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Ideal_Rock
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2 plus carat diamond - help!
- Thread starter JD_MD
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diamondsbylauren
Brilliant_Rock
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No, I''m just a cart following a horse. The horse that leads the cart is how a diamond actually looks.Date: 5/24/2005 3:41:38 PM
Author: valeria101
Oh well, it sounds like it is the ''proof'' that makes AGS0 & H&A attractive and not the other way around. Could this be just a war of words ?
There''s room for an entire dictionary between the current 100 kinds of ''ideal by anybody''s guess'' and the bright new GIA and AGS cut grading mantras and top cut grades. Perhaps these respectable institutions are just following your word by broadening the cut standard back into its senses.
I feel pretty sure that GIA''s top grade for cut will include a lot of stones currently excluded from "ideal".
As far as supply of 2+ carat stones- supply is very short. All stones that I''ve seen presented here looked pretty darn good, and reasonably priced-
Prices are up at least 25% over 12 months ago- in real dollar terms.
diamondsbylauren
Brilliant_Rock
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Hi Leonid,
If I''m not mistaken, the images you have posted are computer generated.
The stones number 2,3, and 4( from the left), look pretty good to me in the "head on" depiction.
I don''t really recall ever seeing a diamond in real life look quite like the stone on the far left, or the 2 stones on the far right.
I don''t appreciate the use of the IdealScope photos- clearly the head''s on non colored photos looks more like a diamond- and in the heads up photos there''s no difficulty in determining which are the poorly cut stones.
Of course I''ve seen 60/60''s with crown angles greater than 35degrees that were not attactive.
If I''m not mistaken, the images you have posted are computer generated.
The stones number 2,3, and 4( from the left), look pretty good to me in the "head on" depiction.
I don''t really recall ever seeing a diamond in real life look quite like the stone on the far left, or the 2 stones on the far right.
I don''t appreciate the use of the IdealScope photos- clearly the head''s on non colored photos looks more like a diamond- and in the heads up photos there''s no difficulty in determining which are the poorly cut stones.
Of course I''ve seen 60/60''s with crown angles greater than 35degrees that were not attactive.
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Date: 5/24/2005 5:06:54 PM
Author: diamondsbylauren
No, I''m just a cart following a horse. The horse that leads the cart is how a diamond actually looks.Date: 5/24/2005 3:41:38 PM
Author: valeria101
Oh well, it sounds like it is the ''proof'' that makes AGS0 & H&A attractive and not the other way around. Could this be just a war of words ?
There''s room for an entire dictionary between the current 100 kinds of ''ideal by anybody''s guess'' and the bright new GIA and AGS cut grading mantras and top cut grades. Perhaps these respectable institutions are just following your word by broadening the cut standard back into its senses.
I feel pretty sure that GIA''s top grade for cut will include a lot of stones currently excluded from ''ideal''.
As far as supply of 2+ carat stones- supply is very short. All stones that I''ve seen presented here looked pretty darn good, and reasonably priced-
Prices are up at least 25% over 12 months ago- in real dollar terms.
25% increase in 12 months?? Looks like diamonds and mansions are the best investments right now...beats the market by a long shot!!
I''m also thinking about the extra $7500 the stone will cost me as opposed to last year...ouch!
pricescope
Ideal_Rock
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Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
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well........i had an 60/60 (mine was UGLY)
https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/from-a-1-47-ct-60-60-stone-to-a-1-15-ct-after-the-recut-by-infinity-diamonds.24501/
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So... that's just fine, except that the tutorial page (link) implies that the first four pics on the chart represent desirable pieces.
And there is no IS interpretation of "fish eye" (due here) to help straighten things. The page on "Fish Eye" says that the HCA catches that effect. I tried 39.7 - 40.2 pavilion angles with all crown angles allowed for 60/60 and no combination read "fish eye" (pavilion angles off the chart do)...
Thinking of a certain chart showing that light red under IS is not that bad (posted by Serghey and lost somewhere in the depth of Pricescope) those first four looked just right.
Aside these, I could not find other clues about fish eye, the IS and HCA to help read Leonid's 60/60 lineup and your comment.
Perhaps it is my way of reading through these things that needs revision... Is the tutorial being revised by any chance ?
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So... the new version is the one up there ? If so, the previous post already contains a sugestion: to give an IS interpretation of the fish.
Also, I thought the chart showing the meaning of pink-to red variations under the IS was quite useful - it would be nice to revisit that explanation somehow if you guys find it appropriate. There must be an intuitive way to describe what it says.
If the new version is not the current one ... I''d be happy to take a look, of course.
pricescope
Ideal_Rock
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I''m looking at the followng diamond:
RB 2.16 F SI1 8.43-8.47-5.07 IDEAL Depth 60.00 Table 57 N IDEAL IDEAL
Crown Angle 34.1
Pavillion Angle 41.0
Is the 41.0 pavillion angle too steep for this stone? The 60/60 stone that is noted above looks too dark under the table with a 41.0 pavillion...would mine look dark as well or does the 57 table change everything???
Thanks
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
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Take the specs and plus them into the HCA.
Then take that 41 pav angle, using same specs, and put in a 40.9.
Then try it with a 40.8.
You will most likely see a better (lower) number each time, you may even see all 4 EX''s rather than EX/EX/EX/VG which is very common (and not bad at all) with the 40.8 or a 40.7 number. The HCA penalizes stones with 41 pav angles.
In any case, the stone you selected is 99.9% fine....but I am a stickler and prefer my stones with lower pav angles. Not everyone is as anal about certain things....BUT Aljdewey has gotten a few new stones over the last few years and her comments to me recently were that she felt the 41 pav angle vs the 40.7 made a huge difference in the POP of her stones. Then again it could be those ''minor facets'' that make a big deal too. I can''t definitively...but for me, if I were spending $20 or $25k I would get a stone that had all my number requirements, esp if it was the LAST stone for me type thing. If you are upgrading it later, then by all means try this one and see if you like it.
Then take that 41 pav angle, using same specs, and put in a 40.9.
Then try it with a 40.8.
You will most likely see a better (lower) number each time, you may even see all 4 EX''s rather than EX/EX/EX/VG which is very common (and not bad at all) with the 40.8 or a 40.7 number. The HCA penalizes stones with 41 pav angles.
In any case, the stone you selected is 99.9% fine....but I am a stickler and prefer my stones with lower pav angles. Not everyone is as anal about certain things....BUT Aljdewey has gotten a few new stones over the last few years and her comments to me recently were that she felt the 41 pav angle vs the 40.7 made a huge difference in the POP of her stones. Then again it could be those ''minor facets'' that make a big deal too. I can''t definitively...but for me, if I were spending $20 or $25k I would get a stone that had all my number requirements, esp if it was the LAST stone for me type thing. If you are upgrading it later, then by all means try this one and see if you like it.
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
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wow actually I just plugged the numbers in myself.
First off HCA for the 41 pav angle and the rest of your specs only give TWO EX''s and the other two are VG''s! I would DEFINITELY not be into that. The score is still low at 1.3 but TWO and TWO? Not my cup of tea at all.
If you change that pav angle to 40.9, it moves to ALL EX''s and a 1.2 score. 40.8 gives a 1.0 EX score which is probably the sweet spot for that stone IMO.
But honestly...I don''t know...that 41 may just change alot in how the stone would look. Tiny shifts in pav angles are important. It''s a beautiful stone regardless, now we are just splitting hairs. But hey that''s the fun part.
First off HCA for the 41 pav angle and the rest of your specs only give TWO EX''s and the other two are VG''s! I would DEFINITELY not be into that. The score is still low at 1.3 but TWO and TWO? Not my cup of tea at all.
If you change that pav angle to 40.9, it moves to ALL EX''s and a 1.2 score. 40.8 gives a 1.0 EX score which is probably the sweet spot for that stone IMO.
But honestly...I don''t know...that 41 may just change alot in how the stone would look. Tiny shifts in pav angles are important. It''s a beautiful stone regardless, now we are just splitting hairs. But hey that''s the fun part.
You''re absolutely right..it''s just too steep. You gotta wonder how accurate those angle measurements are though. I mean...if it really was a 40.8 it would score a 1 and it would be my perfect stone based on my other criteria.Date: 5/25/2005 11:55:58 AM
Author: Mara
wow actually I just plugged the numbers in myself.
First off HCA for the 41 pav angle and the rest of your specs only give TWO EX''s and the other two are VG''s! I would DEFINITELY not be into that. The score is still low at 1.3 but TWO and TWO? Not my cup of tea at all.
If you change that pav angle to 40.9, it moves to ALL EX''s and a 1.2 score. 40.8 gives a 1.0 EX score which is probably the sweet spot for that stone IMO.
But honestly...I don''t know...that 41 may just change alot in how the stone would look. Tiny shifts in pav angles are important. It''s a beautiful stone regardless, now we are just splitting hairs. But hey that''s the fun part.
How accurate is Sarin?
Mara
Super_Ideal_Rock
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Sarin is only as accurate as the calibration of the machine. Two different machines will most likely give you two different readings.
However, if the stone is AGS, then they also run the angles. So if the cert says 41 (don''t know that it does...I havent looked and am on my way out the door)..and the Sarin says 41, then chances are it is pretty close to being 41 as the average. But if the AGS says 41 and the Sarin says 40.9...then you can take the one you like better OR err on the side of pickiness like me and vote against it because one of the items says 41.
Really it all comes down to you in the end, what you feel comfortable with. Pav angles have been discussed on here in the past, tiny changes in them can make large differences in the stone visuals. I have 2 41 pav angle stones and I honestly don''t think they pop as much as my 40.8 pav stones. But they are by no means ugly, they are just as beautiful and are branded H&A but my smaller pav, smaller table type stones just are the ones that I feel are most beautiful TO ME.
You can always order the stone in and then return it if it does not suit! Or keep looking..or order two in and compare them.
Good luck!
However, if the stone is AGS, then they also run the angles. So if the cert says 41 (don''t know that it does...I havent looked and am on my way out the door)..and the Sarin says 41, then chances are it is pretty close to being 41 as the average. But if the AGS says 41 and the Sarin says 40.9...then you can take the one you like better OR err on the side of pickiness like me and vote against it because one of the items says 41.
Really it all comes down to you in the end, what you feel comfortable with. Pav angles have been discussed on here in the past, tiny changes in them can make large differences in the stone visuals. I have 2 41 pav angle stones and I honestly don''t think they pop as much as my 40.8 pav stones. But they are by no means ugly, they are just as beautiful and are branded H&A but my smaller pav, smaller table type stones just are the ones that I feel are most beautiful TO ME.
You can always order the stone in and then return it if it does not suit! Or keep looking..or order two in and compare them.
Good luck!
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