Your advice please!
- Thread starter AMCC
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Have you seen the diamond in person? The H and A images look OK, however the stone is cut a little deep. It also scores 2.7 on the HCA. Do you need a high colour and clarity for any reason? CUT is the most important thing to determine the performance of the stone, I feel you could do better!
Hi Snowdrop13, thanks for your response!
There isn't any particular reason why the colour is D and clarify is VS1, this was just the option provided to us. We haven't been able to see the diamond in person yet and won't be able to until a deposit is put down.
How do you determine if stone is cut too deep? From my research it seems to fit within the ideal proportions...is there something I am missing? I have been using the below parameters as a guideline for ideal cut. Would love to hear what you think.
Thanks
There isn't any particular reason why the colour is D and clarify is VS1, this was just the option provided to us. We haven't been able to see the diamond in person yet and won't be able to until a deposit is put down.
How do you determine if stone is cut too deep? From my research it seems to fit within the ideal proportions...is there something I am missing? I have been using the below parameters as a guideline for ideal cut. Would love to hear what you think.
Thanks
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You will pay a premium for a D - an F is still classed as 'Colourless' and a G or an H will still look icy-white face-up if it is cut well
You might see some slight tint from the side, but tolerance of colour is an entirely personal choice - it makes virtually no impact on actual performance of a round stone. You should ideally see a range of GIA- or AGS-rated stones across the colour range to determine how low you are happy to go - no point paying loads for a D if you and your partner would be happy with an H! Could get a much larger H than a D for the same price
Clarity is also a personal thing - some people are happy with some visible inclusions in an SI1 or even an SI2, but there are also a few unicorns out there at that range that don't have inclusions that are easily visible to the naked eye, despite the grading! Lots of small inclusions spread out are likely to be less visible than a single large one, for example, but even a single large one might be fine if it's not black and/or is hidden under the star facets rather than being visible under the table.
VS1 shouldn't have anything visible in it, VS2 should also be fine (although some appear to have black crystals in that I've seen.) Me? I'm a clarity freak and wanted very definitely 'mind clean', hence went VVS2, but did so in the knowledge I was paying more for something I (literally) couldn't see lol
You might see some slight tint from the side, but tolerance of colour is an entirely personal choice - it makes virtually no impact on actual performance of a round stone. You should ideally see a range of GIA- or AGS-rated stones across the colour range to determine how low you are happy to go - no point paying loads for a D if you and your partner would be happy with an H! Could get a much larger H than a D for the same price
Clarity is also a personal thing - some people are happy with some visible inclusions in an SI1 or even an SI2, but there are also a few unicorns out there at that range that don't have inclusions that are easily visible to the naked eye, despite the grading! Lots of small inclusions spread out are likely to be less visible than a single large one, for example, but even a single large one might be fine if it's not black and/or is hidden under the star facets rather than being visible under the table.
VS1 shouldn't have anything visible in it, VS2 should also be fine (although some appear to have black crystals in that I've seen.) Me? I'm a clarity freak and wanted very definitely 'mind clean', hence went VVS2, but did so in the knowledge I was paying more for something I (literally) couldn't see lol
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everyone covered a majority of my thoughts above... i'd hesitate to go with such high color and clarity knowing i could get an F (colorless still) eye clean VS2 stone in a larger size. Have you done any online shopping for price comparisons? Whiteflash, High Performance Diamonds or Brian Gavin for super ideal stones and you can go to the featured sponsors tab to see other recommended vendors. James Allen has great videos and you can get IS on a number of stones too. You'll find you pay a premium for super ideals but you have all of the light performance details at your fingertips and actually may even find prices comparable to a B&M store.
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It does not fit into ideal proportions. Angles should be complimentary.
Crown 34 to 35
Pavilion 40.6 to 40.8 but 34 better with 40.8 etc.
If you have a 35.5 crown you should really pair it with a 40.6 pavilion, 40.8 is a little steep for that crown. It can still look very beautiful but if you are buying blind, with a non refundable deposit, I'd look elsewhere. I'd discount it on colour and clarity alone unless you culturally require such high colour.
What is your budget and what specs do you require.
Crown 34 to 35
Pavilion 40.6 to 40.8 but 34 better with 40.8 etc.
If you have a 35.5 crown you should really pair it with a 40.6 pavilion, 40.8 is a little steep for that crown. It can still look very beautiful but if you are buying blind, with a non refundable deposit, I'd look elsewhere. I'd discount it on colour and clarity alone unless you culturally require such high colour.
What is your budget and what specs do you require.
Thanks for all your input and knowledge!
We have explored the option of buying online but we haven't been able to find a jeweler who is willing to set it here in Australia.
One thing I'm not grasping is the relationship between the angles, how do you determine complimentary angles? Hoping you can shed some light on this one gm89uk!
Budget is around 20-25k AUD
Specs -
1.5-1.7
Eyeclean
Would prefer E-F or colourless
Above all getting the ideal cut would be the most important factor
Thank you!
We have explored the option of buying online but we haven't been able to find a jeweler who is willing to set it here in Australia.
One thing I'm not grasping is the relationship between the angles, how do you determine complimentary angles? Hoping you can shed some light on this one gm89uk!
Budget is around 20-25k AUD
Specs -
1.5-1.7
Eyeclean
Would prefer E-F or colourless
Above all getting the ideal cut would be the most important factor
Thank you!
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- May 20, 2016
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- 5,105
Put your numbers into this tool (https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca). Reject anything with a HCA > 2.0 (some prefer 1.8. This is a rejection tool, .5 is not better than 1.7.
This tool looks specifically at how complimentary the angle are to each other.
With your budget, is that the cost for the ring and diamond? What % taxes & import will you pay and does that come out of the 20-25k budget?
This tool looks specifically at how complimentary the angle are to each other.
With your budget, is that the cost for the ring and diamond? What % taxes & import will you pay and does that come out of the 20-25k budget?
Thank you Rockysalamander, appreciate it!
I read that scores between 0-1 are not great for rings, is there a reason why that is?
25k for the diamond including the import costs but exclusive of taxes as we can always go overseas to get the tax back.
Thank you
I read that scores between 0-1 are not great for rings, is there a reason why that is?
25k for the diamond including the import costs but exclusive of taxes as we can always go overseas to get the tax back.
Thank you
Pavilion facet are the main reflectors.
Crown facets are the main dispersions.
A steeper crown needs a shallower pavilion and vice versa.
The figures you are reading are averages. If the crown angle is 34 it is an average of all 8. A poorly cut diamond can have a wide variety of angles and the average be 34, looking ideal on paper but not materialising in real life performance. That's why pictures, H&A and reflector images are important.
34 therefore is better paired with 40.8. however this is not set in stone and 34 paired with 40.6 can be beautiful if cut to tight tolerances. Additionally 40.6 is rounded and can mean anything between 40.5 to 40.69. if you have 34/40.5 and the diamond is not precision cut you have a higher chance of obstruction (a dark appearance to diamond on close viewing).
35 is usually good with either 40.6 or 40.8.
The very general rule is, if angles are complementary, a shallower crown leads to brighter diamonds, a steeper crown leads to more fiery diamonds. Within ideal ranges this is a subtle effect, mainly leading to different in flavour. This is more apparent with diamonds that have complementary angles but a bit more significant difference, 32/41 for example. A trained eye can visualise the subtle difference even in ideal angles.
35.5 can produce very beautiful fiery diamonds but it is harder to find the really good ones. Online it is much easier for to the vast amount of choice.
There are several Australian Pricescopers here who can you help you if you wanted to consider the online route (bmfang is a very helpful one!).
If you haven't seen many diamonds in person, don't limit yourself to colourless range until you have had a chance to look at G and H (GIA, AGS) diamonds in person. You may be very pleasantly surprised by how clear they appear, particularly in MRB.
HCA 0 to 1 stones, tend to be shallower stones, sometimes better suited for viewing from a distance than upclose scrutiny. I believe 0 to 1 stones are usually very good stones for pendants and earings. This is not a rule by any means
Crown facets are the main dispersions.
A steeper crown needs a shallower pavilion and vice versa.
The figures you are reading are averages. If the crown angle is 34 it is an average of all 8. A poorly cut diamond can have a wide variety of angles and the average be 34, looking ideal on paper but not materialising in real life performance. That's why pictures, H&A and reflector images are important.
34 therefore is better paired with 40.8. however this is not set in stone and 34 paired with 40.6 can be beautiful if cut to tight tolerances. Additionally 40.6 is rounded and can mean anything between 40.5 to 40.69. if you have 34/40.5 and the diamond is not precision cut you have a higher chance of obstruction (a dark appearance to diamond on close viewing).
35 is usually good with either 40.6 or 40.8.
The very general rule is, if angles are complementary, a shallower crown leads to brighter diamonds, a steeper crown leads to more fiery diamonds. Within ideal ranges this is a subtle effect, mainly leading to different in flavour. This is more apparent with diamonds that have complementary angles but a bit more significant difference, 32/41 for example. A trained eye can visualise the subtle difference even in ideal angles.
35.5 can produce very beautiful fiery diamonds but it is harder to find the really good ones. Online it is much easier for to the vast amount of choice.
There are several Australian Pricescopers here who can you help you if you wanted to consider the online route (bmfang is a very helpful one!).
If you haven't seen many diamonds in person, don't limit yourself to colourless range until you have had a chance to look at G and H (GIA, AGS) diamonds in person. You may be very pleasantly surprised by how clear they appear, particularly in MRB.
HCA 0 to 1 stones, tend to be shallower stones, sometimes better suited for viewing from a distance than upclose scrutiny. I believe 0 to 1 stones are usually very good stones for pendants and earings. This is not a rule by any means
- Joined
- May 20, 2016
- Messages
- 5,105
ok...you'll have to translate for me. Can you give us your diamond budget in USD that we can you to select stone for you (less all the taxes/imports)?
https://loupetroop.com/listings/loo...-hca-1-dot-6-in-vatche-platinum-setting;16386
https://loupetroop.com/listings/loo...-hca-1-dot-6-in-vatche-platinum-setting;16386
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- May 20, 2016
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- 5,105
Here's a few to get you started looking at great stones. Spend some time looking at these and sew what you think about color, that is the major difference among these. Hopefully, others will post other options.
1.864 ct H VS2 A CUT ABOVE - https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3852696.htm
1.604 F VS2, Signature, florescence - http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ags-bl-104083068014#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/1/
1.571 ct F VS2 A CUT ABOVE - https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3802921.htm
1.565 ct G VS2 A CUT ABOVE, https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3833682.htm
1.864 ct H VS2 A CUT ABOVE - https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3852696.htm
1.604 F VS2, Signature, florescence - http://www.briangavindiamonds.com/d...ags-bl-104083068014#!prettyPhoto[gallery2]/1/
1.571 ct F VS2 A CUT ABOVE - https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3802921.htm
1.565 ct G VS2 A CUT ABOVE, https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3833682.htm
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- May 20, 2016
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Great. Once you get the feel about what color you like/don't like, you can update us and we can see if there are other options.
Thank you very much!
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