5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shops

[Laila619]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Phoenix, most vendors want to be paid before they will send anything to an appraiser. I'm not sure where you got the idea they would send it out on memo?

Yes, definitely. Think about it from their perspective--they are sending off a very expensive, valuable stone. We know you are 100% trustworthy, but they don't. If they offer a no-questions asked refund policy, then I guess I'm not seeing why it would be a problem to pay upfront?

Anyway, I hope you find your honker soon!

Fair enough. So I guess what I'll need to establish is whether or not the vendor is trustworthy enough to give me a 100% refund no question asked (I've heard of horror stories of a so-called "restocking fee" which in my case would amount to several thousands of dollars, or worse still what if they refuse to refund the whole amount to me?). How do I do that here without disclosing too much detail (you know, lurkers and all)?

That is definitely going to be the tricky part. If at all possible, I would try to buy with a PS vendor, or a place that others PSers have had good experiences with (like Old World Diamonds or Oak Gem, etc.).

 

[yennyfire]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt that there are too many lurkers here looking for 5+ carat OECs! I think you can safely share the name of the dealer. I would second going through a trusted vendor. Yes, you'll be paying more (perhaps), but given the amount of $$ you're spending, peace of mind would be worth a tangible amount of money to me. And, you have to be prepared to at least reimburse the shipping/insurance costs if you decide to return a stone...that's only fair to the dealer.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Phoenix, most vendors want to be paid before they will send anything to an appraiser. I'm not sure where you got the idea they would send it out on memo?

Yes, definitely. Think about it from their perspective--they are sending off a very expensive, valuable stone. We know you are 100% trustworthy, but they don't. If they offer a no-questions asked refund policy, then I guess I'm not seeing why it would be a problem to pay upfront?

Anyway, I hope you find your honker soon!

Fair enough. So I guess what I'll need to establish is whether or not the vendor is trustworthy enough to give me a 100% refund no question asked (I've heard of horror stories of a so-called "restocking fee" which in my case would amount to several thousands of dollars, or worse still what if they refuse to refund the whole amount to me?). How do I do that here without disclosing too much detail (you know, lurkers and all)?

Use a credit card and perhaps use Paypal too, that offers some additional assurance. Get the return policy in writing. Search online for the vendor's name. Ask well known PS appraisers if they have dealt with the seller. Talk to the seller in person to get a feel for their approach.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Might be very tough to have a credit card with that kind of limit. But maybe there are cards with no limit?

 

[Dreamer_D]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt that there are too many lurkers here looking for 5+ carat OECs! I think you can safely share the name of the dealer. I would second going through a trusted vendor. Yes, you'll be paying more (perhaps), but given the amount of $$ you're spending, peace of mind would be worth a tangible amount of money to me. And, you have to be prepared to at least reimburse the shipping/insurance costs if you decide to return a stone...that's only fair to the dealer.

Again, this is something to get in writing before hand. If the diamond appraises well below (like 3+ color or clarity grades) then I think ine could ask for shipping to be reimbursed.

Clarify with the seller whether they use GIA or EGL standards for their grading if it is in house, so you can evaluate your appraiser's opinion correctly.

 

[Dreamer_D]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Might be very tough to have a credit card with that kind of limit. But maybe there are cards with no limit?

Some ccs you can add funds to them perhaps?

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Since I think there is about zero chance of lurkers snapping up rings like these, I assume you have seen these, Phoenix?

http://jewelry.1stdibs.com/jewelry_item_detail.php?id=62529

http://jewelry.1stdibs.com/jewelry_item_detail.php?id=36247 (ok, maybe above budget but sooo beautiful I had to post it for fun!)

http://jewelry.1stdibs.com/jewelry_item_detail.php?id=51144

http://jewelry.1stdibs.com/jewelry_item_detail.php?id=49804 (another extravagant one!)

http://jewelry.1stdibs.com/jewelry_item_detail.php?id=48764 (not sure you can go to this color, but what a gorgeous stone and ring!)

http://jewelry.1stdibs.com/jewelry_item_detail.php?id=34739 (a great price on this if you could deal with the color!)

Okay, I have to stop looking. I am sure you have looked through that site. There is jewelry fit for royalty on there!

 

[Mara]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Can you use AMEX via PP? They usually have very high spending limits depending. And some CC's have crazy high limits, depends on your income levels and your spending. Or you could piecemeal 2-3 payments.

 

[Phoenix]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Thank you VERY much, ladies, for all your wonderful and very helpful advice. I especially like the idea of paying by PP backed by Amex. Our Amex pple here are very co-operative since we've owned the card for a looong time now and have used it for all kinds of purposes. I am sure they'll help. The Q is will PP allow me to spend such a large amount? There's also the issue of shipping such a valuable item across the globe to me....Anyway, whole thing is very complicated and needs to be worked through very carefully.

Anyway, just an update on one of the rings I've been looking at. I'm v. SAD!! I was looking at a 7ct VCA E Si1 emerald-cut, it's really beautiful...beyond gorgeous in fact . I was beginning to make some headway with the vendor and guess what? It's been SOLD, to someone else!! sob...sob...sob....

 

[Phoenix]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Ok, DS. I've looked at all of those. Some of them are WAAAYYY above what I'm willing to spend/ can in fact afford, not unless i re-mortgaged our house. Ha ha, I 'd have an amazing ring but would for sure be sans husband!

I love the one at Lang's, but they've written to me again telling me that their price is firm! Is it me or is that price not comparable to other cushions of the same specs? Or maybe antiques command a premium?

 

[slksapphire]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

phoenix,

if i may, i wanted to share with you a recent purchase i made. as way of background, i am from new york city but moved to hong kong recently and had to start from scratch because i didn't have any jewelry contacts here.

i purchased a gem-quality 5+ carat blue sapphire. i started searching about a year ago with a few prominent hk jewelers (not mass retail, but well-regarded jewelers with a store or two). i quickly figured out that they could not source what i was looking for; at best, they showed me a stone or 2 every few weeks. they just didn't have access to a large supply of high quality stones. also, it became clear that they were much more experienced with "vanilla" diamonds (probably not OEC) rather than colored stones. i knew very little about sapphires, yet felt i knew more than the salespeople.

the reason i did NOT purchase from the u.s. is because shipping and insurance would have cost about $4,000 per shipment (using a brinks service for fine jewels). as an individual, you CANNOT insure through fedex, dhl, etc. and i was not comfortable shipping such an expensive piece without insurance.

based on advice from posters on PS, i found out that one of the world's leading experts in sapphires lived in hk (dick hughes). i reached out to him and he effectively became my "dealer". he sourced a good number of stones for me at the int'l gem show in hk (i believe there is another one coming in june) and i was very fortunate to find a stone that i loved. as it turns out, chris smith of agl was also in town for the show and provided a report overnight.

i would strongly encourage you to figure out who is an expert in OEC diamonds in hong kong, and then use that person to help you at the gem show. you will then be able to view a bunch of stones side-by-side and then make a decision.

best of luck. btw, getting the stone set in hk has been a tough slog and it is still ongoing! sigh ... wish i were in ny.

eta: as you probably know, the gem shows are to the trade only ... that's why you need to find a dealer.

 

[MyDiamondSparkles]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Thank you VERY much, ladies, for all your wonderful and very helpful advice. I especially like the idea of paying by PP backed by Amex. Our Amex pple here are very co-operative since we've owned the card for a looong time now and have used it for all kinds of purposes. I am sure they'll help. The Q is will PP allow me to spend such a large amount? There's also the issue of shipping such a valuable item across the globe to me....Anyway, whole thing is very complicated and needs to be worked through very carefully.

Anyway, just an update on one of the rings I've been looking at. I'm v. SAD!! I was looking at a 7ct VCA E Si1 emerald-cut, it's really beautiful...beyond gorgeous in fact . I was beginning to make some headway with the vendor and guess what? It's been SOLD, to someone else!! sob...sob...sob....

I'm so sorry, Phoenix. I know exactly how that feels. I always tell myself it just wasn't meant to be and I suppose that makes me feel better.

On the ones at Langs--if it is the 6.48 one I think the price reflects the original setting--I always see top dollar being asked for those.

On PP, call them and ask--they are very helpful. I've spent large amounts with PP before--truthfully speaking though I am sure it was much less than you are spending but I was very comfortable using PP. I know if you use PP and you do have a problem you can't dispute the payment with both PP and the credit card company. It's one or the other so know what each one of them offers as far as buyer protection before you buy and before you dispute. Anyway, Ive had a few successful purchases and more than one that was a dud and was returned. I've had absolutely no problems with the returns. I don't think you are going the EBay route but if so, I will never, ever buy anything (over a certain amount) from anyone with a less than 100% feedback. There is a reason they have 100% feedback and it starts with good communication, good descriptions and easy, hassle free returns. Every time I have purchased from someone with less than 100% I've had some kind of a problem--description is way off, shipping is slow, hassle with a return, etc.

One last thought: If you're like me you want to save money by looking for that special diamond/ ring yourself, but sometimes spending more money and working with a vendor has the benefit of peace of mind. Peace of mind = priceless as I am really starting to find out.

 

[Snicklefritz]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Hi Phoenix!

I was just in SF 2 weekends ago and visited Lang's. I think I tried on that very 6.48ct antique cushion for fun! Must say the setting is DIVINE! The craftsmanship is stunning and so detailed.

BF took a few pics and even a video. I'll try to post them if you're interested! Not sure if it's out of budget for you. Definitely is for me

 

[slg47]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Hi Phoenix!

I was just in SF 2 weekends ago and visited Lang's. I think I tried on that very 6.48ct antique cushion for fun! Must say the setting is DIVINE! The craftsmanship is stunning and so detailed.

BF took a few pics and even a video. I'll try to post them if you're interested! Not sure if it's out of budget for you. Definitely is for me

can you perhaps post just for...educational purposes???

 

[Pandora II]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Phoenix, if you are not adverse to a UK vendor, check out John Joseph at Gray's Antiques Market off Bond Street.

I bought a superb OEC 3-stone that has been much admired by the trade from them, and have gone in a couple of times to vet purchases for other people.

They are very helpful and nice, have amazing jewels, their prices are extremely reasonable and I'm sure if they don't have the right thing (and they certainly carry larger stones) then they would look out for something for you.

Not sure who the best appraiser here would be for old cut diamonds (but can find out) as I'm more au fait with the coloured stone world.

 

[m-2-b]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Have you contacted Victor w/ your requests as another option? I'm currently working w/ him to find a much smaller EC than your 5ct + honker and have found him to be very resourceful! I think he told me recently that he had a 5ct D VS1 EC--would that be big enough for you?

 

[decodelighted]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

I fear the problems you are having could be because these branded antiques are irreplaceable. Not run of the mill MRB's that you can find any old place. Insurance isn't ever going to fully recoup whoever ends up holding the bag in case of damage or loss. This is something to think about yourself when it comes to choosing this type of piece over all others (your three trade-ins, for example). Could you ever be fully compensated for its loss?

I'd also say that the most desirable houses and antique cars etc are snapped up quickly as well. You're only going to be able to haggle and mull over LESS desirable pieces. Why should the vendor bend over backwards to haggle w/you if they know they can sell it elsewhere snappily?

Seems like this type of market might not work w/your expectation set as is. IMHO, there's two choices -- 1) adjust OR 2) roam free once again amongst the widely-available modern cuts of your dreams.

 

[decodelighted]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Oh Phoenix ....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Art-Deco-Pl...aultDomain_0&hash=item43ae52efb0#ht_500wt_816

I know, i know ... too small .... but amazeballs.

 

[Snicklefritz]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Hi Phoenix!

I was just in SF 2 weekends ago and visited Lang's. I think I tried on that very 6.48ct antique cushion for fun! Must say the setting is DIVINE! The craftsmanship is stunning and so detailed.

BF took a few pics and even a video. I'll try to post them if you're interested! Not sure if it's out of budget for you. Definitely is for me

can you perhaps post just for...educational purposes???

Absolutely, slg! Don't want to leave anyone hangin'. Was going to start a thread with other pics I took but haven't gotten around to it


Wish I'd gotten some close ups of the setting. For reference, I'm size 4.

 

[armywife13]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Hi Phoenix!

I was just in SF 2 weekends ago and visited Lang's. I think I tried on that very 6.48ct antique cushion for fun! Must say the setting is DIVINE! The craftsmanship is stunning and so detailed.

BF took a few pics and even a video. I'll try to post them if you're interested! Not sure if it's out of budget for you. Definitely is for me

can you perhaps post just for...educational purposes???

Absolutely, slg! Don't want to leave my PS hangin'. Was going to start a thread with other pics I took but haven't gotten around to it


Wish I'd gotten some close ups of the setting. For reference, I'm size 4.


[/quote]

OH. MY. GOSH.

First, I want your size 4 fingers. Two, I want that amazingballs rock on my new size 4 finger!!!

 

[Phoenix]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

WOWZA!! Thank you, snicklefritz. That is a magnificent ring!! Did you notice any warmth in the I?

So antique cushions are more expensive, because they're antique? I was under the impresssion Lang's prices tend to be on the high side, since it seems to me that a lot of their pieces tend to sit around for months, sometime even years.

 

[distracts]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

So antique cushions are more expensive, because they're antique? I was under the impresssion Lang's prices tend to be on the high side, since it seems to me that a lot of their pieces tend to sit around for months, sometime even years.

I think she was trying to say that the antique stone in its original setting is more expensive than one that has been reset into a new setting, because you have a complete antique piece instead of antique bits in a newer piece. I'm not sure but that's what I got from her comment.

 

[Phoenix]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

So antique cushions are more expensive, because they're antique? I was under the impresssion Lang's prices tend to be on the high side, since it seems to me that a lot of their pieces tend to sit around for months, sometime even years.

I think she was trying to say that the antique stone in its original setting is more expensive than one that has been reset into a new setting, because you have a complete antique piece instead of antique bits in a newer piece. I'm not sure but that's what I got from her comment.

Ah I see. I hope I don't get stoned for this but that setting is rather too ornate for *my* own taste. I do love antique settings (along with antique stones) but I prefer them a bit less ornate. That cushion is certainly gorgeous!

 

[sushi]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

hi Phoenix,

I just had a thought, my best school friend is an antique wholesale jewellery dealer. She is based in London, but buys mostly in Paris and is (so she tells me) one of the biggest sellers to US 2nd hand / estate sales.

How about I get her on the case? She specialises in signed pieces... Obviously this isnt easy to find, but she will help you, and Im sure will give you a great price, as well as letting someone appraise etc....

Let me know!

XOXO sushi

 

[Trekkie]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Hi Phoenix!

I have been following your search for a 5ct+ honker with great interest!

Have you considered widening your search to other countries? I live in South Africa and recently helped a friend buy a 3.06ct F VS1 for his wife at about 30% less than he would have paid back home in Switzerland. I don't know how that would compare to your US prices though.

Perhaps you could have a look at this website http://www.sadiamonds.co.za/ and give Marten a call. I know they can cut to your specifications and their prices are quite reasonable. It might take a while before they find just the right rough for you, but it is one more option to consider.

One thing - In SA, EGL is regarded as the superior lab, but Marten's dad (who is also his business partner) is a GIA Graduate Gemmologist and they would be more than happy to send a stone to GIA for you.

Oh, and here's a pic of my enormous size 6 fingers wearing a 6.12ct round... You know, just because.

 

[Phoenix]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

hi Phoenix,

I just had a thought, my best school friend is an antique wholesale jewellery dealer. She is based in London, but buys mostly in Paris and is (so she tells me) one of the biggest sellers to US 2nd hand / estate sales.

How about I get her on the case? She specialises in signed pieces... Obviously this isnt easy to find, but she will help you, and Im sure will give you a great price, as well as letting someone appraise etc....

Let me know!

XOXO sushi

OMG, your best school friend is an antique wholesale bling dealer?!! I wanna be her new BFF, ha ha...

I'd love to meet up with her, definitely!! What a coincidence, I'm going to be in London and Paris soon! So I'd def like to meet up with her. Please do ask her for me...yes yes yes...Thank you.

XOXO

 

[Pandora II]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

http://www.berganza.com/- was oggling their windows this morning and they definitely have large stones - I have also see large stones in person at JJ (no one else I know well enough to recommend at Grays).

Berganza is not cheap but the quality is amazing.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Berganza has jewelry listed on 1st Dibs, and I noticed they were very high.

Phoenix, just for clarification, you aren't only looking for antique rings are you? You were also looking at branded second-hand pieces that were not antiques. I wouldn't limit myself to antique stones because you found that gorgeous EC that I don't think was antique, right? Maybe I am the one that is wrong, but I thought it needed clarification because you are getting advice on buying antiques when I think you are mainly interested in finding a fine diamond over 5 carats, right? (And a second hand branded ring may be roughly equivalent to a new unbranded diamond and setting).

 

[Phoenix]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

Berganza has jewelry listed on 1st Dibs, and I noticed they were very high.

Phoenix, just for clarification, you aren't only looking for antique rings are you? You were also looking at branded second-hand pieces that were not antiques. I wouldn't limit myself to antique stones because you found that gorgeous EC that I don't think was antique, right? Maybe I am the one that is wrong, but I thought it needed clarification because you are getting advice on buying antiques when I think you are mainly interested in finding a fine diamond over 5 carats, right? (And a second hand branded ring may be roughly equivalent to a new unbranded diamond and setting).

Absolutely, correct, yes DS. In fact, I'd prefer a signed piece (vintage or modern) over a non-signed antique ring. And yes, I'm more interested in the secondhand market, cuz I believe there's value there. That 7ct VCA EC ring was an amazing deal. I did move very fast but it was the vendor who was slow in responding to me!

So again, yes, what I'm looking for is a high quality piece (and preferably with high specs - up to I, Si1 but I would prefer E, F, G, H and VS), signed preferably. 5ct and above only.

Prefer also EC, asscher, OEC, OMC, cushion (not crushed ice), . Proprietary cuts like the Lucida would def be considered. I do not want marquise, heart or princess, and am ambivalent about pears. A modern RB would also be considered but it'd have to be ideal/ super-ideal cut and not priced at current pricing (= too expensive for moi! ).

Brand-wise, I'd prefer HW, Cartier, Graff, VCA (not necessarily in that order), and to a lesser extent Tiffany (but again I love their Lucida cut).

Thank you so much again, DS and everyone else who's helping. I def need your help. I was doing it alone for too long and have not been successful so I really appreciate all your help. You guys ROCK!

 

[slg47]

Re: 5ct+ honker search - Dealing wt antique/ secondhand shop

not sure if this is in your budget but I think it's pretty amazing

http://www.diamondsbylauren.com/index.php/jewelry/emerald-cut-diamond-536-dvvs1-gia-extraordinary-stone-r4473