which diamond do you recomment?

[crimscrem]

First post. Great site. Having a little bit of trouble trying to figure out which diamond to get. I''m looking to buy a diamond for a pendant. Which of the following would you pick (all are GIA; and all prices include mounting and chain):

Diamond #1.
0.71
G
IF
Cut: Very Good
Depth: 62.4%
Table: 55%
Girdle: thin to medium, faceted,
Cutlet: none
Polish & Symmetry both excellent
No fluorescence.
Minor details of polish.
$3400

Diamond #2
0.79
F
VS1
Cut: Excellent
Depth: 61.8%
Table: 56%
Girdle: Medium to slightly thick, faceted (3.5%)
Polish & Symmetry: both Very Good
No fluorescence.
Pinpoint, Crystal, Cloud
$3600

Diamond #3
0.82
G
VS1
Cut: Very Good
Depth: 62.6%
Table: 57%
Girdle: Medium to slightly thick, faceted (4.0%)
Polish & Symmetry: both very good
no fluorescence
Crystal, needle
$3600

I''ve read that clarity isn''t as important as cut when it comes to the brilliance of a diamond. But I''m guessing that the 0.71, G, IF is the rarer stone. I am leaning toward the 0.79 stone. Appreciate the insight.

 

[Gypsy]

We need crown and pavillion angles from the certificate to tell you which has the best cut, as cut is what makes diamonds perform to their maximum potential. Also... you mention that the ''rarer'' aspect appeals to you. Can you tell us more about that, is that why you are sticking to stones of such high color and clairity.

You could safely drop to an H SI1 in an ideal cut stone, especially one for a pendant, and I would suspect that you could get a large stone without noticing any difference in terms of color or clarity. But that my not be important to you.. which is why I''m asking about you comment regarding rareness.

 

[crimscrem]

Date: 7/8/2009 12:28:22 AM
Author: Gypsy
We need crown and pavillion angles from the certificate to tell you which has the best cut, as cut is what makes diamonds perform to their maximum potential. Also... you mention that the ''rarer'' aspect appeals to you. Can you tell us more about that, is that why you are sticking to stones of such high color and clairity.


You could safely drop to an H SI1 in an ideal cut stone, especially one for a pendant, and I would suspect that you could get a large stone without noticing any difference in terms of color or clarity. But that my not be important to you.. which is why I''m asking about you comment regarding rareness.

No problem.

Diamond #1
Crown Angle: 34%
Pavilion Angle: 40.8%

Diamond #2
Crown Angle: 34.5%
Pavilion Angle: 41%

Diamond #3
Crown Angle: 35.5%
Pavilion Angle: 41.2%

I''ve always been stuck on color and clarity. I''ve read that the cut is more important to a diamond''s brilliance (speaking in generalities). And so I do value that, but I like the thought that I''m getting a "rarer" diamond (to the extent diamonds are indeed rare). For my wife''s engagement ring, all the stones were F, with the middle stone being a VVS2 (other side stones were VS1). For earrings, I stuck with Gs and VS1s. I''m going for as large as possible while staying in the G and better and VS1 and better range. Thank you for your help.

 

[Lorelei]

My pick would be the first one - an Idealscope image would be useful, second might be ok but would really want an Idealscope image to check out that angle combo, the third one I would drop from the list due to bad crown and pavilion angle balance, too steep and deep.

If you are unfamiliar with Idealscope, this page explains

http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance

 

[stone-cold11]

#1 is my pick too. #2 could be good too. IS should be the tie-breaker.

 

[crimscrem]

Date: 7/8/2009 5:18:00 AM
Author: Stone-cold11
#1 is my pick too. #2 could be good too. IS should be the tie-breaker.

Did you mean to say that IF is the tie-breaker?

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 7/8/2009 9:01:40 AM
Author: crimscrem

Date: 7/8/2009 5:18:00 AM
Author: Stone-cold11
#1 is my pick too. #2 could be good too. IS should be the tie-breaker.

Did you mean to say that IF is the tie-breaker?

No, what SC means is for him, an Idealscope image ( IS) would be his deciding factor.

 

[crimscrem]

Date: 7/8/2009 3:33:34 AM
Author: Lorelei
My pick would be the first one - an Idealscope image would be useful, second might be ok but would really want an Idealscope image to check out that angle combo, the third one I would drop from the list due to bad crown and pavilion angle balance, too steep and deep.


If you are unfamiliar with Idealscope, this page explains


http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance

Thank you for the link. I have never heard of Idealscope. How does one get an Idealscope image?

What are your thoughts on the brillianteering in the 71 point? I''m guessing that''s where the Idealscope would come in handy. Based on what I''ve read brillianteering is something that sometimes makes no difference, and at other times, does make a difference. My initial thought was that it wouldn''t be a big deal given the IF and the Excellent/Excellent. But when I pulled up the certificate off of GIA''s website and saw that the cut was very good, it made me pause.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 7/8/2009 9:11:37 AM
Author: crimscrem

Date: 7/8/2009 3:33:34 AM
Author: Lorelei
My pick would be the first one - an Idealscope image would be useful, second might be ok but would really want an Idealscope image to check out that angle combo, the third one I would drop from the list due to bad crown and pavilion angle balance, too steep and deep.


If you are unfamiliar with Idealscope, this page explains


http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance

Thank you for the link. I have never heard of Idealscope. How does one get an Idealscope image?

What are your thoughts on the brillianteering in the 71 point? I'm guessing that's where the Idealscope would come in handy. Based on what I've read brillianteering is something that sometimes makes no difference, and at other times, does make a difference. My initial thought was that it wouldn't be a big deal given the IF and the Excellent/Excellent. But when I pulled up the certificate off of GIA's website and saw that the cut was very good, it made me pause.

Here you go, this link explains Idealscope

http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance

Does it say on the grading report in the comments section " cut grade affected by brillianteering"? It is normally mentioned if in GIA's opinion a diamond has what they believe to be excessive brillianteering. If it doesn't mention it then don't worry. Brillianteering is an oft discussed topic here, usually what we see is some crown only painting which in some cases can enhance desirable visual properties of a diamond, not possibly detrimental treatments. Personally I would have no issue with buying a diamond which has been painted if the cut was great and an Idealscope image checked out, some won't touch 'em!

What I would do, check the report, if no mention of brillianteering then you should be fine. In any case, brillianteered or not an Idealscope image would be useful if you can get one.

 

[crimscrem]

Date: 7/8/2009 9:13:31 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 7/8/2009 9:11:37 AM

Here you go, this link explains Idealscope


http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance

So I guess I need to get one of those scopes or have my jeweler snap a picture and send it. I appreciate the information.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 7/8/2009 9:17:16 AM
Author: crimscrem

Date: 7/8/2009 9:13:31 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 7/8/2009 9:11:37 AM

Here you go, this link explains Idealscope


http://www.highperformancediamonds.com/index.php?page=education-performance

So I guess I need to get one of those scopes or have my jeweler snap a picture and send it. I appreciate the information.

If it is a store jeweller they might not have a scope but you can always ask, or you can buy one from this link.

http://www.ideal-scope.com/cart_zoom_item.asp?Id=2&ShowAdd=Y

 

[crimscrem]

Date: 7/8/2009 9:11:37 AM

Does it say on the grading report in the comments section '' cut grade affected by brillianteering''? It is normally mentioned if in GIA''s opinion a diamond has what they believe to be excessive brillianteering. If it doesn''t mention it then don''t worry. Brillianteering is an oft discussed topic here, usually what we see is some crown only painting which in some cases can enhance desirable visual properties of a diamond, not possibly detrimental treatments. Personally I would have no issue with buying a diamond which has been painted if the cut was great and an Idealscope image checked out, some won''t touch ''em!

What I would do, check the report, if no mention of brillianteering then you should be fine. In any case, brillianteered or not an Idealscope image would be useful if you can get one.

I missed this part of your post. I apologize. The GIA report I have from 2005 says "Minor Details of Polish Are Present." The GIA report I pulled off of the GIA website includes the cut grade of "Very Good" and then notes that "Cut grade affected by brillianteering." The polish and symmetry are both "Excellent." And it is an IF stone. The cut grade being knocked down by brillianteering is what initially scared me and got me to this site.

 

[stone-cold11]

ya, GIA just knock down a cut grade once brillianteering exceed a level regardless of it''s effect to the overall optical performance. IS image will tell more if it is possible to get one.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 7/8/2009 10:00:43 AM
Author: crimscrem

Date: 7/8/2009 9:11:37 AM

Does it say on the grading report in the comments section ' cut grade affected by brillianteering'? It is normally mentioned if in GIA's opinion a diamond has what they believe to be excessive brillianteering. If it doesn't mention it then don't worry. Brillianteering is an oft discussed topic here, usually what we see is some crown only painting which in some cases can enhance desirable visual properties of a diamond, not possibly detrimental treatments. Personally I would have no issue with buying a diamond which has been painted if the cut was great and an Idealscope image checked out, some won't touch 'em!

What I would do, check the report, if no mention of brillianteering then you should be fine. In any case, brillianteered or not an Idealscope image would be useful if you can get one.

I missed this part of your post. I apologize. The GIA report I have from 2005 says 'Minor Details of Polish Are Present.' The GIA report I pulled off of the GIA website includes the cut grade of 'Very Good' and then notes that 'Cut grade affected by brillianteering.' The polish and symmetry are both 'Excellent.' And it is an IF stone. The cut grade being knocked down by brillianteering is what initially scared me and got me to this site.

Its ok, I edit as I post! Ok then if the report states the ' cut grade affected by brillianteering", this is a common remark but needn't necessarily be a bad thing, an Idealscope image would tell us more if you could get one.

This is a very good thread which explains about brillianteering in more detail

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/painting-stop-the-madness.45914/

 

[crimscrem]

Date: 7/8/2009 10:05:18 AM
Author: Stone-cold11
ya, GIA just knock down a cut grade once brillianteering exceed a level regardless of it''s effect to the overall optical performance. IS image will tell more if it is possible to get one.

I''m kind of wondering how much any of this matters. I''m guessing that from a visual standpoint with the naked eye, no one will be able to tell the difference between an Excellent cut and a Very Good cut. There is, of course, getting the most bang for the buck. But to some extent differences are factored into the price of the diamond. I have a pretty long history with my jeweler so I wouldn''t think he''d push a certain stone just because he wants to get rid of it.

I''ve been searching on the james allen website too, which isn''t helping me narrow my choices! So many diamonds.

 

[John P]

Date: 7/8/2009 11:08:53 AM
Author: crimscrem

Date: 7/8/2009 10:05:18 AM
Author: Stone-cold11
ya, GIA just knock down a cut grade once brillianteering exceed a level regardless of it's effect to the overall optical performance. IS image will tell more if it is possible to get one.

I'm kind of wondering how much any of this matters. I'm guessing that from a visual standpoint with the naked eye, no one will be able to tell the difference between an Excellent cut and a Very Good cut. There is, of course, getting the most bang for the buck. But to some extent differences are factored into the price of the diamond. I have a pretty long history with my jeweler so I wouldn't think he'd push a certain stone just because he wants to get rid of it.

I've been searching on the james allen website too, which isn't helping me narrow my choices! So many diamonds.

It depends entirely on the two diamonds being compared, the lighting and the observer. In some cases this may be true. In other cases differences are quite obvious.

A recent thread posed that question (and much discussion followed).

 

[crimscrem]

that link on brillianteering appeared to be about something else. I did a search for brillianteering and found good stuff. That was actually what led me to this site in the first place because I wasn't familiar with that term.

I think I'm going to go with the 71 point. Because the GIA report is old (July 2005), do you think I ought to have it redone prior to purchase?

 

[crimscrem]

Date: 7/8/2009 11:19:48 AM
Author: John Pollard

Date: 7/8/2009 11:08:53 AM

Author: crimscrem

Date: 7/8/2009 10:05:18 AM

Author: Stone-cold11

ya, GIA just knock down a cut grade once brillianteering exceed a level regardless of it''s effect to the overall optical performance. IS image will tell more if it is possible to get one.

I''m kind of wondering how much any of this matters. I''m guessing that from a visual standpoint with the naked eye, no one will be able to tell the difference between an Excellent cut and a Very Good cut. There is, of course, getting the most bang for the buck. But to some extent differences are factored into the price of the diamond. I have a pretty long history with my jeweler so I wouldn''t think he''d push a certain stone just because he wants to get rid of it.


I''ve been searching on the james allen website too, which isn''t helping me narrow my choices! So many diamonds.

It depends entirely on the two diamonds being compared, the lighting and the observer. In some cases this may be true. In other cases differences are quite obvious.


A recent thread posed that question (and much discussion followed).

I definitely agree that difference may be seen when comparing two diamonds against one another. With the engagement ring, I took home 3 different stones to compare against one another in various lighting conditions. I was also a bit more meticulous in comparing side stones with the main stone since they were going to be side by side.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 7/8/2009 11:24:40 AM
Author: crimscrem
that link on brillianteering appeared to be about something else. I did a search for brillianteering and found good stuff. That was actually what led me to this site in the first place because I wasn''t familiar with that term.

I think I''m going to go with the 71 point. Because the GIA report is old (July 2005), do you think I ought to have it redone prior to purchase?

That is pre cut grade, however you have the info on the proportions so no need to have the diamond regraded in my opinion, sometimes you find ones with older reports.

 

[crimscrem]

Date: 7/8/2009 11:45:08 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 7/8/2009 11:24:40 AM

Author: crimscrem

that link on brillianteering appeared to be about something else. I did a search for brillianteering and found good stuff. That was actually what led me to this site in the first place because I wasn''t familiar with that term.


I think I''m going to go with the 71 point. Because the GIA report is old (July 2005), do you think I ought to have it redone prior to purchase?

That is pre cut grade, however you have the info on the proportions so no need to have the diamond regraded in my opinion, sometimes you find ones with older reports.

I got the proportions on the angles off of GIA''s website where I typed in the GIA report number and carat weight. I thought I read on here that GIA has also changed how it analyzes brillianteering. I''ve been reading a lot, so maybe I''m misremembering.