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luckystar112

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This thread is about ultimatums. (Obviously lol.)
Have you given one? Know anyone that has?

Personally, I don't think an ultimatum is a great way to start a marriage.
But, I know a few girls who have taken that step. Their relationship have ranged from 4-6 years.

I might have accidentally given my ff one just the other day! We were talking about summer vacations. Since my family lives in ME, his in VA, and we live in TX all of our vacation time goes toward visiting these families. Usually he goes to his family for xmas and I go to mine. One time we flew to Maine, took a train to Virginia and flew back to TX from there but it was a lot of money. Still, we are thinking about doing it again this summer.

His family is pretty conservative, so when we are there for a family reunion we aren't allowed to sleep in the same room. Last year, I didn't go at all because his mom told him that it might be "awkward" for the family if I had to sleep in my own room. I didn't get it...I thought she was punishing me or something because it wouldn't have been my first time going to one of their reunions, and no one seemed to have a problem with it before. I didn't see the big deal. I think that his mom was indirectly trying to tell him to get ENGAGED to me already, because directly after she told him that she started telling him that he needed to hurry up and put a ring on my finger. So, I didn't go, and ended up feeling embaressed and alienated. I don't think she meant to hurt my feelings. But at the time I took it as "You don't belong here since you aren't part of the famiily."

So since then I've been to VA with him for xmas, and everything was fine. I think it's just when the whole family from all different states are around that it gets "weird".

The other day FF and I were talking about his family reunion this year, and maybe we can do the whole ME and VA thing like we did a few years ago. I told him I'm NOT going to a reunion without a ring on my finger!!!!!!! I didn't realize how bad this sounded until after I said it. But I didn't care. I was so hurt last year that I can't bare the chance of someone saying that again. It wasn't a "marry me or that's it!" ultimatum, but it was an ultimatum nonetheless.

Another thing is that when you're in your 20's, like I am, you are still trying to find yourself. I know for a fact that if FF and I weren't together, and if I didn't think I might marry him one day that I wouldn't be living in TX. That is why, for me, I feel the need to find out what the heck is going on so I can go on with my life either way...you know? I can live perfectly happy in TX with him, but not without him. Without him, I'd leave in a milisecond...this state just isn't for me. Anyway, I wonder if other 20 something girls feel pressured to give ultimatums for these same reasons. I don't think I could even give the "ultimate" ultimatum though, as I said before. I want him to marry me because he WANTS to...but I want him to do it faster!
 

bee*

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well Im 25 and have been with D for nearly 8 years and have been tempted sometimes to just say lets get engaged or that''s it. It kind of came to a head when we went to NY in Jan 2006 and we ended up having a huge talk and we decided that we were going to go back this year and get our engagement ring. It really put my mind at ease having a timeframe and now that we''re only four months away from going to NY, I cannot wait and D is talking about it quite a lot too so hopefully he wont wait too long to put it on my finger. If come July, something happened and he decided that he wasnt ready to get engaged then, Im not sure how much longer I would wait around. It would be really hard to walk away, but marriage is something that I want. Have you spoken to your ff and got any sort of timeline?
 

musey

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FI never got an ultimatum from me--but he got LOTS of "when?" questions! Once I switched gears from "when" to "why not now," that's when we made real progress. It only took a couple of conversations about why now/very soon wouldn't be the perfect time for him to realize well hey, maybe it is!

Every guy responds differently to those kinds of conversations, but if you really feel like your relationship is at the point now where you're honestly wondering "why not now?" (and it sounds like you are wondering--and have a right to) then it's an appropriate time to ask him that question, too, IMO. He may have an absolutely legitimate reason, and he may not--every guy is different as to why he "waits."

Once you two get down to the nitty gritty of the issue, you will probably feel better about waiting, and he will probably feel better about not waiting--hence making your wait shorter and more bearable at the same time!!



ETA: After I posted I realized you weren't really asking for the advice I gave--hopefully it may help some other reader!

Anyway, I don't think that what you gave him really was an "ultimatum," (at least not in the negative connotation of the word,) especially considering the circumstances. If it were me, I'd interpret it more as a reaction to the situation with his family (creating uncomfortable tension if you are there and not engaged), than an imposition of a timeline (I want to get engaged, so you have until your reunion). But then, do we have more information than your bf?
 

Haven

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Luckystar,

I completely understand your confusion--I''m in a similar situation myself, and I''ve seen a couple of my friends handle these situations in a few different ways.

You are so right to say that you want him to marry you because he WANTS to, but you also have a right to speak up about things that are making you feel uncomfortable. It sounds like your "ultimatum" is just what Musey said it is--a reaction to a situation. Good for you for standing up for yourself!

I have a friend who gave her now-husband a real ultimatum--the "if I don''t have a ring on my finger by August then you don''t have a girlfriend anymore" ultimatum. He ended up asking for an "extension" and then when he did propose all of the excitement had completely deflated because the reaction was more like "finally" rather than "ohmygoshweresoexcitedforyou!" And actually, the now-husband actually told my boyfriend that he wasn''t quite ready to propose when he did. What a horrible situation!

Another good friend of mine went the "perhaps if I bring it up enough he''ll get the picture and ask me already" route which actually seemed to work. He was definitely annoyed with all the engagement talk, but he also called me up several months ago to help him pick out a ring.

Bottom line--it sounds like you said what you needed to say, and you certainly need to know where you two stand if you are staying in Texas to be with him. Bee''s suggestion of a timeline discussion sounds perfect, too.

Sorry for the long post, you really hit on something I''ve been thinking about myself. H and I have been together for about three years, and I''m starting to wonder if I should begin dropping hints, myself.

Good luck, and let us know what happens!

Haven
 

MustangFan

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I wouldn''t feel guilty, you shouldn''t expect you to go to another reunion without the engagement thing.

My mother dated my Dad for 4 years and every Sunday my grandmother would make her feel like crap.. "why buy the cow, when you get the milk for nothing!" At least you only have to go through it once a year, well maybe...
My mom flat out told my Dad, I want an engagement ring, his words.. we''ll save for it! lol
never was the real romantic type, but she finally got it after she refused to have a child with him out of wedlock.
 

firebirdgold

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Well, I don''t believe in Ultimatums either. Yet I gave one too! His sister''s wedding was 6 months away at the time and would have been the first time I met any of his extended family. I told him I wasn''t going to go unless I had a ring on my finger! He told me not to worry.
(Didn''t make it in time for my sister''s wedding though which was pretty annoying as I was there w/o him and had to field a bunch of questions).

I really don''t think that saying you won''t go to a family reunion without being engaged is the same thing as saying that unless we''re engaged by such and such date I''m leaving. But maybe that''s just to make me feel better for having given one!
 

Mara

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imo there can be diff types of 'ultimatums'...and it can also be how you present it. who wants to hear 'marry me or else'...lol. but i have known people who gave soft ultimatums...or 'deadlines'....and also people who knew that their mate wanted to get married and said 'okay so here is what i need you to do for me to want to be ready to marry you'...etc. i think that the word ultimatum gets a bad rap...because really it's about voicing your thoughts, what you know/feel you deserve and finding out if the person is willing to give that to you.

the ultimatum's i don't really agree with are things like 'you have to propose by X date or else i am walking out the door on Y date and it's over'...because then you are putting a serious amount of pressure on someone, and also you have to be ready to make good on the walking out the door part IF it doesn't come around. most people aren't that ready to close the door on a relationship they have invested a fair amount of time into.

what i did i guess was kind of like an ultimatum but not too stressful i would hope...i said well we have been together for X time...you should know within the next 6 months if i am the 'one for you' kinda thing...you don't have to propose on bended knee by any sort of date, i just want to know by end of the year that i am the one you want to spend your life with so we can start figuring out how to go from there. because otherwise, i don't want to invest any more of myself into this relationship if you are unsure after 2+ years of being with me. and he responded really well to it...i said 'do you think this is a reasonable request' and he said 'yes'...so we went from there. within the 6 months he was not only knowing i was the one he wanted to be with long-term, we had a stone before the 6 months was up and i got the actual proposal by like the 7th month i think. but really after we started looking at rings, i already had my answer from him, though not verbal. we also were a little older, aka i was 28 when i did this and he was 33 i think...so for me it was like 'we need to figure this out or move on and find people we DO want to be with long-term...we're not getting any younger'...lol.

i think it's really important to let the person who is being given some sort of ultimatum/timeline/deadline to let them come to whatever conclusion they will come to on their own. and give them a reasonable timeframe to figure things out within. i think that this works well for people who are more apt to just float along happily in the relationship and think 'why does it have to change'. but sometimes people respond badly to the whole timeline thing if they really just are flat out not ready! and that is where it can get sticky.

anyway...long post but i think it depends on the individuals, the relationship, what the history is, what has been discussed for the future, and where they both mentally are. i think that forms of soft ultimatums, aka more like a timeline or a deadline to know something (rather than a proposal which can be scary)...works better. i never wanted to feel like i was forcing a proposal from my husband...but i wanted him to know he HAD to stop and think about it at some point and ask himself 'is this what i want?'...and if it was...to know that i was on board with it and how i felt. and it worked out wonderfully for me. thank goodness hehe.
 

anchor31

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I''m not sure if what I did was an ultimatum or not... In any case, it wasn''t the "marry me now or I''m leaving you" kind of thing.

We both knew we wanted to get married someday, and around our second anniversary he asked me to move in with him in a year. I wasn''t expecting it, and I didn''t believe in moving in together before engagement, which he didn''t expect. So it caused some confusion at first. I made sure he understood that I didn''t want to live like his wife without being at least on my way to becoming his wife, but I also made sure he understood that it didn''t have to be right now. I was fine with waiting longer, we just wouldn''t be living together until then.

He said he would have proposed in 2006 either way, so there really were no problems at all. We''re just moving in together one year later than he expected, and I think it''s better this way.

I guess my situation is similar to yours... As long as your boyfriend is as ready to take that step as you are, I don''t see any problems.
 

luckystar112

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Wow! Lots of responses!

Well first let me just say (about the reunion) that I don''t think his mom was trying to hurt my feelings. I''m pretty sure she loves me. In fact, the month before the reunion we were in Italy. FF and I slept in the SAME bed in the SAME hotel room. So, I really think that when she told him it would be "awkward" for me to come, she was really trying to say, "You two aren''t engaged yet, and because of this you know she''ll have to sleep in a seperate room in front of the extended family. Why don''t you save her the embaressment and get engaged already?" But when my FF relayed the message back to me he just said, "My mom thinks it will be awkward if you''re there." So of COURSE I was freaking out! I thought I had said/done something in Italy that turned them off. I was FREAKING out. I cried. I was embaressed. Not only that, but a lot of his family members were expecting me there. Six of us went to Italy--FF and I, FF''s brother and his wife, and FF''s parents. While we were there we met up with some more of FF''s family that are stationed in Naples. All of them brought up the reunion to me and asked if I was coming. When I said I didn''t know (since it was before his mothers comment) they were like you HAVE to come.

So needless to say, all I could think about was my boyfriend going to the reunion, everyone wondering where I am (which DID happen) and knowing that the only reason I am home is because I''m not engaged yet! His mother, when telling him that it might be awkward for me to be there, also told him that they (his parents) have invested so much in me emotionally and financially (Italy was free for us.) that it would be a huge dissappointment if we didn''t work out, so he needs to decide his life.

This was like 8 months ago!!!

So of course I don''t want to go to this next reunion. You know, it''s sad too...because I feel extremely close to his grandparents, and his grandfather probably doesn''t have too much longer to live. I''d really like to have a wedding that his grandfather can attend. I''d really like to be able to go to a reunion! Which I know I CAN this summer, but I was so hurt last summer I really just can''t picture going there and having everyone talk because I have to sleep in my own bed again and my boyfriend STILL hasn''t made it official.


We''re going on 4 years now...which I realize is nothing compared to how long some of you girls have waited, but I was a late bloomer in college. (I didn''t go until I was 23) I am about to recieve my associates next semester, and then I can pretty much go wherever I want. I kind of have an ultimatum in my HEAD that if we aren''t engaged by the time I get my associates I''m just going to apply to schools near my hometown and move on from there....and if he really wants me, he can come get me. If not, then at least I know the truth, you know? I really think we''ll be engaged by then, but this is a "just in case" measure. I''ve also been thinking recently that I could try to take a semester abroad, make him realize how much he''ll miss me. lol...but I think thats just a silly game that I''d hate myself for playing.


Wow, my posts have a tendency to be LONG. Sorry guys!

I think at a certain point in a relationship an ultimatum is the swift kick in the butt that some guys need. I have a friend that was with her husband for 6 years before she gave him an ultimatum. I''m just NOT like that. I can''t wait 6 years. I''m a planner....I need to have my life laid in front of me. There are things that I want accomplished by a certain time and my goals are JUST as important as his. I''m sure a lot of girls feel that way. Plus when we first first first got together, Britney and Kevin Federline had gotten together. (haha I know.) I remember reading an article about how they were getting married "already". FF and I talked about that (we were practically a brand new couple) and I told him that I thought it was too soon for Britney, but I would think that within two years a guy should have a pretty good idea whether or not he wants to be with someone forever. He AGREED. Yet here we are....going on 4 years....

MEN!!!!
 

FutureMrsC

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Your situation sounds so similiar to mine! I''ve been with my boyfriend since I was 22 and after about 6 months of dating I started attending his family''s functions. Well, a year had gone by and Christmas rolls around; his entire mother''s family sleeps over at his grandparent''s home every year and he invited me to join them... well a few days before Christmas Eve my boyfriend tells me the whole family is buzzing about where I will sleep as it couldn''t possibly be in the same room as him, should they buy me gifts when he''s not even engaged to me, and a bunch of other petty concerns about us not being official and it being improper (mind you we were living together at this point). Well I was very taken aback and hurt at their attitudes as I''d been to Thanksgiving dinner, countless birthday parties and other celebrations and always felt very welcomed, so I backed out of going. It''s been 3 more Christmas''s since that one and I have refused each year to go. The family now acts surprised that I don''t come, but I was very hurt by their attitudes back then and even though I spend all the other holidays with them I can''t seem to make myself go through that "un-engaged" humilation of not really being part of the family at Christmas time. My boyfriend doesn''t understand why I feel this way still and keeps trying to assure me they are over that and I should come, but until I have a ring on my finger I''m refusing. I''ve never looked at that as an ultimatum, just a way for myself not to have to deal with the issue. Thanks for sharing your story, comforts me to know there are other crazy families out there that make big deals out of nothing. :)
 

KimberlyH

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Date: 3/6/2007 3:01:37 PM
Author: FutureMrsC
Your situation sounds so similiar to mine! I''ve been with my boyfriend since I was 22 and after about 6 months of dating I started attending his family''s functions. Well, a year had gone by and Christmas rolls around; his entire mother''s family sleeps over at his grandparent''s home every year and he invited me to join them... well a few days before Christmas Eve my boyfriend tells me the whole family is buzzing about where I will sleep as it couldn''t possibly be in the same room as him, should they buy me gifts when he''s not even engaged to me, and a bunch of other petty concerns about us not being official and it being improper (mind you we were living together at this point). Well I was very taken aback and hurt at their attitudes as I''d been to Thanksgiving dinner, countless birthday parties and other celebrations and always felt very welcomed, so I backed out of going. It''s been 3 more Christmas''s since that one and I have refused each year to go. The family now acts surprised that I don''t come, but I was very hurt by their attitudes back then and even though I spend all the other holidays with them I can''t seem to make myself go through that ''un-engaged'' humilation of not really being part of the family at Christmas time. My boyfriend doesn''t understand why I feel this way still and keeps trying to assure me they are over that and I should come, but until I have a ring on my finger I''m refusing. I''ve never looked at that as an ultimatum, just a way for myself not to have to deal with the issue. Thanks for sharing your story, comforts me to know there are other crazy families out there that make big deals out of nothing. :)
Wow, how harsh! I don''t think it''s "making a big deal out of nothing." These are obviosuly the values his family holds dear, as do/did your BFs parents, and in their home they have a right to request that those values be respected. That isn''t to say that it isn''t a bit awkward for the OP, but I''m sure it was awkward for his family as well.

When my sister and her then boyfriend, now husband, and I and my then boyfriend, now husband, visited my parents as boyfriend and girlfriend we chose to stay in a hotel out of respect for my parents beliefs about sleeping together (even if it is just sleeping) prior to marriage. I would have been so angry and offended if my DH had ever called my parents crazy or said that they were making a big deal out of nothing by stating we were not welcome to share a room in their home. Such a rude statement to make about someone''s family for having a different set of values than yours.

Sorry for the hijack, that just REALLY rubbed me the wrong way.
 

luckystar112

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Jan 8, 2007
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Date: 3/6/2007 3:53:41 PM
Author: KimberlyH
Date: 3/6/2007 3:01:37 PM

Author: FutureMrsC

Your situation sounds so similiar to mine! I've been with my boyfriend since I was 22 and after about 6 months of dating I started attending his family's functions. Well, a year had gone by and Christmas rolls around; his entire mother's family sleeps over at his grandparent's home every year and he invited me to join them... well a few days before Christmas Eve my boyfriend tells me the whole family is buzzing about where I will sleep as it couldn't possibly be in the same room as him, should they buy me gifts when he's not even engaged to me, and a bunch of other petty concerns about us not being official and it being improper (mind you we were living together at this point). Well I was very taken aback and hurt at their attitudes as I'd been to Thanksgiving dinner, countless birthday parties and other celebrations and always felt very welcomed, so I backed out of going. It's been 3 more Christmas's since that one and I have refused each year to go. The family now acts surprised that I don't come, but I was very hurt by their attitudes back then and even though I spend all the other holidays with them I can't seem to make myself go through that 'un-engaged' humilation of not really being part of the family at Christmas time. My boyfriend doesn't understand why I feel this way still and keeps trying to assure me they are over that and I should come, but until I have a ring on my finger I'm refusing. I've never looked at that as an ultimatum, just a way for myself not to have to deal with the issue. Thanks for sharing your story, comforts me to know there are other crazy families out there that make big deals out of nothing. :)
Wow, how harsh! I don't think it's 'making a big deal out of nothing.' These are obviosuly the values his family holds dear, as do/did your BFs parents, and in their home they have a right to request that those values be respected. That isn't to say that it isn't a bit awkward for the OP, but I'm sure it was awkward for his family as well.


When my sister and her then boyfriend, now husband, and I and my then boyfriend, now husband, visited my parents as boyfriend and girlfriend we chose to stay in a hotel out of respect for my parents beliefs about sleeping together (even if it is just sleeping) prior to marriage. I would have been so angry and offended if my DH had ever called my parents crazy or said that they were making a big deal out of nothing by stating we were not welcome to share a room in their home. Such a rude statement to make about someone's family for having a different set of values than yours.


Sorry for the hijack, that just REALLY rubbed me the wrong way.

Awww....I don't think she was trying to be rude. I think she probably thinks the same as me:

I don't think either of us think it's a bad thing that we can't sleep in the same bed as them. That isn't the case at all! If anything, I respect them SO MUCH MORE because of it! To me, it signifies a family with great morals. I would NEVER get on their case for that. It's comforting for me to know that not just anyone has been allowed in my boyfriend's original bed in his bedroom. (lol)

And in FutureMrsC's case, I think she referring more to the fact that his family didn't want to get her gifts/ect because she wasn't engaged to her boyfriend yet. And she said that she had been to countless events/birthday parties before, so I'm sure she bought THEM gifts. For some reason, this one holiday meant more to them. She felt accepted and then dropped in a milisecond. Same thing happened to me with the reunion.

When it comes to xmas for her, and the reunion for me....both very big events, we're discluded and sort of punished for our boyfriends not proposing to us yet. You know? I don't think either of us care if we sleep in the same bed as our boyfriends. I think it's the feeling of not belonging, when we "belong" the rest of the year. To me, it's about loving his family so much but not being able to call them my own, and suffering for it!

It's really about our procrastinating boyfriends if you want to get technical!!! lol.
 

KimberlyH

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 15, 2006
Messages
7,485
Date: 3/6/2007 6:36:51 PM
Author: luckystar112

Date: 3/6/2007 3:53:41 PM
Author: KimberlyH

Date: 3/6/2007 3:01:37 PM

Author: FutureMrsC

Your situation sounds so similiar to mine! I''ve been with my boyfriend since I was 22 and after about 6 months of dating I started attending his family''s functions. Well, a year had gone by and Christmas rolls around; his entire mother''s family sleeps over at his grandparent''s home every year and he invited me to join them... well a few days before Christmas Eve my boyfriend tells me the whole family is buzzing about where I will sleep as it couldn''t possibly be in the same room as him, should they buy me gifts when he''s not even engaged to me, and a bunch of other petty concerns about us not being official and it being improper (mind you we were living together at this point). Well I was very taken aback and hurt at their attitudes as I''d been to Thanksgiving dinner, countless birthday parties and other celebrations and always felt very welcomed, so I backed out of going. It''s been 3 more Christmas''s since that one and I have refused each year to go. The family now acts surprised that I don''t come, but I was very hurt by their attitudes back then and even though I spend all the other holidays with them I can''t seem to make myself go through that ''un-engaged'' humilation of not really being part of the family at Christmas time. My boyfriend doesn''t understand why I feel this way still and keeps trying to assure me they are over that and I should come, but until I have a ring on my finger I''m refusing. I''ve never looked at that as an ultimatum, just a way for myself not to have to deal with the issue. Thanks for sharing your story, comforts me to know there are other crazy families out there that make big deals out of nothing. :)
Wow, how harsh! I don''t think it''s ''making a big deal out of nothing.'' These are obviosuly the values his family holds dear, as do/did your BFs parents, and in their home they have a right to request that those values be respected. That isn''t to say that it isn''t a bit awkward for the OP, but I''m sure it was awkward for his family as well.


When my sister and her then boyfriend, now husband, and I and my then boyfriend, now husband, visited my parents as boyfriend and girlfriend we chose to stay in a hotel out of respect for my parents beliefs about sleeping together (even if it is just sleeping) prior to marriage. I would have been so angry and offended if my DH had ever called my parents crazy or said that they were making a big deal out of nothing by stating we were not welcome to share a room in their home. Such a rude statement to make about someone''s family for having a different set of values than yours.


Sorry for the hijack, that just REALLY rubbed me the wrong way.

Awww....I don''t think she was trying to be rude. I think she probably thinks the same as me:

I don''t think either of us think it''s a bad thing that we can''t sleep in the same bed as them. That isn''t the case at all! If anything, I respect them SO MUCH MORE because of it! To me, it signifies a family with great morals. I would NEVER get on their case for that. It''s comforting for me to know that not just anyone has been allowed in my boyfriend''s original bed in his bedroom. (lol)

But when it comes to xmas for her, and the reunion for me....both very big events, we''re discluded and sort of punished for our boyfriends not proposing to us yet. You know? I don''t think either of us care if we sleep in the same bed as our boyfriends. I think it''s the feeling of not belonging, when we ''belong'' the rest of the year. To me, it''s about loving his family so much but not being able to call them my own, and suffering for it!

It''s really about our procrastinating boyfriends if you want to get technical!!! lol.
Lucky,

I can totally understand your feelings of discomfort and frustration. It''s a difficult position to be almost family, but not quite. A lot of parents don''t consider the SO''s of their children to be family until the couple have said "I do." It''s a pretty common viewpoint, especially from older generations. And it''s all part of the dating and mating process.

I just think it''s important to view it from both sides of the fence, and instead of Mrs.C doing so, she chalked it up to his family being "crazy" and basically irrational for not being comfortable with their son/grandson/whatever sleeping in the same bed as his girlfriend. I really don''t think you are saying the same thing she is, I wish you were because I think it''s so sad that she would say something so cruel about her BFs family.
 

FutureMrsC

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Joined
Aug 28, 2006
Messages
26
Thank you Lucky, you expressed how I felt much better than I did apparently.

Please don''t be so quick to judge Kimberly. My "crazy" might have been a bad choice of words but it meant no disrespect to his families values. When visiting my own grandmother we have separate rooms and would not have it any other way. To me that was a non-issue.

What hurt me was that it was such an issue to his family with the fact we weren''t yet engaged. Like Lucky said I''d been embraced in every other facet and it just came as a slap in the face to know they had a problem with me in any way. I could care less where I sleep or about presents... I found it "crazy" that it was a big concern to them when I would have been happy sleeping in a sleeping bag in the living room and watching the joy on all their faces with their gifts. Instead it''s a sore spot for me and even several years later and all the other family events I''ve been through with them since then, I send my gifts with my boyfriend and he brings mine home to me and I spend Christmas with my puppy dog. I know I''m being silly, but I don''t want to made to feel inferior for making the choices I did to live and spend holidays with a man I''m not yet engaged to.
 

KimberlyH

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Joined
Jun 15, 2006
Messages
7,485
Date: 3/6/2007 8:49:13 PM
Author: FutureMrsC
Thank you Lucky, you expressed how I felt much better than I did apparently.

Please don''t be so quick to judge Kimberly. My ''crazy'' might have been a bad choice of words but it meant no disrespect to his families values. When visiting my own grandmother we have separate rooms and would not have it any other way. To me that was a non-issue.

What hurt me was that it was such an issue to his family with the fact we weren''t yet engaged. Like Lucky said I''d been embraced in every other facet and it just came as a slap in the face to know they had a problem with me in any way. I could care less where I sleep or about presents... I found it ''crazy'' that it was a big concern to them when I would have been happy sleeping in a sleeping bag in the living room and watching the joy on all their faces with their gifts. Instead it''s a sore spot for me and even several years later and all the other family events I''ve been through with them since then, I send my gifts with my boyfriend and he brings mine home to me and I spend Christmas with my puppy dog. I know I''m being silly, but I don''t want to made to feel inferior for making the choices I did to live and spend holidays with a man I''m not yet engaged to.
I don''t think I judged you, I just said that it was rude of you to call your BF''s family crazy, and it was. If it''s not how you feel that''s great and groovy, it''s not what you said and at the end of the day it makes no difference to me. My main intention was to help the OP to see things from a different point of view, that of the family, as opposed to chalking it up to his family being wrong or "crazy," as you did. It would be hard to be on either side of the fence, the GF who feels unwelcome (or chooses to be) or the family who''s in a bit of an awkward position (as the GF is not family, yet, but will likely be one day).

I wish both of you lots of luck. I hope your proposals come sooner rather than later so that this issue resolves itself.
 

FutureMrsC

Rough_Rock
Joined
Aug 28, 2006
Messages
26
I still feel like what Lucky is expressing is very similar to what I feel.

Kimberly, I appreciate your effort to bring the family''s viewpoint into the discussion, but I really feel you could have done it without negating my situation. The assumptions you made about me couldn''t be further from the truth. Thanks for the well wishes just the same.

Let''s re-write this sentence to clear up any further judging/inferring/assuming whatever you want to call it.

Original: "Thanks for sharing your story, comforts me to know there are other crazy families out there that make big deals out of nothing. :)"

Revised: "Thanks for sharing your story, it comforts me to know there are other people going through the same thing with families that mean well, but the end result ends up being the furthest thing from their intentions."

All better now? Sure hope so.
 

neatfreak

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Feb 17, 2007
Messages
14,167
No ultimatum...but like many people here I asked him straight up what his intentions were. Since we were planning on signing a new lease together, I basically asked where he saw us going in the future. He then told me he wanted to marry me, without hesitation, so I had my answer. I brought it up in December (I was also a little tipsy and he wasn''t so it was the peeerfect way to bring it up in a non-confrontational way) and we started looking at rings soon after.

Now the countdown is on. Since he''s excited too I have been able to get a much better timeline out of him than I initially thought possible. He keeps teasing me, and I know he''s having fun harassing me. Right now we''re at "before summer" (also known as "I promise you''ll be able to take the dog and your new pet, the diamond, to the dog park before it gets nice (we''re in the Upper Midwest)). YAY!

I highly recommend the non-ultimatum approach, works very well. But it sounds like you didn''t give him the BAD kind of ultimatum (ring or I''m leaving). I think your approach was tactful, you let him know how you feel, and aren''t threatening to leave him, just saying that you''re not comfortable going to the event. He''ll get the picture.

Good luck!
 

TravelingGal

Super_Ideal_Rock
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
17,193
Ultimatums are lame, IMO. How many of us would react well if we were given one? No one likes to feel like they are being put in a corner, especially for something as emotionally huge as commitment to marriage.

However, AGREEMENTS are another thing. For instance, what Mara did was simply coming to an agreement. "I am thinking X, do you agree? Is that unreasonable?" to which he should nod understandingly and reply "No, it is not unreasonable, and I agree."


It''s about conversations, not statements and subtle (or obvious) threats. If any guy ever said to me, do X or else, I would really wonder who stole a marble or two of his.
 

KimberlyH

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jun 15, 2006
Messages
7,485
Date: 3/6/2007 10:19:07 PM
Author: FutureMrsC
I still feel like what Lucky is expressing is very similar to what I feel.

Kimberly, I appreciate your effort to bring the family''s viewpoint into the discussion, but I really feel you could have done it without negating my situation. The assumptions you made about me couldn''t be further from the truth. Thanks for the well wishes just the same.

Let''s re-write this sentence to clear up any further judging/inferring/assuming whatever you want to call it.

Original: ''Thanks for sharing your story, comforts me to know there are other crazy families out there that make big deals out of nothing. :)''

Revised: ''Thanks for sharing your story, it comforts me to know there are other people going through the same thing with families that mean well, but the end result ends up being the furthest thing from their intentions.''

All better now? Sure hope so.
Things were never bad, so there was nothing to make better. It''s good that your feelings about your BFs family aren''t reflected in what you stated (not what I inferred or assumed), that''s great for you, him and his family.

And now back to our regularly scheduled programming...

I concur with TG, ultimatums are silly. Especially when the person giving the ultimatum isn''t prepared to follow through, which is pretty darn common. Again, OP, I''m so sorry you were made to feel uncomfortable, whether we like it or not there''s a difference between being the GF and being the FI or wife, it''s all part of the dating and mating game.

As I said before, I hope that you and your BF are engaged soon and all of this awkwardness can be a thing of the past.
 

princessmo2

Rough_Rock
Joined
Dec 22, 2006
Messages
29
I didn''t give an ultimatum either, exactly... We bought a condo together last summer, but before I would commit to it, I sat him down and basically said that if we were going to do that, I needed to know that we would get engaged within one year at the most, since I didn''t want to make such a huge commitment and have false expectations. And my bf is adorable... Because money is tight right now and we have more pressing things to pay for (like his school), I actually offered him an extension, which he declined! He said that even if all he had was $100 to buy me a ring, we were getting engaged by the end of the summer, end of story.


So, ultimatums - not so good, but mature discussions, perfectly reasonable, I think.
 

lovebug

Rough_Rock
Joined
Nov 30, 2006
Messages
32
What did he say when you told him you didn''t want to go without a ring? Was he responsive and understanding? Did he just disregard it? We had a similar situation where we were going to an event and I told him I couldn''t do another event like that without a ring. He proposed about a month before.

What is he waiting for? Is it that he is not emotionally ready? Financially ready? Just ask him what it is. Tell him that perhaps unlike him, you are getting questions from friends, colleagues and family and you want to know how to defend him. If he is waiting for more money, more time, whatever it is. Once you have a reason for the "delay" then you will feel better. I was with my fiance for 7 years before the proposal and had to field so many questions from people and it was fine when I had an answer (i.e. we''re still in school, we don''t have any money), but when I ran out of answers I got frustrated! I told him this and I think it made him realize that there was no good answer and it was the right time.

I think you are perfectly in the right. Guys don''t realize how other people are and how they harrass you all the time about the engagement.

Good luck to you!
 

luckystar112

Ideal_Rock
Joined
Jan 8, 2007
Messages
3,962
When I told him he just kind of smirked/laughed. But he KNOWS I''m serious.

I think the reason we aren''t engaged right now is because of money, although he hasn''t done anything to try and save any. We aren''t hurting for money or anything, and we have some extra cash for emergencies, but there isn''t a ring "fund" that I know of.

He told me a long time ago that he would actually prefer to finance it. A lot of people would say this is a bad idea (including me), but he is very responsible. He told me he wants to build up his credit score, since credit unions (despite the word "credit") do nothing for you in that respect. So...that''s his reasoning. He just hasn''t done it yet!!!
 

Missmotocross

Rough_Rock
Joined
Mar 26, 2007
Messages
2
Ultimatums.....hmmm....

I think they have their place (I know, I KNOW...don''t all try to strangle me thru the screen at once, now, y''all!

If, left alone, your situation will not resolve itself in a satisfactory manner (which I''ll go ahead and define as "solved in a manner that makes EVERYONE happy")then I''m all for the use of an ulimatum.

With all due respect to each poster who has used the "mature, open dialogue" strategy, I prefer a different course of action....It''s a little bit "meaner" than the whole "open discussion" thing, and it requires that you be 100% secure in the knowledge that the man will either propose, OR that you will be A-OK if he doesn''t...because you WILL have to walk after this (that''s what makes it an ultimatum). It''s also pretty much for relationships of 1 year long or longer..any sooner and you risk looking a little psycho, LOL

PHASE 1: Have the whole "talk" but NEVER tell the man "We have to TALK" or anything like that....choose a private moment when you''re having a good time and say something like "I love hanging out together..makes me wonder what life would be like if I were getting married to you..."

PAY ATTENTION to his reaction: does he shut you down, or act weird or defensive, change the subject, etc.? You have your answer. Extract yourself from the dead-end relationship and move on.

If he''s vague or talks about "someday..." then you can reply with a statement about your future that has some DEFINITE time frame issues, so that the man sees he doesn''t have forever and a day to keep you waiting...(such as: what age you want to be done having babies by, when you want to buy a home, your career, etc, etc...whatever you want to say here...)

So now, Mr. Man has an idea of what your timeframe is. Drop it.

From this moment on, he knows the score. Now that you''ve told him this, ACT UPON IT. Being to act a little more distant and remote. Hang out with some of your VERY single (and lovin'' it!) girlfriends. Whatever "little things" you do for him...STOP doing them. This way, he''ll miss them (and you). If you live together, make plans with friends for dinner after work, then DON''T call and tell him about them. When he calls your cell, tell him "oops, I COMPLETELY forgot to tell you...bye now, my shrimp cocktail just got here we''ll talk later.." hang up without listening to his protests (yeah, even if you have to cut him off mid-sentence...tough love, man...tough love)

If you keep doing this, one of two things will happen:

The man will ask you to marry him, probably well before your deadline

OR

He''ll ditch you....in which case, you have been cultivating a new life while you gave him enough time to pull his head out of his hindquarters, so you''ll have a new "single girl" routine of friends, dinners, drinks, events, and possibly, other interesting male prospects....so you get to walk away with dignity, instead of being "THAT" girl, you know the one: the girl who hounds her man for a proposal until he dumps her, leaving her alone and devastated while he tells all his friends how "clingy" and "pushy" she was......

The trick, as I guess you''ve figured out by now, is to make it seem to this man as if the whole thing was HIS IDEA.

Most guys WILL do the asking if they fear they''ll lose you...and they''ll ask even FASTER if they perceive that the "you" they will be "losing" is this sought-after social butterfly who couldn''t give a fig if he stays or goes. Men can''t STAND to lose in a competition...and if you make him feel like he has to "compete" against all the fun of being single (and all the guys you''ll meet when you go out without him) he will fall right in line.

Game playing? Maybe a little. But the guys are playing games, too ya know...After all, they are WELL AWARE that as women we have to wait for them to be ready to propose...so they drag it out a little so they feel "chased" by their girlfriends...it''s an ego boost.........

This is also a FABULOUS way to detect whether this guy wants to marry you, or if he just wants "free milk" as the old saying goes, because if he doesn''t react strongly to your newfound "distance" he simply doesn''t love you, and who wants to be with THAT guy?????

GOOD LUCK!!
 
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