Advice on Round Brilliant and GIA vs. EGL

[rockwell]

Been researching a while and went to downtown LA today to check out some diamonds. Narrowed it down to two that I liked. If you have any advice on either diamond or think they''re a solid deal or bad deal, any opinion would be appreciated.

GIA Cert.
Round Brilliant
6.57-6.62x4.02mm
1.05 Ct
Depth---61.0%
Table---57%
Girdle---Thin to Medium
Culet---NOne
Polish---Excellent
Sym.---Very Good
Clarity---VS1
Color---H
Flourescence---None
$5670.00
Not sure how to get the cut rating?

Liked the way it looked to the eye and through the loupe. Would prefer to go up to a 1.20-1.30 stone, but would like to stay down around 6K.

I was hoping to get a GIA certed stone, since from what I''ve read, they are sent the higher end stones, but not sure how important that is to me. Also looked at the following EGL stone:

Round Brilliant
1.12 CT
6.78-6.68x4.18mm
Depth---62.1%
Table---58%
Crown---14.5%
Pavilion---44.5%
Girdle---Thin to Med.
Culet---none
polish---VG
Sym---Good
clarity---VS2
color--H
Flouresence---NOne
$5376.00
Again, don''t know how to figure HCA cut rating?

Please let me know if you think these are priced properly, think they''re cut well or any other thoughts on either. I''m getting close to buying something. Anything I should be asking the dealer that I might have overlooked? She did show me soom SI1 and SI2 stones, but I think I''d prefer to stay in the VS1 or VS2 grade. More flexible on color.

Also any thoughts on buying online through whiteflash or goodoldgold would be appreciated. I''ve read many good things on here in the past.

Thanks----

 

[oldminer]

First thing, do a Pricescope search on the H VS stones types you'd consider. Now, you'll have the "price" range that competition dictates. Of the two diamonds you examined so far, the GIA one is the one I'd lean towards....for several small reasons, no major ones. Most importantly, you must ask the question, "Is the "H" on the EGL report a GIA H?"
Could be, might not be...and we cannot tell you with any degree of certainty at a distance.

 

[diamondsman]

There is no question here as to which stone you should go for.For approx.$300.00 more you are getting, G.I.A cert.VS1 quality ,better depth,table,polish.
I would pick the first stone anyday.

"they're a solid deal or bad deal"

As far as the price is concerned it is about $500.00 overpriced.

 

[rockwell]

Thanks everyone. I've put in a request for the crown and pavilion percentages. Not sure if they'll have it. They are wholesalers. Not open to the public. It's not a retail store in any way.

pqcollectibles---thanks for the links and the info. Did you happen to run the HCA on the GIA diamond? I looked at the links you posted and the diamonds do look great. For some reason, I've set my mind on a VS diamond though and I'm not sure about compromising to a SI for size. Of course, I did say earlier that I was hoping to get up near a 1.20 stone. I don't know. Too much info to take in! Overload!

I never realized this would be the stressful part of getting engaged.

Thanks again everyone.

 

[Nicrez]

Hey Rockwell, if by wholesalers you mean they are cutters and don't normally sell to people, these people specifically should give Sarin reports, because if they cut, they use Sarin to determine HOW to cut a rough stone, and need to detail the cut stone thereafter.




If you mean these wholesalers but the stones from cutters, and use middle men to get it to market, they should have access to people who have Sarin machines, or even try your local friendly gemeologist who would at least have a machine to measure that is similar.




Good luck!

 

[rockwell]

Nicrez----Yeah, they are wholesalers that get them from Asia cut. They definitely have access to people with Sarin machines, but it's just not something they provide at the consumer level, since they don't normally deal with selling to people like me. They have been very forthright with all information and are not presenting a "hard sell" at all. I just want to be sure with this kind of purchase that I'm getting what I pay for. Thanks--

 

[pqcollectibles]

Wholesalers that sell to the public are not wholesalers. They are RETAILERS.

You would need crown and pavillion info to crunch the HCA on the GIA diamond.

When buying a diamond, everything has a price. Carat weight, of course, impacts price. But, quality of cut impacts price. Clarity impacts price. Color impacts price.

Clarity costs far more than color does. If you focus your search for a well cut diamond, cut will mask a lot. Cut can hide inclusions and cause a diamond to appear visually whiter and brighter.

The key to clarity is size, type, color, and location of the inclusions. A rigidly graded SI1 could be a lot of wispy, white inclusions that will never be seen with the naked eye. Some dark inclusions are really flecks of other gemstones, such as garnet, imbedded in the diamond.

The links I posted are diamonds the Vendors physically have on hand. They can pull them out and discuss them with you over the phone. They can send you magnified pics of the diamonds and the inclusions. Both Vendors are extremely reputable. If they say a diamond is eye clean, it's gonna be eye clean.

 

[oldminer]

Stick to what you want. Don't be so polite or naive to allow any seller to withold information that is very much a part of making an informed decision. Just because a seller says they are unaccustomed to providing Sarin data, does not mean that they cannot do it if you want to look at it. They would do this for a dealer, so why not give it to you?

Once you pay for the stone, it is yours. Be sure it is the one you want BEFORE you pay.

 

[rockwell]

pqc---

thanks for your time and input. the place i'm going to isn't open to the public. they are in fact a wholesaler. I happen to know a former GIA staffer that has worked there for years and she is letting me buy from them. no taxes

. slight bonus.

she just sent me the following infor which I had requested earlier per your suggestion. please let me know what you think if you see this post. I have posted the GIA 1.05 specs again so it is all in one place. The new info regarding crown and pavilion angles is at the bottom.

GIA Cert.
Round Brilliant
6.57-6.62x4.02mm
1.05 Ct
Depth---61.0%
Table---57%
Girdle---Thin to Medium
Culet---NOne
Polish---Excellent
Sym.---Very Good
Clarity---VS1
Color---H
Flourescence---None
$5670.00

Crown angle for 1.05ct stone is 34.50, Pav angle is 38.40, Pav depth is 43.3% for ideal make. AGS grade 0.

Thanks again for your advice.

 

[aljdewey]

hmm - something's off here....you may want to double check the information on the pavilion angle.




typically, they are expressed this way: 34.5, not 34.50 as you listed the crown angle.




The pavilion angle ....if it really is 38.4, that's not ideal by any means. This figure wouldn't correspond with the percentage expression of 43.3% either, so I'm fairly certain there's a typo or miscommunicated number on the pavilion angle, and that number is critical. Can you confirm it again?




Rockwell, I'm always a bit skeptical of places that swear they don't sell to the public....except for you. Having said that, it sounds like you "know" someone, and that might be the trick. Please, please follow this next piece of advice......make SURE before you purchase that you completely understand their return policy.




They may not have one if they really do not sell to the public. Make sure YOUR sale allows return for full refund within 10 days. That gives you time to get the stone to an independent appraiser to verify it for peace of mind. Someone else here just learned a very tough lesson - in pursuit of a "deal", didn't note the "exchange only" policy and learned AFTER purchase that the diamond wasn't what she thought it was.




Even better.....follow Dave's very sage advice and make SURE it's what you want before plunking down the cash.

 

[mike04456]

----------------
On 2/25/2004 8:45:09 PM rockwell wrote:





Pav angle is 38.40

----------------

That's got to be a mistake. Check with them again. If that's correct, then the other measurements are off and you've got a stone that's several light years from being ideal cut.

 

[aljdewey]

----------------
On 2/26/2004 3:06:35 PM rockwell wrote:





aljdewey---

so you don't think this is a good diamond? Or you just don't think it's ideal----------------

I'm not saying either. What I'm saying is that two pieces of information you listed directly conflict with one another......so one of them must be wrong. It's important for you to find out WHICH ONE is wrong in order to determine the make of the stone.

Go back and verify the 1) pavilion angle and the 2) pavilion percentage. They cannot be 38.40 on the angle and 43.3% respectively. Something is wrong, and it's really important to know which of them is wrong.

I suspect that the pavilion angle is not 38.40.....but if it is, then I'd suspect that this diamond is not ideal and not good, either.

As Lawgem and I mentioned, go back and get the correct information. Then we can help better.

 

[rockwell]

aljdewey---


Got the correct information on that stone.

Crown angle ...33.8......AGS0
Pav Angle.......41.0
Pav Depth......43.3%.....AGS0
Culet..............0.5%.......AGS0
Table..............57.6%....AGS0

Please let me know what you think now that we have the correct info. Thanks.

 

[anothernewbie]

http://www.pricescope.com/cutadviser.asp

1.3 ex,ex,vg,vg

 

[caratgirl]

Based on the latest corrected details, it sounds like a very nice choice! Especially with the color and clarity. I think that a 1.05ct stone is a very nice size.

 

[pqcollectibles]

Specs sound nice. Great HCA score. Price is in line with what Price Scope Vendors are asking for comparable diamonds.

Great potential for a good performer that is priced right!

 

[aljdewey]

Ah.....better!

The numbers suggest the stone should be a fine performer. Of course, you should verify this by having it independently appraised, but by the numbers, it should be beautiful!

 

[rockwell]

Thanks for all the advice.

Anyone got a line on a LA based independent appraiser that is very good. I'm assuming in a city this size there are many.

 

[pqcollectibles]

Just click on the Appraisers link at the top of the page.