Vet Fees, Aaarrrgghh!

[JewelFreak]

Am I crazy for being steamed over the charges for a visit to a vet dermatologist? My dog has crusty, itchy spots at the corners of her mouth & on her chin. My regular vet tried a variety of things for a year & nothing helped so she referred me to a specialist. I nearly fainted at the bill -- $470. In addition, my appt. was for 9 a.m. & I still had to wait 30 min., so my time wasn't deemed of any value at all.

Here's what I paid:

$132 for the vet's time. She checked the dog over, took skin samples with a piece of scotch tape, an assistant looked at them under a microscope, adding a charge of $15 for "extra skin scrapings" -- I guess you only get so many for your 132.

The microscope peek cost me $58.

A thyroid test -- fT4(ED), TSH, T4 -- for, gasp, $170! Would a human one even cost that much? I suspect the lab charged them less than $45.

Meds to take home & try: $95. One is for yeast infections: I told her my vet did a culture & found no fungal infection. Is yeast different? Or was she selling me something I didn't need?

I am increasingly shocked at veterinary fees, they're driving me to the poorhouse w/4 animals! Have read that corporations buy up vet practices & give them profit goals which they must meet. Pet care in the U.S. is a billion $/yr business -- & I have NO objection to a business making a good profit. But I feel gouged so much of the time lately. Seems to me they take advantage of your love for your little pal to squeeze till your wallet spurts blood. That is immoral, to my mind.

Or am I just a cranky skinflint?

--- Laurie

 

[movie zombie]

after a $2000.00 one day visit for one cat, yes, i think you are cranky.
everything in this country has gone up re costs. vet school is not cheap.
yet you are right that many of the vet groups, especially those that are not just local, are owned by organized business....big organized business.

 

[wildcat03]

$170 for thyroid function tests is completely reasonable. They are charged at a much higher rate in humans, although insurance may pay out less if you have insurance.

Meds - the prices are what they are, and certainly not set by the dermatologist. Blame Congress. They have decided that physicians can not accept PENS from pharmaceutical companies, yet they essentially allow the pharmaceutical companies to get away with murder, to provide gifts to congresspeople, and to bribe insurance companies.

Microscopic exam/bill for vet services: also somewhat reasonable. Think about what the vet went through to become a veterinary dermatologist. 4 years of college, 4 years of vet school (tuition runs 40,000+ per year, plus living expenses!), 2 years of veterinary dermatology residency (paid at around 30,000/year). That's a LOT of student loan debt and a LOT of opportunity cost. Simply put, the vet's time is worth that much.

 

[Enerchi]

I don't think you are cranky, I think you were surprised at the cost! We have 2 dogs and they have been (thankfully!) very healthy other than their yearly shots/ check ups. Even at those, I am amazed at the cost of medications (heartworm, rabies) and 1/2 jokingly request the meds are written in our names so we can get them covered! (and what would our insurance company think if there was a receipt for "Sentinel Heart Worm" under our names??? )

I know it is the cost of pet ownership; I appreciate everyone is in business for a profit; I know education is expensive... but I'm with you JF, I do wonder if we are actually getting what we pay for???

Wish pets came with free healthcare, like Canada provides

 

[JewelFreak]

I don't mind paying a lot for major stuff -- an MRI on my other dog was $2000 & I coughed up willingly for the skill & knowledge. Another $1800 for endoscopy to drag a wooden skewer from his pipes after the same idiot swallowed one.

I object, though, to high prices for the same things for which a general vet charges 1/2 the amount, such as a microscopic look at skin cells. I've been charged by specialists 3 times what my general vet asks for exactly the same exam -- then told to come back for the expensive procedures, those I don't mind paying for. A thyroid test on my cat done from our regular clinic was about half what these folks charged; the lab work involved is the same for any species so I can't imagine costs should be so much higher for a dog -- unless simply because the traffic will bear it.

When the product delivered is no different, why should they bill at multiples? A plumber might have a PhD, but you don't pay him extra to fix your sink. These are the only vet dermatologists in this city -- it took 2 months to get an appt.; I'll bet if there were others, their time would not be quite so valuable.

--- Laurie

 

[PinkTower]

In October we spent 8k on our labradoodle in 8 days. She did not live. She came down suddenly with AIHA, an autoimmune disease. I do feel the vets spoke too positively of the possible recovery from the disease, now that I can look at the research with less emotion. It was presented to us that she had a one in three chance of survival, and I find that figure ambitious, the more I read.

 

[chemgirl]

Vet stuff is expensive. I've had some scary large bills with my cats. I have the attitude that it is what it is and its worth it to make the little guys as happy and healthy as possible.

 

[Karl_K]

I have worked for a lot of vet offices doing IT consulting.
One thing driving up prices is insurance in many states, some are worse than others.
It used to be very reasonable for liability/malpractice insurance then some lawyers decided it was an untapped market and started advertising, sue your vet and insurance rates skyrocketed.
Insurance for specialists or vets who do surgery beyond the minor ones has been going up 30%+ a year.
Regular vets 15%+
Like many small businesses the costs of providing insurance for them and their staff has skyrocketed.
They are also doing more expensive tests like ct and mri that they hardly ever used to do.

All of that gets reflected in what they have to charge.
imho vets have been underpaid in relation to the training/education and work they do.
Most do it for the love of animals.

 

[luv2sparkle]

I think that bill is crazy!!! Our little Abby has cost a couple thousand in vet bill, though thankfully, not all at one time. I LOVE my dogs
but there is a limit on what I will spend on them. I am not sure what that is because when there is an issue I feel like there is not an
amount of money that I wouldn't spend. I think if they told me it was going to be 2K at one time, I would have to say no.

Ask me again if something serious comes up. I may have changed my mind.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

We have learned in our own experience that much of what is recommended is totally unnecessary. We do not believe in yearly shots since there is plenty on the internet that says there is no proof that yearly immunizations are even needed. Once our bulldog was limping and they suggest surgery for luxating patella, and we said we'd think about it, and guess what? Within a few months it totally healed on it's own!!! When the same bulldog came down with lymphoma near the end of his lifespan, I do appreciate my vet's honesty in telling us that dogs do not survive the type he had and that doing chemo would probably only extend his life for 3 or 4 months. We chose meds that would make him comfortable instead. I think it is a big racket, personally. (Although, good, honest vets certainly should be well paid.)

JewelFreak, I can definitely understand your frustration.

PinkTower, I think you were totally taken for a ride. That is unbelievable. I'd almost get a lawyer for that one.

 

[TooPatient]

We just paid a little under $400 (I'd have to check, but I think it was $392) to our regular vet. She isn't a specialist -- just our every day vet.

I don't remember the exact break down off the top of my head but that included an office visit fee, blood work to check several things, looking at gunk swabbed from ear, and an antibiotic.

We'll be going in every 2-3 weeks for a while....


I'm not shocked by your bill (with 4 animals the vets have lost the ability to shock me!), but it is crazy what they charge.
A great example of that is the other medication we just started our dog on -- the vet wanted her to have one anti-fungal ($26/2 weeks) but we requested a different that we are familiar with (fewer side affects, more effective). She didn't have it in stock so we had to pick it up at a pharmacy (paying full price, no insurance) -- $4 for 2 weeks.

I do understand the expense of school and insurance and all that. It just seems that you have to watch super carefully every step of the way or they'll do lots of extra that really isn't needed. (previous vet wanted to x-ray and ultrasound(?) to check for an enlarged heart in our elderly (17 yr old) cat.... knowing we wouldn't treat it)

 

[Pandora II]

Do you not have pet insurance schemes in the USA?

My parents have them for their cats here in the UK and it has saved them thousands.

 

[iLander]

I'm with you JewelFreak, 100%.

I hate taking my dogs to the vet for minor things, because I NEVER come out of there for under $300, even though they advertise it's a $38 visit. I think it's ridiculous, but the worst part is that they never seem to know what the actual problem is. I've gotten so many erroneous "diagnosis" for my dog's paw licking that I finally did my own research. The vet had diagnosed that she had a bacterial infection of her paw, but then my DH had said that it was probably bacteria from all the licking. So then I watched for when and if she licked, and realized it was a neurotic reaction to walking in wet grass. So now I do the last half of her walk on the dry sidewalk, and wipe her paws off if they're wet. No more licking! It was over a year and two Expensive pet visits, with a battery of tests and meds (which she hated) and I finally had to figure it out myself. That steams my clams.

So then I researched some more, looking for something that was a doggie equivalent to Neosporin, just to get rid of any minor bacteria. I found Sulfodene 3-way ointment for $9 at the pet store. http://www.sulfodene.com/ It beat the heck out of the $27 tiny tube of goo the vet sold me. And the tube was so small, it only lasted a week, and didn't really do anything. This stuff works in one shot.

As for the price of medication, if your vet is filling the prescription, they are making big dollars on that. They buy in bulk, and usually resell it to you for 2-4X the price. Online pet med companies are usually much cheaper. When we had fleas, my vet sold me Frontline, which absolutely did NOT work. Then they sold me those pills that dogs swallow, and the fleas would jump right back on the next time I walked my dogs. I eventually tried canine Advantex plus (on my own) and I only use it in the summer. It works great and it's non-prescription. I can't believe they sold me stuff that didn't work, just so they could make a buck.

Then, my worst vet story, the vet made fun of me (he made me CRY) when I said that I fed my dogs cooked chicken breasts. He agressively ridiculed me and said it was silly and that any Purina was better than that. I felt like a bad doggie mommy! I never went back to that guy, and switched practices completely. Unfortunately, I ended up with the people that couldn't figure out the itchy paw problem.

So, yeah, totally with you JF. I've overpaid for bad service for a really long time. I avoid them like the plague now. I've learned that dogs and cats have remarkable healing powers and I do my own research.

I can appreciate that vet school is expensive, and that they have some kind of liability insurance, but I remember when an $85 visit got you everything you needed, and it wasn't THAT long ago.

 

[Lottie]

Do you not have pet insurance schemes in the USA?

My parents have them for their cats here in the UK and it has saved them thousands.

This. We pay 15gbp per month and our cat is completely covered for all eventualities. I hope it never happens, but we would even be reimbursed his purchase price if he went missing or died. Is Pet insurance not as viable or more costly over there?

 

[VRBeauty]

JF I've gone through the same rant myself, many a time.

I got spoiled by the neighborhood vet I had when I first got cats as an adult - his prices were very reasonable. I was in for a rude awakening when he retired and sold his practice -- it seemed like the prices doubled overnight. But the new docs are caring and good, and I've come to realize that what they're charging is the norm, so what do you do?

Right now I only have one cat, so in all likelihood I'll be able to handle anything the vets throw my way. I probably won't ever have to face the dilemma of declining life-saving treatment for my cat because of its cost. My parents are living on fixed incomes and they do have to make those kinds of calculations. I used to dismiss that line of reasoning, but now that I'm edging closer to retirement myself, I understand better. Sometimes the need to have a pet just doesn't outweigh other types of needs and securities.

 

[chemgirl]

Do you not have pet insurance schemes in the USA?

My parents have them for their cats here in the UK and it has saved them thousands.

This. We pay 15gbp per month and our cat is completely covered for all eventualities. I hope it never happens, but we would even be reimbursed his purchase price if he went missing or died. Is Pet insurance not as viable or more costly over there?

We have cat insurance (in Canada) and its about $20 per cat. There is still a $400 deductible per medical condition per year and routine checkups are not covered. So visits are still expensive, but at least we know we can choose the best care for large medical problems.

Given the large deductible, our insurance doesn't really help with the costs associated with minor illnesses. I was debating cancelling it for a while, but it saved my kitty so I think its worth it in the long run.

 

[maplefemme]

Am I crazy for being steamed over the charges for a visit to a vet dermatologist? My dog has crusty, itchy spots at the corners of her mouth & on her chin. My regular vet tried a variety of things for a year & nothing helped so she referred me to a specialist. I nearly fainted at the bill -- $470. In addition, my appt. was for 9 a.m. & I still had to wait 30 min., so my time wasn't deemed of any value at all.

Here's what I paid:

$132 for the vet's time. She checked the dog over, took skin samples with a piece of scotch tape, an assistant looked at them under a microscope, adding a charge of $15 for "extra skin scrapings" -- I guess you only get so many for your 132.

The microscope peek cost me $58.

A thyroid test -- fT4(ED), TSH, T4 -- for, gasp, $170! Would a human one even cost that much? I suspect the lab charged them less than $45.

Meds to take home & try: $95. One is for yeast infections: I told her my vet did a culture & found no fungal infection. Is yeast different? Or was she selling me something I didn't need?

I am increasingly shocked at veterinary fees, they're driving me to the poorhouse w/4 animals! Have read that corporations buy up vet practices & give them profit goals which they must meet. Pet care in the U.S. is a billion $/yr business -- & I have NO objection to a business making a good profit. But I feel gouged so much of the time lately. Seems to me they take advantage of your love for your little pal to squeeze till your wallet spurts blood. That is immoral, to my mind.

Or am I just a cranky skinflint?

--- Laurie

Did she actually give your dog a confirmed diagnosis based on these tests?

I don't know how it works in the US, but in Canada, vet fees are not regulated, they can charge whatever they want and fees vary greatly between vets.
My vet's practice is open 24 hours and he doesn't charge emergency fees. He will also write me a prescription for meds that have a human equivalent, so I can take them to my pharmacist and get a better price.
One time I couldn't get in to see him because they were backed up with two emergencies so I went to a new vet down the street from my house. My dog had an allergic reaction to a shampoo I used on him and his groins were on fire, I couldn't wait.
He charged me $380 for antibiotics (WTF did he need them for?!) antibiotic cream and 1oz of hibitane soap. I used to work at a vet clinic as a tech, I know what these things cost, he gouged me HUGE!
I was extra annoyed that he was balls-to-the-wall terrified of my dog, he kept jumping back when my dog faced him, completely incompetent - he's a therapy dog! If you're scared of dogs, don't be a vet, my dog is a dream to work with, the wagging tail is the dangerous part!

 

[TooPatient]

Do you not have pet insurance schemes in the USA?

My parents have them for their cats here in the UK and it has saved them thousands.

This. We pay 15gbp per month and our cat is completely covered for all eventualities. I hope it never happens, but we would even be reimbursed his purchase price if he went missing or died. Is Pet insurance not as viable or more costly over there?

We have cat insurance (in Canada) and its about $20 per cat. There is still a $400 deductible per medical condition per year and routine checkups are not covered. So visits are still expensive, but at least we know we can choose the best care for large medical problems.

Given the large deductible, our insurance doesn't really help with the costs associated with minor illnesses. I was debating cancelling it for a while, but it saved my kitty so I think its worth it in the long run.

I've looked into a couple of different plans, but none would work for us. One of the big limits that I've run into is the age cut off -- they don't want to insure older animals. There were also other requirements that made me hesitate.

There have been times when it has taken some juggling, but my animals have always gotten the best care. I don't want the limitations that insurance puts on me. When my animals need care, I want to take them to the best vet and not have to think about whether the insurance will cover it or not.

 

[Matata]

JewelFreak, did you talk to the vet about the charges? I ask for an explanation of charges that I think are excessive, not as a challenge to my vet's expertise, but as an opportunity for both of us to be educated -- me on hidden costs and her on keeping it real. My vet is actually reasonable with charges and reduced her fees when the economy tanked.

Yesterday I paid $2800 for an MRI and other tests for one my cats and part of the fee was $59 in cab fare because the specialty clinic doesn't have an MRI machine and had to transport him to a local human hospital. LOL.

 

[chemgirl]

Do you not have pet insurance schemes in the USA?

My parents have them for their cats here in the UK and it has saved them thousands.

This. We pay 15gbp per month and our cat is completely covered for all eventualities. I hope it never happens, but we would even be reimbursed his purchase price if he went missing or died. Is Pet insurance not as viable or more costly over there?

We have cat insurance (in Canada) and its about $20 per cat. There is still a $400 deductible per medical condition per year and routine checkups are not covered. So visits are still expensive, but at least we know we can choose the best care for large medical problems.

Given the large deductible, our insurance doesn't really help with the costs associated with minor illnesses. I was debating cancelling it for a while, but it saved my kitty so I think its worth it in the long run.

I've looked into a couple of different plans, but none would work for us. One of the big limits that I've run into is the age cut off -- they don't want to insure older animals. There were also other requirements that made me hesitate.

There have been times when it has taken some juggling, but my animals have always gotten the best care. I don't want the limitations that insurance puts on me. When my animals need care, I want to take them to the best vet and not have to think about whether the insurance will cover it or not.

Maybe this is a difference between countries thing. I've never had my insurance company deny a claim and we pick our care. One of our kitties was in the best oncology center in the country for a week and they covered it no questions asked. But like I said, I'm in Canada and people insurance is very different here so pet insurance probably is too!

 

[lulu]

Maybe I should look into the insurance thing, We spent $2000 on Margaret's cancer surgery last year and the previous year Lou the labbie had cruciate ligament surgery for about $2500. I find that paying the big stuff that requires that kind of skilled treatment doesn't bother me but the cost of meds does.

Honestly, the cost of really decent dog food blows my mind more!

 

[tuffyluvr]

Ugh. That sucks, but I don't think it's completely outrageous--vets fees are expensive and specialists even more so! I think it helps if you let the vet know that you are on a budget, so they don't go crazy pulling out all the stops. My vet will always try the more conservative methods first. I don't think vets are out to rip you off, but of course their first priority is to diagnose and treat their patient, and that can be expensive!

 

[Hera]

I find most vet bills under $500 to be fairly reasonable. I have found large discrepancies in pricing so sometimes I call around to check pricing. Sometimes, they take the time to give it to me and other times they don't. I also have a vet insurance policy that has a $500 deductible on my pets. My dog and cat are over ten years old so there are policies out there for older pets. I believe I pay around $65/mo and they pay 80%. I feel it's a good idea for people who will spend almost anything to treat their pets from cancer etc.

 

[maplefemme]

I think we have lucked out finding a good and reasonably priced vet clinic. Their last annual appointments we're less than $90.
They only charged $750 for an amputation and the follow-ups were free. There are 11 vets in the clinic now and so far I like the ones I've met.

 

[wildcat03]

I don't mind paying a lot for major stuff -- an MRI on my other dog was $2000 & I coughed up willingly for the skill & knowledge. Another $1800 for endoscopy to drag a wooden skewer from his pipes after the same idiot swallowed one.

I object, though, to high prices for the same things for which a general vet charges 1/2 the amount, such as a microscopic look at skin cells. I've been charged by specialists 3 times what my general vet asks for exactly the same exam -- then told to come back for the expensive procedures, those I don't mind paying for. A thyroid test on my cat done from our regular clinic was about half what these folks charged; the lab work involved is the same for any species so I can't imagine costs should be so much higher for a dog -- unless simply because the traffic will bear it.

When the product delivered is no different, why should they bill at multiples? A plumber might have a PhD, but you don't pay him extra to fix your sink. These are the only vet dermatologists in this city -- it took 2 months to get an appt.; I'll bet if there were others, their time would not be quite so valuable.

--- Laurie

You are paying extra for the veterinary dermatologist's education and training. General vets only do college, vet school, and possibly an optional year of residency before they go into practice. Veterinary dermatologists have an additional 2 years of training (thus, two years of delayed income and loan repayment). Hence, they bill at a higher rate. It's the same way in human medicine. If an internist manages your high blood pressure, things are billed at one rate. If a cardiologist (specialist with 3 extra years training) manages your high blood pressure, things are billed at a higher rate. This is also true in dentistry. I had a root canal done by my general dentist and the cost was about $800. I had to have it redone several years (and one new general dentist) later, but it was redone by an endodontist (two extra years of training) and cost about $1250. So, you are paying extra for expertise and specialty training. You could argue that the "product" is the same, but it really isn't. Your general vet could not manage your dog's skin issues, thus your dog had to be seen by a specialist, so if the "product" is expertise and the practice of veterinary medicine, it is a different product.

 

[Imdanny]

I don't think you are being cranky. My mom worked for a vet in the 70's. The Dr. got his degre from Cornell vet school. He was well respected and had lots of business. Guess what. In the 70s people did not spend thousands upon thousands on every dog or cat. Do I need to say what happened instead?

They are lucky there is even a market for their services, let alone in this economy.

 

[Asu]

I would be shocked as well.I'm gonna be honest,even if this might shock someone,but there is a limit on the amount of money I would spend on my pets.We spent about 450 for our birman surgery once,and we were able to give the vet the money in two times,otherwise we wouldn't have been able to pay.I think that is about the max I would spend (400/500).Now,when we got them we were in a very different economical situation,and the economy itself was in a very different state,so we would have been able and willing to pay more;right now,not so much.Luckily for us,other than Nicodemo surgery(he had crystals and got blocked four times),our cats never needed the vet too much.Nico's only been there for the surgery,Mirò actually only went in twicence to be neutered,like all of our cats,and once about six years ago because he fought a bee and lost his paw was HUGE.
Pochi is blind,and is the one who I think goes to the vet the most.He is also the one we would spend more money on,honestly.He is like our own kid,and we had him since he was 3 weeks old.The vet loves him too,and often doesn't even ask us to pay for routine checks or small procedures.

 

[NewEnglandLady]

We have spent over $45,000 on vet bills since October of 2010, but I have to say that (for us), it was worth every penny. There have been a couple of times where I've been frustrated at how much it costs for the doc to read lab results. Or most recently--last weekend we had an $1,800 vet bill and were charged and extra $250 for using the emergency services, even though the doc couldn't see us for an hour and we were first in line.

But what I do appreciate is that all of these costs are given to us up front. Every single time we've had a hefty vet bill, all of the costs were gone over with us. For instance, last weekend the doc suggested that they keep Byron overnight for his injections, but it would have cost us an extra $500. From all of Byron's previous chemo injections, we felt comfortable doing it ourselves and we thought Byron would be most comfortable at home. So we made the decision to bring him home. At least we can decide what we want and don't want BEFORE we're charged for it.

The one regret I do have is not getting pet health insurance! We made the decision not to get it because we had money set aside "just in case"--and I doubt all of our vet bills would have been covered, anyway, but I think in the long run it would have saved us money!

 

[Clairitek]

I'm starting to experience the pinch of higher-than-usual vet bills since my cat has advanced kidney disease. We were actually gearing up to have her teeth fixed, but her health is otherwise fairly poor so we have opted to spare her the pain of the surgery. The bill was about $600 and included 3 xrays, a urine extraction (they use an ultrasound to find the bladder and go in with a needle), blood pressure reading (really expensive on a cat, but I'm sure its not as simple as putting a cuff on her little arm), a blood test for thyroid, kidney, liver, and pancreas function. Then we were charged for a vet visit the night before all of this where we discussed everything. While $600 is no small sum to pay, we were warned about it ahead of time. We were shown a quote of high and low end so we would know what to expect when we picked her up. If we hadn't been shown this quote I would have asked for one ahead of time so I wasn't shocked. I think that this is the key to avoiding upset and disappointment (and anger, even) when you are handed a high vet bill.

 

[Imdanny]

We have spent over $45,000 on vet bills since October of 2010, but I have to say that (for us), it was worth every penny.

Please put this in context? How many pets, what were/ are their conditions, what has been the outcome/ prognosis?

Thanks!