Were you surprised by the Zimmerman verdict

[Dancing Fire]

Why must left-wingers keep on adding fuel to fire causing more violence all over our country?

I'm not going to claim "left-wing" status here, but if you want right-wing status, I'll grant it to you. I think you have a nerve to say that I am contributing to violence, though. I am not the one supporting the use of guns by civilians in places other than their homes.

Don't ask me why I am appalled that things in the United States are so badly broken that an innocent teenage boy was shot dead by a vigilante legally carrying a gun around on property that was not his own and that others cheered that verdict. Until the problem is fixed, I have a problem. America has a problem. Black people know it. The NAACP knows it. (I mention that only because I am a member and get all their e-mails.) Charles M Blow knows it. You say the right-wing doesn't know it? I say that they must, then, willfully not know it. Because knowing it would not coincide with their interests.

AGBF

Deb
Calm down... no one wants to see violence in out country. IMO the NAACP should put the pressure on the Chicago mayor to try and stop blacks from killing blacks every day.Don't forget that I am too a minority in this country ...

 

[kenny]

DF, I'm also offended by painting liberals with your broad brush.
Such groupism is as ugly as racism.

Liberals vary, as do conservatives.

Peace and love, man.

 

[Smith1942]

However, I still wonder why Zimmerman didn't give him a disabling shot in the thigh, which you'd think would be easier than going for the chest if someone is astride you.

How? This is one thing that made me think as I do about it. Pretend it's you, for a minute. You're flat on your back. A heavier & bigger guy sits on your stomach, leaning over you, 4" to 6" from your face (as the evidence showed), banging your head repeatedly on concrete, pounding away on your face. He has broken your nose; since you're on your back, blood drains into your mouth, nose, & throat instead of down your chin. Raise your head to find his thigh? Right into his fists? Your shirt gets pushed up in the scuffle & he sees your gun. Says, "You're gonna die tonight, m-f" & reaches toward it. It is raining. It is dark. How are you going to stop, think, get into position to point at his leg, while he's trying to grab the gun & whaling on your face? His thigh is down by your hip. His core a couple inches right above you. Picture yourself there.

Police noted at the scene that the back of GZ's shirt was wet & had grass on it; TM's was not. Pretty clear evidence of who was on top.

It is all sad, more imho as an example of what's happened to our society.

--- Laurie

P.S. The defense did not use the Stand & Defend law. It was not part of this case. They argued Self-Defense.

Deb, the gun did not come out until GZ's shirt pulled up & TM reached toward it. GZ did not have it in hand when he first stopped TM, nor during most of the beating. I meant that Martin was not what I think of as an "innocent kid." That connotes to me a child who tries to do the right thing, has morals & all that. Whatever morals this guy had included admiration for violence, guns, & getting stoned. Neighborhood Watch does have the right to stop unknown individuals & ask where they're going. Zimmerman should have waited for police before confronting Martin -- if he had, this wouldn't have happened. I don't know in whose book it's "innocent," however, for anyone to attack & beat a person who asks where they're headed.

If someone is astride me and I'm able to pull the gun from my pocket, the person's thigh is going to be closer to my hand than their chest. Hitting the chest would involve pulling my hand up and over their thigh and holding it up to the front. I'm assuming that the pocket was a side trouser pocket though. So you reach to your side, grab the gun, and then - if the person is astride you - your hand is very close to the outside of their thigh. In fact their thigh would be very near the pocket - if it is, indeed, a side trouser pocket.

I agree that it sounds very difficult to get your gun out while being beaten up, but Zimmerman did manage it. I still don't understand why the only shot he could possibly have fired was a super-accurate chest shot. The guy was on top of him, close range - surely there are many places on his body he could have hit - but he fired straight at the heart.

They were both at fault. Zimmerman should never have worried at him and Martin should not have beaten him up. Zimmerman must have stared at Martin aggressively for Martin to have described him as "creepy" and for Martin to call a friend and say he was being followed. Zimmerman wasn't exactly being subtle, and that can really annoy some people. Zimmerman should have quietly noted him and called the police. He shouldn't have made it obvious to Martin that he was being staked out and he shouldn't have followed Martin. And Martin should not have beaten him up. The case is a tragedy.

 

[packrat]

This is what I don't get. There aren't any witnesses, other than GZ. So, does our justice system say we have to take him at his word or no? B/c if it does, then...the jury did and the jury believed him and that's the system we have in place. It's not always right, there are puh-leeenty of people walking around who have committed some pretty bad crimes and there wasn't enough evidence to convict them. And there are puh-leeeenty people currently in jail for things they didn't do b/c there were "witnesses" that said they did or the evidence led the jury to believe they did. (or they had crappy lawyers or good/convincing lawyers, as the case may be )That's the system we have, and I don't know that any of us has a license to practice real law, not the armchair/laptop law degree everyone has on the internet. The system is flawed, there's no argument there.

 

[Ella]

Courtesy of those who were unable to continue this thread politely and without insulting other political groups, religions and races, this thread has now been closed.