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Advice on this pair 4.71 ctw

KKJohnson said:
... recut you run the risk ...
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Would say the same: fiddling with this pair seems more not less complicated than asking for the highest of the high in terms of match & cut.
 
Is there urgency to spend 150K on diamonds--whose information (not education)--is vetted through an open forum? I really don't get it.
 
I agree with others - it is inconceivable to me to consider throwing down 130-140k on two diamonds that don't match and are really unknown in terms of excellent cut quality. If you would consider buying these and then spending another few thousand to recut, why not consider having them custom cut from the beginning to insure beautifully cut, matched stones? Particularly if you want them to be treasured as heirlooms in your family? Haste makes waste my friend - I would encourage you to think this through carefully, to talk to experts on cut, and not be swayed by a friend in the business. We could all tell you sad stories about the family friend in the diamond business - and they seldom end up with happy endings.
 
You have a good point there Missgotrocks.

My friend has worked tirelessly in sourcing the stones based on the specs I presented. My understanding has obviously evolved a lot the last week or so on this forum and I have been putting him through these gyrations as my thinking has progressed.

I started off with Gia XXX to be the gold standard on diamond buying. This was when he got the first 2 stones in the previous thread.

Then I got schooled on table, depth and angles even within Gia XXX.. . I had him source those specs off of whiteflash ACA specs.... He got these 2 stones sourced and procured from the supplier.

Now the position has evolved further into matching stones, ASET imaging, custom cuts etc.

Been quite a journey so far.



MissGotRocks said:
I agree with others - it is inconceivable to me to consider throwing down 130-140k on two diamonds that don't match and are really unknown in terms of excellent cut quality. If you would consider buying these and then spending another few thousand to recut, why not consider having them custom cut from the beginning to insure beautifully cut, matched stones? Particularly if you want them to be treasured as heirlooms in your family? Haste makes waste my friend - I would encourage you to think this through carefully, to talk to experts on cut, and not be swayed by a friend in the business. We could all tell you sad stories about the family friend in the diamond business - and they seldom end up with happy endings.
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Which part is in question? Don't people ask pricing opinions all the time on these forum alongside the educational aspects?

There is no urgency to spend the money.

canuk-gal said:
Is there urgency to spend 150K on diamonds--whose information (not education)--is vetted through an open forum? I really don't get it.
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Pagalkutti said:
You have a good point there Missgotrocks.

My friend has worked tirelessly in sourcing the stones based on the specs I presented. My understanding has obviously evolved a lot the last week or so on this forum.

I started off with Gia XXX to be the gold standard on diamond buying. This was when he got the first 2 stones in the previous thread.

Then I got schooled on table, depth and angles even within Gia XXX.. . I have him those specs off of whiteflash ACA specs.... He got these 2 stones sourced and procured from the supplier.

Now the position has evolved further into matching stones, ASET imaging, custom cuts etc.

Been quite a journey so far.
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I joined this forum a year ago and I’m still learning! It is rather crazy with the amount of education goes into finding great diamonds. There is a lot of science and precision that also goes into great diamonds.

With what you are wanting (cream of the crop family heirloom quality) within the healthy budget you have, don’t rush this even if the numbers look good on paper. Most likely these diamonds will preform well but at this price range well preforming diamonds is not acceptable.

Reach out to a few more vendors and see what they can provide or go custom cut.
 
I did reach out to whiteflash and they have given me a quote for custom cuts.

The quote format is as follows

"4.02 - 4.16ctw D VVS1 A Cut Above Diamond Pair (2.01-2.08ct each): $xxx, xxxlist price / $yyy, yyy wire price

These diamonds would be cut specifically for you, and guaranteed to meet, at minimum, our promised carat weight, color, clarity, as determined by AGS Laboratories, and our A CUT ABOVE Qualifications and Specifications"

 
Pagalkutti said:
I did reach out to whiteflash and they have given me a quote for custom cuts.

The quote format is as follows

"4.02 - 4.16ctw D VVS1 A Cut Above Diamond Pair (2.01-2.08ct each): $xxx, xxxlist price / $yyy, yyy wire price

These diamonds would be cut specifically for you, and guaranteed to meet, at minimum, our promised carat weight, color, clarity, as determined by AGS Laboratories, and our A CUT ABOVE Qualifications and Specifications"
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This does not say that they will also be guaranteed to match X parameters within Y margins. ACAs are all lovely stones, but ACA specifications permit a range of proportions.

To put it this way... by sticking to ACAs you’re guaranteed berry flavoured ice cream - you aren’t going to wind up with one vanilla stone and one strawberry stone. But there’s blueberry, strawberry, raspberry... and you want two blueberry pints. Or two raspberry pints, or two strawberry.

Ask about this explicitly.

Have you inquired into Crafted by Infinity? Any two CBI stones with comparable 4Cs are guaranteed to exhibit a particular flavour of light return - Infinity stones are specifically fashioned this way.
 
No...I have not reached out to crafted.

What is the gold standard then when it comes to custom cut for what I am looking for?
 
Pagalkutti said:
No...I have not reached out to crafted.

What is the gold standard then when it comes to custom cut for what I am looking for?
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I believe I understand what you are asking, but it is difficult to answer.

The vendors you see oft recommended here on PS - WF, CBI, BGD, Canera, Jon/August Vintage... if you’re working with these vendors you don’t need to concern yourself with “ensuring you’ll wind up with a beautiful stone”. Every single one of them produce stones that are cream of the crop in terms of beauty, light return, desirability, and brand cachet (within the niche consumer community that values precision cutting).

With your project, however, you need (or rather - you have the budget to demand) two stones that match exceptionally well. There are several flavours of light return that are all objectively equal in terms of “excellence”, but finding/cutting two stones of near-identical proportions and size to produce a pair that exhibit the same visual flavour - that’s the trickier bit. Note that a pair of near-identical stones will be worth more than the sum of each stone bought/sold individually.

It is not an impossible task. I bought a 2.7ct stone eight years ago and found a near-perfect mate for it year before last - colour, carat, proportions, faceting, fluorescence. It took several months to find the mate, and I was looking for a much more common colour/clarity combination than you are. In your case, since you’re buying both stones together, you have the opportunity to short-circuit the timeline. Some vendors’ top shelf line of diamonds include precision-cut stones of various proportions that show off different types of light return. Nothing wrong with this business model at all - it offers consumers some choice of flavour. Crafted by Infinity is the opposite: CBI stones are beautiful, with flawless precision of cut, and all stones have very similar proportions and showcase the same flavour of light return. Again, nothing wrong with this business model - it provides an unyielding guarantee of visual continuity.

For your rather unique situation... the CBI model just happens to be a perfect fit out-of-box. I recommend reaching out - contact Wink at High Performance Diamonds (HPD is a US CBI vendor).
 
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I would NOT recommend custom cut because it is more expensive and you never know what exactly will be the outcome.
Also, something VERY important to consider is that 2.3ct is much better carat weight than 2.01 (two point zero something) that are just on the border of 2ct mark.
Your 2.3ct D Flawless is an EXCEPTIONAL stone and I would not miss it out. A good search worldwide can finds you a matching stone for it.
 
It is interesting that without being from the Asian culture, I do appreciate D/Flawless diamond crystals. These crystals are special and extremely rare in big sizes. So I am always happy when someone is looking for such stones.
 
Appreciate the recommendation Eva Evans.
Pulled the trigger on the D/Flawless.

Rejected the other one. The search continues for a matching pair.

Hope I made the right call. The last couple of days have been heart wrenching
 
I’m curious, which aset image was the D Flawless? Top or bottom?
 
KKJohnson said:
I’m curious, which aset image was the D Flawless? Top or bottom?
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Proportions indicate the bottom computer generated ASET on the last page is for the FL stone.
 
Let me rephrase: if those two CG ASET images are the correct images for these two stones, then the bottom image is for the FL :))

You should be aware of two things:
1. Once set, the stone will no longer merit the FL clarity grade.
2. The stone is very nice, but is not precision-cut and does not exhibit excellent optical symmetry. That doesn’t mean that it will not a beautiful and sparkly stone! It does mean that it lacks both brand cachet and niche cut quality specialiazation, which leaves future valuations wholly up to “generic market fluctuation”. Sounds like you’re okay with that!
 
Thx yssie. Curious as to what brand cachet will mean 30 years from now. Do we see a lot of 30 year old stone brands for sale in today's market ...say from the 60's and 70's that command a premium over non branded stones from that era(all else being equal)? Are a lot of the brands from 30-40 years ago still around today?

yssie said:
Let me rephrase: if those two CG ASET images are the correct images for these two stones, then the bottom image is for the FL :))

You should be aware of two things:
1. Once set, the stone will no longer merit the FL clarity grade.
2. The stone is very nice, but is not precision-cut and does not exhibit excellent optical symmetry. That doesn’t mean that it will not a beautiful and sparkly stone! It does mean that it lacks both brand cachet and niche cut quality specialiazation, which leaves future valuations wholly up to “generic market fluctuation”. Sounds like you’re okay with that!
Click to expand...
 
Pagalkutti said:
Thx yssie. Curious as to what brand cachet will mean 30 years from now. Do we see a lot of 30 year old stone brands for sale in today's market ...say from the 60's and 70's that command a premium over non branded stones from that era(all else being equal)? Are a lot of the brands from 30-40 years ago still around today?
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By brand cachet I meant the Richemont conglomerate, Tiffany type of pedigree! Sorry, that wasn’t clear :))

Precision diamond cutting hasn’t been a “thing” for that long - it’s a movement that I believe really took off early 2000s.
 
Pagalkutti said:
Thx yssie. Curious as to what brand cachet will mean 30 years from now. Do we see a lot of 30 year old stone brands for sale in today's market ...say from the 60's and 70's that command a premium over non branded stones from that era(all else being equal)? Are a lot of the brands from 30-40 years ago still around today?
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Almost sounds like someone told you that “brands” are just a passing fad
 
Your diamond 2.30ct D/FL:
42233589.jpg
The matching diamond 2.36ct D/FL:
42181112.jpg
 
Totally understand branding .. Just trying to understand it in the diamond world

Anyways the deal is done. No turning back now.
Maybe for the matching pair I will go full on branded. My problem was that I couldn't find inventory in the D-VVS world at 2.x CT for branded and then I was going down the world of custom cuts etc.

Once the stone gets here maybe I will get it reevaluated.

KKJohnson .. Since you are in the DFW area like me....what is a good place to get Aset imaging etc done?

KKJohnson said:
Almost sounds like someone told you that “brands” are just a passing fad
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Pagalkutti said:
Totally understand branding .. Just trying to understand it in the diamond world

Anyways the deal is done. No turning back now.
Maybe for the matching pair I will go full on branded. My problem was that I couldn't find inventory in the D-VVS world at 2.x CT for branded and then I was going down the world of custom cuts etc.

Once the stone gets here maybe I will get it reevaluated.

KKJohnson .. Since you are in the DFW area like me....what is a good place to get Aset imaging etc done?
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That’s a good question, maybe an appraiser can help with that. I use Jarvis Gems and Jewelry Appraisals, his office maybe able to help or even recommended someone? Other than that I typically do business with Diamond Direct and Diamond Exchange
 
Screenshot_20180929-182538_Drive.jpg Here is another option given the circumstances and I want to get thoughts on it. My wife has a wedding ring that we were also looking to upgrade.

It's a 2.65, I, SI 1 Xxx Gia.

What if I use my newly procured D-FL and put it on that ring and search for a matched fully branded 4 ctw matching earring pairs here in the US. This time around for the earrings maybe do an E-VVS or something as was recommended in the previous thread. Also I can perhaps trade in the 2.65 current wedding ring stone towards this pair.

Thoughts?

Here is the Gia cert of that stone and a terrible pic I just took

Screenshot_20180929-182140_Gallery.jpg
 
I think many women prefer their ring stone to be significantly larger than their earrings stones - such that the ring is the star of the show. You know your wife’s tastes best though.
 
Good point.

She will be going down from 2.65 to 2.3 but will be getting a much better stone(D-FL)

Plus she will get the whiteflash-ish, branded, ideal and precision cut, matched 4 + tcw diamond earrings that everyone raves about with killer ASET imagery, minimal light bleed and super awesome specs and symmetry

I am eyeing these puppies

https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=3999627,4006547

Thoughts on this twist in the plot?




yssie said:
I think many women prefer their ring stone to be significantly larger than their earrings stones - such that the ring is the star of the show. You know your wife’s tastes best though.
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Pagalkutti said:
Thoughts on this twist in the plot?
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I think that
1. Sorting out your wants and your total budget up front would be a far better approach then twisting the plot along the way, from your perspective as the person paying for all of this, and
2. You’ve talked about “what she’ll be getting”, but not what she wants, and what she wants is the most important part of this discussion. How does she feel about these changes? Some women are emotionally invested in their wedding sets and wouldn’t want to trade/upgrade them... some aren’t. Some women, like me, prefer that their ring stone be much larger than their earring stones... some don’t. Some women would see a colour and clarity upgrade and size downgrade as a net positive... some wouldn’t. What sort of woman is your wife?
 
I like the Whiteflash pair and I also really like the second D flawless that Eva found. But now with the discussion of upgrading your wife’s engagement ring, it seem that there may need to be a clear path figured out; studs or ering?
 
She does not like studs. She likes the leverback style more where the stones dangle


Hoping the whiteflash pair looks good on this style.

I think this plan also takes care of upgrading the engagement ring which we were thinking of getting done for a while. The newly procured D-FL goes into the engagement ring... Not a really big step down from a size standpoint 2.65 vs 2.3

The 2.65 I, SI 1 can be traded in to get the E vs1 pair from white flash.

Pricescope avg pricing says I should get around 21k for it.... But I think that sounds high.. Thoughts?
Does whiteflash take trade ins?

https://www.pricescope.com/diamond-prices/round#2-2.99

I think if I can pull this plan off all will be fine in the world......
 
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