Which of 2 diamonds

[Huge Metal Fan]

For ring, hoping to decide today

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...d-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-4826035
1.7 CTW D VS2, 1.9 HCA score, $16,730.
Has some higher visibility inclusions but I think (hope) will be eye clean. Easy to see at 10X, but I can't see them at 5X.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...e-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-7020362
1.66 CTW E VS1, 1.5 HCA score, $15,850.

My goal is to be under $16K but I've not been finding many under 2.0 HCA. Ideally would like to be north of 1.65 CTW and D or E color.

Kind of needs to be from James Allen as they have the setting I want. GF's setting taste is pretty specific and I had a devil of a time finding one I thought matched up to what she likes.

 

[KKJohnson]

I wouldn't pick either, what do you think of these?

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...d-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-6686268

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...f-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-7342345

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...e-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-7193658

 

[lovedogs]

OP: what setting does she like on JA? I dont love the videos for either of the ones you picked.

I really like the 1.70 E/VS2 that @KKJohnson linked. Sadly can't run through HCA because JA hides the reports now.

 

[KKJohnson]

OP: what setting does she like on JA? I dont love the videos for either of the ones you picked.

I really like the 1.70 E/VS2 that @KKJohnson linked. Sadly can't run through HCA because JA hides the reports now.

With them hiding the reports it does make me wonder how well the search feature works, I would hope that it still pulls from your criteria you entered

 

[Huge Metal Fan]

Two of the ones you gave KKJohnson I liked and ran through my filter.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...d-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-6686268
This was one I sifted and liked the look of, HCA came out 2.4 on it. I tentatively rejected because of score.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...e-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-7193658
I also liked this one, it's HCA was 2.6.

Maybe I am over relying on HCA as rejection mechanism? Last diamond I bought I leaned heavily on HCA and was happy with how the stone looked, but could be coincidence.

 

[lovedogs]

Two of the ones you gave KKJohnson I liked and ran through my filter.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...d-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-6686268
This was one I sifted and liked the look of, HCA came out 2.4 on it. I tentatively rejected because of score.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...e-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-7193658
I also liked this one, it's HCA was 2.6.

Maybe I am over relying on HCA as rejection mechanism? Last diamond I bought I leaned heavily on HCA and was happy with how the stone looked, but could be coincidence.

The HCA is a very reliable rejection tool. So I would typically reject anything over 2. Do you have the GIA reports of those two?

 

[lovedogs]

I don't see anything on JA that I would recommend right now, especially since I can't see actual performance in any of them without GIA/AGS certs.

I strongly recommend considering other vendors, and opening up to F color, since F will look incredibly white to almost everyone (even G looks very very white). Up to you of course, but I think being restrictive with color is hurting you in this case.

 

[lovedogs]

As an example: I really like this one from Adiamor. Scores under 2 on the HCA and the specs look good. I would want a video or ASET/IS if possible.

https://www.adiamor.com/Diamonds/1....Cut-Round-Diamond/D43292356?&refer=pricescope
There's one on whiteflash that I like as well, but can't link it because their website it down for me right now.

 

[KKJohnson]

Two of the ones you gave KKJohnson I liked and ran through my filter.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...d-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-6686268
This was one I sifted and liked the look of, HCA came out 2.4 on it. I tentatively rejected because of score.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...e-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-7193658
I also liked this one, it's HCA was 2.6.

Maybe I am over relying on HCA as rejection mechanism? Last diamond I bought I leaned heavily on HCA and was happy with how the stone looked, but could be coincidence.

OK, you are rejecting them but the JA send you the GIA reports? the info on the site does not give enough info to reject stones

 

[lovedogs]

OK, you are rejecting them but the JA send you the GIA reports? the info on the site does not give enough info to reject stones

Yeah, that's why I was asking about the GIA certs. Because otherwise there isn't enough info to run through HCA at all.

 

[Huge Metal Fan]

This is the setting I tentatively picked:
https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...und-shaped-diamond-engagement-ring-item-17719

She doesn't want to pick the setting for me. She sent me a batch of pictures of things she likes. Lots of 1900-1930 Edwardian / Art Deco, lots of styles that I don't think are made new anymore. I was able to find some more similar in style being sold, but they were actual antique rings so a very high premium relative to stone quality. I discussed with her and explained why I think rings are not made like this anymore, I think we were in agreement that it was more about shape / flow to her than actually owning an antique, and she'd rather have a nicer diamond than a very expensive relic piece.

Some examples she gave me:

 

[Huge Metal Fan]

JA will send the GIA cert if you ask for it in chat. They don't post it on the website, but you can get it for stones you are interested in.

 

[lovedogs]

I hate to be a downer, but the ring you picked looks NOTHING like her inspiration pics. She sent delicate, dainty, feminine settings that have an antique feel. The one you picked is huge, chunky, and doesn't look antique at all. Please please please don't buy that setting.

 

[lovedogs]

JA will send the GIA cert if you ask for it in chat. They don't post it on the website, but you can get it for stones you are interested in.

Can you link pics of the GIA certs for the stones that KKjohnson posted?

 

[Huge Metal Fan]

Can you link pics of the GIA certs for the stones that KKjohnson posted?

That's this one https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...d-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-6686268


And this one: https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...e-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-7193658

 

[lovedogs]

Thanks. Just helps to tell why they were over 2 on the HCA. 1st one was too deep, 2nd one was steep on both crown and pav, and *just* under the max depth.

 

[Huge Metal Fan]

I hate to be a downer, but the ring you picked looks NOTHING like her inspiration pics. She sent delicate, dainty, feminine settings that have an antique feel. The one you picked is huge, chunky, and doesn't look antique at all. Please please please don't buy that setting.

Well the good news is the time pressure is off I guess. I thought I had found the closest fit I was going to find from a new make. And JA has a 25% off setting ($740) sale running through tomorrow 2100 PST. On further reflection the friend who gave second opinion is kind of a yes man.

Don't feel bad, I would rather start fresh than have her be disappointed. I don't trust my artistic judgement and I need to think of friends/family I can ask for honest second opinions.

The bad news is I have zero clue how to find what she wants now. Maybe I am just terrible at shopping or artistic design comparison. I probably need to do a lot more reading and maybe enlist someone's help who is artistic. I am a math person; I am not artistic in the least.

Here are notes she gave me with pics:
Setting: Vintage style (1900s-1940s, Edwardian and Art Deco), white metal
Stone: Diamond, round, 0.75 - 1.5 carats
I like a ring that has designs/engraved details in the metal, and/or accent stones on either side. If there are accent stones I prefer all white, but blue is ok if that fits with the setting. I like the center stone to be noticeably bigger than the accent stones (if any), so that it stands out. I don't like bulky-looking prongs holding the center stone; I prefer them to be more subtle. I don't care for halo settings.

Someday I would love a coordinating/complementing wedding band.

And rest of the pics:

I was still quite confused, and didn't see anything new made online that was close to these designs. Antique shops, but I didn't like their offerings($20K for ring with 1.25 CTW H VS2 stone)

I spoke with her Monday about it, discussed tradeoffs, and had these takeaways:
1. She likes metal engraving details
2. She likes rings that have "shoulders" or slope up from the band to the center stone, not a center stone sitting on a straight bar of a ring. These "shoulders" can be metal as in her example pics, or graduated side stones.
3. I think many/most of her pics are what you'd call bezel set stones, IE stone sits close to flush in a bedding of metal. I don't think rings are made like this anymore because it hides the stone and prevents light from hitting it as compared to 4/6 prong settings. I discussed this with her and she seemed to agree, but she (on reflection) tends to have a very hard time expressing what she wants.

Back to the drawing board for me. I want to do this right.

 

[KKJohnson]

I aslo agree, I do not think the setting you picked and what she gave examples of match well. I did look at their settings and didnt see any that looked similar to what she wants.

I like this one from BlueNile for the setting, it has the side stones and vintage feel.
https://www.bluenile.com/build-your...age-three-stone-diamond-engagement-ring_60452

Scores a 1.4 HCA, there were others that looks good but the thick girdles are not recommended
https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-de...MONDS&track=viewDiamondDetails&action=sameTab

https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca/

Just an idea

 

[Huge Metal Fan]

I aslo agree, I do not think the setting you picked and what she gave examples of match well. I did look at their settings and didnt see any that looked similar to what she wants.

I like this one from BlueNile for the setting, it has the side stones and vintage feel.
https://www.bluenile.com/build-your...age-three-stone-diamond-engagement-ring_60452

Scores a 1.4 HCA, there were others that looks good but the thick girdles are not recommended
https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-de...MONDS&track=viewDiamondDetails&action=sameTab

https://www.pricescope.com/tools/hca/

Just an idea

Thank you for the input. I appreciate both of your help.

That Zac Posen setting was my top pick from BN aesthetic wise. But it will only take a 1.35 CTW stone. I have a small hangup about the carat weight because my first marriage I got a 1.5 stone for the engagement ring (D, VS2, 0.7 HCA). The woman I am with now treats me a million times better than my ex did and I want to get her something at least the same size, ideally a bit bigger but not much. I know she said in her notes 0.75-1.5 but she is very hesitant to ask for things in general. I nudged her for 9 months before I was able to get her to clarify what type of setting style she likes aesthetically.

 

[KKJohnson]

Does she like vintage cut diamonds? With her liking those types of setting it makes me wonder

But if you really wanted a great preforming stone
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4113555.htm
https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10687
https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds/ags104102374002-1.405-f-vs2-hearts-arrows-round

little out of price range
https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/...ls/1.505-g-vs2-round-diamond-ags-104090535096

 

[KKJohnson]

I just remembered this vendor has great vintage feel engagement ring settings

https://ivyandrose.com/

 

[Siamese Kitty]

Does she like vintage cut diamonds? With her liking those types of setting it makes me wonder

But if you really wanted a great preforming stone
https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-4113555.htm
https://www.hpdiamonds.com/en-us/diamonddetail/HPD10687
https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds/ags104102374002-1.405-f-vs2-hearts-arrows-round

little out of price range
https://www.briangavindiamonds.com/...ls/1.505-g-vs2-round-diamond-ags-104090535096

Yeah, I am really getting the vibe that she favors OECs/OMCs. I think all of her inspiration rings show an antique stone. Those are more often found in warmer colors, however. Is the D/E back to wanting to be sure to get her something at least as "nice" as before, or her actual preference? (Very sweet thought I put "nice" in quotations because many don't find lower colors any less nice, particularly in the older cuts.)

Also, are you 100% sure she would appreciate a larger stone than the range she gave you? While unusual in these parts, some women do think a diamond can be too big, ha!

If I may give my two cents, I'd focus on a 1.5ct antique cut and spend the money you would on a larger stone on a mind-blowing setting. I still wish sometimes my husband would have put the legwork into finding me the antique ring of my dreams. He played it safe with a modern H&A in a solitaire (my other preferred choice I gave him), which is now a 3 stone. I LOVE my ring, but still think about what that other ring could have looked like. I told him to pick if he went the antique route because I loved so much about all those antique rings I honestly couldn't narrow it down myself. Kind of backfired, but again, still happy.

Good luck!

 

[Huge Metal Fan]

I just remembered this vendor has great vintage feel engagement ring settings
https://ivyandrose.com/

Thanks for the suggestion! They have a bunch of things that seem to look like what she wants.

Yeah, I am really getting the vibe that she favors OECs/OMCs. I think all of her inspiration rings show an antique stone... Is the D/E back to wanting to be sure to get her something at least as "nice" as before, or her actual preference? ...Also, are you 100% sure she would appreciate a larger stone than the range she gave you?
Good luck!

I think I am having a hard time because consciously or subconsciously I'm looking for designs I would like, which are not at all what she would like. I pick up pretty quickly on color and have a strong preference for very white stones. I suspect she might not care about that at all. In her "if you had infinite money" dream home must be 1890 to 1920 construction with original wood built ins and original kitchen cabinets, a preference I still don't really understand. I couldn't even tell you my preferences for a kitchen . I think this is like that - I don't even know how to think about what she wants because it's not something I've ever looked for.

 

[josieKat]

I'm also getting the feeling she might like a vintage diamond cutting style along with the setting.

There are ideal cut versions of Old European Cut diamonds these days - fantastic light return in the old fashioned cutting style. I looked at August Vintage and here is a 1.25 E under your budget (there is a 1.54 F but quite a bit over budget too):
https://augustvintageinc.net/collec...ct-e-vs2-august-vintage-european-cut-74530403
If you think she'd be open to slightly lower colors, I had an AVR I that faced up completely white.

CVB designs does wonderful rings that I think fit with the aesthetic she likes, e.g. on the AV site:
https://augustvintageinc.net/collections/caysie-van-bebber/products/the-sienna-solitaire

If you think she'd like a cushion shape instead (since some of her inspirations might have Old Mine diamonds):
https://augustvintageinc.net/collec...vs1-august-vintage-cushion-brilliant-74202337

There is a 1.34 F VVS2 AVC at Good Old Gold too (where the inventor of AV rounds and cushions used to be - I've used them for two rings quite happily):
https://www.goodoldgold.com/diamonds/id/3639240

Victor Canera also has his own round and cushion vintage style cuts.

 

[Venzen007]

You said the time pressure is off, so that's good! Rushing is bad.

@josieKat mentioned CVB. I'm considering her for a pendant design, but check out this commission she did:

She has plenty more. Search Caysie Van Bebber

 

[Wanaka]

Hi @Sean Olander , great news that the time pressure is off! You’ve come to the right place in my opinion for help and good pointers.

First off it’s really thoughtful of you want to get your lady a diamond that’s as good as or better than what your ex had. Having said that, it seems that your lady’s tastes lean towards the antique and so the diamond in question is probably going to be a whole ‘nother kettle of fish.

I’ll second the comments above that her inspo pics seem to indicate a preference for an older cut (Old European or Old Mine). Definitely check out August Vintage for their newly-cut but in that old style. It maximises light performance (sparkle bomb!) in those old cuts.

Also check out Old World Diamonds on Instagram or online. I believe the owner is a gentleman called Adam. He has some amazing old cuts and can also create your ring in the style of your inspo pics. Recent example:


Another couple of names to search out on Instagram - cjd_sako and Alex Park of Parks Fine Group.

Good luck and keep us posted, this community will definitely help you out!

 

[molecule]

Joseph Jewelers also does great antique/vintage style settings.
Subtle enhancement of a solitaire - https://www.josephjewelry.com/engag...aved-diamond-solitaire-engagement-ring-100700

Not a "perfect match" to what she asked for, but similar feel. https://www.josephjewelry.com/engagement-rings/vintage-inspired-diamond-engagement-ring-103298 I would work with the designer to lower the diamond if you pick this one.

Near identical to what she asked for: https://www.josephjewelry.com/engagement-rings/custom-hand-engraved-diamond-engagement-ring-102979

Another very close match: https://www.josephjewelry.com/engagement-rings/vintage-inspired-diamond-engagement-ring-103049

Hand engraved tapered solitaire- https://www.josephjewelry.com/engag...aved-solitaire-diamond-engagement-ring-104085

 

[molecule]

For stock settings, consider Bev K. The workmanship on these rings is amazing.
http://www.beverleyk.com/vintage/r9410-a-d-d-cz-r9410-a-d-d-cz.html

http://www.beverleyk.com/vintage/r9226-a-d-d-cz-r9226-a-d-d-cz.html

http://www.beverleyk.com/vintage/r11319-r11319.html


I ordered my Bev K wedding band through schubach jewelers and had no issues whatsoever. I'm not sure who else is authorized to sell them anymore (other than good old gold who has fallen out of favor).

 

[lovedogs]

You are obviously a super sweet guy who wants to get the woman he loves the best of the best. But I wouldn't get caught up in the size of the stone vs your ex's stone. You are getting a great size diamond with your budget, and whether or not its a 1.5 vs 1.3/1.4/1.6 just doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things, especially since your GF didn't express wanting the biggest stone possible.

If I were you, I would consider Victor Canera. He's an outstanding artist, and cuts ideal OECs and H&A stones that can fit into his great designs (some of which I think would be great for your GF given what she likes). There are obviously other vendors mentioned above who are also fantastic, but here are my recommendations for VC:

Settings:
https://www.victorcanera.com/rings/engagement/diana-vintage-solitaire-with-sculpted-pave-profile
*I LOVE this for her. I think it's a great vintage style. Don't know the price at all, so I'm trying to find stones in the 13K range to allow 3-4K for the setting.

https://www.victorcanera.com/rings/engagement/vintage-octagonal-solitaire-with-french-cut-diamonds
*Super unique and I love the vintage feel.

For stones, there's one OEC for you to consider (J color, but antique stones often have more body color so I'm not too worried about that).
https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds/ags104099118006-1.511-j-vs2-old-european-cut

And there are a few H&A stones that might work. I'm lowering the color requirement, because it honestly seems like she isn't worried about color as much as you are, and I think this needs to be all about her preferences.
https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds/ags104105671003-1.411-g-vs2-hearts-arrows-round
https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds/ags104104706004-1.462-h-vs2-hearts-arrows-round
https://www.victorcanera.com/diamonds/ags104102370002-1.430-h-vs2-hearts-arrows-round

 

[LLJsmom]

@Sean Olander
Seriously did you come to the right place. I would bet money that your GF would LOVE an old cut stone. And I promise you with that budget you can get a great one, either newly cut antique style or an actual antique stone and setting. Are you familiar with old European cuts? I’ll link you a bunch later. But whatever you do, don’t commit to a modern round brilliant yet.