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Rainman

Rough_Rock
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Jul 25, 2006
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What kind of dimensions/sizes should i be looking for in a princess diamond. I''m kind of unsure when I see all these number at what I''m looking for when it comes to depth an all that.

What will make a diamond of the same ctw look larger or smaller.
 
For a GIA type of stone is the best we have for going by numbers: http://diamonds.pricescope.com/fnc1.asp

But just having depth and table will never tell you the whole story. Class 2B diamond that looks great under the IS http://www.whiteflash.com/princess/Princess-cut-diamond-1226184.htm Up to 3A is considered good, but then the numbers are just too broad to be useful in buying. What's the point, anyway, when a 2B can perform better than a 1B?

For rounds, there is table, crown angle, and pavilion angle. That is enough to run HCA which will tell you if the stone should be rejected. In a princess, there is table, two crown angles, and two pavilion angles. Then throw in girdle thickness to be accurate. There are so many variables that generalizations are not possible.

Read: http://journal.pricescope.com/Articles/21/1/The-matter-of-depth-in-a-princess-cut.aspx

If you'll look at this princess, 0 light performance and proportions http://www.whiteflash.com/princess/Princess-cut-diamond-2361972.htm and http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?pid=LD00315732#grading_report WF spread of 5.54 mm and BN has a spread of 5.51 mm; WF stone 1.02 cts and BN 1.08 cts. BN stone is heavier but smaller. If you look at the crown height, the BN stone is 12.5% vs 9.2%; so the BN stone is just more on the top, but nothing more sideways. Most BN AGS stones I've looked at have very steep and high crowns (15% and 45-50 degrees is not uncommon.)

Also interesting is the 77% table on the 1.08. Usually we equate a larger table with more spread, but that is not the case. Before the AGS system came out, princesses were usually cut for weight with wide tables and low crown heights (it uses more of the rough.) It was and still is widely believed that the table should be less than the total depth in order to have sufficient crown height. The 1.08 shows that high crowns and large tables can coexist.
 
So is the spread what makes the top face of the diamond appear larger?
 
spread is the length by width.

which is different from two stones having the same spread but one /appears/ smaller because it is leaking light on the edges.
 
ok here were some suggestions I was given from james allen

Item Number: 866462 923363 862496
Shape: Princess Princess Princess
Carat weight: 0.75 0.80 0.78
Cut: Premium Ideal Premium
Color: F H F
Clarity: SI1 VS1 SI1
Certificate: GIA GIA GIA
Depth: 73.2 71.7 74.7
Table: 74 71 75
Polish: Very Good Very Good Excellent - Ideal
Symmetry: Good Good Good
Girdle: Medium to slightly thick Thin to slightly thi Thick
Culet: None None None
Fluorescence: None None None
Measurements: 4.95*4.93*3.61 5.28*5.06*3.63 4.99*4.91*3.67
Price: $ 2,520 $ 2,590 $ 2,490


and here''s the link to some reccommended from whiteflash.
http://www.whiteflash.com/diamonds/Compare_Diamonds.aspx?idnos=2435474,2387161,2435469

Thoughts or suggestions? I''d like to stick to james allen cause they have the setting I like.
 
The person I''ve been going back an forth with through email said that the one i like the first one of the 3 she sent me was a "fantastic SI-2 and faces up completely clean to the naked eye" however the list she sent me said it was an SI1 and that they dont have an ideal scope image available.
 
any thoughts on what I should do?
 
well, you can put your faith in the vendor to pick a stone without giving at least an idealscope image or you can find one that will provide more information.
i wonder why ja doesn't have idealscopes on them? are they not in house stones?
 
i kinda got the feeling they were in house if she was able to tell how it looked
 
if they are in house, you should be able to get idealscope pictures then. that is a very important part of the buying process.
 
ok the first one is not inhouse, but for $25 they can bring the diamond in and perform the following

When we bring a diamond into the office, we perform the following services:

We take an Idealscope image.


We take a Magnified image.


We run a Megascope/Sarin report.


We compare the color to other GIA graded diamonds in stock.


We examine the diamond in different lighting environments, comparing the brilliance and fire against any other similar diamonds we have in stock.


We check the clarity of the diamond under a microscope and make sure the diamond is 100% free of any visible inclusions.


We perform any other services requested by the client that can be done using the tools and resources we have available.

Based on what they can provide me about the diamond does anything think this might at all be worth it? Or am I just wasting my $25. also if a purchase is made the $25 gets refunded.
 
I bought my 1.64c princess from JA - it was not inhouse. They had to bring it in and run the tests for the $25. The stone was totally worth it and I never had to pay the $25 b/c I bought it. I basically had narrowed it down to two and had them go over the pros and cons of each for me. I brought in the 1 that had the most pros. The stone I ended up with was $200 cheaper, slightly larger, and 1 color grade lower (hence the price difference). And it is a beautiful diamond - I couldn''t be happier.

Although it can be difficult to buy a diamond that''s not inhouse, if you ask the right questions and get all the info possible (IS, Sarin, magnified pics, etc) you can get a great stone. And JA was fabulous through the whole process for me so it made it very easy.

1.gif
 
"We examine the diamond in different lighting environments, comparing the brilliance and fire against any other similar diamonds we have in stock."

WHAT do they have IN STOCK that they can give you an Ideal Scope picture of right now?
From the picture, it doesn't look bad, but I'm not someone who can look at a picture and say if it's good.

If you don't like any of these on paper, then yes, pay to have the F SI1 brought in. But these four are under the in-house search and it shouldn't cost you to get pictures.
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=131&item=862497
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=131&item=862498
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=131&item=862742
http://www.jamesallen.com/diamond.asp?cid=131&item=861999
 
Ok well JA sent me more info on the diamond I like without paying the $25 fee. So i''d appreciate it if I can get some thoughts especialy from some of the experts here. I''ll start with the Ideal scope:

princesspk4.jpg
 
Here is the Megascope report:

megascopevj5.jpg
 
Damn, that looks red!
 
75fsi1uf0.jpg
heres an enlarged image. she said the diamond is white and clean to the naked eye
 
I don''t know much about princess cut stones. I will say though, that I got my stone through James Allen. I had a VERY hard time trusting someone to look at something that important for me and I felt silly about not trusting him sooner. I thought my customer service was great. I think is is great. Even now. I had some questions about stone...here it is 9 months later...and he''s still great at dealing with my very particular and bothersome nonsense!
 
very, very similar idealscope to the princess cut we bought from JA in mid-July and my diamond is gorgeous in person. when i took it to the jeweler that is doing my setting he was stunned by the "great deal" we got on it. and this is a very reputable dealer in cincinnati that sells their own fair share of stones. JA was fantastic to me and i think we got a fantastic deal.
 
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