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Unbelieveable verdict! if you going to commit a murder...

Oh for Pete's sake, juries in non-sanctuary cities acquit people of murder charges. I trust George Zimmerman or Casey Anthony rings a bell for you.

I would bet you know as much about the actual trial as our President does -- bupkes. As a former career prosecutor, I feel confident in opining that the verdict, reached after days of deliberation, is not an example of jury nullification. The verdict is scarcely "unbelievable" in light of the evidence & the burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the prosecution must shoulder. Here's a decent, informed summary:
http://www.sfchronicle.com/crime/article/Kate-Steinle-murder-trial-How-the-12399543.php
 
He shouldn't be in the U.S. in the first place. I love it when the liberals come out to defend criminals...:rolleyes2:
 
MollyMalone said:
Oh for Pete's sake, juries in non-sanctuary cities acquit people of murder charges. I trust George Zimmerman or Casey Anthony rings a bell for you.

I would bet you know as much about the actual trial as our President does -- bupkes. As a former career prosecutor, I feel confident in opining that the verdict, reached after days of deliberation, is not an example of jury nullification. The verdict is scarcely "unbelievable" in light of the evidence & the burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the prosecution must shoulder. Here's a decent, informed summary:
http://www.sfchronicle.com/crime/article/Kate-Steinle-murder-trial-How-the-12399543.php
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Thanks for the article Molly. Though it does not give me enough information as to the lack of a guilty verdict for involuntary manslaughter. Maybe because the prosecution pushed so hard for murder? I find it hard to believe that IM could not be reached as it was a third option provided to the jury and the defense was using the "accident" claim.
 
Dancing Fire said:
He shouldn't be in the U.S. in the first place. I love it when the liberals come out to defend criminals...:roll2:
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And I love it when you purposefully mischaracterize my posts (this ain't the first time) :roll2:
redwood66 said:
Thanks for the article Molly. Though it does not give me enough information as to the lack of a guilty verdict for involuntary manslaughter. Maybe because the prosecution pushed so hard for murder? I find it hard to believe that IM could not be reached as it was a third option provided to the jury and the defense was using the "accident" claim.
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I'm not well acquainted with California's Penal Code. But generally speaking, the imposition of criminal liability (and the attendant prison sentence) requires different/"more" proof than the plaintiff has to show to get monetary damages in a civil, accidental death case, i.e., "ordinary" carelessness/mistaken judgment isn't enough to support a conviction of involuntary manslaughter a/k/a criminally negligent homicide.
 
No one here has said we do not need immigration reform. Unfortunately there are bad people in all races and nationalities. Bad things happen to good people everyday. Look at the man in Colorado who is accused of killing his pregnant wide and two small children. He was here legally. It sure didn’t stop him from killing his family,
 
White people commit more crimes than any other race--white men specifically. Yet they tend to "get away with it" more than anyone else and often serve no punishment, beyond, if anything, probation. If you want to get in to racial disparities in charging, prosecuting and imprisoning citizens or otherwise, you'll see that black men and women are prosecuted more harshly and often imprisoned for minor offenses vs white people who often get no more than probation for the same if not a worse offense. Part of it is racism, and the rest is financial punishment--white people are generally more able to afford a better attorney, though, the financial disparity is also generally related to historical and systemic racism. You as an Asian man would likely be punished more harshly than, say, my white husband, regardless of income level, simply because you're not a white guy.
 
Please provide statistics for your claims. Whites are 62% of the population so of course the numbers are higher. Now in order to look at it realistically one needs to look at the statistics as a percentage of the population. This is not to say that blacks/hispanics/others are not convicted in some locations higher and longer sentences than other races because that does happen.

This murder table does not agree with your claims.

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u....016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-2.xls


https://crime-data-explorer.fr.cloud.gov/explorer/national/united-states/crime/2006/2016
 
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redwood66 said:
Please provide statistics for your claims. Whites are 62% of the population so of course the numbers are higher. Now in order to look at it realistically one needs to look at the statistics as a percentage of the population. This is not to say that blacks/hispanics/others are not convicted in some locations higher and longer sentences than other races because that does happen.

This murder table does not agree with your claims.

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u....016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-2.xls


https://crime-data-explorer.fr.cloud.gov/explorer/national/united-states/crime/2006/2016
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Hmmm.....

Screen Shot 2018-08-23 at 9.04.45 PM.png
 
redwood66 said:
So FBI data is no longer any good? Where else would you like to get the crime data?
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You tried to refute AME. I just pointed out that the data that you used was flawed.
 
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soxfan said:
You tried to refute AME. I just pointed out that the data that you used was flawed.
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She provided no data at all. The data I used is the same data that is used by all studies. It is the clearing house for data for crimes in the US. If you can find a better one please link it.
 
redwood66 said:
She provided no data at all. The data I used is the same data that is used by all studies. It is the clearing house for crimes in the US. If you can find a better one please link it.
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I don't think she linked it because it's common knowledge and has been proven time and time again that white men commit the majority of crimes. AME- do you have a link?
 
soxfan said:
I don't think she linked it because it's common knowledge and has been proven time and time again that white men commit the majority of crimes. AME- do you have a link?
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Again of course they do. Whites are 62% of the population. A better view is percentage by population. If you don't look at it that way then you are cherry picking for an agenda.
 
Let's use the FBI statistics for murder (table I linked) and blacks as that is what ame used.
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u....016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-2.xls

Whites are 62% of the US population - per the table they committed 29.5% of all murders

Blacks are 13.4% of the US population - per the table they committed 35.9% of all murders

https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/US/PST045217

This is what I mean when I say you have to look at all the statistics. There are studies that have crunched all these numbers and I want to look at statistics when crime is discussed. Not just what someone thinks. Our justice system does have its problems and I will never refute that.
 
redwood66 said:
Let's use the FBI statistics for murder (table I linked) and blacks as that is what ame used.
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u....016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-2.xls

Whites are 62% of the US population - per the table they committed 29.5% of murders

Blacks are 13.4% of the US population - per the table they committed 35.9% of murders

https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/US/PST045217

This is what I mean when I say you have to look at all the statistics.
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Wait... seriously??? This was her post:

Screen Shot 2018-08-23 at 9.27.02 PM.png

Do you disagree with her? Do you have the statistics on how many of those white men were prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law vs. the black men??? And wow, looks to me with those numbers that I was right- white men comprise the largest criminal pool in our nation...
 
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soxfan said:
Wait... seriously??? This was her post:

Screen Shot 2018-08-23 at 9.27.02 PM.png

Do you disagree with her? Do you have the statistics on how many of those white men were prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law vs. the black men??? And wow, looks to me with those numbers that I was right- white men comprise the largest criminal pool in our nation...
Click to expand...
No need to get angry. I edited my post to add that our criminal justice system has its issues for sure. I know this all too well.

Do you understand why the "pool" is larger? Doesn't it make sense that the number would be higher for 62% of the population?

As far as the prosecuted black vs white, I did not make that claim, she did so it is up to her to provide those statistics.
 
Us Asians are well behave. :praise:
 
Not that I want to indulge someone who clearly identified herself several years ago as a white supremacist, here's some of MANY sources regarding my factual comment:

https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/rhovo1215.pdf

Another:

https://www.ussc.gov/research/research-reports/demographic-differences-sentencing
https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/...h-publications/2017/20171114_Demographics.pdf

Another:
https://dash.harvard.edu/bitstream/handle/1/3226952/sampson_racialethnicdisparities.pdf?sequence=2

Some snippets:

"DOJ’s Bureau of Justice Statistics found that a majority of most violent crimes are committed by people who are the same race as their victims. Indeed, the rate of white-on-white violent crime, it found, is about four times the rate of black-on-white crime."

"The BJS study demonstrates plainly that this is simply not the case. Some 57 percent of crimes involving white victims were committed by white perpetrators, while only 15 percent were committed by blacks, and 11 percent by Hispanics. Black crime victims fell along similar racial lines, with 63 percent of the crimes committed by black perpetrators, while 11 percent were committed by whites, and 6.6 percent by Hispanics."

“the rate of white-on-white violent crime (12.0 per 1,000) was about four times higher than black-on-white violent crime (3.1 per 1,000). The rate of black-on-black crime (16.5 per 1,000) was more than five times higher than white-on-black violent crime (2.8 per 1,000). The rate of Hispanic-on-Hispanic crime (8.3 per 1,000) was about double the rate of white-on-Hispanic (4.1 per 1,000) and black-on-Hispanic (4.2 per 1,000) violent crime.”
 
ame said:
Not that I want to indulge someone who clearly identified herself several years ago as a white supremacist, here's some of MANY sources regarding my factual comment:

https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/rhovo1215.pdf

Another:

https://www.ussc.gov/research/research-reports/demographic-differences-sentencing
https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/...h-publications/2017/20171114_Demographics.pdf

Another:
https://dash.harvard.edu/bitstream/handle/1/3226952/sampson_racialethnicdisparities.pdf?sequence=2

Some snippets:

"DOJ’s Bureau of Justice Statistics found that a majority of most violent crimes are committed by people who are the same race as their victims. Indeed, the rate of white-on-white violent crime, it found, is about four times the rate of black-on-white crime."

"The BJS study demonstrates plainly that this is simply not the case. Some 57 percent of crimes involving white victims were committed by white perpetrators, while only 15 percent were committed by blacks, and 11 percent by Hispanics. Black crime victims fell along similar racial lines, with 63 percent of the crimes committed by black perpetrators, while 11 percent were committed by whites, and 6.6 percent by Hispanics."

“the rate of white-on-white violent crime (12.0 per 1,000) was about four times higher than black-on-white violent crime (3.1 per 1,000). The rate of black-on-black crime (16.5 per 1,000) was more than five times higher than white-on-black violent crime (2.8 per 1,000). The rate of Hispanic-on-Hispanic crime (8.3 per 1,000) was about double the rate of white-on-Hispanic (4.1 per 1,000) and black-on-Hispanic (4.2 per 1,000) violent crime.”
Click to expand...
You don't even deserve discussion or respect at this point with that remark. But I expected nothing less. :wavey:
 
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@Redwood, This isn’t a bait question. I’m mainly just curious. Do you feel black people and people of color are treated the same as white people are in our country?
 
Oh, you're going to play the victim again. :roll

soxfan said:
Wait... seriously??? This was her post:

Screen Shot 2018-08-23 at 9.27.02 PM.png

Do you disagree with her? Do you have the statistics on how many of those white men were prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law vs. the black men??? And wow, looks to me with those numbers that I was right- white men comprise the largest criminal pool in our nation...
Click to expand...
Dude, don't even bother trying to have a functional conversation with her. She likes to throw out bullshit and skewed/fake fox "news" "statistics" about how everyone non-white is just a thug and a criminal and an illegal living off our tax money, and then plays the victim when she's called out for it with actual facts from real sources. It's just like those jerks that call the cops when someone is getting into their own car because how dare a black man own a better car that she does or barbequing in the park she decided they don't belong in. If she didn't block all of her past posts from view, you could see her history of trolling.
 
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Did anyone ever get clarification on whether or not she believes Black Lives Matter is an edit: "hate group"
 
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Elliot86 said:
Did anyone ever get clarification on whether or not she believes Black Lives Matter is an edit: "hate group"
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She's said so in the past, so I'd gather she still believes that.
 
:lol: I see the keyboard warriors are at it again. What pieces of work. Must be miserable to be so hateful. Wallow in it like pigs in filth. :wavey:

Put me on ignore if you don't like to read what I say.
 
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I take virtually nothing you say seriously, but I did actually have a moment where I thought "She doesn't really believe BLM is a hate group though, right?"

Thanks for clearing that up :wavey: Ignore goes both ways, but do take a play doh gift bag on your way out!
 
Elliot86 said:
I take virtually nothing you say seriously, but I did actually have a moment where I thought "She doesn't really believe BLM is a hate group though, right?"

Thanks for clearing that up :wavey: Ignore goes both ways, but do take a play doh gift bag on your way out!
Click to expand...
Ditto.
 
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