Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in NYC.

[JewelFreak]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

If we didn't live in a "sue happy society" the drug companies will release more drugs to cure more diseases.

Because they could spend the tens of millions per year now allocated to legal depts on research instead.

I worked in the pharmaceutical industry around the world for 14 years. It is thanks to drug companies that losing a child or a parent is a rarity rather than the norm experienced by every family; that people with chronic illnesses like asthma, depression, heart disease, diabetes, live long & normal lives.

Pharmaceutical companies aren't perfect, but they provide the basis of health that makes the rest of our world possible. Almost every researcher I talked to in all those years went into the field because a relative had some disease that made them want to help find cures for others. They are far far from the evil monoliths usually depicted.

Where would you & your family be without them? I would be dead.

--- Laurie

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

If we didn't live in a "sue happy society" the drug companies will release more drugs to cure more diseases.

Although I agree that our society is most definitely "sue happy" these days, this isn't really a factor that would keep a drug from being released. It's a lot more complicated than that, as it takes years and multiple studies and trials to get a drug to market. That's why they have disclaimers, list side effects, etc... i.e. "you have been warned what is possible if you agree to take this medication" Now, if it was found that the drug company covered up anything during trial phases, that would be another issue.

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Because they could spend the tens of millions per year now allocated to legal depts on research instead.

I worked in the pharmaceutical industry around the world for 14 years. It is thanks to drug companies that losing a child or a parent is a rarity rather than the norm experienced by every family; that people with chronic illnesses like asthma, depression, heart disease, diabetes, live long & normal lives.

Pharmaceutical companies aren't perfect, but they provide the basis of health that makes the rest of our world possible. Almost every researcher I talked to in all those years went into the field because a relative had some disease that made them want to help find cures for others. They are far far from the evil monoliths usually depicted.

Where would you & your family be without them? I would be dead.

--- Laurie

+1
Very well stated, Laurie.

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Let me just say that I don't wanna break my 25 yr winning streak.

Well, a great way to win (not get OR pass on) the flu is to get vaccinated. That goes for any infectious disease that can be prevented through vaccinations. You may be winning, but in your 25 years of not getting a flu shot, it's very likely that you have given it to someone else.

 

[ksinger]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

** facepalm **

Oh fer....

Here we go again. There is simply NO end to the stupid. GAHAAHAHAHAHAA!!

http://www.salon.com/2014/03/17/mtv_star_kristin_cavallaris_anti_vaccine_statements_make_her_the_new_jenny_mccarthy/

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

** facepalm **

Oh fer....

Here we go again. There is simply NO end to the stupid. GAHAAHAHAHAHAA!!

http://www.salon.com/2014/03/17/mtv_star_kristin_cavallaris_anti_vaccine_statements_make_her_the_new_jenny_mccarthy/

I didn't even read the article, as it would just p!ss me off... but since when did celebrities (some really dumb ones, at that) become the new voice of health care?

 

[Logan Sapphire]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

What would you do if one of your children was legitimately vaccine-injured? Not a fever or mild rash- but serious enough to qualify for the vaccine injury compensation fund? Would you continue to vaccinate him/her and your other children?

I have a friend to whom that happened. She stopped the vaccinations for her first child and her second is not vaxed.

My kids are fully vaccinated, in fact, probably overly vaccinated.

 

[kenny]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

** facepalm **

Oh fer....

Here we go again. There is simply NO end to the stupid. GAHAAHAHAHAHAA!!

http://www.salon.com/2014/03/17/mtv_star_kristin_cavallaris_anti_vaccine_statements_make_her_the_new_jenny_mccarthy/

More than these stupid women I blame the media companies.
They make money from controversy.
The more outrageous and upsetting the better.

Who cares that people are dying?
ABC is laughing all the way to the bank.
All that matters is money.

Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if this was all just thought up in a boardroom.
These two women may actually get their kids vaccinated (medical records are private after all) and their public anti-vax position is all just an attention-getting, money-making scam.

 

[amc80]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

What would you do if one of your children was legitimately vaccine-injured? Not a fever or mild rash- but serious enough to qualify for the vaccine injury compensation fund? Would you continue to vaccinate him/her and your other children?

Well, statistically speaking, the chances that a serious reaction would happen again have to be really low.

 

[vintagelover229]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Now I am not a scientist and hadn't researched this prior to this thread but figured I'd post this video for some of you to watch. Either way it's interesting. I'm not saying anything about it one way or another-just posting it for viewing purposes. I'd love to hear your thoughts/opinions on it (FYI it's 16 minutes long).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7kbWfsygG4&noredirect=1#t=508

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

What would you do if one of your children was legitimately vaccine-injured? Not a fever or mild rash- but serious enough to qualify for the vaccine injury compensation fund? Would you continue to vaccinate him/her and your other children?

Well, statistically speaking, the chances that a serious reaction would happen again have to be really low.

This would be a tragic, of course. ...as it is a tragedy when someone takes any drug with which they suffer a severe reaction. No one would be at fault. For example, no one knows they are allergic to penicillin or sulfa until they have a reaction -- they wouldn't have a reason to carry an Epi-Pen in case of anaphylaxis. It's unfortunate, but it happens. Reactions to flu vaccine are not nearly as common, and rarely cause serious side effects/death.

 

[Laila619]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Receiving the flu shot is no guarantee of not getting the flu. It's just essentially a guess as to what strains will be going around. Obviously if you catch a different strain than scientists predicted, then you're SOL.

I fully get behind vaccines that are proven to completely prevent disease. But the flu shot? No.

 

[iLander]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I encouraged DD to just say no the Gardasil "ovarian cancer" vaccine.

I don't feel the iffy science is worth the risk. It MAY help prevent ov cancer, IF it's caused by a few types of HPV (link no proven).

The ovarian cancer rate is actually extremely low, usually 8 out of 100,000 women, .008% of women. Ever wonder why your gyn is so relaxed about giving you your pap smear results? Because it's really not that prevalent.

http://www.cdc.gov/cancer/ovarian/statistics/race.htm

Meanwhile, your chance of being in a serious accident in a car are 1 in 40.

It seems they've been checking under the wrong hoods all these years.

 

[ksinger]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I encouraged DD to just say no the Gardasil "ovarian cancer" vaccine.

I don't feel the iffy science is worth the risk. It MAY help prevent ov cancer, IF it's caused by a few types of HPV (link no proven).

The ovarian cancer rate is actually extremely low, usually 8 out of 100,000 women, .008% of women. Ever wonder why your gyn is so relaxed about giving you your pap smear results? Because it's really not that prevalent.

http://www.cdc.gov/cancer/ovarian/statistics/race.htm

Meanwhile, your chance of being in a serious accident in a car are 1 in 40.

It seems they've been checking under the wrong hoods all these years.

Uh...iLander....Gardasil is not an ovarian cancer vaccine - there IS no vaccine for ovarian cancer, nor is there even a decent test for it at present. Gardasil is a cervical cancer vaccine, and the link between certain strains of HPV and that type of cancer is well-established.

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Receiving the flu shot is no guarantee of not getting the flu. It's just essentially a guess as to what strains will be going around. Obviously if you catch a different strain than scientists predicted, then you're SOL.

I fully get behind vaccines that are proven to completely prevent disease. But the flu shot? No.

That's right, there is no guarantee of not getting the flu... but the CDC has a good history of being pretty accurate on the strains that will likely be going around. They're not perfect -- they're gonna be wrong sometimes. If there is a very different strain from what is typically seen (i.e. H1N1 or "swine flu"), there isn't a whole lot anyone can do about it except to treat those who test positive for it and prepare the next year's vaccine to include said strain.

Most people who contract the flu after getting the shot have either waited too long or happened to be around a carrier prior to the immunization. If more people would get vaccinated, there would be a lot less chance of contracting from a carrier. That said, I am still amazed at those who insist that the flu vaccine "gave them the flu."

All things aren't "proven" and fool-proof, but I still think the responsible thing is to do our part and make an effort. In the case of the flu, at least you would have tried to protect yourself and others.

Kinda got off course with speaking of the flu in particular (and not MMR), but the same goes for any vaccination.

 

[momhappy]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I encouraged DD to just say no the Gardasil "ovarian cancer" vaccine.

I don't feel the iffy science is worth the risk. It MAY help prevent ov cancer, IF it's caused by a few types of HPV (link no proven).

The ovarian cancer rate is actually extremely low, usually 8 out of 100,000 women, .008% of women. Ever wonder why your gyn is so relaxed about giving you your pap smear results? Because it's really not that prevalent.

http://www.cdc.gov/cancer/ovarian/statistics/race.htm

Meanwhile, your chance of being in a serious accident in a car are 1 in 40.

It seems they've been checking under the wrong hoods all these years.

The ovarian cancer rate may be low, but it is the 5th leading cause of cancer-related death among women. It is the deadliest of gynecologic cancers. I just met a man a few weeks ago who lost his wife to ovarian cancer and a good friend of mine, just had her cousin diagnosed with it (she's in her 40's, had 3 kids, and is now dying…). It's no laughing matter.

 

[ksinger]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

I encouraged DD to just say no the Gardasil "ovarian cancer" vaccine.

I don't feel the iffy science is worth the risk. It MAY help prevent ov cancer, IF it's caused by a few types of HPV (link no proven).

The ovarian cancer rate is actually extremely low, usually 8 out of 100,000 women, .008% of women. Ever wonder why your gyn is so relaxed about giving you your pap smear results? Because it's really not that prevalent.

http://www.cdc.gov/cancer/ovarian/statistics/race.htm

Meanwhile, your chance of being in a serious accident in a car are 1 in 40.

It seems they've been checking under the wrong hoods all these years.

Uh...iLander....Gardasil is not an ovarian cancer vaccine - there IS no vaccine for ovarian cancer, nor is there even a decent test for it at present. Gardasil is a cervical cancer vaccine, and the link between certain strains of HPV and that type of cancer is well-established.

I feel obliged to add, the link is SO well established that they know which ones (16, 1 and can and DO do HPV DNA tests in addition to regular pap screenings for high-risk patients. Also, cervical cancer is a leading cause of death of women outside of first-world countries. There is nothing funny about cervical cancer, and gynocologists are not "relaxed" about it. They take it very seriously indeed.

 

[ArielleB]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Okay, educated people, help me out here. I'd love to give some water-tight answers to these common objections:

1) I don't want to vax my baby because his/her brain is developing so rapidly, and aluminium (in vaccines as a preservative) is a known neurotoxin.

It's not enough to say it's a 'safe level'-give me details of studies that prove the safety levels of aluminium.


2) The vaccines given to newborns disrupt an otherwise pristine gut environment. That's why there are so many food allergies these days.

Go.


I think the problem is not always just uneducated people; it includes educated people who know enough to question, and enough not to blindly trust. This thread might promote vaccines more effectively as a q&a thread, rather than as a point-the-finger-at-the stupid-non-vaxxers thread.

 

[Rhapsody]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Now I am not a scientist and hadn't researched this prior to this thread but figured I'd post this video for some of you to watch. Either way it's interesting. I'm not saying anything about it one way or another-just posting it for viewing purposes. I'd love to hear your thoughts/opinions on it (FYI it's 16 minutes long).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7kbWfsygG4&noredirect=1#t=508

Andrew Wakefield has zero credibility. His studies had major conflicts of interest, shoddy methodology and fabricated data. He has lost his ability to practice medicine in the UK. This gives a summary of the issue and links to other sources.
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/antivaccine-hero-andrew-wakefield-scientific-fraud/

There is a fund set up for children harmed by vaccines, the national vaccine injury compensation program. I don't know under what circumstances people are eligible, but the government can help defer medical costs in the rare event there are serious side effects from a vaccine.

I work in academia in a lab that does some work with pharmaceutical companies, so I see some of the money problems from each side. Research and drug development are expensive, and speculative. And I share the frustration about feeling like things that involve our health shouldn't be for profit. But unless tax payers want to pick up those costs capitalism is the only way things will get done.and of course there are people who's goal is to strike drug pay dirt and retire early, everyone I know works to better understand disease so we can find new ways to treat it.

The line between personal freedom and protecting the rights of those who may be hurt by another individual's choices has always been a fine line to walk. When it comes to something as fundamental as protecting the lives of others, I don't think peoples fear should guide the outcome.

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Uh...iLander....Gardasil is not an ovarian cancer vaccine - there IS no vaccine for ovarian cancer, nor is there even a decent test for it at present. Gardasil is a cervical cancer vaccine, and the link between certain strains of HPV and that type of cancer is well-established.

I feel obliged to add, the link is SO well established that they know which ones (16, 1 and can and DO do HPV DNA tests in addition to regular pap screenings for high-risk patients. Also, cervical cancer is a leading cause of death of women outside of first-world countries. There is nothing funny about cervical cancer, and gynocologists are not "relaxed" about it. They take it very seriously indeed.

I really wish I had been a little younger when Gardasil came out, because I would've been first in line to have a needle stuck in my arm! Cervical cancer is no joke -- it is a terrible disease that can be prevented. A friend of mine is in the mid-stages of it. It all started with HPV that she didn't even know she had. She had skipped about three years of pap smears, and it was too late when they found it. It will kill her sooner than later.

This is one of the main reasons why gynos and docs express the importance of a yearly exam. I will vaccinate any daughter of mine with Gardasil -- and give her a little better chance for a healthy life.

Edit: noted to say cervical cancer by way of HPV!! UGH! My mind is must be fried -- too many Rx fills for one RPh!! LOL

 

[ksinger]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Uh...iLander....Gardasil is not an ovarian cancer vaccine - there IS no vaccine for ovarian cancer, nor is there even a decent test for it at present. Gardasil is a cervical cancer vaccine, and the link between certain strains of HPV and that type of cancer is well-established.

I feel obliged to add, the link is SO well established that they know which ones (16, 1 and can and DO do HPV DNA tests in addition to regular pap screenings for high-risk patients. Also, cervical cancer is a leading cause of death of women outside of first-world countries. There is nothing funny about cervical cancer, and gynocologists are not "relaxed" about it. They take it very seriously indeed.

I really wish I had been a little younger when Gardasil came out, because I would've been first in line to have a needle stuck in my arm! Ovarian cancer is no joke -- it is a terrible disease that can be prevented. A friend of mine is in the mid-stages of it. It all started with HPV that she didn't even know she had. She had skipped about three years of pap smears, and it was too late when they found it. It will kill her sooner than later.

This is one of the main reasons why gynos and docs express the importance of a yearly exam. I will vaccinate any daughter of mine with Gardasil -- and give her a little better chance for a healthy life.

Argh! NOT ovarian cancer!!

Sorry, I realize it was likely a typo, coming from you, but people saying it's for ovarian cancer is just bugging me!

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Uh...iLander....Gardasil is not an ovarian cancer vaccine - there IS no vaccine for ovarian cancer, nor is there even a decent test for it at present. Gardasil is a cervical cancer vaccine, and the link between certain strains of HPV and that type of cancer is well-established.

I feel obliged to add, the link is SO well established that they know which ones (16, 1 and can and DO do HPV DNA tests in addition to regular pap screenings for high-risk patients. Also, cervical cancer is a leading cause of death of women outside of first-world countries. There is nothing funny about cervical cancer, and gynocologists are not "relaxed" about it. They take it very seriously indeed.

I really wish I had been a little younger when Gardasil came out, because I would've been first in line to have a needle stuck in my arm! Ovarian cancer is no joke -- it is a terrible disease that can be prevented. A friend of mine is in the mid-stages of it. It all started with HPV that she didn't even know she had. She had skipped about three years of pap smears, and it was too late when they found it. It will kill her sooner than later.

This is one of the main reasons why gynos and docs express the importance of a yearly exam. I will vaccinate any daughter of mine with Gardasil -- and give her a little better chance for a healthy life.

Argh! NOT ovarian cancer!!

Sorry, I realize it was likely a typo, coming from you, but people saying it's for ovarian cancer is just bugging me!

You got to it before I could edit!!! Sorry guys!!

 

[momhappy]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

All infants are exposed to aluminum - it's in the air, food, water, personal hygiene products…. Heck, it's even in breast milk and formula. Even if you control the amount of aluminum in a vaccine (by not vaccinating), there's simply no way to control everyday exposure.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Let me just say that I don't wanna break my 25 yr winning streak.

Well, a great way to win (not get OR pass on) the flu is to get vaccinated. That goes for any infectious disease that can be prevented through vaccinations. You may be winning, but in your 25 years of not getting a flu shot, it's very likely that you have given it to someone else.

Yes have coodys, so explain to me why some people whom had gotten the flu shot still catch the flu?.. obviously it does not work for every body.

 

[ksinger]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Let me just say that I don't wanna break my 25 yr winning streak.

Well, a great way to win (not get OR pass on) the flu is to get vaccinated. That goes for any infectious disease that can be prevented through vaccinations. You may be winning, but in your 25 years of not getting a flu shot, it's very likely that you have given it to someone else.

Yes have coodys, so explain to me why some people whom had gotten the flu shot still catch the flu?.. obviously it does not work for every body.

msop04 already did explain it, above.

"Most people who contract the flu after getting the shot have either waited too long or happened to be around a carrier prior to the immunization. If more people would get vaccinated, there would be a lot less chance of contracting from a carrier. That said, I am still amazed at those who insist that the flu vaccine "gave them the flu.""

 

[packrat]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

The flu shot is NOT a guarantee that you won't get the flu. It *never* has been a guarantee, ever ever ever. You will probably won't have as severe a case if you've been vaccinated compared to if you hadn't.

Getting any sort of immunization is not a guarantee that you won't ever get it. I would assume that the more you're exposed to something, the higher your chances of your body not being able to fight it off, vaccinated or not. Yes or no? So, it stands to reason that the more people who are NOT being vaccinated are also upping the risk for those of us who ARE. Yes or no?

It's not Star Trek, there's no "Captain, detectors show H1N1 in our vicinity" "Sheild's UP!" and then the virus bounces off and continues on it's merry way. It's still in your body but you're hopefully vaccinated and able to fight it off...but you're STILL able to pass it to someone else. yes or no?

 

[ksinger]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Since we seem to be going a bit sideways to influenza, I would HIGHLY suggest "The Great Influenza: The Story of the Deadliest Pandemic in History", by John M. Barry. I found it a riveting read. It is an engrossing combination of history and science. It is written for the layperson, but is not dumbed down in any way, and contains an excellent explanation of how influenza mutates over time.

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

All infants are exposed to aluminum - it's in the air, food, water, personal hygiene products…. Heck, it's even in breast milk and formula. Even if you control the amount of aluminum in a vaccine (by not vaccinating), there's simply no way to control everyday exposure.

This is true. The amount of aluminum adjuvant found in some (note: not all) vaccines is about the equivalent to 30-35 ounces of breat milk, so "not vaccinating" in an effort to decrease aluminum exposure doesn't hold water. Furthermore, it's found in a lot of foods, building materials, and medicines (like antacids, buffered ASA).

Here is a list of some Al-containing vaccines/other items in case anyone is interested:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Pneumococcal vaccine
0.125 mg/dose

Diphtheria-tetanus-acellular pertussis (DTaP) vaccine
< 0.17 to < 0.625 mg/dose

Haemophilus influenzae type b (Hib) vaccine
0.225 mg/dose

Hib/ Hep B vaccine
0.225 mg/dose

Hepatitis A vaccine (Hep A)
0.225 to 0.25 mg/dose (pediatrics)
0.45 to 0.5 mg/dose (adults)

Hepatitis B vaccine (Hep B)
0.225 to 0.5 mg/dose

Hep A/ Hep B vaccine
0.45 mg/dose

DTaP/inactivated polio/ Hep B vaccine
< 0.85 mg/dose

DTaP/inactivated polio/Hib vaccine
0.33 mg/dose

Human Papillomavirus (HPV) vaccine - Gardasil
0.225 mg/dose

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Breast milk
0.04 milligrams per liter (mg/L)

Ponds, lakes, streams
0.1 mg/L

Infant formula
0.225 mg/L

Soy-based formula
0.46 to 0.93 mg/L

Buffered aspirin
10 to 20 mg/tablet

Antacid
104-208 mg/tablet

 

[Dancing Fire]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

Let me just say that I don't wanna break my 25 yr winning streak.

Well, a great way to win (not get OR pass on) the flu is to get vaccinated. That goes for any infectious disease that can be prevented through vaccinations. You may be winning, but in your 25 years of not getting a flu shot, it's very likely that you have given it to someone else.

Yes have coodys, so explain to me why some people whom had gotten the flu shot still catch the flu?.. obviously it does not work for every body.

msop04 already did explain it, above.

"Most people who contract the flu after getting the shot have either waited too long or happened to be around a carrier prior to the immunization. If more people would get vaccinated, there would be a lot less chance of contracting from a carrier. That said, I am still amazed at those who insist that the flu vaccine "gave them the flu.""

I known people whom had gotten their flu shot on time and yet they still caught the flu. I am still amazed at those who insist that the flu vaccine will prevent them from catching the flu.

 

[msop04]

Re: Thanks, Anti-Vaxxers. You Just Brought Back Measles in N

The flu shot is NOT a guarantee that you won't get the flu. It *never* has been a guarantee, ever ever ever. You will probably won't have as severe a case if you've been vaccinated compared to if you hadn't.

Getting any sort of immunization is not a guarantee that you won't ever get it. I would assume that the more you're exposed to something, the higher your chances of your body not being able to fight it off, vaccinated or not. Yes or no? So, it stands to reason that the more people who are NOT being vaccinated are also upping the risk for those of us who ARE. Yes or no?

It's not Star Trek, there's no "Captain, detectors show H1N1 in our vicinity" "Sheild's UP!" and then the virus bounces off and continues on it's merry way. It's still in your body but you're hopefully vaccinated and able to fight it off...but you're STILL able to pass it to someone else. yes or no?

This made me laugh!