your opinion on a GIA certified "K" color RB

[tommyboy]

Hi Everyone, I am new to this board and have gotten some valuable info from reading the message boards thus far.

I have bought this stone below and need some opinions on it.

It is a 1.82 ct RB
7.89 - 7.98 x 4.71mm
Depth 59.4
Table 64
Girdle Thin to slightly thick
Culet Small
Polish Very Good
Symmetry Good
Clarity Grade VS1
Flourescance Faint

The stone looks gorgeous and because of the flourescance, it actually faces up like an I or J, I was told by my jeweler. Keep in mind I didnt buy it from a Jeweler but from a friend whose wife owned it and had it certified. They got divorced and I paid $6,250.

Does anyone have any input on a real certified K. I know K's are not usually certified, but a certified K I must say does not look bad, it actually looks great to me. Jewelers will usually say yellow stones are probably K's, but none of these will be certified so in reality will be more like m, or n's

Please post some feedback on your experiences with certified K round Brilliants.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Mara]

Welllllll I don't know much about K colored stones (Valeria may chime in)...but I would venture to guess that a K would definitely show a tint of color, but it would not be YELLOW. I had N colored earrings and I thought they were H's for 2 years! So it all depends on perception. Mine were warm looking but when people note yellow I think of yellow diamonds. Very different.




Anyhow, have you seen it in person? Faint fluor would add something to the stone, but I don't know if it would bump it up TWO color grades to an I. More like a J. Which is still pretty good. J colored stones look very nice..especially when placed in yellow gold settings which absorb some of the color.




Lastly, the one other thing I want to point out is that this stone has an odd cut to it. The table at 64% is WAY too big. The depth corresponds well at 59 but even that is not shallow enough IMO. My stone is a 61.4% table and a 56.9% depth and that combination works very well. 64% however is just huge.




Chances are this stone does not look as good as it could if it was well cut. I am not sure what you paid for it, but I would caution in the future to not necessarily trust a friend when purchasing such an expensive bauble. They may not know more than you do. What did your jeweler say about it?




Anyway, the deed is done so enjoy the stone...but for future purchases, hopefully you will find our board before you buy.

Good luck!

 

[Rhino]

Can you get a Sarin on this stone? If possible we'd like to know crown/pavilion angles.




I have seen K's that are extraordinary stones and even more brilliant than those of higher color when cut properly. The stone you list does have a rather large table but if combined with the right crown/pavilion angles could be a very bright stone and the fluorescence surely helps too. See if you can get those angles and we'll give ya some more input.




Rhino

 

[tommyboy]

Mara & Rhino, thank you both for your input. It is very much appreciated. The large table puts the stone in the 'good cut' range. Although not ideal, the stone has extreme fire and lust. I will try to upload some pictures.

How would I go about getting a sarin report?

Has anyone ever seen a GIA certified K?

When I put it next to a certified I, I can barely notice a difference.

 

[Mara]

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On 1/12/2004 10:05:27 PM tommyboy wrote:











the stone has extreme fire and lust.
----------------


Wow I want one of those!!

If it looks great next to an I then you should be more than fine. Color is mostly about perception, how one's eyes perceive color.

Congrats.

 

[caratgirl]

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On 1/12/2004 10:05:27 PM tommyboy wrote:

Has anyone ever seen a GIA certified K?

When I put it next to a certified I, I can barely notice a difference.----------------

I have seen exactly one that a diamond broker placed in front of me when I was looking for a stone for my nephew's girlfriend. It was so gorgeous, that my husband wanted to get it. Unfortunately, I had specific ranges from my Nephew, and didn't want to be responsible for the decision. It was so nice though...kind of regret not getting it for myself for a pendant. It was a 1.22 or 1.23 ct for only $2900 as I recall, with I think (it's been 4 months or so) VS1 clarity. Much better deal if you love the stone.

 

[valeria101]

I can't see any reason why a 2ct K color would not get certified. There are not too many honest reasons not to submit a stone to certification: one surely is price. If the cost of this exercise approaches the expected value of the stone, than some would pass the cert even if it may make selling easier. But this could not be the case with a 7k diamond.

Oh, and yes, K is getting dangerously close to those wormer color grades I prefer - as Mara mentioned. It sounds like you have got a great piece, given color, size, and what you are saying about it's presence. Are you planning to go about checking the optics of that treasure as Jonathan suggested? I guess the appraiser (if you are going to one) could help and a simple Lightscope toy in your hand would too. Not that's needed, but we see rather few Ks around here...unfortunately.

 

[Giangi]

A true K is not that yellow as many think. Especially if the stone is very well cut, it may face up like a much lighter grade.

The cut may be nice, but we can tell. Large tabled stones may be attractive, if they have the right crown and pavilion combo. You seem to be very sure about what you got and that's all that matters!

 

[chris-uk04]

K isn't as bad as you think. If it is loose against a white background you might think it looks quite yellow. If you see in a setting with white gold or platnum setting, it will be hard to see the color. I was looking this weekend at a H and J stones that were in the setting and they both didn't look yellow at all. It took a bit of studying for my untrained eye to see any difference between the two stones while in the setting.

The price you paid is fair, I think. Here's a 1.64 K, VS1 for $5895... which is $3595 per carat. You paid $3434 per carat though the table is off a wee bit. So I think it's okay there.

1.64 K, VS1, 62% table, 59% depth

Don't loose any sleep over it. A real jeweler (not a mall assistant) may see the color, but your friends and neighbors won't.

 

[tommyboy]

So you dont think an untrained eye will be able to tell that it is a lower grade diamond?

I need to take some pictures of the ring and post it here so everyone can see it...in my eyers it looks great.. only concern I have is that under certain light, it looks yellow...where as, would an I color look yellow under the same light?

I Had it put in a 3 stone lucida platinum setting

1.82 middle, .5 on each side.. 2.83 tcw.

I know because of its large table, the stone is not in the ideal cut range, but it is in the good cut range?

 

[chris-uk04]

I don't think you will see a difference. If there is a jeweler in town go pretend to shop and see a couple of diamonds in settings and see their color range. There are plenty of colors certified by other certification houses. So you would be able to get a good feel of how a K looks in a setting compared to perhaps an G or and H. The "J" I saw was pretty clear in the setting so I don't think a K would look bad at all. Supposedly most people's diamonds are M or something and they don't even know it.

Here are some guide lines. At 64% it falls into 2B for that value. See this page for more detail. If you know more details you can type them in an then it will tell you the overall value. (The actual page has the lower cut grades as well, but it would make the photo fuzzy)
Gem Appraisers

 

[Hest88]

You might as well just get it appraised, for insurance purposes if nothing else. That way you can get the real scoop. Since you bought it already, and from a private party, I'm assuming you can't return it anyway.

 

[Rank Amateur]

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On 1/13/2004 3:43:56 AM chris00nj wrote:

K isn't as bad as you think. If it is loose against a white background you might think it looks quite yellow. If you see in a setting with white gold or platnum setting, it will be hard to see the color. I was looking this weekend at a H and J stones that were in the setting and they both didn't look yellow at all. It took a bit of studying for my untrained eye to see any difference between the two stones while in the setting.

The price you paid is fair, I think. Here's a 1.64 K, VS1 for $5895... which is $3595 per carat. You paid $3434 per carat though the table is off a wee bit. So I think it's okay there.

1.64 K, VS1, 62% table, 59% depth

Don't loose any sleep over it. A real jeweler (not a mall assistant) may see the color, but your friends and neighbors won't.----------------

Note that the photo in this link is not that of the actual diamond. How annoying.

 

[valeria101]

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On 1/13/2004 8:29:02 AM tommyboy wrote:

So you dont think an untrained eye will be able to tell that it is a lower grade diamond? [...]... only concern I have is that under certain light, it looks yellow...where as, would an I color look yellow under the same light?
----------------

If you find a really diamond-obsessed person with a D-color on his/her hand set just rigt, that one may put the diamonds side by side and say : oh, look at that tint: is it an G-H-I-J? And why would a trained person attempt to guess the color grade of a diamond flashing infront of their eyes on someone's hand? (as if that would be a smart thing to try)? The answer to your Q is NO. Grading diamond color is not very easy and requires close inspection under appropriate conditions: a ring at arm length is not that.

Any diamond would pick up the color in the light source: under incandescent lights that's yellow, and the little refractive diamonds seem to pick that up even if we don't after being so used to think that bulbs produce "white" light. Your answer? Yes, sure. There were at least two other recent threads with the same questio, one of the diamonds in question was an H, the other I do not remember.


PS: I do believe that you are really looking to emphasize whatever detraction that rock of yours may have. Why call a 2cts K a "low grade" diamond, and try so hard to pick up that illusive tint? People surely do not spend time judging each others jewelry, nor are they as informed about these as most pricescope dwellers or as you are, now that you went through the "diamond buying process". After all, even most diamond-buyers do not know much more than what their diamond looks like, whatever the grades. All people will ever see is a nice set of diamonds in that ring and that's all. I am very unsure that you'll find a whole lot willing to ask "what color grade is THAT?". Why on Earth ?...

 

[tommyboy]

Thank you to all who have posted responses to my questions. I went today to a few local jewelers. I presented my ring and was offered more than what I paid for it. Its amazing! I need to take a picture and post it...

They also showed me some other diamonds > 2ct, H in color that were SI1 or SI2 If i wanted to upgrade. The inclusions were obvious to the naked eye and I would not even attempt to trade up to something like that. Is this true of SI stones?

Without the certification report, they all told me mine was an I color stone. They tried to show me some Ks but they showed me stones that were so yellow that they were probably more like n, o or a p.

Now that I see mine next to others they are claiming to be of the same color, there is no comparison.

Would anyone trade up to a stone greater than 2ct SI in clarity from what i have now? I dont think it will cost me since I can trade mine in at this jeweler for a premium already....

Thanks as always!

 

[Mara]

I would keep what you have, it sounds great in terms of color and if you think it looks good, you got a great price. Upgrading to something with visible inclusions to me doesn't make sense. If you upgraded at all, I wouldn't ugprade in color since you seem to be happy with it, but instead would upgrade the CUT and a local jeweler with no information other than GIA cert won't be able to help you with that. You'd need a Sarin and your eyes.




But bottom line, you paid next to nothing for this stone...don't try to 'better deal' it, because it sounds like you love it, it looks great and that is all that matters.

 

[valeria101]

I stand by Mara's opinion about 300%

After all, it sounds like the respective jeweler would have liked to get your ring. That he offered a good price for it is really not common, and unlike any outcome of the not-so-many such deals I know of. That the other uncertified "K" stones looked like iced tea I ma not at all surprised: it does hapen often that uncerted stones are so for a reason, and FEW such reaons are right. But most of all, your stone already is close to 2cts in weight and more so in size (since the bigger the diamond, the smaller the difference in size one extra weight unit will make). For example, a nicely cut 2cts will probably barely have 0.3mm more in diameter: not a huge difference to say the least (do you have one of those 0.5mm pens on your desk? it's a good reference...).

Your purhase seems like an outstanding deal already: which really means that increasing anything (color, clarity, weight, cut) for the same money or close is not going to bring much improvement but can easily prove a pitfall.

 

[tommyboy]

Thanks to all the great input I have gotten, I have decided to stay with what I have. I believe it to be an extraordinary deal as well as a beautiful setup.

I will post some pics of it as soon as I get my new digital camera. My old one is broken.

Stay tuned.

 

[tommyboy]

Has anyone seen a lucida style setting and if do, have any thoughts?

I am giving the ring soon, and was looking for some comments on this type setting.

THANKS

 

[abbymax825]

i love the lucidia style setting...i saw it at tiffanys in chicago with the lucidia cut stone in it and my friend who just got engaged has the lucidia style setting with a 2ct round. It is awesome!!! Look at the good old gold website, go to for sale, settings and gallery. There is the lucidia style setting adn the vatache x prong, there is also a u prong with is neat too. My only problem with the lucidia setting is that the prongs are bigger and more noticable than the x prong...just preference!!
Let me know what you think about it!!