Conned on ebay. I quit!

[whatmeworry]

Kelpie,
Here's wishing good karma for you. I get a vicarious kick reading about your great ebay finds. As for the seller, it's disgusting the way you are treating this matter. So much for a 150% guarantee.

 

[Laila619]

Kelpie, the situation sucks, and I'm really so sorry. But why not just forward her the insurance claim info if that's all she wants? If the stone was damaged in the mail (and it's not up to PS to decide if it was or not) then she does have the right to file an insurance claim. And of course, you absolutely have the right to get your money back. It's a win win for both.

 

[y2kitty]

Kelpie, the situation sucks, and I'm really so sorry. But why not just forward her the insurance claim info if that's all she wants? If the stone was damaged in the mail (and it's not up to PS to decide if it was or not) then she does have the right to file an insurance claim. And of course, you absolutely have the right to get your money back. It's a win win for both.

Because that ties her refund to the settlement of insurance when it has nothing to do with whether or not she deserves a refund. She deserves a refund with no conditions.

So RockHugger, if you took your webpage down because you have no inventory why did you take down you business facebook page?

 

[VapidLapid]

I wonder how much it cost to post the stone back to kelpie, and then too, I wonder if RH insured it, and if so for how much, because then there would be a case for possible insurance fraud. In the original situation there wasnt really any justification to call it insurance fraud. Really it was a scenario that describes exactly what postal insurance is for. If the insurance company wants to negotiate a settlement that is their business, but if the stone was insured and damaged then she IS entitled to file a claim. Except that RH wasnt the sender and that IS how the postal insurance claims are made; by the sender. AGL sent the stone but they did so as Kelpie's agent and presumably they want kelpie to file the claim. but kelpie doesnt have the insurance ticket because she never bought it because she didn't send it. The thing to do is to ask AGL for the insurance info. I know you dont want to do that or anything that would help RH now. Your anger is justified. But sometimes fixating on that can be a block to negotiating a resolution. All I am doing here is speculating on what a resolution might look like. So one could get the insurance info from AGL and turn it over to RH and she then might even be able to file the claim since when you sent the stone to agl it was not yet yours, it was RH's, since the transaction was not completed. You sent the stone to AGL then as RH's agent so AGL was not really your agent when they sent the stone to RH they were RH's agent, albeit one agent removed. This, however, assumes that AGL did in fact insure the stone when they sent it. I say this because we have not heard yet if that is indeed so and confirmed. It was extremely foolish of RH to ship the stone back to you like a hot potato. If a claim was going to be made the post office requires you to have saved all the packaging materials. Without that one cannot make a claim. even if one wanted to, which I know you do not. But now She has shipped the stone to you at great expense. And you have instructed you post office that you are refusing receipt of the package. I don't know how that might play out. Will they return to sender all the way from Tanzania to wherever it is RH lives? will they return it postage due for the return trip? Did she insure it and will she be able to file a claim if she did? Tune in tomorrow for another episode.

Meanwhile I will say again Kelpie, that it is outrageous what has gone on in this ordeal. And the fact that RH has had multiple opportunities to do the right thing and has instead escalated the wrong thing boggles my mind. We don't often get opportunities to right a wrong, so when we do get them it is a privilege to act on them. Kelpie, I fear that the only way you will get justice and your money will be through an aggressive discourse with paypal even though it is past your filing a claim period. At least for that you have this thread to forward them with RH making her extortion demands.

 

[minmin001]

Kelpie, the situation sucks, and I'm really so sorry. But why not just forward her the insurance claim info if that's all she wants? If the stone was damaged in the mail (and it's not up to PS to decide if it was or not) then she does have the right to file an insurance claim. And of course, you absolutely have the right to get your money back. It's a win win for both.

first of all that stone is worth nothing compare to what she paid for so even if it goes through RH wouldn't get $800. and who can promise RH wouldn't keep both money, so far she haven't shown anything for us to trust her with.

 

[minmin001]

Stone was returned to keplie yesterday because she has refused to forward me any information about a claim with AGL or USPS. I am not going to keep the stone as at this point it does not belong to me. I accept returns if returned in the same condition as it is sent out. This is obviously not the case with this stone, so I am refusing the return. I offered to help with the claim, but kelpie refused, so she can handle it on her own. The claim amount through USPS or AGL would never cross my hands anyway because I am not the shipper. It would automatically go to kelpie as I explained to her.

Insurance exsists for this very reason. The concern about the stone being insured for more the its value is bogus. Because I am not the owner of the stone, or the shipper, it would cover the purchase price kelpie paid. As far as its value, shortly after this thread started its sister stone (less saturation and slightly smaller) sold for 750.00 as a non cuprian afghan tourmaline (I sent that one to GIA after this ordeal). So the value of that stone is completely in line with the insurance amount. There is no reason not to file a claim with AGL (who packaged the stone so poorly, causing damage) or USPS, and I honestly am at a loss as of why keplie has not other then bogus excuses and accusations that are completely unwarented. And the fact she refuses to file (or has but has not disclosed) makes me uncomfortable of her intentions. Because I am a 3d party with no rights to the claim money, there is no protection to me if I refund her the money first, and she refuses to forward the claim money (aka pockets it) to me or does not file a claim at all.

As far as these accusations (I only skimmed the thread) of the stone being sent to her cracked. I honestly think if it was cracked as much as it is now when I sent it to her in the first place, that would have been the first email I would have received. I have not heard from kelpie about any crack in the stone, or is it in the AGL photo. I know of every inclusion by memory and microscopic image that was in that stone before it was sent out.

And as asked above, yes my website is down for the moment. Ironically the attempt to 'ruin my reputation' increased traffic and my stock has been sold. It will be down for the next few weeks until I restock then listed back up. My customers have been informed of this.

Kelpie, if you do not accept the stone or packaging, that is your own choice. It has been sent back to you, so you can file the claim (like I said, I cannot do this because I am not the shipper or under contract with AGL).

This is all I will say about this subject from here on out. Good luck.

wow is all I can say...funny how you still think you are doing no wrong and have the courage to show your face to say so when the ENTIRE PS community doesn't agree with... anything ring a bell there? karma is a bitch, so just wait for it~

 

[Indylady]

Kelpie, after reading that last response from RH, all I can say is that I am so sorry.

 

[Haywood74]

Well, I for one don't necessarily believe that she can't refund Kelpie's money. Interesting thing about eBay, you can see what a person buys on there as well if you look through the right feedback. Dropping $200 on a doll is not something I would consider if I was as broke as what everyone seems to think she is. Call me cooky.

Bottom line, the transaction never completed because the terms were never met. Period. The responsibility is on RH to make this all right, not Kelpie. Taking such an arrogant and aggressive approach to this whole thing has left me thankful I have never had, nor will I ever have any business dealings with RH.

 

[Arkteia]

Each time I am opening this thread, I am hoping that RH finally realizes how much damage she is doing to herself, her business and her reputation by not refunding Kelpie. And each time it looks more and more grotesque.

 

[Imdanny]

At this point I don't know how to be sure that I am getting fair value as a seller.

By getting the report. It's as simple as that.

OP, wow, I am just shocked that someone would ask you to claim a value of an item that has already been proven to have been a) misrepresented and b) worth way, way less than said value. That sounds criminal to me. I would contact the appropriate law enforcement agencies. The behavior of this business (I use the term loosely) person is unreal.

 

[Gypsy]

WOW. Reminds me of an unfortunate DB transaction I had with a psycho seller. ((HUGS)) Kelpie, you don't deserve this you did nothing wrong except assume that RH was an honest and forthright seller who would act ethically. Unfortunately, RH clearly doesn't have any ethics at all.

Rockhugger, you are acting reprehensibly. Period.

 

[minousbijoux]

Kelpie: sending dust your way. Here's to hoping that you follow up with ebay. The egregious nature of her scam could easily compel ebay to go beyond normal action to see that you are reimbursed, and that she is not allowed to continue this behavior on ebay. I have a feeling that ebay could construe this as a significant enough infraction to warrant tough action, as they reallydon't want the involvement of the FBI, the Federal Trade Commission, and/or the US Postal Inspection Service mucking around in ebay affairs.

And with no judgement, I believe I know exactly why you waited. You have a big heart, and like many of us, trusted RockHugger. You were affording her the respect, trust and courtesy earned by a member of this community. You believe in the goodness of people and had every reason to believe it was a misunderstanding; you thought she would come through and did not want to escalate the situation. In essence, the way I see it, your belief in the goodness of people and the PS community outweighed your concern about the money. If that is the case, I would've done the same thing for the same reasons, always hoping for the best in human nature.

I applaud your conduct

 

[natsplat]

Dear kelpie, all I can say after reading all of this is you have been treated outrageously, and I am sending you 100-tonne bags of dust to keep you calmly dealing with this in the excellent way you have been. Keep following the suggested avenues, and I am sure you will prevail xx

Each time I am opening this thread, I am hoping that RH finally realizes how much damage she is doing to herself, her business and her reputation by not refunding Kelpie. And each time it looks more and more grotesque.

+1

 

[kelpie]

Kelpie: sending dust your way. Here's to hoping that you follow up with ebay. The egregious nature of her scam could easily compel ebay to go beyond normal action to see that you are reimbursed, and that she is not allowed to continue this behavior on ebay. I have a feeling that ebay could construe this as a significant enough infraction to warrant tough action, as they reallydon't want the involvement of the FBI, the Federal Trade Commission, and/or the US Postal Inspection Service mucking around in ebay affairs.

And with no judgement, I believe I know exactly why you waited. You have a big heart, and like many of us, trusted RockHugger. You were affording her the respect, trust and courtesy earned by a member of this community. You believe in the goodness of people and had every reason to believe it was a misunderstanding; you thought she would come through and did not want to escalate the situation. In essence, the way I see it, your belief in the goodness of people and the PS community outweighed your concern about the money. If that is the case, I would've done the same thing for the same reasons, always hoping for the best in human nature.

I applaud your conduct

You are very kind, Minous. You are right, I thought opening a case would be a negative strike against her and a few weeks ago she was extremely civil and apologetic but it was just to run down time.

Thank you everyone for your support. I know this is an egregious crime and while she may deserve the FBI knocking on her door I highly doubt they'll take my case. Someone got a hold of my credit card number and bought $1300 in airfare to Bahrain once and FBI said, "If it's not more than $50,000 then we don't care". Still have small claims, various internet avenues the state's attorney generals, and possibly renting a billboard in her home town that says she's a crook. Also, postal service has their own special agents who mean serious business, I may look into that when I'm in the states. This thread has 5000 views and I haven't seen anyone who fully understands the situation supporting RH's actions so that counts for something. I was completely ready to delete it if this was resolved quickly, but now I'm glad it will be in the annals of google.

At the end of the day Kate Klein or whatever name she goes by (there seem to be several variations) has to live with the kind of person she is and the choices she's made. That's my only moral compass....to make choices I hope I can reflect back on proudly, RH seems to be an exceptional case that is so out of touch with reality or such a person devoid of empathy she doesn't have this concern.

And VL...she told me to expect two packages, one containing the original packing materials. It was sent first class. I don't know if she insured. Don't worry, I have my postmaster on my side and she's a good enough friend I'm actually watching her dog (which means she's going out of down hence the warning against receiving packages from RH plastered on the wall).

 

[Nomsdeplume]

What a piece of work you are RH. So basically your 150% guarantee is non-existant. Your stance now is that it's not your stone?

I sincerely hope Kelpie goes after you and reports you to the FBI and everybody else because sellers like you give genuine hardworking sellers a bad name. You should be thoroughly ashamed of yourself.

Oh well, what goes around, comes around.

+1

 

[cushioncutnut]

Re: Conned on ebay. !I quit!

Rockhugger, if your really worried about your reputation, hence not selling on your Ebay store until you get inventory , you would restore your customer's confidence in you by doing the right thing! Refund her $$$. Everything that has been initiated by you, should end with you! It is the right thing to do! I hope that somehow you have a heart or grow a conscience and give Kelpie her money back! Shame on you if you don't!

 

[Porridge]

Wow I just read this. Thanks for alerting us Kelpie, so that we can avoid this crook in the future.

It is so beyond shady. RH, you seem entirely out of touch with reality, so there is probably no point even saying this, but regardless I will state it again, echoing others:

The refund you owe Kelpie has nothing to do with USPS insurance claim. You sold her a misrepresented product. You need to refund her the money you stole from her because you sold her a misrepresented product.


Whether you then choose to claim insurance for a crack is your own business. It has nothing to do with the refund that you owe Kelpie.

But you probably know all this.

Kelpie, I would use every avenue to go after this clear case of fraud.

 

[y2kitty]

File a consumer complaint with the North Dakota attorney general:

http://www.ag.nd.gov/

 

[Imdanny]

Stone was returned to keplie yesterday because she has refused to forward me any information about a claim with AGL or USPS. I am not going to keep the stone as at this point it does not belong to me. I accept returns if returned in the same condition as it is sent out. This is obviously not the case with this stone, so I am refusing the return. I offered to help with the claim, but kelpie refused, so she can handle it on her own. The claim amount through USPS or AGL would never cross my hands anyway because I am not the shipper. It would automatically go to kelpie as I explained to her.

Insurance exsists for this very reason. The concern about the stone being insured for more the its value is bogus. Because I am not the owner of the stone, or the shipper, it would cover the purchase price kelpie paid. As far as its value, shortly after this thread started its sister stone (less saturation and slightly smaller) sold for 750.00 as a non cuprian afghan tourmaline (I sent that one to GIA after this ordeal). So the value of that stone is completely in line with the insurance amount. There is no reason not to file a claim with AGL (who packaged the stone so poorly, causing damage) or USPS, and I honestly am at a loss as of why keplie has not other then bogus excuses and accusations that are completely unwarented. And the fact she refuses to file (or has but has not disclosed) makes me uncomfortable of her intentions. Because I am a 3d party with no rights to the claim money, there is no protection to me if I refund her the money first, and she refuses to forward the claim money (aka pockets it) to me or does not file a claim at all.

As far as these accusations (I only skimmed the thread) of the stone being sent to her cracked. I honestly think if it was cracked as much as it is now when I sent it to her in the first place, that would have been the first email I would have received. I have not heard from kelpie about any crack in the stone, or is it in the AGL photo. I know of every inclusion by memory and microscopic image that was in that stone before it was sent out.

And as asked above, yes my website is down for the moment. Ironically the attempt to 'ruin my reputation' increased traffic and my stock has been sold. It will be down for the next few weeks until I restock then listed back up. My customers have been informed of this.

Kelpie, if you do not accept the stone or packaging, that is your own choice. It has been sent back to you, so you can file the claim (like I said, I cannot do this because I am not the shipper or under contract with AGL).

This is all I will say about this subject from here on out. Good luck.

Wrong. From a legal perspective, from a moral perspective, and from the perspective of common sense, the sale of this stone was contingent on it being what it was represented to be. It turned out not to be what it was represented as, therefore, no sale.

Duh.

 

[Imdanny]

But you probably know all this.

My thoughts exactly. The pseudo-apology, given in a personal context, not a business context, I might add, as if the misrepresentation were some trivial matter, rather than an essential element of the contract, made me look askance at this whole mess. But the sudden ploy of trying to send the misrepresented stone back is too convenient for words. Obviously, the cash and stone couldn't remain in the seller's possession so one of them had to go.

 

[minousbijoux]

You know Kelpie, for all the support you have here, we could all probably pitch in and buy you a real paraiba!

Kate Klein or RockHugger or Gemsrock2010 should watch out, because there are a lot of folks who now know how she conducts herself - she will never know if someone is buying her goods because she is duping them and they think they're getting a deal, or whether its one of us, the growing crowd of indignant and disgusted gem lovers who might buy something from her knowing it was likely fraudulent to turn her in and tank her business...but then again as others have said, what goes around, comes around, and for that I am grateful

 

[pregcurious]

PSers, are you suspicious of RH's Paraiba listing and would like Ebay to investigate and potentially take action against RH? (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280712672577&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123).

If you are, I encourage you to flag this listing as suspicious for Ebay to investigate. Anyone registered on Ebay can contact them about a listing that violates the policies of Ebay for selling jewelry:

Ebay Policy overview for selling Jewelry, precious metals, or loose beads
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/jewelry.html
"Policy overview
-When you sell jewelry, precious metals, and loose beads on eBay, you need to follow a few guidelines. First, be sure to select a category that matches the item listed. Second, be sure to provide clear and accurate information in the item description. Listings that misrepresent (or appear to misrepresent) the true nature or value of the item being sold may be removed from eBay.
-For more details, see the What are the guidelines? section below.
-Make sure your listing follows these guidelines. If it doesn't, it may be removed, and you may be subject to a range of other actions, including restrictions of your buying and selling privileges and suspension of your account."

If you would like to join me in flagging the listing as suspicious, please do the following:
-Log into Ebay (or register if you do not have an account)
-Click on Customer Support (top right of window)--choose "Customer Support" on the pull down menu
-Click on the "Contact Ebay" window (which will appear BEHIND the "Find Answer" window)
-Click on "Buyer"
-Under "Resolving Buying Problems", click on "Report Item or Listing"
-Enter the item number: 280712672577 (or the listing will pop up if you have visited it recently)
-Click "Report Item" --> Choose the following violation: Listing practices > Fraudulent Listing Activity > You suspect that a listing is fraudulent
-You will get" The listing has items being sold without the owner's authorization. You didn't bid.", unless of course you are Kelpie. Kelpie should get something else.
-Press "Send".
-You will some boilerplate text that they will review the report, and they can delete the listing, give the seller some training, or restrict their buying/selling privileges/inactivate them.

 

[Ella]

Please stick to the facts and avoid making accusations. Keep the seller's personal life out of the thread or we will need to close it.

Please be respectful regardless of the situation.

 

[Arkteia]

Everything I know about RH's personal life is from her own posts, I do not know her personally and the first time I found her name was from this thread. She has been actively posting here until about a year ago. But I accept the blame since the feedbacks I saw on ebay are no longer there. And since they are no longer there, my post lacks credence. Because of this, I shall send an email to Ella and ask to delete my post. I made it in haste and feel that it lacks courtesy.

P.S. I just emailed Ella and asked to remove the previous post. As well as my post about another vendor who was not too fast in refunding me.

 

[SB621]

PSers, are you suspicious of RH's Paraiba listing and would like Ebay to investigate and potentially take action against RH? (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280712672577&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123).

If you are, I encourage you to flag this listing as suspicious for Ebay to investigate. Anyone registered on Ebay can contact them about a listing that violates the policies of Ebay for selling jewelry:

Ebay Policy overview for selling Jewelry, precious metals, or loose beads
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/jewelry.html
"Policy overview
-When you sell jewelry, precious metals, and loose beads on eBay, you need to follow a few guidelines. First, be sure to select a category that matches the item listed. Second, be sure to provide clear and accurate information in the item description. Listings that misrepresent (or appear to misrepresent) the true nature or value of the item being sold may be removed from eBay.
-For more details, see the What are the guidelines? section below.
-Make sure your listing follows these guidelines. If it doesn't, it may be removed, and you may be subject to a range of other actions, including restrictions of your buying and selling privileges and suspension of your account."

If you would like to join me in flagging the listing as suspicious, please do the following:
-Log into Ebay (or register if you do not have an account)
-Click on Customer Support (top right of window)--choose "Customer Support" on the pull down menu
-Click on the "Contact Ebay" window (which will appear BEHIND the "Find Answer" window)
-Click on "Buyer"
-Under "Resolving Buying Problems", click on "Report Item or Listing"
-Enter the item number: 280712672577 (or the listing will pop up if you have visited it recently)
-Click "Report Item" --> Choose the following violation: Listing practices > Fraudulent Listing Activity > You suspect that a listing is fraudulent
-You will get" The listing has items being sold without the owner's authorization. You didn't bid.", unless of course you are Kelpie. Kelpie should get something else.
-Press "Send".
-You will some boilerplate text that they will review the report, and they can delete the listing, give the seller some training, or restrict their buying/selling privileges/inactivate them.

Done!

Ella I'm sorry but RH put her personal life up on the forums so of course it will be referenced. Just look at previous posts in pearls forum. Regardless I don't want this thread closed so I won't comment more on the subject. Except I agree with T-gal and pretty much always have.

 

[Arkteia]

Sarahbear, it was my post that got deleted per my request. RH's personal life is all over the PS and plus, I did not say anything negative about her personal life, rather, was supportive, so that part of my previous post does not faze me. But unfortunately, I mentioned some issues related to RH's eBay activity, which I should not have done because these issues are no longer there. So I asked to delete that post. It was my post that Ella was referring to. Sorry.

 

[Imdanny]

I retract the word "Duh" from my previous post. Absolutely, we should be respectful no matter the situation.

I will say that the fact the seller so far has refused to admit the fact that the contract was contingent upon the stone being as represented is frustrating.

The seller did not mention this fact in her recent post and has said many non sequitars, e.g. said a similar stone that was not represented to be what this one was represented as sold for x price, etc.

The seller is responsible for the misrepresentation.

Kelpie, I'm sorry for the trouble you've had. Hugs.

 

[Mynah*Bird]

I haven't been posting much lately but I have been avidly reading this thread in hopes that RockHugger sees the light and realizes how totally wrong she is on all accounts.............and the longer this goes on the less hope I have, I'm so sorry Kelpie!

As everyone else has stated numerous times, wrong that you were sold a stone which was misrepresented, wrong that she won't stand behind a grossly advertised "150% guarantee," wrong that she has now kept your money and goods, and wrong that she won't refund you and now demands you to file a claim.

So let me get this part, and I may be off since I suffer from Mommybrain, (especially on Mondays).......you paid her the $800, it is insured for that ammount I assume, so she keeps the $800 YOU paid and tells you the only way to recoup your $800 is by filing a claim, yet she has the stone and the money?!

Stinky McStinkerton....

 

[Arkteia]

I would also lodge a complaint with ND attorney general, as herekittykitty has advised. It is easy to open another account on eBay or what not..she should be reported to eBay, no doubt, but the main goal of eBay is to promote sales ... its protection is very limited. Paypal is better but there are loopholes to avoid Paypal..although since her cc application was rejected a frozen Paypal account may be a problem for RH, so I would pursue this avenue regardless of time limitations. But someone has to also go after her so that it would be difficult to emerge under another name. Her and Paypal. If they agreed to work with my bank, it is a precedent and I will be happy to provide information about my case if needed.

 

[kelpie]

I haven't been posting much lately but I have been avidly reading this thread in hopes that RockHugger sees the light and realizes how totally wrong she is on all accounts.............and the longer this goes on the less hope I have, I'm so sorry Kelpie!

As everyone else has stated numerous times, wrong that you were sold a stone which was misrepresented, wrong that she won't stand behind a grossly advertised "150% guarantee," wrong that she has now kept your money and goods, and wrong that she won't refund you and now demands you to file a claim.

So let me get this part, and I may be off since I suffer from Mommybrain, (especially on Mondays).......you paid her the $800, it is insured for that ammount I assume, so she keeps the $800 YOU paid and tells you the only way to recoup your $800 is by filing a claim, yet she has the stone and the money?!

Stinky McStinkerton....

Um yeah. Except she seems to have realized the flaw in her logic and has recently shipped me back the worthless stone. No, how does that make sense? Ship me back the money!

Thank you, Mynah