A gay friend may be turning straight

[galeteia]

I used to be of the strong opinion that sexuality was fluid, we are more than biological animals, etc etc. Then I read a scathing rant by a professed bisexual man in regards to a study that was done on how the brain's sexual areas "light up" when the subjects are exposed to naked images of both genders. What the scientists were surprised to discover was that the primitive, animal areas that provoke that MUST MATE NOOOW reaction only lit up when viewing men in the 'bisexual' males, whereas both women and men prompted those areas to light up in 'bisexual' women. These were not measuring general attraction, this was strictly sexual response.

The blogger was enraged as he felt that the study invalidated the claims of bisexual men, and yet proceeded, in the course of his blog, to describe how he 'missed' the "companionship, commitment, and affection" of women when in a relationship with men. None of those things imply "I am going to jump your bones RIGHT NOW", which ironically just dovetailed with the study itself. Missing companionship and affection? Buy a puppy, or find a woman who doesn't care that she doesn't turn you on the way a man would.

Do I think that sexual response completely equals attraction? No. Not even close. I know from my own past that one can become attracted to those not of one's gender preference based on the person, but I while I might have had a general attraction, I did not have explicit sexual thoughts about them they way I would with a man. I could not 'perform' with a woman.

Now, my own personal opinion is that bisexual men are not truly sexually attracted to both genders, although they may be generally attracted to both and enough to be in a satisfying relationship with either. I doubt most long-term couples are as 'in heat' for one another as they were in the early days of intimacy, but there is so much more to a relationship than just the strength of sexual tension.

But I do not for a moment believe that someone can 'go straight' if they are in the extreme of the spectrum (and apparently men are more likely to be in the extreme), and I find it quite offensive when someone tries to 'cure' themselves of homosexuality by going through the motions of being straight, hoping it makes it true. It impacts not only them, but the poor soul they marry; why would I want to marry a man who did not love me 'that way'?? Then it becomes the ruination not just of one person's happiness, but two. Ugh.

Not only that, but one cannot live a lie forever- will he wait until he's married and has kids before he breaks down and starts craving sex with men- will he sneak around? Break up the family? Suffer in silence?

If he wants children, he does not have to have a wife for that.

 

[lyra]

That does seem odd. Maybe he''s just tired of having to fight so hard.

My daughter''s best male friend is gay. He has very strong views and really cannot stomach the idea of being intimate with a woman. I once knew a couple who were married for 14 years before the husband came out, and I understand that scenario much better. Guess I have nothing productive to add. I hope he''s not lonely or depressed.

 

[terceslil]

I guess you could say that these things happen. Why, I don''t know, but they happen.

I''ve always had a rule to not date ''straight'' girls... Straight girls meaning any girl who had not had a girlfriend before I met her. Well, my last girlfriend had just divorced right before I met her, so she was single when I met her. She chased me. She knew I was a lesbian. When we were together, she swore that she felt all of her life that she should have been with a woman instead of a man. (I never asked. Plus, I never asked her to confirm or label her sexuality.) She took it on herself to make such declarations. We had a terrible breakup, so we don''t keep in touch. She does keep in touch with my sister, though. My sister says that my ex is back with men.

So, that would be the first time that I ever dated a straight girl, and more than likely the last as I am ready to settle down with my current girlfriend. Certainly I am no expert, having only had a relationship with one person who went straight (?for lack of a better term?).

I guess it would be easier to live inside society''s norms, however it is not as hard as it used to be. I remember coming out in 1992, and things were waaaaay different. It was a lot harder. People are more accepting.

If your gay friend turns straight, it probably isn''t for you to understand. I don''t understand it myself, but I would have to accept it, and that is probably all that your friend would hope you would do as well.

 

[LAJennifer]

Some things are just unexplainable, I guess, and few of us truly fit the labels given us by society. Concerning you friend, Kenny, I''ve seen this happen twice.

1) A dear friend''s father was "gay" until his late 30''s, when he decided he was truly heterosexual. He viewed his past as experimental and heavily influenced by others. He married a lovely woman and had 2 wonderful sons. They were very devoted to each other. He developed AIDS (I''m not sure when it was actually contracted)and ultimately succumbed to the disease, but his wife was by his side til the very end.

2) A friend of a friend suddenly decided to date a woman after the breakup with his long time boyfriend. We were all pretty shocked when he announced they were getting married. They now have 2 daughters and, as far as I know, are living happily ever after.



About 10 years ago, I had a 3 month tryst with a young gay man. He was in his early 20''s, I was in my mid 20''s. We were acquaintances with several mutual friends. He was always kind of flirty whenever I was around and one day he just started hitting on me. We definitely had a sexual connection, and we were, without a doubt, attracted to each other. Having a relationship wasn''t something that was practical for either of us, but we had some fun for a while. And I have to say, he was very different (both in private and out in public) when he was just with me as opposed to his group of friends. He was very pretty and certainly more on the "fem" side of the scale - yet all those mannerisms disappeared when he was just with me (he was still pretty, though). We are no longer in the same social circle, however, I ran into him a couple of years ago. He introduced me to his friend as the woman that stole his heart and said that I could still have it if I wanted it (I didn''t - he was way too high maintenance). I don''t think he has been with any other women. I guess it was just "one of those things . . . ", whatever that means.

 

[Mrs Mitchell]

Kenny, I don''t have any insight or words of wisdom to offer, but I do hope that your friend finds peace with who he is and comes through this smiling. It must be tough for him.

He''s lucky to have support, and I know it can''t be easy for you either.

Jen

 

[Gypsy]

I'm in the sexuality is fluid camp too. I don't think that it is for everyone, but I think it's a spectrum accross humanity. Some people are obviously at the poles, and some are in the middle. And I don't think that your position on the spectrum is always fluid. People grow and change and their tastes do too. As for what to disclose to women he dates... ya know... there are all kinds out there. I can easily see some women being attracted to this, understanding about it, or just not caring. I do think that communication is key, and that at the right point in the relationship (and preferably toward the begining) he should just tell whoever it is he's dating about his past. But I think that people should do that no matter what their sexual persuasion is.

I can understand why this might be strange for you Kenny. It may stick. It may not. Ultimately your friend is a person and thier sexual identity is something that is private to them, and that is entirely their decision. Just as it shouldn't matter if a friend comes out of the closet... they are the same person and you should support them, if your friend is entering a new sexual period in his life... he probably is scared and afraid of rejection and scorn and I hope that you support them and let them know that you care for them, regardless of their sexual identity. It's brave thing he's doing. Whether 'becoming' a homo or hetro sexual-- change is hard for people. Both for themselves and for those around them. It's easy to do what is 'normal' for your peer group, whether that's staying hetro or homo sexual. It's really hard to go against the norm and tell your friends and loved ones that you are different from them.

 

[LGK]

I wonder if he realized he was attracted to a particular woman, and based on that decided he had to be either gay or straight- no grey area or bisexuality allowed in his view?

I ask that because I actually did know a guy- dated him in fact

- that was just like that. Sometime after we broke up, he met a guy he was attracted to, and all of a sudden he declared that he "must" therefore be 100% gay, and had only imagined that he was into women too. And he came out to everyone on earth pretty much. Then he broke up with his boyfriend, met a girl he was attracted to, and did a complete 180 to swearing he was totally straight. It was really bizarre. I haven't spoken to him in years, so I have no idea what he ended up deciding his orientation was, but he was a very inflexible sort of person. He was young, and I'd hope that an older more experienced person wouldn't feel that the world had to be so either/or, but you never know...

It does interest me how many people think bisexual men don't exist, that they have to be either gay or straight. A friend busted out with that (very bizarre) opinion the other day- it kind of boggled me. I guess it's been something I've been talking about a lot with people lately. I definitely feel sexuality has a lot to do with how one reacts to individuals rather and that labels such as gay/straight/bi can be rather restrictive and pigeon-holey.

Personally I do believe that most people are somewhat bisexual, whether they acknowledge it or ever act on it or not. And that one's perception and self knowledge can certainly change over a lifetime, which can of course change a sexual orientation. It is odd that your friend declared that he's *straight* as opposed to bi- is he not attracted to men at all anymore? That's hard to believe, but I guess anything is technically possible.

Sexuality and one's sexual orientation can definitely be something that we hide from ourselves too, that's for sure. I know a guy in his mid '30s who finally admitted to himself that he is occasionally attracted to other guys- rarely, but it does happen. And that's something he didn't really know about himself until recently, though I'm sure it was there all along. I think as one grows more secure and confident, one can definitely face things about oneself that at a younger age we perhaps weren't ready for.

I wish that everyone on earth, including my mother and my coworkers, didn't know that LittleGreyKitten is my favorite username sometimes.

 

[Imdanny]

Kenny, I don't believe that people change their sexual orientation. I think that they might discover more about whatever it is but I don't think that they change. (I also don't think something "makes" someone gay.) It seems to me that your friend might be exploring his sexuality, but I wouldn't discount the possibility that he might be confused about it.

 

[partgypsy]

Interesting thread. I don''t think I''ve thought about this as much as others being "straight." My own personal perception seems like gayness in men seems more "innate" in that it is seen earlier in development (sometimes other people identify it before the person identifies or acknowledges it) and has a similar frequency of occurence in many cultures (though hard to document in very conservative countries), while gayness in females is often seen later, with now-identified gay women in most cases having experiences dating/engaged/married to men. Also alot of straight women admitting they found during their lives this or that female sexually attractive (while hard to find straight men that will admit same). Huge generalizations as there exceptions in each case (David Bowie and Mick Jagger versus members of women''s softball team) and just based on people I''ve known.

 

[Hest88]

In my experience, I''ve seen women more likely to be truly bi-sexual or fall in love with "a person"--whether man or woman--regardless of their past sexual history. With men the boundaries have tended to be more strict, and I know very few men I''d think of as truly fluidly bi-sexual. I have a feeling that if we lived in a society that was more like some giant hippie commune we''d see more examples of that, but I still suspect it would still be more likely a tendency among women. Obviously, though, some posters in this thread know men who seem to be more bi-sexual, so it''s not like it''s impossible.

Either way, Kenny, it sounds like you just need to support your friend during what must be a confusing time.

 

[jewelz617]

Maybe he''s just bi? He will hopefully be honest with the woman he decides to be in a relationship with.

 

[HopeDream]

Hi Kenny,

I bet your friend has a lot of the same questions you do.

Given the millions of people on the planet I bet "re-orienting"(can I say that?) has happened to thousands of individuals(gay or straight)this year alone. Going from gay to straight just doesn't seem to be talked about so there's not realy an ettiquett surrounding it yet(so It's good that we're talking about it).

Society as a whole seems very black and white and socialy it's easier to be able to identify a person in a perticular "group". The societal "We" are very intolerant of grey areas and individuals changing their minds - as if a change always indicates that what ever happened before the change was somehow wrong or incorrect. Sometimes there is more than one correct answer.

I know this isn't the same thing, but I think it's a similar type of experience:
Recently one of my dear friends identified as transgendered and it's a little awkward for me to make sure I'm thinking of him as male and using the propper pronouns(I'm super afraid of accidentaly saying the wrong thing and embarassing him), but I don't think it completely invalidates her past as a woman. You know? I imagine he would tell whoever he was dating about his past at the appropriate time in their relationship.

I also wonder if your friend has lady-dating on his bucket list?(40s mid-life and all).

Love is also a very powerful force and is one of the only things I know that will cause people to leave their old lives, habits, and hobbies, and move halfway across the world to be with "the one". Maybe he's falling in love.

I bet he's working it through himself and talking to you is helping, so keep having conversations, you are a good friend.

 

[kenny]

Hopedream, good point.
We are very uncomfortable with ambiguity.
We like categories.
When someone does not fit nicely into a category we get uncomfortable.

Even our language accommodates only only male and female (his and her), when perhaps over 1% of births are intersex, aka hermaphrodite, or having reproductive organs of both genders. Source
1% is a large group of humanity to exclude.
Which pronoun to use for transgender and transsexual people is another example of how problematic categorizing is.

I certainly continue to support and love my good friend regardless of what is happening.

 

[dragonfly411]

COMPLETELY OT - I LOVE LAJENNIFER''S AVATAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Hest88]

I''ve been staring at LAJennifer''s avatar too!

 

[LAJennifer]

Date: 3/5/2010 3:22:51 PM
Author: dragonfly411
COMPLETELY OT - I LOVE LAJENNIFER''S AVATAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LOL! Thanks, Dragonfly.

 

[lilyfoot]

Date: 3/5/2010 1:38:25 PM
Author: kenny
Hopedream, good point.
We are very uncomfortable with ambiguity.
We like categories.
When someone does not fit nicely into a category we get uncomfortable.

Even our language accommodates only only male and female (his and her), when perhaps over 1% of births are intersex, aka hermaphrodite, or having reproductive organs of both genders. Source
1% is a large group of humanity to exclude.
Which pronoun to use for transgender and transsexual people is another example of how problematic categorizing is.

I certainly continue to support and love my good friend regardless of what is happening.

To the highlighted: yep! That was really my only thought when reading this thread. I could care less if someone bounces back and forth between men and women, or only sees men, or only women, or sees a woman once in a lifetime of otherwise seeing men .. I don''t feel the need to put a label on anybody''s sexuality. As long as it doesn''t involve children or animals, I don''t care what other people do with their bodies!

And to the bolded part, that is a great thing to read, and I''m sure your friends truly appreciates it!

 

[HollyS]

Your friend is probably not questioning his ''gayness'', but he''s looking for companionship without strings - - maybe? Somebody to do things with, without relationship pressure?

The problem with this would be if some woman thinks that he truly cares for her, can commit to her, has changed his orientation forever, (or she doesn''t even know about his prior relationships), and she gets her heart broken because straight isn''t what he really is. If he isn''t sure of who he is, then he needs to take some time out to figure that out.

If he, however, remains quite openly gay, and still wants to hang out with women, and they know, then I''m sure he''ll have fun being just friends.

 

[monarch64]

Kenny, I think your comment about the discomfort we feel when things cannot be neatly placed into a category is spot on. (Firefox quotation/highlighting problems, or I would''ve quoted that post of yours, sorry.) I have serious problems with PLACING things into categories, myself! If you read my posts here and there on PS, you will see I have used the forward slash to death in between 3-4 words meaning "sort of" the same thing.

I''m one of those people who likes versatility, thinks sexuality can definitely be fluid/changing (see?) and has a hard time choosing just. one. thing. in life. I''ve changed majors, I''ve changed careers, certainly changed mates, etc. It''s very hard for me to be rigid about anything! I like variety. I can understand if someone changes their mind a hundred times...to me, it doesn''t signify lack of commitment or indecisiveness, it tells me a person is open to change and growth and wants to experience many different things in lieu of the typical roles society expects. Those are my opinions and thoughts towards others, though. As I''ve aged, I find that I''m less liberal about some things, and more conservative towards other things than I was 10-15 years ago. I just have an incredible thirst for knowledge and all that really matters to me is character rather than past proclivities.

That said, if I were the woman a formerly homosexual man was interested in, I would want to know about that history of his, and I would have to think about it very intensely to decide if I would be comfortable moving forward in a relationship with him. I think it can be done. I can''t speak for the hypothetical homosexual man since that is and has never been part of my physical make-up. I can only imagine that it would be just as difficult for that person to deal with their change in mindset. It''s an interesting topic, for sure.

 

[joflier]

Thinking about what others have posted about women becoming lesbians after having bad experiences with men......Could this be a similar situation?
Has this friend had a bad relationship with a man or been very hurt by his own gender? Enough to make him look towards a woman in hopes of things being different?

 

[susimoo]

Kenny

I don't have anything particularly clever to say. I will simply tell you how life has been in my family.


My Eldest brother is gay. I have been around gay people all my life. I was brought up to respect life not to put it into a box for description purposes.

My mum once told me that the bible refers to only two types of sex, male and female. Her take on it was he (God) was having a bit of a joke on all of us and there was at least 6 other types, as yet unidentified. She told me to go out and find someone to love that loves me as much in return. I did that with my dear Husband. She and my father would have loved me no less if it has been a woman or any of the other sexes that God forgot to detail in the bible. ( my parents book of choice)

Love because you fall in love. Don't love because of the description/label that life has applied to the object of your affection.

Be a good friend. From all the posts I have read so far (new member) you are passionate in all the you believe in. Believe in your friend.

 

[reader]

My friend Bill went through some confusion in his early 20s. Every now and again, he would try dating a girl. Every now and then I would get a silver claddaugh ring that his ex girl had worn with a quick "Nope, still gay."

Weatherman, another friend in his mid 30s just got out of a marriage and a relationship with a guy, and is left wondering just what the heck he wants, he is so confused sometimes.

Midlife crisis, curiosity, or biological clock ticking?

 

[Cehrabehra]

susimoo - what a great response