shape
carat
color
clarity

Advise about color/clarity trade-off

KA

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
127
We just ordered a diamond from blue nile, ideal cut, F color, SI2 clarity. The alternative at similar price was ideal cut, H color, SI1 clarity. We still have the option of changing our minds. What do you recommend, better color or better clarity? Do you have recommendations on where to buy from instead of blue nile? We thought that was the best place, but advise would be welcome.
 

nfowife

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 15, 2011
Messages
544
Blue Nile does not have images of its inventory so you don't know if the SI2 you purchased is eye clean to your specs or if the inclusions are visible. Same with the H/SI1.
Vendors often recommended here are Whiteflash, James Allen, Brian Gavin Diamonds, and Good Old Gold. They have pictures and idealscope images of their stones so you can see it before you buy it. Prices are often better than Blue Nile and they specialize in ideal cuts (in-house stones only).
Blue Nile has a good return policy IIRC so you can certainly stick with them and see upon receipt if the stone is to your liking before looking elsewhere. What is the GIA report # and weight of the stone you purchased? And what price did you pay? We can help you determine if you paid a fair price for the stone you purchased or if you are interested, show you other comparable stones within your budget.
 

skphotoimages

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Dec 1, 2005
Messages
188
If you call blue nile, they will have a gemologist look at the diamond for you and give you their opinion of both diamonds. I did that once with them when I had it narrowed down to two diamonds and the guy told me how visible the inclusions were in the stones and it helped. Also have you looked at the inclusion plot of both diamonds on the GIA or AGS report. Did you know you can also call them and they will hold both diamonds for a day or so while you decide?
Is it a round? If it's a round I personally would do H SI1.
 

slg47

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 4, 2010
Messages
9,667
blue nile does not provide images which is why we generally do not recommend them. however they do have a good return policy.

as far as F/SI2 vs H/SI1 it depends on the characteristics of each stone...SI2 or SI1 does not tell you if it is eye-clean and so far we know nothing about cut. But assuming everything is equal...I'd probably take the SI1.
 

KA

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
127
They are both about a carat. The F/SI2 was about 6800 and the H/SI1 was about 6600.

The GIA report number for H/SI1 is 2126043051. It seems to have some tiny inclusions on its top surface and some lines in the bottom. I can't find the other report number right now, but I'll try to post it later. We were looking for something about a carat, but slightly lower is ok, and the price between 6000 and 7000.
 

KA

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
127
Here is the report number for the F-SI2 diamond: 2116839599. It seems to score well on the HCA thing from the previous post. In the GIA report, there is a rather large inclusion under the top surface, but it looks pretty clean otherwise. Right now, I am considering just going through with this order and looking at the diamond. Do you guys think that's a good idea or should I just cancel now? We would like to get it sooner rather than later, since my bf won't let me tell people about being engaged until we have the ring, and I'm impatient to tell my mom. So if this diamond is more likely to be a bad idea than a good idea, we would like to just cancel and order something else now rather than wait a week for it to arrive, send it back, wait for refund and then order something else.
 

nfowife

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 15, 2011
Messages
544
what's the carat weight for the F/Si2 stone? we need that to look up the report.
 

Stone-cold11

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Sep 9, 2008
Messages
14,069
That is a cut more for brilliance, known as a BIC around here. It has slightly better brilliance and better spread, larger diameter, for a similar weight but more balance cut stone, but it sacrifice some fire performance for it. Some prefer it, some don't.

Might not be eye-clean as it is an SI2 crystal inclusion under the table but it also depends on other things, such as color of the crystal and how deep it is located under the surface, not mentioned in the report. Best to ask BN to check it out first, to your eye-clean requirement, before committing.

https://www.pricescope.com/journal/what_eye_clean_diamond
 

nfowife

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Mar 15, 2011
Messages
544
I think with the location of the crystal it is quite possible you will see it, it's directly under the table. You won't know without seeing the stone in person or a picture. Not sure if Blue Nile will take a look for you, or if they are a drop-shipper? You might want to contact them.

here are some other options I found within your price range that look promising:
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/H-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1324906.asp
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/F-SI2-Ideal-Cut-Round-Diamond-1379637.asp
 

pkanawha

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
49
Something else to consider is the color of the metal of the ring. If it's platinum or white gold, it will be more sensitive to an off color. If it's yellow gold, a little color in the diamond won't show as much.
 

jstarfireb

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Mar 24, 2007
Messages
6,232
pkanawha|1310678487|2969084 said:
Something else to consider is the color of the metal of the ring. If it's platinum or white gold, it will be more sensitive to an off color. If it's yellow gold, a little color in the diamond won't show as much.

This is a topic that has been debated a lot around here. I personally disagree and believe that yellow gold brings out a diamond's color.

Based on what Stone-cold said, I'd go with the F/SI2 if it's eye-clean. Seems to have a better cut than the H/SI1. Otherwise, I usually value clarity over color, but that's assuming cut is equivalent, which they're not in this case.
 

LGK

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Nov 27, 2007
Messages
2,975
Yeah, a mostly clean plot in an SI2 is not a great thing usually- that tends to mean rather than a lot of smaller inclusions which may be spread out and not so visible on their own, there's one single big one smack dab in the middle of the stone... I'd definitely think this stone may not be eye clean depending on your eyesight of course, but obviously no way to know without seeing it.

SI2s are tough to find eye clean (at least at a carat and up) IMO- especially if you have good closeup vision and your idea of "eye clean" is whether or not you can spot the inclusion with your naked eye at all, not just at a glance from 8-10 inches face up only, which is what most vendors call eye clean. Meaning- you will probably see an inclusion in most SI2s under some lighting conditions, with close scrutiny. Will that bug you?

Often people like ordering from places like WF, GOG, BGD over drop shippers like BN because they have a bunch of stones in house and you can pester them to check a number of SI clarity stones for you since they're right there, and they tend to cherry pick the ones they stock in house in the first place for eye cleanliness.
 

KA

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
127
I called blue nile and they checked it out and said that it is not eye clean. So I am going to cancel that order and the search is on again. If any of you have any advice on diamonds over 0.9 carats or so, ideal cut, H or above, SI1 and above, under 7000 dollars, we would appreciate it. I have been using the HSA calculator, but it is so tedious. Do you guys know of a fast way of checking? Do some websites tell you the HSA characteristics directly instead of having to punch them into the calculator?

Thanks for your help.
 

KA

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
127
Thanks for the info. I picked 3 among them and asked for idealscope images. They should arrive next week. I am hoping we can decide and order something then. I had another question. I was reading a bit more, and read something about gem advisor. Is this useful? Should I be asking for the gem advisor files from JA. Do they even provide those? I looked on their website and didn't see anything there. I am not sure if I'm just making life more complicated for myself. Some advise would be great. Thanks!
 

slg47

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 4, 2010
Messages
9,667
KA|1310845858|2970466 said:
Thanks for the info. I picked 3 among them and asked for idealscope images. They should arrive next week. I am hoping we can decide and order something then. I had another question. I was reading a bit more, and read something about gem advisor. Is this useful? Should I be asking for the gem advisor files from JA. Do they even provide those? I looked on their website and didn't see anything there. I am not sure if I'm just making life more complicated for myself. Some advise would be great. Thanks!

I think you should be fine with just the idealscope images.

have you decided on a setting?
 

KA

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
127
Right now, our favorite is a tacori setting

http://www.tacori.com/Engagement-Rings/462RD6

It is rather expensive, and will take time to be set, so I was trying to find something else that is comparable, cheaper, and faster. I posted about that too here:
[URL='https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/tacori-ring-setting-question.163224/']https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/tacori-ring-setting-question.163224/[/URL]

But it is hard to look at settings online and decide if we'll like it in person, unless it is very similar to the one we like.
 

centralsquare

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
2,214
I have an H color diamond and am overall very satisfied, so I would go with an H and jump up a bit in clarity just to be sure, esp with BN for the reasons others stated. I have SI jewelry and am just as happy with those pieces as I am my VS diamonds, but I was highly confident there were eye-clean because I had them appraised. BN is great with returns, so you can always get them appraised. I like BN...have purchased from them a bit and would do so again.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
In general, for me SI2 is too much compromise, given that H color is really still very colorless to my eye. Unless you are really aiming to stretch the budget as far as it will go for carat weight, I would not drop to SI2. If you want colorless I would rather personally drop carat a little.
 

KA

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
127
Yes, I'm only looking at SI1 and above now, and have dropped the carat weight to 0.90. Do you know if the size difference is considerable? I have never tried on a ring with 0.9 carats, and my fiance is nervous about it being too small. I actually don't care about it being a full carat as long as we get a good diamond and a good deal. But I want the look of a thin band with a noticeable stone. I am hoping that 0.9 and 1 are different enough, and the look will be pretty much the same.

I should be perfectly happy with an H or a G color, and it looks like for 0.9 carats, we can get reasonable clarity for about 6000. So we have picked 3 out of the list from james allen above and asked them to send me images and have someone look at them to see if the inclusions are visible. They said that it would take 3 working days for them to get back to me. I am hoping that one of them is a nice diamond in most respects, and that the search will be over.
 

KA

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jul 14, 2011
Messages
127
Yes, I noticed that. But all the 0.9 carat stones that I am ending up picking are about 0.4 to 0.5 mm smaller than the 1 carat stone I was picking. Now I'm not sure how much you can notice that on a hand. I also have a 4 and 3/4 ring size, so I think it should look ok. I think it is mostly my fiance who is worried about it not being a carat and I think he is affecting me by continually insisting that it might be too small and I may not like it once it is set and then it will be too late to do anything. Do any of you have pictures of how a 0.9 carat in a solitaire type setting with a thin band looks on about a size 5 finger?
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
KA|1310878662|2970679 said:
Yes, I noticed that. But all the 0.9 carat stones that I am ending up picking are about 0.4 to 0.5 mm smaller than the 1 carat stone I was picking. Now I'm not sure how much you can notice that on a hand. I also have a 4 and 3/4 ring size, so I think it should look ok. I think it is mostly my fiance who is worried about it not being a carat and I think he is affecting me by continually insisting that it might be too small and I may not like it once it is set and then it will be too late to do anything. Do any of you have pictures of how a 0.9 carat in a solitaire type setting with a thin band looks on about a size 5 finger?

There is an "under one carat" thread in SMTB that has lots of different sizes and most pics list the finger size.

If you set a .90ct and a 1ct next to each other loose and really looked hard, you might just see the difference in size.

But once set and worn, I bet good money that you would not be able to pick out which was the bigger of the two.

The issue your fiance is having is more in the head than based on reality I suspect. In reality, the two size diamonds are almost indistiguishable. But a lot of people take a lot of pride is saying "It's one carat!" If he wants that pride you can either drop color (I have a J color stone and am very happy with it, you might be too), or you can pay more! Or hunt for an eye clean SI2, they do exist.
 

cl600500

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jul 11, 2011
Messages
33
COLOR IS THE MOST IMPORTANT.....THEN CUT.............screw the clarity and size......get a nice diamond that is smaller,,, over the bigger diamond with low color
 
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