Which 2 carat diamond should I choose?

confuseddiamond · Jan 6, 2020

I am struggling to find which of the following two round diamonds are better for my engagement ring -
Diamond A - 2.01 ca, 3EX, SI1, none (a few twinning wisps across the bottom and left facet to the centre)
table:61%, depth:59.8%, crown:33, pavilion:41 measurement: 8.15x8.21x4.89
It also comes with a GEMEX score of H, VH, H performance. I have looked at the stone in person and it shines brightly with good fire.
HCA score 1.6
Price: USD 22,435

Diamond B - 1.97 ca, 3EX, SI1, faint (a few twinning wisps right beneath the table)
table: 55% depth: 62.5%, crown:34.5 pavilion:40.6 measurement: 7.96x7.99x4.98
HCA score 0.9
Price: USD 20,512

Both of them are of similar requirements but Diamond A appears to be larger (due to larger carat and table) with decent light performance although the ratio of the diamond DOES NOT meet the measurements of a super ideal cut round diamond recommended online. On the other hand, while I have not looked at Diamond B in person, it seems to be able to meet all recommended measurements of a super ideal cut round diamond.

Judging from the information provided above, would any diamond expert or lovers here have any recommendations for me, please? Thank you.

OoohShiny · Jan 6, 2020

confuseddiamond said:
I am struggling to find which of the following two round diamonds are better for my engagement ring -
Diamond A - 2.01 ca, 3EX, SI1, none (a few twinning wisps across the bottom and left facet to the centre)
table:61%, depth:59.8%, crown:33, pavilion:41 measurement: 8.15x8.21x4.89
It also comes with a GEMEX score of H, VH, H performance. I have looked at the stone in person and it shines brightly with good fire.
HCA score 1.6
Price: USD 22,435

Diamond B - 1.97 ca, 3EX, SI1, faint (a few twinning wisps right beneath the table)
table: 55% depth: 62.5%, crown:34.5 pavilion:40.6 measurement: 7.96x7.99x4.98
HCA score 0.9
Price: USD 20,512

Both of them are of similar requirements but Diamond A appears to be larger (due to larger carat and table) with decent light performance although the ratio of the diamond DOES NOT meet the measurements of a super ideal cut round diamond recommended online. On the other hand, while I have not looked at Diamond B in person, it seems to be able to meet all recommended measurements of a super ideal cut round diamond.

Judging from the information provided above, would any diamond expert or lovers here have any recommendations for me, please? Thank you.

Welcome to the forum

Personally speaking, I would be interested in Diamond B - small table should help increase coloured fire, which I like

Diamond A is more '60/60' style (~60% depth,~ 60% table) - they generally look larger for their carat weight but tend to produce more white light than coloured fire, if I understand things correctly.

Do you have any particular preference for coloured fire or white light return? Can you describe what you saw and how you felt with Diamond A?

Diamond A should look noticeably bigger (I understand that 0.2mm difference is where we can generally see a difference) but you are also paying quite a lot more for going over the 2.0ct (psychological) barrier.

confuseddiamond · Jan 6, 2020

OoohShiny said:
Welcome to the forum

Personally speaking, I would be interested in Diamond B - small table should help increase coloured fire, which I like

Diamond A is more '60/60' style (~60% depth,~ 60% table) - they generally look larger for their carat weight but tend to produce more white light than coloured fire, if I understand things correctly.

Do you have any particular preference for coloured fire or white light return? Can you describe what you saw and how you felt with Diamond A?

Diamond A should look noticeably bigger (I understand that 0.2mm difference is where we can generally see a difference) but you are also paying quite a lot more for going over the 2.0ct (psychological) barrier.

Thanks for your reply OoohShiny.
Personally I do not have a strong preference on white light or fire as long as they are both on the high side. But, if I must choose one over another, probably I would prefer fire a bit more.

In fact, I got the chance to look at Diamond A under a brillianceScope and it was actually the fire and sparkle of the diamond that caught my eye. There were a lot of fire and sparkle as compared to other stones the vendor showed me. I think it is kinda in line with what the GEMEX and HCA said - Diamond A has a VH on fire under GEMEX, and excellent fire under HCA (to complete the picture of HCA, it has excellent spread and very good light return and scintillation). Judging from the view from brilliance scope, I would say the contrast of the stone is good but probably not the best.

On the other hand,Diamond B’s cut looks promising and it shows excellent on light return, fire and scintillation, good on spread under HCA. Yet, as I said, I didn’t have to chance to look at the real stone.

Budget-wise both are within my acceptable range. Indeed, going over the 2ca barrier do have some kind of (psychological) value to me. Yet, since it is not the super ideal cut as usually recommended in PS, I have to make sure there are no critical problem with Diamond A that I’m not aware of.

confuseddiamond · Jan 7, 2020

I understand that it would be better to look at the ASET photos but currently I don’t have them. Put it the other way, given the measures/ratios of Diamond A as well as its scores under GEMEX and HCA, is it still possible that it would have a bad ASET image?

flyingpig · Jan 8, 2020

This may be unpopular recommendation, but.....

Diamond A for me.
1.97 carat is not 2 carat.

confuseddiamond · Jan 8, 2020

flyingpig said:
This may be unpopular recommendation, but.....

Diamond A for me.
1.97 carat is not 2 carat.

Any other reasons for choosing Diamond A apart from the size?

flyingpig · Jan 8, 2020

confuseddiamond said:
Any other reasons for choosing Diamond A apart from the size?

1. 0.2mm diffierence in diameter is not insignficant.
2. The cut quality of Diamond A is not the best, but it is good enough.
3. I just do not like 0.95~0.99 and 1.95~1.99 carat stones. If budget is limited, I rather go for 1.90c and save couple thousands more and I have more options to choose from. 1.97c does not do me anything. It is not 2.0 carat, or saves me alot. It is not even 8.00mm.

What is the color of these diamonds? They appear a bit overprice if H color or lower

Snowdrop13 · Jan 8, 2020

You mention “super ideal” in a couple of posts. You could, depending on colour, of course, have a 2ct super ideal for your budget. Depth 62.5 won’t fit into those parameters.

confuseddiamond · Jan 8, 2020

flyingpig said:
1. 0.2mm diffierence in diameter is not insignficant.
2. The cut quality of Diamond A is not the best, but it is good enough.
3. I just do not like 0.95~0.99 and 1.95~1.99 carat stones. If budget is limited, I rather go for 1.90c and save couple thousands more and I have more options to choose from. 1.97c does not do me anything. It is not 2.0 carat, or saves me alot. It is not even 8.00mm.

What is the color of these diamonds? They appear a bit overprice if H color or lower

That's true....oh i forgot to mention the colors, both of them are D color, which is indeed one of my requirements.

confuseddiamond · Jan 8, 2020

Snowdrop13 said:
You mention “super ideal” in a couple of posts. You could, depending on colour, of course, have a 2ct super ideal for your budget. Depth 62.5 won’t fit into those parameters.

I forgot to mention the color of the stones which are both D color. It seems very difficult to find a 2ct super ideal cut in D color for my budget though. For the depth, I thought it just fits the upper end of a super ideal cut? Isn't it?

Snowdrop13 · Jan 8, 2020

I see, yes, for the budget you‘d be looking at G, H or even I colour. There are different brands of superideal but here are the parameters for Whiteflash as an example,

confuseddiamond · Jan 8, 2020

Snowdrop13 said:
I see, yes, for the budget you‘d be looking at G, H or even I colour. There are different brands of superideal but here are the parameters for Whiteflash as an example,

Thanks. So what do you think about Diamond A? Is it a good or at least a reasonable deal given its quality?

OoohShiny · Jan 8, 2020

I understand flyingpig's position re: breaking the psychological 2ct barrier - sometimes it is just easier/better to say 'oh, it's a 2ct' than 'oh, it's near-as-dammit 2ct'. I think it might depend on your social circles and whether you are confident enough to not give a damn what they think either way!

As for which is a better stone, they both have measurements and HCA scores that suggest they will perform well, but they will have different characters in terms of white light and coloured fire light performance.

I'm guessing that you've seen A locally and they have offered to get B in as a potential option? A surely did look great under the shop lights, but don't forget they are designed to make everything perform exceptionally well

lol

If you have not already done so, you could ask to check out stone A in different lighting environments, such as flat cloud or uplighters, and hold it under a sheet of card to remove direct lighting - that will help you check how it performs away from ideal lighting.

As another alternative, you could order stone B in and compare it side-by-side with A, to see which you prefer? (You would need to check out any costs related to this if it is a local vendor, or if it's an online purchase, what the Returns policies/costs are.)

As for which is better value... A is a chunk more than B but should look larger and is over the psychological whole-carat boundary, so both aspects are likely to be adding to the cost. You could use the Search Bar at the top of the forum to look for stones with similar dimensions/specs and then compare prices - use the Filters and Advanced filters to get the table size and depth ranges roughly similar to what you are looking at.

confuseddiamond · Jan 9, 2020

OoohShiny said:
I understand flyingpig's position re: breaking the psychological 2ct barrier - sometimes it is just easier/better to say 'oh, it's a 2ct' than 'oh, it's near-as-dammit 2ct'. I think it might depend on your social circles and whether you are confident enough to not give a damn what they think either way!

As for which is a better stone, they both have measurements and HCA scores that suggest they will perform well, but they will have different characters in terms of white light and coloured fire light performance.

I'm guessing that you've seen A locally and they have offered to get B in as a potential option? A surely did look great under the shop lights, but don't forget they are designed to make everything perform exceptionally well lol

If you have not already done so, you could ask to check out stone A in different lighting environments, such as flat cloud or uplighters, and hold it under a sheet of card to remove direct lighting - that will help you check how it performs away from ideal lighting.

As another alternative, you could order stone B in and compare it side-by-side with A, to see which you prefer? (You would need to check out any costs related to this if it is a local vendor, or if it's an online purchase, what the Returns policies/costs are.)

As for which is better value... A is a chunk more than B but should look larger and is over the psychological whole-carat boundary, so both aspects are likely to be adding to the cost. You could use the Search Bar at the top of the forum to look for stones with similar dimensions/specs and then compare prices - use the Filters and Advanced filters to get the table size and depth ranges roughly similar to what you are looking at.

Thanks for your reply again. I might be able to have a more detailed check of Diamond A but probably cannot do a side-by-side comparison with B as the latter is offered by another vendor.

I have just conducted a quick search in the forum and it seems that the price of A is reasonable/slightly lower than other similar stone while B is a bit overpriced as compared with other similar stones. Based on all that information available, I think I might consider A if I am happy with the next examine.

sledge · Jan 9, 2020

Assuming both stones are same color and clarity and both triple X....

A = $22,435 / 2.01 = $11,162 per carat
B = $20,512 / 1.97 = $10,402 per carat

A = $22,435 / 8.18 avg = $2,743 per mm
B = $20,512 / 7.975 avg = $2,572 per mm

How is A a better bargain?

While I have much respect for @flyingpig I think the statement about the B not being 8mm is technically true, but of such an insignificant nature. The only way you would ever know is if you carry a set of micrometers or the report around with you.

Literally....no it's not 8 o'clock it's 7:59 and 59.9 seconds.

I do agree you could see a slight size difference in a side by side comparison between A and B. The difference in real world terms? The thickness of 2 sheets of copy paper (0.10mm x 2 = 0.20mm).

It boils down to this....do you want to pay $2k extra for crossing a psychological barrier? Does your financial status allow you to do so comfortably? There isn't a right or wrong answer necessarily but rather how each individual views the situation.

Here's my advice...

1. Use the appraiser list here to find a trusted advisor where you live and I presume stone A is located. Ask both vendor A and vendor B to send their stones for review to this trusted 3rd party appraiser. If stone B is from an online vendor, you may need to pay for it ahead and then exercise a return process if you reject it.

2. Order your own ASET scope. Cost is about $35 + $15 shipping for $50 total. Available from AGS directly or David Atlas. See how each stone looks under the ASET scope as this will help determine any leakage or problem areas.

3. While at the appraisers office, look at each stone under a variety of lighting environments to see what personality you prefer and if there is any difference to your eyes.

4. Ignoring size, determine which you consider to be the better performing stone. See if you and the appraiser agree and what additional insight he may have for the same or differing opinion.

5. Reject and return the stone you didn't like.

OoohShiny · Jan 9, 2020

confuseddiamond said:
Thanks for your reply again. I might be able to have a more detailed check of Diamond A but probably cannot do a side-by-side comparison with B as the latter is offered by another vendor.

I have just conducted a quick search in the forum and it seems that the price of A is reasonable/slightly lower than other similar stone while B is a bit overpriced as compared with other similar stones. Based on all that information available, I think I might consider A if I am happy with the next examine.

Sledge makes good points

If you have the time/energy/credit/inclination, I think it would be a good way forward

All of that said, though, if you just want/need to make a decision quickly or because you have had enough with all the looking and analysing

then as long as you are buying in full awareness of the options, that's all we can ask for

flyingpig · Jan 10, 2020

The price of Diamond A is reasonable and on par with what you find online.

Like many pointed out, the cut quality of Diamond A is not the best. In fact, I would reject it normally, if it were not 2.0c. I personally take a different approach when choosing a diamond in 1.0x, 2.0x, and 3.0x ranges, especially when combined with a high color.