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Would this upset you?

Jennl

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 16, 2011
Messages
5
I am posting this under a separate username because I want to keep my identity anonymous. I have been posting here for well over a year and it will be obvious which vendor I'm referring to if you know my "real" PS identity.

I recently sent a GIA certed stone to a vendor for setting in a custom setting. Upon receiving the stone, the vendor said that she wanted to "go over" the cert with me. Not sure why, but fine with me. The stone is VS2. She proceeds to tell me that the stone isn't typical of a VS2 and that, under the loupe, she can see a couple of darkish inclusions (I've have the cert and am aware of this). They are NOT visible to the naked eye. She then also tells me that because my stone has medium flour. that it will appear cloudy/milky when it gets dirty and will be harder to keep looking clean. I tell her that the stone is mine and I don't really have a way to exchange it, short of spending more money to upgrade (I did not get the stone through this vendor). I ask her what the point of telling me these things is and she says that it's customary for them to "go over" the certs with their clients.

I was kind of upset that it sounded like she was saying negative things about my stone when she knows that it's already mine. She then said that "it's a beautiful stone, I just wanted to make sure you knew about these characteristics". I can understand that if she were selling me the stone, that offering full disclosure would be fantastic, but what's the point of telling a client who's going to be spending $4K+ on a setting with you, that there is something wrong with their stone (when there really isn't...the kind folks of PS were very complimentary about this stone as was the independent jeweler I took it to for a second opinion before deciding to keep it).

So, would this upset you? I'm kind of feeling like I don't want to do business with this vendor right now....
 

VapidLapid

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 18, 2010
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4,267
I wouldnt read too much into that. It may be that she thinks there are some judgement call type discrepancies between your stone and the lab report. She might only be looking out for you.
 

zoebartlett

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 29, 2006
Messages
12,450
I see what you're saying, but like, VapidLapid, I think this vendor was just making sure you're aware of the characteristics of the stone.
 

tyty333

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
Messages
22,120
Yep, I'd be annoyed. Have you had it out in sunlight? Did it go milky/oily? So what if they would call the stone an SI1? If the
lab said its a VS2 and the inclusions match up with the cert then whats the issue? I'm not sure what the person's point was
unless they were trying to sell you a new stone.
 

iheartscience

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 1, 2007
Messages
12,111
Hmmm, I would probably be pretty annoyed too. I also don't understand why a vendor would speak negatively of a client's stone unless she/he was trying to get you to upgrade with them. Plus I think that the whole "fluoro=cloudy" line isn't true. I've never heard that before in regards to cleanliness of a stone. I have heard very strong blue fluoro can make a stone appear cloudy in sunlight, but I don't think that is always the case.

I actually was out shopping for an eternity band recently and the saleswoman/owner told me I should wear my e-ring and wedding band separate because they don't look good together. Obviously I disagree, which is why I wear them that way! Needless to say, I didn't buy the band from her. ;))
 

Amys Bling

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
11,025
Zoe|1308263329|2947781 said:
I see what you're saying, but like, VapidLapid, I think this vendor was just making sure you're aware of the characteristics of the stone.
My initial reaction would to be annoyed/upset. I am emotional and things get to me easily, but after I have some tome I usually ease up and see the other point of view. Like Zoe said I think she wanted to verify this with you and go over it- maybe she felt the cert information was not in depth about these aspects
 

Jennl

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 16, 2011
Messages
5
Exactly my point tyty! Yes, I took it out in direct sunlight (with the jeweler who looked at it for me) and it wasn't the least bit milky or oily. The stone sparkled like crazy and I handled it quite a bit with my hands, so it wasn't all that clean to start with!

I'm not going to pull my business, as I did a lot of homework before deciding to work with this vendor, I'm just a little irritated and wanted to know if I was out of line.

Thanks for the feedback...
 

Jennl

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 16, 2011
Messages
5
thing2of2, I wonder if that jeweler would have thought twice about voicing her opinion if she knew that it had lost her your business. It's like telling someone you don't like their dress. They obviously like it because they bought it and since they're wearing it, they can't return it, so the only thing accomplished by saying anything is to upset them. It just doesn't make sense....
 

junebug17

Super_Ideal_Rock
Premium
Joined
Jun 17, 2009
Messages
12,399
I'd be really annoyed - I just can't see why she would negatively critique a stone you already own. Maybe she thought she was "helping" you by giving information on your diamond :rolleyes: . Very odd for her to make those comments IMO.
 

iheartscience

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 1, 2007
Messages
12,111
Jennl|1308264181|2947792 said:
thing2of2, I wonder if that jeweler would have thought twice about voicing her opinion if she knew that it had lost her your business. It's like telling someone you don't like their dress. They obviously like it because they bought it and since they're wearing it, they can't return it, so the only thing accomplished by saying anything is to upset them. It just doesn't make sense....
Yeah I bet she would have! I was really shocked she said it. Not because I was upset (I'm confident in my taste and I think they look great together) but because it struck me as rude and kind of obnoxious! It just left a bad taste in my mouth and I don't plan to go back. If she had something I really wanted I would have still bought it, though, so I don't blame you for staying with your vendor.

I doubt your vendor meant any harm by her comment, but it still annoying and I'm sure a little upsetting. Not that it's an excuse, but I think that after working in the jewelry industry (or any industry) for a long time, you can forget that to other people, the diamond or piece of jewelry is a big deal. Plus jewelry in particular tends to have a lot of emotion tied up in it.
 

lyra

Ideal_Rock
Premium
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Jul 13, 2007
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5,078
Yes it would have upset me if I wasn't satisfied with her reasoning for making the statements. If I got the hunch that she was criticizing my stone to upsell me something, I wouldn't be happy, but that probably wouldn't have made me change my mind about the setting I wanted. I would have asked her several questions about her statements, because it's my nature to be very inquisitive. I would understand someone pointing out that a particular setting might not show off my stone to it's best advantage, if that could be an issue, but otherwise just a general agreement that the stone was indeed the one on the cert would be sufficient and normal IMO.
 

Circe

Ideal_Rock
Trade
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Apr 26, 2007
Messages
8,087
I would guess she was trying to be sure you knew all the possible outcomes before you shelled out additional cash for a custom setting - if there was a chance you had the option to return and had somehow missed these characteristics, you might have appreciated it.

If you like the vendor's designs and workmanship, I'd say don't take it personally. If, on the other hand, this is the straw that's breaking the camel's back ... don't follow through on a project that will leave a bad taste in your mouth.
 

suchende

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Apr 14, 2008
Messages
1,001
It feels like an attempt to sell a new diamond to me and I would be hugely turned off. It reminds me of when a trainer I'd hired started trying to sell me vitamins... I immediately cancelled all future appointments.
 

swingirl

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Apr 6, 2006
Messages
5,655
I am not sure I'd call her comments "opinion". Her opinion was that it was a beautiful stone. Seems to me she was giving you factual information. The inclusions are really there and the stone does have fluorescence. Is that criticism?

Why would a vendor who is getting a $4000 job purposely want to upset the customer? But if you really feel she wanted to upset you, you ought to take your business elsewhere. Otherwise you won't be happy with your piece and it'll be difficult should another issue arise.
 

eddiexp

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
41
I am not sure if my initial reaction would be annoyance. I'd think the vendor might have just been treating you as an average consumer, and making you aware of such issues just incase you did not know. Perhaps so that you may have a chance to decide if you still want to go through with setting that exact diamond into a relatively pricey setting.

From the sounds of it, it just sounds like a minor misunderstanding, and the vendor is probably not aware that you are more educated than the average consumer?

For example, I tinker with cars a lot as a hobby and have a pretty in depth knowledge of such, probably more than most mechanics. When I goto the dealership to get warranty work done or tires changed etc....they treat me like a complete idiot and explain everything in extreme layman's terms. I don't get offended by this because I understand that to most average consumers they probably have to explain it that way for them to understand what’s going on. I just usually smile and say oh ok. :tongue:
 

Amys Bling

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
11,025
eddiexp|1308269659|2947872 said:
I am not sure if my initial reaction would be annoyance. I'd think the vendor might have just been treating you as an average consumer, and making you aware of such issues just incase you did not know. Perhaps so that you may have a chance to decide if you still want to go through with setting that exact diamond into a relatively pricey setting.

From the sounds of it, it just sounds like a minor misunderstanding, and the vendor is probably not aware that you are more educated than the average consumer?

For example, I tinker with cars a lot as a hobby and have a pretty in depth knowledge of such, probably more than most mechanics. When I goto the dealership to get warranty work done or tires changed etc....they treat me like a complete idiot and explain everything in extreme layman's terms. I don't get offended by this because I understand that to most average consumers they probably have to explain it that way for them to understand what’s going on. I just usually smile and say oh ok. :tongue:
:appl:

Very true- she probably didnt realize you were a sauvy PSer.
 

texaskj

Brilliant_Rock
Joined
Aug 31, 2010
Messages
1,196
I think this is a case of "Don't take it personally." And I know that's not easy when we're talking about your diamond and the fact you're spending a serious chunk of change with her. It wouldn't surprise me if the jeweler thought she was doing you a favor. A Dale Carnegie class would probably do wonders for her. I know someone with her own business and she tends to talk to clients the same way. They seem to forget you're paying them to do what you want. Period.
 

iLander

Ideal_Rock
Joined
May 23, 2010
Messages
6,731
Is there any possibility that she was protecting herself? If she shows you the diamond very carefully, and you are familiar with it, then you are less likely to think she switched your diamond for a lesser diamond during the setting process.

I don't know why that occurs to me, but if I were a jeweler, I'd do that to keep people from falsely accusing me. Maybe she had this problem in the past?

But I'm kinda of the paranoid type . . . :rolleyes:
 

Jennl

Rough_Rock
Joined
Jun 16, 2011
Messages
5
You've all made some really good points. PSers are more savy than the average consumer, so maybe she didn't realize that I had louped the stone myself and also had the backup of a bunch of PS experts! ;)) And maybe she was covering her tush by pointing these things out to me, to prevent any possibility of my thinking the stone had been switched. Who knows??

However, if I WERE an uneducated consumer, she probably would have lost my business because her statements would have panicked me into thinking that I didn't get what I paid for and I'd be trying to return the stone, in which case, I wouldn't need a $4K setting....

I just think that this was a stupid thing to say, no matter the situation. There was no possibility of upselling me another stone, so there was nothing to gain by making any comment other than "my, what a lovely stone..."....

Thanks again for your opinions......back to my "regular" PS persona! :naughty:
 

movie zombie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 20, 2005
Messages
11,879
i'd clear the air first with her before beginning the project......on the other hand, perhaps she's seen this thread and will recognize herself despite the change in your user name. i might have been irritated but being the outspoken person i am, i'd probably have said i'm well aware of what the cert says. its acceptable to me. are you concerned about something happening to the stone during setting? if not, then let's get to it.
 

dreamer_dachsie

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
24,364
She was offering opinions in her comments, not just facts.

Her statements about flour are not factually true by anything I have read in RT or heard from any of the experts there, including some very well respected appraisers. Medium flour in particular is inconsequential to a diamond's appearance, though obviously it gets lumped into the whole "oily looking stone" propoganda. Flour and dirt is something I have never heard of in all the threads on flour that some up! So those were not straight hard facts to my knowledge, but her opinions that I can only think reflect a lack of knowledge. Strike one.

And her comments about the inclusions are interesting but not really that informative, since dark color of inclusions in no way excludes a stone from a VS2 grading, so I am not sure how dark inclusiuons are "not typical" of a VS2. If she wanted to question the clarity grade, say so. Strike two.

Anyways, it would have bugged me because I am a saavy PSer :tongue: and don't like loosey goosey commentary about my diamonds that reflect opinion being expressed as fact, and particularly opinions that contradict the facts as I know them. The scenerio also reminds me of the jeweler who kept going on and on about how horrid J color stones are to me, when I own one. Just bad customer relations and I would likely not work with someone like that. I am sure she did not mean anything bad, but it would still put me off spending big bucks with such a person.
 

supergirl10

Shiny_Rock
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
315
Yeah I think it would have been irritated as well. I am no where near as savy as I could be but would be insulted if a vendor that I had spend 12 months researching was that inconsiderate, I would assume to they were trying to get you to upgrade.

I hope it all works out.
 

Italiahaircolor

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
5,184
I think the best way to show someone you personally disprove of their selling approach, is to take your business elsewhere.

I don't know the reasons behind her going over the stone with you. Obviously, you like the stone, otherwise you wouldn't have purchased it to begin with. So whether it was shaming you or an attempt to up-sell you, who knows. Bottom line is, this vendor isn't the ONLY ONE in the world and you so have the option to take your diamond back and move on to someone you'll have a better report with if it really, really bothers you.
 

Amys Bling

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
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11,025
Bottom line is, YOU need to be comfortabl and happy with the vendor you are using.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Dreamer_D|1308287801|2948143 said:
She was offering opinions in her comments, not just facts.

Her statements about flour are not factually true by anything I have read in RT or heard from any of the experts there, including some very well respected appraisers. Medium flour in particular is inconsequential to a diamond's appearance, though obviously it gets lumped into the whole "oily looking stone" propoganda. Flour and dirt is something I have never heard of in all the threads on flour that some up! So those were not straight hard facts to my knowledge, but her opinions that I can only think reflect a lack of knowledge. Strike one.

And her comments about the inclusions are interesting but not really that informative, since dark color of inclusions in no way excludes a stone from a VS2 grading, so I am not sure how dark inclusiuons are "not typical" of a VS2. If she wanted to question the clarity grade, say so. Strike two.

Anyways, it would have bugged me because I am a saavy PSer :tongue: and don't like loosey goosey commentary about my diamonds that reflect opinion being expressed as fact, and particularly opinions that contradict the facts as I know them. The scenerio also reminds me of the jeweler who kept going on and on about how horrid J color stones are to me, when I own one. Just bad customer relations and I would likely not work with someone like that. I am sure she did not mean anything bad, but it would still put me off spending big bucks with such a person.
Ditto. I am not sure how a PS vendor can make the comment about the fluoro since it is not true and why make any comments on a previously purchased stone at all? Was this a sales person? If so, I might want to talk to a gemologist/jeweler there to question why those comments were made. I think the sales person needs to get some feedback about this, honestly. I am not sure I'd spend $4000 on a setting from anyone but Leon, Steven K, or Victor C., so if it is one of these, I'd probably consider switching to one of the others.
 

partgypsy

Ideal_Rock
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Nov 7, 2004
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6,437
I side with the don't take it personally line. There are other threads which talk about how beneficial it is for a jeweler to review the stone with the client before setting. As we have all seen on previous threads before there are many people not so familiar with their stone, that after setting notice something about their stone that they didn't before and then suspect their stone was switched. The jeweler by reviewing the stone provides additional assurance that this is your stone, and you can identify it after setting.

Granted the way it was done may not have been the most tactful, but I wouldn't necessarily read more into it.
 

diamondseeker2006

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Jan 11, 2006
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55,822
I could have agreed with the "don't take it personally" idea if this had not been said:

"She then also tells me that because my stone has medium flour. that it will appear cloudy/milky when it gets dirty and will be harder to keep looking clean."

Not only is that not true, it was irrelevant as far as educating her about her stone to be sure she didn't think it was switched. All a vendor should do is to say that their stone matches their report and it has no structural problems to prevent it from being set.
 

Indylady

Ideal_Rock
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Apr 28, 2008
Messages
5,574
Huh..just a little strange. I wouldn't take it personally unless she continues to offer opinions/criticisms.
 

jewelerman

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Sep 30, 2007
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3,101
okay, after reading this post i thought that she was trying to sell you one of her stones.But after re-reading it think that she is covering her behind and informing you of certain aspects of the stone.Its not unheard of that clients have a stone set and then tell the jeweler that their stone has been switched because they notice something new afterward.It has happened to every jewelry store owner at least once and that is when you learn to cover your behind with detailed discussions with clients about their jewelry,plotting, and detailed paperwork.Unless she stated something like "Ive got an a better stone to show you "then i would consider that shes not very good at being diplomatic and is covering her behind before doing the work. I would have informed a client early on that a vs graded stone has small dark inclusions because many people believe that vs quality stones should have no dark inclusions.i think she needs to learn how to communicate the strength and weaknesses of a stone better to a client.
 

luv2sparkle

Ideal_Rock
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Feb 3, 2008
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7,741
I think Jewelerman, is absolutely right, but I don't think I would use this vendor to make my setting. Her opinion would feel a bit
like she really didn't care for the stone, and I would wonder if she would be doing her best work on it because of that.

Plus, making a setting for an e-ring is a bit of an emotional thing, I would not want to have any negative feeling attached to it if
I could help it.

Yes, I would be a bit offended. I am always surprised when business people show a lack of savvy in dealing with folks. Hello!!! Avoid
offending those people whom you want to spend money doing business with you!!! Is that not a basic rule of business?
 
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