5 stone nightmare - help!

[chloe88]

After pursuing the 5 stone ring thread for about a year, I finally decided to purchase a ring from an etsy vendor. There were many reviews and they were really positive. I received the ring and the quality/worksmanship of the ring was not good at all which prompted me to check out other details.The ring was supposed to be 1.75ctw, f color, vs2/si1, very good cut. It came with an appraisal from a Gia gemologist. The price was good..turns out too good to be true.

I had the ring appraised by a Gia gemologist locally, and the ring quality was totally different from what was stated. It was only 1.5ctw, g-h color, mostly i1 quality stones with good cut. I contacted the seller to request a refund or up the quality. After much talk, seller’s final offer was a refund minus the 15% restocking fee. I didn’t think I should pay that restocking fee since I basically got a different product. I should add the seller was very adamant about the quality and basically didn’t believe me or the local appraiser. Seller had apparently known the 3rd party appraiser for a long time. I showed the copy of the appraisal from the vendor to the local appraiser and she thought it was a very generic appraisal. It didn’t have any measurements and didn’t bother appraising the individual stones. It stated color f color, vs2-si1 color, 1.75ctw with a dollar value. Needless to say, I ended up filing a dispute with PayPal. They will be investigating and I should find out the results in the next few weeks.

Just wondering if anyone has had a similar experience? I’m curious as to how PayPal will decide the claim when both sides have a Gia gemologist written document. Also, how can the vendors appraiser get the ctw so wrong? I feel it’s one thing to be one grade off for color/clarity, but measuring a diamonds measurements shouldn’t be so varied? I would appreciate any input from pricescopers..

 

[Diamond_Hawk]

Appraisals can be a very tricky thing and are often used interchangeably with "grading a diamond" - they are not the same thing.

That distinction is not important currently as what you are concerned about is the different grading of the stones, so let's address that. Individual gemologists can be GIA trained, but will not necessarily give the diamond the same grading as a GIA report. Even within each GIA lab there is often some disagreement in the grading of a diamond. When that happens, they will often need a majority of 5 or more graders to agree on the 'disputed' grades before issuing the lab report - one of the reasons they tend to be consistent and are the world's largest issuers of diamond grading reports.

Long story short, when diamond shopping "Graded by a GIA gemologist" is not the same as "Accompanied by a GIA Lab Report" (often called a certificate).

I am not familiar with Etsy nor Paypal practices, so I cannot help you in that regard - but in my experience filing complaints, posting publicly and standing your ground can often work with someone who depends on their online reputation for new clients.

Best wishes.

 

[chloe88]

Thanks for your input! I will be posting names and further details so others can avoid this seller. I didn’t realize that Gia gemologists can have such different opinions. I guess Gia Certs are the best bet.

 

[tyty333]

Do you have any pics to post? We'd all like to see the ring.

We never advise going for "very good" cut stones in this size. Very Good can be cut pretty deep so maybe the 1.75 ctw is there in the depth. I'm
sure the seller knows exactly how much ctw is in the ring...whether it be deep stones or whether she shorted you some. We do have vendors
we trust and that we like to work with when you get your money back.

I hope paypal agrees with you. Fingers crossed!

 

[Golden_bird]

After pursuing the 5 stone ring thread for about a year, I finally decided to purchase a ring from an etsy vendor. There were many reviews and they were really positive. I received the ring and the quality/worksmanship of the ring was not good at all which prompted me to check out other details.The ring was supposed to be 1.75ctw, f color, vs2/si1, very good cut. It came with an appraisal from a Gia gemologist. The price was good..turns out too good to be true.

I had the ring appraised by a Gia gemologist locally, and the ring quality was totally different from what was stated. It was only 1.5ctw, g-h color, mostly i1 quality stones with good cut. I contacted the seller to request a refund or up the quality. After much talk, seller’s final offer was a refund minus the 15% restocking fee. I didn’t think I should pay that restocking fee since I basically got a different product. I should add the seller was very adamant about the quality and basically didn’t believe me or the local appraiser. Seller had apparently known the 3rd party appraiser for a long time. I showed the copy of the appraisal from the vendor to the local appraiser and she thought it was a very generic appraisal. It didn’t have any measurements and didn’t bother appraising the individual stones. It stated color f color, vs2-si1 color, 1.75ctw with a dollar value. Needless to say, I ended up filing a dispute with PayPal. They will be investigating and I should find out the results in the next few weeks.

Just wondering if anyone has had a similar experience? I’m curious as to how PayPal will decide the claim when both sides have a Gia gemologist written document. Also, how can the vendors appraiser get the ctw so wrong? I feel it’s one thing to be one grade off for color/clarity, but measuring a diamonds measurements shouldn’t be so varied? I would appreciate any input from pricescopers..

I have deal with PayPal a lot . Your case will be in your favour !if you have official appraisal from the jeweler and it depends on the price of your purchase. I guess on everything before 750$ , they aoutomaticly let you return the item without any supporting documentation, for more high value item , they will need an appraisal from 3rd party. They in most cases favor buyers

 

[chloe88]

Thanks for sharing your experience Golden_bird! I hope they do allow me to return w/o the restock fee.

Tyty333, the appraiser i went to measured the depth and width of the stone. Turns out it is exactly 1.51ctw. Next time I purchase, it's going to be excellent cut only.
I attached some pictures, but don't mind the glove. My hands were looking extremely unattractive in the photos, so I grabbed a glove.

 

[tfc_diamondlvr]

oh boy!
I'm in the process of purchasing a 5 stone ring myself. Your story gives me reason to pause and reflect, as I'm buying from a local jeweler!

It seems like the PSers are coming to rally on your side and give advice etc! I hope things get resolved to your liking.

How would you know something is an excellent cut unless you are allowed to take the rings to get it independently appraised?

and LOL to the glove pics! I feel like doing that all the time! My hands are atrocious in this winter weather here in Canada!

 

[PintoBean]

I recommend to my friends to verify what the return policy is and take their purchase to an independent appraiser within the return period. Make sure it's an independent appraiser not another jeweler that does appraisals bc it is in their best interest to dismiss your purchase and encourage you to buy from them instead.

I am glad OP took their purchase to be verified by an appraiser, hopefully an independent one, since they only identified the person as a GIA gemologist.

Also, as a general FYI, you can locate an independent appraiser under the resources tab

 

[LaylaR]

Just as a side note, the best way to avoid this type of issue going forward, especially with the size stones you are looking at, is to get lab graded stones.

 

[ringo865]

And buy from PS recommended vendors.

Hi @LaylaR

 

[tfc_diamondlvr]

And buy from PS recommended vendors.

Hi @LaylaR

I'm a bit ignorant! Would you be able to tell me where to find the PS recommended vendors? I'm looking for someone specifically from Toronto, Canada
Thanks!

 

[LaylaR]

And buy from PS recommended vendors.

Hi @LaylaR

Hi ringo865!!

 

[rockysalamander]

When you are ready to move forward with a new ring, why don't you come back and see what PS members can find from specic vendors.

 

[AprilBaby]

Maybe your appraiser measured the stones at 1.51 but they are deep. They could be 1.75 by weight. Then you are both kinda right but weight trumps measurement.

 

[chloe88]

When you are ready to move forward with a new ring, why don't you come back and see what PS members can find from specic vendors.

That’s exactly what I’m hoping to do. I see so many posts regarding ID jewelry and pricescope quality diamonds. Can anyone tell me what their idea of pricescope quality is??

 

[chloe88]

Maybe your appraiser measured the stones at 1.51 but they are deep. They could be 1.75 by weight. Then you are both kinda right but weight trumps measurement.

Hi Aprilbaby, I just assumed measuring the depth would be taking steepness into account. I guess no way to be sure unless you take them out of the setting?

 

[AprilBaby]

That would be my assumption.

 

[Karl_K]

Its a fairly open setting with access to the girdle for an accurate measurement and while not likely possible to directly measure the depth there are ways to get really close.
If it was say 1.5ctw vs 1.6ctw then maybe but I dont buy 1.5 vs 1.75 and there not being an issue assuming the appraiser the OP hired is good at his/her job.
On a per stone basis that is .3ct average vs a .35 average.
On a one ct stone .05 difference in estimated weight is rounding in the calculations but at this size it is a large difference.
Even if the weight estimates of the OPs appraiser were questionable, si vs i1 is an easy call and grounds for a refund.

 

[chloe88]

Appreciate all the feedback. I’m going to keep my fingers crossed and hope PayPal processes the refund quickly!

 

[chloe88]

Not sure if anyone is following this thread, but PayPal emailed me today saying they will give me a refund as long as I ship it back. It took 10 days from day of filing and I spoke with the rep numerous times regarding the case. They weren’t able to give me concrete answers but they did email the back office who works on such matters. So relieved everything worked out.

The Etsy shop’s name was jewelryulovebyaby.

 

[Golden_bird]

Not sure if anyone is following this thread, but PayPal emailed me today saying they will give me a refund as long as I ship it back. It took 10 days from day of filing and I spoke with the rep numerous times regarding the case. They weren’t able to give me concrete answers but they did email the back office who works on such matters. So relieved everything worked out.

The Etsy shop’s name was jewelryulovebyaby.

I am so happy that evtworked out !!! It’s stressful but glad you r going to get your money back !!

 

[Karl_K]

Glad to hear you are going to get your refund!!

 

[missy]

Ugh sorry you had to go through all that and I am relieved for you that you are receiving a full refund! Good for you and hope you find the ring of your dreams! Don't forget to enlist the help of PSers to do that. Good luck!