize when I wasn''t the one screaming and cursing and wasn''t the one who did anything wrong. She told me how disrespectful I was, I tuned her out because I wasn''t interested in getting into another argument. For a couple weeks I refused to go to their house because I just had no interest in seeing people who could treat me that way. I told DH he should speak to them all he wants (and I encouraged him to talk to them because I want him to have a relationship with them) but when it came to me, I needed time to deal with the things she said to me before I went to see her again. Finally recently we saw them for Mother''s Day and we pretended everything was fine. It''s not fine and probably never will be, but I can''t deal with her and neither can DH if we actually tell her we''re still upset. For us, it''s better to smile and bite our tongues than it is to actually actively fight.

I''m not sure why I shared that whole story - maybe so you know you''re not alone with the crazy MIL. I know how you feel, I know how frustrating it is, and I wish I had an answer how to make it better. I''ve learned to just smile and bite my tongue and limit my time with them. "Fake friendly" works for us for now. At least if she *is* nasty, I know I wasn''t the one who caused the problem if I''m being friendly towards her. Although, as you said, it''s going to be even more difficult and complicated one day when we have kids.

Good luck with your MIL, and feel free to vent here whenever you want - I do really understand how you feel!

 

[RaiKai]

I know a very good and experienced marital therapist who once talked to me about how one of the biggest stressors on a relationship...up there with the money...is toxic or interfering in-laws AND how you as a team deal with toxic in-laws is a factor in how your relationship will succeed.

The key here being it is not that you HAVE toxic in-laws that is the problem. Lots of us have nutbar relatives - ha - and no say in that. The issue here is that your husband is sending them the message they can interfere and you and he are not a team -that *you* are not family. To me it is abysmal on his part that he seems to show by attending this dinner - to which you are not invited - that he does not support you and they can do this.

This does not mean agreeing with you if you are being unreasonable (I do not think you are) but it does mean letting his family know that he supports you as an individual - as his wife - and he is not going to stand against you, as he is doing here.

And you are right - it will get worse when children come along if the boundaries are not established NOW. DH must do this. Period. And I find it saddening he has let it go on like this for so long.

I see a lot of these sorts of situations in friends families..and some of DHs extended family where certain people will not talk to certain people because of these sorts of issues. It sounds painful, stressful and just exhausting. I despise this kind of drama!

My experience is far less dramatic. Before we married MIL had a small panic attack on some stuff I won''t get into and she made some assumptions about me based on something he had told his family. She loves me but can get into a spin at times! DH immediately made sure to tell her her assumptions were way off base..that what he said had to do with what HE wanted and let her know he stood by me and so on. She immediately calmed and is great and is excited to have me in the family. But if he had not done that it could easily have spiraled out of control.

 

[Lilac]

Date: 5/13/2010 7:35:15 PM
Author: RaiKai
I know a very good and experienced marital therapist who once talked to me about how one of the biggest stressors on a relationship...up there with the money...is toxic or interfering in-laws AND how you as a team deal with toxic in-laws is a factor in how your relationship will succeed.

--

DH immediately made sure to tell her her assumptions were way off base..that what he said had to do with what HE wanted and let her know he stood by me and so on. She immediately calmed and is great and is excited to have me in the family. But if he had not done that it could easily have spiraled out of control.

RaiKai, I completely agree with you that it''s not always about the in-laws and what they do, it''s more about how you and your spouse DEAL with the in-laws that can make or break whether or not they cause friction in the marriage. The way a couple deals with the interfering in-laws is the most important thing.

However, I just want to point out that while your MIL calmed down when your DH set her straight, unfortunately not all of us have MILs like that. I am taking a class right now about marriage and families and my professor said something that really stuck with me when we were discussing in-laws and toxic relatives and friends - she said, "You cannot reason with unreasonable people."

While you are lucky enough to have a MIL that loves you and calmed down when your DH explained what was going on and therefore it didn''t spiral out of control, some of us have very unreasonable MILs that wouldn''t calm down no matter how things are explained to them. My husband has defended me from Day 1 and stood by me through everything, but his parents always think the worst (of both me and of him). They are extremely unreasonable, and unfortunately neither my husband nor I see them changing anytime soon.

 

[RaiKai]

Oh Lilac...I know, that is why I cautioned it was a far less extreme example and was only used as an example of how a spouse can handle it. My point was that DH was very clear with MIL that he supported me. And if she had *not* calmed down he would have stood by what he said. DH has some very extreme family feuds in his extended family and he has seen how they get that way.

Believe me, I know of a lot of situations similar to yours and know they are difficult. While MIL may remain spun up, it does not detract from fact DH can still show his family he will not support that treatment of his wife (as your DH does).

 

[Lilac]

Date: 5/13/2010 9:31:28 PM
Author: RaiKai
Oh Lilac...I know, that is why I cautioned it was a far less extreme example and was only used as an example of how a spouse can handle it. My point was that DH was very clear with MIL that he supported me. And if she had *not* calmed down he would have stood by what he said. DH has some very extreme family feuds in his extended family and he has seen how they get that way.

Believe me, I know of a lot of situations similar to yours and know they are difficult. While MIL may remain spun up, it does not detract from fact DH can still show his family he will not support that treatment of his wife (as your DH does).

I totally agree. MIL doesn't have to change her mind (because as I think we can all agree, sometimes people are just unreasonable and there's nothing anyone can do about it) but the important thing is DH standing up for his wife and sticking by her.

Ally, I don't know if your MIL will ever change her ways, but the most important thing is your husband sticking by your side. If your MIL or SIL says you are not welcome in their house, I think your husband should say he doesn't want to come and will not come without you. You are his wife and if you are not welcome there and if they can't treat you with some decency, then I would think your husband wouldn't want to be there either.

ETA: Ally - I don't think he should stop speaking to his family altogether (in fact, I think he should continue having a relationship with them because otherwise he may come to resent you one day, even though it isn't your fault). I just think he should tell his family in no uncertain terms that they *cannot* speak badly of you because you are his wife. They can talk to him about other things, but they cannot say negative things about you to him.

 

[PumpkinPie]

if they have told your husband that you are not welcome there, he should not go. That`s it in a nutshell for me - you are his primary family now and that must have priority.

 

[Prana]

I agree with Maevie.

 

[Haven]

Date: 5/13/2010 11:42:46 PM
Author: Maevie
if they have told your husband that you are not welcome there, he should not go. That`s it in a nutshell for me - you are his primary family now and that must have priority.

I agree.

If your husband does go to this dinner, that will probably be the start of his family''s attempts to drive a big wedge between the two of you.

I think RaiKai''s wisdom regarding HOW you deal with nutbar relatives (love that term, by the way) is right on. My father has a very bizarre, manipulative family, and my parents were NEVER on the same page as to how to deal with them. My mother insisted that she and my father move our family OUT OF STATE to get away from them many years ago, and that is how they ended up moving from Florida back to Chicago. They were that bad. I can recall HUNDREDS of fights between my parents about his family, if not thousands. It would have been so much easier on them if they had agreed on how to deal with the crazies together.

SO, that being said, my husband and I have actually had numerous discussions about how to deal with all of the crazies we are blessed to have in both our families. We agreed a long time ago that we have to be united, and that has really made it easier to deal with family issues. And trust me, there have been issues. If you and your husband could just *agree* to deal with all family issues as a united front, that will seriously make so many things easier for you two, it really will. This does mean that sometimes I have to bend to make my husband happy when we''re dealing with his crazies, and vice versa when we''re dealing with mine, but in all instances we act as a team and nobody is going to drive a wedge between us with their nuttiness.

Good luck. I know it''s tough. I could populate a small island with all the wackos in our family. I really could. You have my complete and utter empathy here.

 

[mimzy]

ally, i can relate....sort of. my in-laws and i are not exactly on the same page (i think that's the nicest way i can say it!) and it has been the primary source of tension between DH and I . They are very demanding and passive aggressive and DH is vveerrrryyyy understanding and accommodating, whereas my patience is much thinner. There have been multiple occasions when DH will make the trek across state to go see them and i will stay at home, simply because i am too tired to deal with it. While I think it's ridiculous that he does bend over like he does for his parents, i've accepted that it's his choice, his relationship, and i only have to let it affect me to a certain degree. I can say no,even if he doesn't,and it's no skin off my back, no matter what they think of me (or even what my husband might think of me for it in that moment). Yes we are family and a team and blah blah blah, but we're not one person and we do come from different backgrounds and we've found that we can have two different stances on this issue and not let it drive a huge wedge between us. We hash out specific things that come up and dealy them individually, and make it a point not to let the 'theme' of THEM vs. ME gain too much momentum. He has his reasons and i have mine and we don't see eye to eye, but we've learned to respect each other in this regard and we don't have any love lost between us.

BUT

when they start to cross the line and disrespect me, i know that my husband will stick up for me. is he going to end his relationship with them over it? No way, but he let's them know it's not okay and that's that. it's never got so bad where they ban me from their home (i doubt it ever will, their brand of crazy is more generalized, not directed specifically toward me......usually), but I know that DH would let them know that until they apologized they wouldn't be seeing much of him, despite the lengths he usually goes to please them. If it ever did get to the point where them and i weren't on speaking terms, i feel like DH would probably only see them on occasion...sporadically for lunches, etc...things that i wouldn't necessarily be at to begin with - NOT family dinners that I'm specifically not invited to.

Bottom line, it's absurd that your husband won't acknowledge his parent's disregard of you, no matter how hard it is for him. He has to draw a line SOMEWHERE. If not here and now, when? What do they have to do to make him say something?? If/when you guys have kids, the game is going to change and he is going to have to respect the boundaries that YOU set for your kids and his mother...and it sounds like he needs to start practicing that discipline and assertiveness now.

 

[allycat0303]

Liliac: Oh my gosh, your situation was so much worse!!! I can''t believe that you were able to let it go. Just hearing about it makes my blood boil. You are totally a better, bigger person then I am.

I totally agree that he shouldn''t cut off all contact. That''s not even a question. Just this dinner thing really makes me mad. I feel like it''s her first attempt to be manipulative (and she is very, very manipulative). So I don''t want him to go to THIS dinner. All subsequent dinners, I don''t think I will care. He''s talked to his family many times on the phone since the falling out happened, but this is her first attempt.

Haven: It sounds like you two have worked out a terrific system. I really WISH that this was the attitude my husband would take, but it really isn''t. I''m very envious of you. I personally feel the way you do. That we are a team, we need to stick together. The sad part is that my husband does NOT feel the same way. But I knew this before I married him, because we have had instances before where I felt he would not stick with me. And it''s the opposite with me. I am very loyal, even if I am at odds with my family. He just isn''t like that. It makes me really sad to write that, but he was like that before we got married. I walked into this with my eyes wide open. It just kind of sucks.

Mimzy: I shudder to think about the kids. I KNOW she''s going to try to use my kids to manipulate the situation. LUCKILY at the moment I''m not hot on kids, so my husband (who wants them) is aware that it''s going to take a lot for me to have kids. And trust me, the boundaries are going to be non-negotiable. I have to agree that we are WAY to different. I personally do NOT agree with the way she raised the children, and my kids will NOT be raised with the same values. (i.e when I convinced my husband to go back to school to become an engineer, his mom spent 3 hours trying to convince him to take a job at a MEAT packing plant, because that was a STABLE job) they don''t value education. And EVERY occasion is an excuse to get drunk. At the 1 year anniversary of his father''s death, most of them got totally drunk. Uhmm...ok.

So my husband isn''t going. But I''m still upset. He''s passively agressively giving me all sorts of attitude. And I''m really mad that he doesn''t think of how this makes me feel. It''s kind of a fight I don''t even think we should be having. I just wish he would see how this makes me feel. Obviously she is trying to drive a wedge between us. I''m not invited but he HAS to be there. They have postponed it 2 because he was Italy. Funny how his other brother doesn''t have to be there

. I am many things, but I''m not an idiot.

Thanks gals. I feel better just venting.

 

[Haven]

Oh Ally, I''m so sorry.

Do you think he may change his mind about the team thing? I feel like that is a really big deal.

 

[brazen_irish_hussy]

Ally, I am so sorry about this, I can only offer you my experience.

My MIL is also manipulitive and she has borderline personality disorder, so she has some serious problems. She runs the family and everyone did what they were told, until DH met me. After time with my family, he realized how many problems there were in his and started to pull away. His mother reacted by saying and doing some things to break us up that I have promised never to mention because he was so bothered by it. After 3 years together, it was clear things were just no going to work. First, I told him I could no longer stay there over night, it was just too much and he agreed. As things got worse, people in my life started begging me not to go at all as they were worried about what would happen to me, although I never felt threatend. DH and I had some fights and we came to an agreement, he could talk to his family and be with his family, including holidays, but I would not. We spent a number of holidays apart because of it, but I felt it was his choice as it was his family and I didn''t like it, but I have no right to tell him what he can and cannot do with his family.

It has gotten so bad that he has not spoken with his mother in over a year, but he still has horrible nightmares about their fights. But I could never have made him do this, it had to be him and only him making this decision.

If it were me, I would explain why it is important to you that he not go and how it makes you feel. If he is on the same page, great. If not, then there is really nothing you can do. You do not want to be the one seperating him from his family and if you have to force him to not go, it will create the wedge you are trying to avoid.

 

[Amzizzle]

Date: 5/14/2010 11:10:54 AM
Author: Haven

Date: 5/13/2010 11:42:46 PM

Author: Maevie

if they have told your husband that you are not welcome there, he should not go. That`s it in a nutshell for me - you are his primary family now and that must have priority.

I agree.


If your husband does go to this dinner, that will probably be the start of his family''s attempts to drive a big wedge between the two of you.


I think RaiKai''s wisdom regarding HOW you deal with nutbar relatives (love that term, by the way) is right on. My father has a very bizarre, manipulative family, and my parents were NEVER on the same page as to how to deal with them. My mother insisted that she and my father move our family OUT OF STATE to get away from them many years ago, and that is how they ended up moving from Florida back to Chicago. They were that bad. I can recall HUNDREDS of fights between my parents about his family, if not thousands. It would have been so much easier on them if they had agreed on how to deal with the crazies together.


SO, that being said, my husband and I have actually had numerous discussions about how to deal with all of the crazies we are blessed to have in both our families. We agreed a long time ago that we have to be united, and that has really made it easier to deal with family issues. And trust me, there have been issues. If you and your husband could just *agree* to deal with all family issues as a united front, that will seriously make so many things easier for you two, it really will. This does mean that sometimes I have to bend to make my husband happy when we''re dealing with his crazies, and vice versa when we''re dealing with mine, but in all instances we act as a team and nobody is going to drive a wedge between us with their nuttiness.


Good luck. I know it''s tough. I could populate a small island with all the wackos in our family. I really could. You have my complete and utter empathy here.

ditto

 

[Bliss]

I'm sorry, Ally. My opinion on looney tunes family members is this: family's family. But my new "family" - supercedes everyone and everything. When we took vows, it was "What God has put together, let no man put asunder." We took it literally... it is WRONG to try to split a couple up or to drive a wedge between them. People who truly love you will support your marriage, not put stress upon it. That's a selfish love, and it's not the kind of love I'm interested in fostering.

But let's face it. Family members do love us. We need to respect that. And they are flawed human beings like the rest of us. Usually, they will come around once you put up a united front and show them definitively that NOTHING can come between you. DH's mom tried it in the beginning - and he told her that he would NEVER speak to her again if she tried to create drama between us. And he was serious. He made it absolutely clear that I was the most important woman in his life. And since then, she has come around completely and we have a great relationship. Hmmmm... do you think this is like the pack animal theory? People, like animals, when unsure of their place in the pack tend to be unhappier, fight more and have anxiety? Maybe if it's made clear re: who the Alpha female is, his mom will fall in line and be happier overall with the boundaries drawn?

Unfortunately, some MILs are beyond rehabilitation and will always be this way. You can either learn to grin and bear it in your own way, suffer in silence and seethe or limit your contact with her for the rest of your life. People at that age are very hard to change and they rarely see the viewpoints of others. In any of the above scenarios, it sure would feel a LOT better on your end if your DH supported YOU. Then, it would be more bearable. I think the part that hurts the most is that he's not taking a stand one way or another. He should - if he took vows, he has only ONE side to take and that's yours. Maybe it will just take time. I kind of feel bad for your DH. I feel like his mother is emotionally abusive and manipulative - and this has probably scarred him up until his adulthood. So he's not thinking clearly because he IS damaged from his relationship with her. He cannot draw clear lines and probably has trouble separating from her. You know? So I would also keep this in mind and not get so angry because he is your husband. Maybe you can help each other.

 

[allycat0303]

Well, a completely horrible weekend but it''s done. My husband didn''t end up going to said dinner, but it was such an awful weekend. I think we fought the every single moment of the day. He says he just feels completely guilty, and he heaped blame on me for not letting him go, for the whole situation (which incidently, I am adament...is NOT my fault). I feel like it''s pretty darn unfair because I really didn''t do anything wrong, and I feel like I''m being punished.

In any case, nothing got resolved but at least it''s behind us. Today he''s going to have supper at his mom''s house. I am trying to be adult (haven''t made a comment yet), I''m just going to pretend they don''t exist and limit all (if possible) contact with his family. I''m 30 years old. I think at my age, I have the right to decide who I want, and DO NOT want in my life. Similarly, he is also enough of an adult to make his own decisions. And really, after this weekend, I don''t feel up to doing battle on this again.

I''m a little concerned that she will spend the night bad mouthing me, and then he''ll come home and be annoyed and we''ll fight all over again. Ideally, he goes, comes back, and nothing happens. I can only wish.

Thanks for letting me vent ladies!

 

[tyty333]

Date: 5/18/2010 3:44:12 PM
Author: allycat0303
Well, a completely horrible weekend but it''s done. My husband didn''t end up going to said dinner, but it was such an awful weekend. I think we fought the every single moment of the day. He says he just feels completely guilty, and he heaped blame on me for not letting him go, for the whole situation (which incidently, I am adament...is NOT my fault). I feel like it''s pretty darn unfair because I really didn''t do anything wrong, and I feel like I''m being punished.

In any case, nothing got resolved but at least it''s behind us. Today he''s going to have supper at his mom''s house. I am trying to be adult (haven''t made a comment yet), I''m just going to pretend they don''t exist and limit all (if possible) contact with his family. I''m 30 years old. I think at my age, I have the right to decide who I want, and DO NOT want in my life. Similarly, he is also enough of an adult to make his own decisions. And really, after this weekend, I don''t feel up to doing battle on this again.

I''m a little concerned that she will spend the night bad mouthing me, and then he''ll come home and be annoyed and we''ll fight all over again. Ideally, he goes, comes back, and nothing happens. I can only wish.

Thanks for letting me vent ladies!

Ally,
Its clear this is driving a wedge between you and your husband. Maybe you can come to some agreement with your husband that he goes over there
for dinner occasionally...you stay home and watch a good chick flick, or go shopping, or do whatever you like to do! He spends time with his disfunctional
family and you get to have some fun free time (you both win). He needs to make it clear to his family that if they say anything to disparage you that he
is leaving, and he needs to not discuss you in specifics. My husband goes to his parents everyother week or so and I love that I dont have to go.

If you do feel that you need to go as a united front then it might be better if you just dont put your feelings out there about other family
members. Kind of like religion and abortion...just dont discuss it and dont get pulled into conversations. If they ask you what you
think about his brother going to Russia to get a bride...just give them a "whatever" type of answer or "I hear its beautfiul in Russia this time
of year", etc. I know you may have a different opinion about his brother and what he does but if it doesnt affect you personally then I wouldnt
bother to offer an opinion. I''m just trying to give you some ideas that might help you to get through some of the difficulties of dealing with
a family (MIL/SIL) that are very different from you. My MIL critized me about what I was doing with our new born son with respect to
getting him to sleep though the night. After that, when she asked how he was sleeping...I responded with "just fine...typical new born"
and changed the subject. It sort of shut her down and I didnt have to listen to her telling me what I should or shouldnt be doing (or
critizing me). If you come up with some short but non-commital kind of responses they may come in handy in the future. I wish you all
the best. Moving farther away would be my next piece of advice but I know that may not be in the books. I just hope that you can
find something that works for both you and your husband because this is clearly not going to be the end of it.

 

[Kaleigh]

Gaahhh, where to begin.

I well remember all the threads for your FIL, asking for prayers. You were on top of his care... If anything, you made things happen for him, and was his number one Advocate... Your MIL is way off the mark... ( in so many ways..)

OK deep breath... YOU have to speak UP for YOURSELF. NOW would be a good time...


It's all in the delivery..

My MIL tried to pull some shitty stuff lately, we have had our ups and downs..

Ya know what?? I called her on it, flat out.

I spent the next day, Mother's day with her. I was expecting tension from her, but nope. All I got was respect.


It's been a work in progress..


Your MIL needs to RESPECT you. Cultural differences or not.....

We are so happy to have you alive, after your accident...

I can't come to understand why these people act the way they do...

But as always will keep you in my prayers...

You were one of the first to be nice to me when I joined PS ages ago....

And back then, omg, rough waters... LOL!!!

HUGS friend!!!

 

[allycat0303]

Hey Lisa,

You''ve hit the nail on the head about why I was so hurt. I think I was really there for the family when FIL passed away. And I did stuff, that I haven''t talked about too. So to have them treat my grandfather''s death without a word, I felt it was a slap in the face. I think the relationship was very one sided, and I decided *I had enough* I also worked really hard to get SIL and BIL, on a list for gastric banding procedure (the waiting list is 5 years in Canada) by speaking with the surgeon, and campaigning on their behalf. SIL waited 1 year and BIL 1.5 years, and honestly, BIL thanked me, and just the simple acknowledgement was very appreciated. SIL. NOTHING. Not once did she say, "Thanks for thinking of me. Thanks for working to get this for me". I''m very resentful on many levels. I think that there has been a culmination of slights, annoyances, that have pushed over the edge.

I''m glad you stood up to your MIL. I''m surprised that she didn''t give you any attitude about it. Kudos to you. I know you''ve been married for a LONG time, and it''s STILL a work in progress. I swear MIL can be so frustrating!

 

[nkarma]

Date: 5/24/2010 6:12:16 PM
Author: allycat0303
Hey Lisa,

You''ve hit the nail on the head about why I was so hurt. I think I was really there for the family when FIL passed away. And I did stuff, that I haven''t talked about too. So to have them treat my grandfather''s death without a word, I felt it was a slap in the face. I think the relationship was very one sided, and I decided *I had enough* I also worked really hard to get SIL and BIL, on a list for gastric banding procedure (the waiting list is 5 years in Canada) by speaking with the surgeon, and campaigning on their behalf. SIL waited 1 year and BIL 1.5 years, and honestly, BIL thanked me, and just the simple acknowledgement was very appreciated. SIL. NOTHING. Not once did she say, ''Thanks for thinking of me. Thanks for working to get this for me''. I''m very resentful on many levels. I think that there has been a culmination of slights, annoyances, that have pushed over the edge.

I''m glad you stood up to your MIL. I''m surprised that she didn''t give you any attitude about it. Kudos to you. I know you''ve been married for a LONG time, and it''s STILL a work in progress. I swear MIL can be so frustrating!

I am not a newlywed...will be one in 3.5 months, but I just wanted to let you know that the weirdest and most out of character I have ever seen normal people act is when there is a death. People don''t know how to deal with it or what to say or do. I cut a lot of friends out of my life after my father passed because I thought they were not being caring enough. When I think about it now they actually were being supportive in their own way or probably had no idea what to say. If I got mad at everyone who I thought didn''t act appropriately or say what I wanted, then I wouldn''t have any family or friends because most of them didn''t even say anything to me. These are people that are the most supportive and caring in other situations, but when it came to death, they just couldn''t or wouldn''t be for whatever reason. Humanity is weird about death though, they don''t want really want to think about their or anyone else''s mortality. Because of that, as far as the grandfather thing, I would try to cut them some slack. I truly don''t think they are intentionally trying to be hurtful to you by not bringing it up. For some deranged reason, even though it is probably the opposite, they probably think bringing it up will make you sad and think about your grandpa, when they don''t realize you are thinking about him all the time anyways. Also whatever words they can say to you they feel probably isn''t enough. Whenever someone I know has a close relative die, I try really hard to think of something comforting because I have been through it before, but nothing I can think of really portrays how I feel and the utter importance of the situation.

Others have given you great advice about handling them as a team and such. Hope you guys work this out so there isn''t any more fighting.

 

[luvshinyrocks]

Well, a completely horrible weekend but it''s done. My husband didn''t end up going to said dinner, but it was such an awful weekend. I think we fought the every single moment of the day. He says he just feels completely guilty, and he heaped blame on me for not letting him go, for the whole situation (which incidently, I am adament...is NOT my fault). I feel like it''s pretty darn unfair because I really didn''t do anything wrong, and I feel like I''m being punished.

In any case, nothing got resolved but at least it''s behind us. Today he''s going to have supper at his mom''s house. I am trying to be adult (haven''t made a comment yet), I''m just going to pretend they don''t exist and limit all (if possible) contact with his family. I''m 30 years old. I think at my age, I have the right to decide who I want, and DO NOT want in my life. Similarly, he is also enough of an adult to make his own decisions. And really, after this weekend, I don''t feel up to doing battle on this again.

I've been through a very similar thing with my in-laws, and I had this same attitude when things first started to go downhill. Every time he wanted to go visit them, have dinner, etc., it made me feel very angry and upset. What I finally realized is that HE has to deal with his family, and if I yell at him and tell him he doesn't have my "permission" to see them, then 1) I'm allowing his family to come between us, and 2) I'm being manipulative and I'm no better than MIL is.

Here is what I did. First, I acknowledged that I could not make my husband's decisions for him w/r/t to his family. Then we sat down and and discussed the logistics of our relationship - as a couple - with his parents, and figured out something that we could both live with. He now goes over there about once a week, and I usually only go on special occasions for short periods of time. You cannot and should not stop him from seeing his family - perhaps, if they continue to be as unreasonable as they have been he will eventually decide that he no longer WANTS to see them, but he HAS to come to that conclusion on his own. Unless you can let him do that, this issue will continue to drive a wedge between the two of you - even if you manage to pressure him into never seeing them, he may resent you for it later.

I really don't think that you personally cutting them off completely (much as you want to) is going to do anything but cause problems in your marriage. At some point it sounds like you're going to have kids, and your husband is probably going to want them to know their grandparents. If you can establish a minimal level of respect between you and MIL it will make your life a lot easier.

If he has a problem asserting himself with his parents in general and drawing boundaries with them (it sounds like that's possible) then that's something else you should talk to him about. As much as you shouldn't try to control his relationship with his parents, he has to absolutely realize that YOU are his family now and his relationship with you comes first.

Someone else gave you the "smile and nod" advice. This is really good advice IMO. Personally, I limit contact with my in-laws to about once every couple of months if I can get away with it. It makes their nutty ideas easier to deal with, and then I can just smile and nod and know that I don't have to see them again for awhile. If my MIL brought up Russian mail-order brides I wouldn't even feel the need to express an opinion - which probably would have averted the fight in your situation in the first place. You can't reason with crazy people!

If all else fails, just keep on looking forward to the day when you can put the old bat in a home!

 

[diva rose]

Aw..Ally - big hugs!

I feel your frustrations. My DH's family and I aren't on the best of terms. My MIL and SIL were caught talking bad things about me behind my back and making things up. Long story but to cut it short, DH stood his ground after many moments of frustrations (1 year of it from my part). Looking back, if DH stood his ground from the first moment his mother opened her mouth - things would have been a lot better.

Your DH isn't being fair. He needs to place himself in your shoes. You were defending him.
As your husband he needs to defend and protect you. He should never let anyone treat you like that.

He needs to talk to his family. Put his foot down and man up.
He is going to be a dad one day, how can he expect you to protect the children when he can't defend his wife against his mom?

They don't need to like you but there is no need to be rude and mean.

He needs to make it clear that he won't tolerate bad behaviour from them towards you. It will be hard for him but he needs to do that otherwise you'll have more problems in the future.

Your MIL is always going to forgive her son and place all blame on you.

BTW she should have apologised to you also not just your DH.

Unfortunately not everyone is blessed with a MIL who will actually treat their daughter in laws like their own.

 

[StonieGrl]

Both my husband and I come from families of malignant narcissists---they operate on a spectrum of behavior, sometimes one of them is pretty okay, and sometimes way off the charts. We never know what kind of inappropriate whack behavior is coming our way.

I don't require my husband to do ANYTHING, think anything, or feel any particular way about my family and he extends to me the same kindness. We limit the length of time with them because we have seen that they are like small children: They hold it together pretty well for shorter periods of time, long dinners, etc etc they can't handle too well and the bad behavior comes oozing out.

Where I had the most concern with your recounting of that dinner was when you asked your husband (or fiance, sorry, to get this part wrong) to leave and he HAD TO HAVE HIS COFFEE? Is he the King? Must HRH leave the table before anyone else can? (Just kidding around but you get my drift here.)

That was an unkindness to you, that is how one responds to a child hankering to go home, and it was such a simple request: Dear, I'm not feeling well right now (for goodness sakes, your grandfather had just died) and I would like to make a dignified and tandem exit.

I'm sure you have coffee at home too.

I would worry about this: If such an easy and simple request gets you a smack on the nose with the rolled up newspaper, what about the bigger things? And they will come as time goes by.

Somewhere it must be stated up front and clearly that you come first.

You're clearly getting involved in a family of narcissists at the very least, better have some ground rules going in.

 

[Italiahaircolor]

I think you have every right to be upset...it hurts to see those we love hurt, embarrassed, yelled at. Clearly you're on an emotional bender with the loss of your grandfather and the lack of sympathy from your in laws isn't helping the matter much.

However, with that said, I'd totally drop out of the crux of the problem (the mail order bride)...

This is your BIL's life. You don't like him, so who cares what he does or who he marries or what his reasons are? Those things don't effect you. If his choices mean more distance, then so be it. Fine. No loss. But it's not worth getting yourself worked up over...clearly you have bigger things to worry about and work past.

If your husband wants to be with his family, let him go...you're your own person, and you don't have to join him if they make you unhappy. Fake a headache. It doesn't have to be that way forever, but when you're so angry sometimes it's best to take a time out. That doesn't mean a wedge in the relationship...if you're strong as a couple, missing one dinner won't tear you apart...but consider it a mental health break.

Basically, what I'm saying is...if your husband is going to tolerate being treated like that by his family, thats his choice and you can have your opinions on that, but you can't change his reactions. You have the option to bail out, the choice to create distance, so if you're really so unhappy, take it.

And I'm really sorry to hear about your grandfather, I hope feeling better.