Which vendors have a good selection of H&A and why are many AGS, not GIA?

[diamondheart]

Looked at a couple of vendors and looked at a diamond at Exceldiamonds, someone here said there are better values around. I was wondering where do you go to look? Also Why does it seem that many of the H&A stones are AGS graded rather than GIA?

 

[pahoyafan]

Whiteflash has 2 stones in their Expert Selection that are 1.3 ct and have better numbers than the 2 stones posted in your other thread. There is a 1.3 ct H VS1 that has cherry numbers (61.7 depth, 56 table, 34.8 crown, 40.7 pavilion). The other stone was a 1.3 ct G VVS2 with 60.6 depth, 55 table, 34.7 crown, and 40.8 pavilion. Though these stones are Expert Selection and not H@A, I don''t think the naked eye would pick up the difference because these stones are so well cut. If you want to search for an H@A stone, click on home and do a diamond search for H@A.

 

[^]

I personally had great experiences with WhiteFlash and GoodOldGold.

AGS is generally a little more coveted than GIA. Overall, their grading is considered more strict, and an AGS000 grade is more sought after than a GIA EX, in my experience. So if you have a truly wonderful stone, you''d want to get the AGS seal of approval, since it also brings in a premium which reflects their desirability in the market.

See this for some more info.

Good luck,
^

 

[strmrdr]

when you don''t have a lot of other info ags0 for cut is a better indicator of a quality cut diamond than gia EX.
That, tradition and a slight premium are the reasons for a AGS report.
From a vendor that provides a lot of info there isn''t any reason to go with one over the other.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 8/8/2006 12:51:29 AM
Author:diamondheart
Looked at a couple of vendors and looked at a diamond at Exceldiamonds, someone here said there are better values around. I was wondering where do you go to look? Also Why does it seem that many of the H&A stones are AGS graded rather than GIA?

You seem to have hold of the wrong end of the tiger.

You think GIA is the top of the tree in diamond grading.

Wrong.
AGS is the niche boutique lab that specializes in cut grading and tends to be more strict than GIA in color and clarity. AGS has more stringent symmetry (but does not recognize H&A''s as being beneficial) and polish grades.

GIA (in my opinion) has a better girdle grading system.

 

[perry]

AGS is more respected as a grading company than GIA.

Another issue: Hearts and Arrows.

Carefull out there. What is a Hearts and Arrows diamond. The original H & A diamonds met some very strict cut and pattern criteria. Lots of people claim that they sell H & A dimonds that are nowhere near those criteria; and in fact can really be far from it.

This is kinda like "ideal cut" diamonds. Most of the companies selling "Ideal Cut" diamonds are not. Only a very small percentage of diamonds are really ideal cut. But it makes great advertising.

Recently the major labs have changed the grading standards to more better reflect an ideal cut. AGS has what most consider the best difinition and most restrictive grading - and rate the factors as a "0" grade. An AGS tripple Zero is a great diamond from a cut perspective.

So, if you are shopping for a H & A diamond - learn what really is a H&A diamond (and not just what some people claim), and if you are looking for a true "ideal" cut diamond to maximize light return and sparkle - make sure you learn what really is a true ideal cut diamond - and not just what some people claim.

I would start in the Q & A section of Pricescope here, and the look for threads on these issues.

I would also suggest reading all of the educational material on NiceIce, Good Old Gold, and Whiteflash. For diamonds, I'd also include a discussion with Wink Jones at Winfields.

Perry

Perry

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 8/8/2006 7:53:11 AM
Author: perry

I would start in the Q & A section of Pricescope here, and the look for threads on these issues.

I would also suggest reading all of the educational material on NiceIce, Good Old Gold, and Whiteflash. For diamonds, I''d also include a discussion with Wink Jones at Winfields.

Perry at $10 an hour of reading and research time it would be easier and cheaper to buy a poorly cut 1.50ct diamond and send it to me to supervise recutting it to a nice 1.00ct

 

[diamondlove]

hi diamondheart,

We got my stone from Exceldiamonds/Supercert and it''s a beautiful H&A. However, I don''t think that they are necessarily a better value -- most of the recommended online vendors are a good value all around but sometimes it''s about finding that right sized stone with good specs and one vendor happens to have the specific specs you are looking for over another.

The ones mentioned here so far are all worth looking at: whiteflash, GOG, Exceldiamonds, Wink''s, James Allen-- I think they all carry the equivalent of H&A (superideal) and Ideal diamonds. IN the end you have to look at the numbers and do your research bc all vendors may have terrific and not so terrific stones.

Good luck!

DL

p.s. Mine is a newly graded AGS0 and I def. recommend that bc they include performance rating (I think that''s the rt way of putting it) or else just make sure the GIA ''Excellent'' ratings are within the numbers you want.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I would just say that there are most certainly diamonds graded by GIA that are equivalent to diamonds graded by AGS. To infer that AGS diamonds are "better" is wrong! Within GIA excellent graded diamonds, the AGS0 category also falls, so you can get a GIA graded diamond with AGS0 qualifications. You can use the HCA to see where your diamond falls. Good Old Gold is a vendor who chooses stones which mostly fall within the highest GIA and AGS grades regardless of which lab graded them.

As far as to the answer of the original question, Good Old Gold and WhiteFlash seem to carry the largest selection of in-house hearts and arrows stones.

 

[WinkHPD]

Date: 8/8/2006 7:41:04 AM
Author: Garry H (Cut Nut)

Date: 8/8/2006 12:51:29 AM


AGS is the niche boutique lab that specializes in cut grading and tends to be more strict than GIA in color and clarity. AGS has more stringent symmetry (but does not recognize H&A's as being beneficial) and polish grades.

Gary,

In conversations with Pete Yantzer he tells me that although they do not list H&A on the grading report that they do recognize that the super symmetry of the H&A cut diamond does improve the contrast pattern as seen in the ASET and that they believe it does enhance the overall light performance and beauty of the diamond.

Wink

 

[aljdewey]

Date: 8/8/2006 8:38:04 AM
Author: diamondseeker2006

To infer that AGS diamonds are ''better'' is wrong! Within GIA excellent graded diamonds, the AGS0 category also falls, so you can get a GIA graded diamond with AGS0 qualifications.

That''s absolutely true.....but for someone who wants to limit the time they spend checking out options, it can be easier to stick to AGS stones. If you know you''re looking for AGS0 qualifications, it''s certainly easier to look at AGS stones, right?

Much the same way that some folks who want eyeclean stones might choose to stick to VS as you do. Doesn''t mean that there aren''t some beautiful, eyeclean SI stones; it just means that a higher percentage of VS stones will be eyeclean than SI stones, so someone very concerned with eyeclean or mindclean might arbitrarily decide not to go below VS.

One little point, though, about GIA stones.....since the information on the grading report is rounded, the feedback from the HCA becomes less exacting. Garry has noted for years that rounding (which previously meant using percentage instead of angles) would produce a less accurate result with wider latitude. If that''s true for percentages, then it''s certainly true for rounded GIA numbers.

If one can get another set of measurements (Sarin, OGI, etc.) that don''t round for a GIA stone, then it would be a better gamble. But again, why go through that when you can just go to the source (AGS) and see what makes their grade?

I always default to looking at AGS first; only if I cannot find what I want in that venue do I expand my search to include GIA stones, and then only if it comes with supplemental measurement info.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

I am making an assumption that GIA grades a tremendously larger number of stones per year than does AGS:

Internet Diamond Listings July 2004
GIA........72.9%
EGL........22.8%
AGS........2.5%
IGI........1.4%
HRD........0.4%

So if this assumption is true, then it is likely that there is access to far more GIA excellents than AGS0 stones. YOu just have to know how to weed through the GIA excellents.

 

[Rod]

Date: 8/8/2006 3:13:16 PM
Author: diamondseeker2006
I am making an assumption that GIA grades a tremendously larger number of stones per year than does AGS:

Internet Diamond Listings July 2004
GIA........72.9%
EGL........22.8%
AGS........2.5%
IGI........1.4%
HRD........0.4%

So if this assumption is true, then it is likely that there is access to far more GIA excellents than AGS0 stones. YOu just have to know how to weed through the GIA excellents.

EXACTLY!

 

[perry]

Garry Says:

Perry at $10 an hour of reading and research time it would be easier and cheaper to buy a poorly cut 1.50ct diamond and send it to me to supervise recutting it to a nice 1.00ct

You are of course right - for those of us who are knowlegable about diamonds.

For a beginner - I suspect reading all the tutorials would be a lot more valuable than just getting a "better" H&A diamond.

As far as your recutting a diamond for me: I keep my eyes open for sparkly things on the beach, and hoping to find an elderely couple willing to sell me a good diamond cheap. If I get one (and after the 30 day waiting period for "found" sparkly''s) - I''ll send it your way.

Perry

 

[diamondheart]

Is AGS000 the same as AGS0 when you do the search for diamonds on pricescope?