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Trump Already Ordered Mueller Fired

AGBF

Super_Ideal_Rock
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Jan. 25, 2018

Excerpts below are from a January 25, 2018 article in "The New York Times" by Michael S. Schmidt and Maggie Haberman

"WASHINGTON — President Trump ordered the firing last June of Robert S. Mueller III, the special counsel overseeing the Russia investigation, according to four people told of the matter, but ultimately backed down after the White House counsel threatened to resign rather than carry out the directive.

The West Wing confrontation marks the first time Mr. Trump is known to have tried to fire the special counsel. Mr. Mueller learned about the episode in recent months as his investigators interviewed current and former senior White House officials in his inquiry into whether the president obstructed justice.

Amid the first wave of news media reports that Mr. Mueller was examining a possible obstruction case, the president began to argue that Mr. Mueller had three conflicts of interest that disqualified him from overseeing the investigation, two of the people said.

(snip)​


After receiving the president’s order to fire Mr. Mueller, the White House counsel, Donald F. McGahn II, refused to ask the Justice Department to dismiss the special counsel, saying he would quit instead, the people said. They spoke on the condition of anonymity because they did not want to be identified discussing a continuing investigation.

Mr. McGahn disagreed with the president’s case and told senior White House officials that firing Mr. Mueller would have a catastrophic effect on Mr. Trump’s presidency. Mr. McGahn also told White House officials that Mr. Trump would not follow through on the dismissal on his own. The president then backed off.

(snip)​

Mr. McGahn, a longtime Republican campaign finance lawyer in Washington who served on the Federal Election Commission, was the top lawyer on Mr. Trump’s campaign. He has been involved in nearly every key decision Mr. Trump has made — like the firing of the former F.B.I. director — that is being scrutinized by Mr. Mueller.

Mr. McGahn was also concerned that firing the special counsel would incite more questions about whether the White House was trying to obstruct the Russia investigation.

Around the time Mr. Trump wanted to fire Mr. Mueller, the president’s legal team, led then by his longtime personal lawyer in New York, Marc E. Kasowitz, was taking an adversarial approach to the Russia investigation. The president’s lawyers were digging into potential conflict-of-interest issues for Mr. Mueller and his team, according to current and former White House officials, and news media reports revealed that several of Mr. Mueller’s prosecutors had donated to Democrats.

Mr. Mueller could not legally have considered political affiliations when making hiring decisions. But for Mr. Trump’s supporters, it reinforced the idea that, although Mr. Mueller is a Republican, he had assembled a team of Democrats to take down the president.

Another option that Mr. Trump considered in discussions with his advisers was dismissing the deputy attorney general, Rod J. Rosenstein, and elevating the department’s No. 3 official, Rachel Brand, to oversee Mr. Mueller. Mr. Rosenstein has overseen the investigation since March, when Attorney General Jeff Sessions recused himself."

Article...https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/25/...ab-top-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
 
Nothing Trump does anymore should shock me, yet I continue to be shocked.

How on earth is this man STILL president? And I still don't understand how he became president in the first place. Aggggg.
 
For those of you old enough to remember...

"The Real World - White House Edition"

Or wait, even better:

"Big Brother - White House Edition"
 
Does he not know that is exactly what Nixon tried to do?? Someone obviously slept through history class.
 
Deb

since you brought up this topic why don't you tell us about the fake dossier and the missing texts.

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo...exts-are-recovered-doj-inspector-general-says

You remind me of Trump, himself, Dancing Fire. If you cannot respond logically and the discussion looks damaging to your point of view, you simply say something, anything, to divert attention from the the point of the discussion.

Naturally I did not "bring up this topic" (the supposedly missing texts). I printed excerpts from a breaking news story about Trump intending to fire Special Counsel Mueller.

One has to ask oneself about your posting, as one does about Trump's tweets, whether it is a deliberate (albeit desperate) attempt to make others stray from the path of reason that causes you to throw obvious red herrings into the conversation, or if it is simply a lack of ability to think logically.

Deb/AGBF
 
You remind me of Trump, himself, Dancing Fire. If you cannot respond logically and the discussion looks damaging to your point of view, you simply say something, anything, to divert attention from the the point of the discussion.

Naturally I did not "bring up this topic" (the supposedly missing texts). I printed excerpts from a breaking news story about Trump intending to fire Special Counsel Mueller.

One has to ask oneself about your posting, as one does about Trump's tweets, whether it is a deliberate (albeit desperate) attempt to make others stray from the path of reason that causes you to throw obvious red herrings into the conversation, or if it is simply a lack of ability to think logically.

Deb/AGBF

Why the need for a choice? There's absolutely no reason it can't be both.
 
This "opinion piece" in "The New York Times" argues that it is Republicans, like McGahn, who need to make it clear to Trump that he cannot fire Special Counsel Robert Mueller.

The author of the piece also makes it clear that McGahn is not a always a defender of liberty or, as he puts it, someone to be lionized. He is simply doing better than many other Republicans at the moment.

"I would caution people not to lionize McGahn. He’s been involved in some of this administration’s seedier acts, including the nomination of unqualified federal-judge candidates, at least one of whom had personal ties to him. He also played a role in previous attempts by the White House to muck up the Russia investigation, including the firing of James Comey as the F.B.I. director.

But McGahn acted honorably and bravely when it mattered most. He flat-out refused an order from his boss, which is never easy, let alone when your boss is the president and the order deals with the most explosive subject in politics. He doesn’t deserve to be lionized, but he does deserve praise.

Unfortunately, other Republicans may soon find themselves facing the same decision as McGahn did. Trump has recently been offering conciliatory words about the investigation, but there is every reason to think he is afraid of it — and willing to do almost anything to obstruct it. Here’s hoping other Republicans show the same courage as McGahn.

Elsewhere, Jonathan Chait writes in New York magazine — even before the news of the June order broke — that Paul Ryan is actively helping Trump undermine the rule of law.
"

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/26/...-left-region&WT.nav=opinion-c-col-left-region
 
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Deb
since you brought up this topic why don't you tell us about the fake dossier and the missing texts.

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo...exts-are-recovered-doj-inspector-general-says

For someone who didn't vote for Trump why do you spend so much of your energy finding cr@p to support the guy? Hillary was the antichrist because of those emails yet Trump can lie, cheat, bribe everyone around him, pay off Russians and Julian Assange to help him win the election, buy off hookers and so on and any time anyone points this out you say but I didn't vote for him and continue to defend him.

I will reiterate I'm not anti conservative, vote for any other decent conservative that you want and I won't say a thing - but I am against having a narcissistic jackass as your president.
 
For someone who didn't vote for Trump why do you spend so much of your energy finding cr@p to support the guy? Hillary was the antichrist because of those emails yet Trump can lie, cheat, bribe everyone around him, pay off Russians and Julian Assange to help him win the election, buy off hookers and so on and any time anyone points this out you say but I didn't vote for him and continue to defend him.

I’ve wondered the same thing for a year now @arkieb1
 
I will reiterate I'm not anti conservative, vote for any other decent conservative that you want and I won't say a thing - but I am against having a narcissistic jackass as your president.
Since this jackass became POTUS...
#1-The stock market is at record high. 401K is rising.
#2-More Americans are back to work b/c more jobs are returning from abroad.
#3-Americans are receiving bonuses + higher wages per hr.
#4-ISIS is 90% destroyed.
#5-Our economy is strong.
I know, I know ...all these are horrible news for Dems.
 
Naturally I did not "bring up this topic" (the supposedly missing texts). I printed excerpts from a breaking news story about Trump intending to fire Special Counsel Mueller.
Deb. There would be no Mueller w/o the fake dossier from the HRC camp.
 
Deb. There would be no Mueller w/o the fake dossier from the HRC camp.

So you are saying that without Steele, Trump would have gotten away with his collusion? Because George Papadopoulos having already told the Australians about it and their already having told the FBI wouldn't have been enough to alert the United States to what Trump was up to? We needed the Steele Dossier? Thank goodness we got it, then. Too bad you don't have more faith in our friends the Australians, though. I think they are a pretty great crowd. ;))
 
Since this jackass became POTUS...
#1-The stock market is at record high. 401K is rising.
#2-More Americans are back to work b/c more jobs are returning from abroad.
#3-Americans are receiving bonuses + higher wages per hr.
#4-ISIS is 90% destroyed.
#5-Our economy is strong.
I know, I know ...all these are horrible news for Dems.

# 1 - The stock market is cyclical if it has a crash or severe downturn on Trumps watch will you actually blame him for that or are you still going to say that magically that was somehow Obama's fault? Historically the GFC was caused by conservative governments in the US.

#2 - Statistically job creation was rising at the end of Obama's presidency. Your economy picked up slightly. I grant you that restricting trade agreements and protectionism short term can indeed create more jobs, in the long term however it will create more conditions that can potentially cause another GFC. Google basic economic principles of why protectionism for a country your size is a bad thing and perhaps learn something.

#3 - Americans should receive higher wages per hour I totally agree with that. Given the fact Trump has a documented history of underpaying his own workers over a large period of time I sincerely doubt this has much to do with his own personal values in what he wants to achieve as president. Read parts of Fire and Fury - everyone that works with Trump says the place is a glorified sh@tshow.

#4 - Trump's stance in Israel is currently stirring up more anti US sentiment and hatred than less IMHO. ISIS is becoming stronger in parts of Asia and reforming according the the national intel they are publishing.

#5 - Your economy is strong compared to what? I've read extensive economic forecasters saying you are heading for another economic crash/crisis hopefully it will happen under Trump's watch so people like you can get your head out of your own backsides and admit that other than stroking his own ego people like Trump who have limited to no political or economic experience other than bullying and bribing people should not be given the keys to the White House.
 
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The only thing that can/will cause the stock market to crash is higher interest rates which i'd believe it'll happen sooner rather than later.
 
i saw where he tried to fire mueller in june on the news too. Im surprised it is just now coming out. He makes everyone around him a worse person. I hope his wife is able to find a nice man who will treat her with respect.
It doesnt surprise me he tried to fire mueller. he has never been a good human who has respect for the laws or the country or the constitution.

he cares only for himself .

Every day trump is allowed to defile the presidency and embarass the nation with his blatant disregard for truth, and decency the country becomes less of a beacon to all humanity and becomes one step closer to being a morally void land that is focused on wealth and supporting corruption at the expence of everything else.
I truly hope we can soon be rid of the vapid narscissist and try to get the country back to a future that doesnt make respectable people shudder. While i do not agree with much of the democrats agenda, i dont worry they will start a nuclear war or deliberately hurt other nations just to be classless egomaniacs. If they will stand for decency - they will have my support . We need civility. We need to have a leader who can be respected.
Republicans do not have much time left to stop this train before they all go off the cliff with him and trump is on the track to take them all down.
 
The only thing that can/will cause the stock market to crash is higher interest rates which i'd believe it'll happen sooner rather than later.

And what exactly do you think causes higher interest rates? Are you going to blame Obama for them too? Rising interest rates are again a product or tool of economic management, as the supply of credit increases (which can be cause by things like lifting regulations for banks which I believe Trump has done). Credit available in the economy decreases and lenders decide to defer loans, every day Mum and Dads at home have less available income to spend on things like food and goods and services which then has the knock on effect that impacts the housing market and economic growth because people have less disposable incomes. The stock market panics and again investor become more bullish and less balanced or bearish.

I dunno DF for someone that seems to live for stock market gains you seem to want to ignore basic economic principles 101. Blame Obama for years of mismanagement when as far as I can see he was climbing out of a GFC that Bush created, and now support Trump because you are sitting at home lining your own pockets because for now the stock market is up and your kids have jobs, yet you cannot see the long damage this imbecile is creating.

If you had a conservative government that actually knew how to manage the US economy that would be one thing and I'm sure Trump has a few advisers that do, but I'd be concerned that he is more obsessed with making populist short term decisions that make him look like some kind of tough golden guy and his own personal image than actually running the country properly or implementing some hard long term strategies that will actually lead you long term out of debt in any sustainable fashion. The guy couldn't manage his own companies without going bankrupt several times, and the Australian government will never allow him to open casinos or get licenses to start any business here because of his known ties to the Mafia and known levels of corruption.

For a guy that was so bent out of shape about those emails, perhaps you should be concerned that this piece of human garbage should not be running any country.
 
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I don't know why anyone is surprised he thought about firing Mueller. He thinks the entire investigation is a witch hunt. Just like the other one thought hers was. Mueller wasn't fired and the investigation continues. We'll see what happens in the end.

I'd venture to say if she had won there would be no investigation.
 
Since this jackass became POTUS...

#1-The stock market is at record high. 401K is rising.

When President Obama took office on Jan. 20, 2009, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) slumped to 7,949.09, the lowest inaugural performance for the Dow since its creation.

As of the end of Obama's term on January 20, 2017, the Dow Jones had more than recovered from its January 2009 slump, resting nicely at 19,732.40 for the day, more than double what it was on inauguration day. More importantly, it had maintained a healthy range of 15,660 and 19,974 in 2016. Though there have been intermittent downturns, the Dow's general upward trend speaks well for the Obama administration's efforts at economic recovery.

/www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/101314/where-was-dow-jones-when-obama-took-office.asp

#2-More Americans are back to work b/c more jobs are returning from abroad.

TOURISM TANKS UNDER TRUMP, COSTING AMERICA 40,000 JOBS, REPORT FINDS

http://www.newsweek.com/tourism-tanks-under-trump-costs-america-40000-jobs-report-finds-789452


#3-Americans are receiving bonuses + higher wages per hr.

https://thinkprogress.org/a-chart-a...te-house-doesnt-want-you-to-see-a8cb80a659c5/

You over estimate this and these companies are pulling in HUGE cuts that they are not sharing. Not many companies are raising salaries right now.

#4-ISIS is 90% destroyed.

Obama’s ISIS policy is working for Trump

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-is-working-for-trump/?utm_term=.0d6ee011ba52


There’s a middle ground between going all in and getting all the way out in Iraq and Syria. Obama struck that balance and Trump has stuck with it.

Trump had very little with destroying ISIS DF.. I don't know why you keep saying this???

#5-Our economy is strong.

http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/05/news/economy/trump-obama-jobs/index.html

Employers added more than 2 million jobs during 2017, making it a very good year for Donald Trump's first in office.

But it's not quite as good as Barack Obama's last year on the job.

Trump wasn't in office yet when the Labor Department collected the data used in January 2017 jobs report, so for the sake of comparison it makes sense to exclude the first month of the year. But in the remaining 11 monthly jobs reports, employers added 1.84 million jobs, according to the December jobs report released Friday. That compares to 2.09 million jobs added in Obama's last 11 months in office.

I know, I know ...all these are horrible news for Dems.

Not horrible, but not exceptional.. it's like you sat thru Obama's tenure and just read some alternate universe websites.
 
@ Tekate - but according to DF Obama did everything wrong (despite Bush largely causing the GFC) and Trump is now doing everything right. He seems to wish to overlook that economics is cyclical and economic measures (including ones made on both political sides) can take years to actually fully impact those economies...

The GFC didn't magically happen overnight despite what people think, nor do stock market crashes and rising interest rates - they are all things that have occurred or will occur due to a complex set of economic conditions created largely by a number of factors and how well or how badly those conditions are managed by governments.

Irrespective of which side of politics I prefer my axe to grind here isn't who can best manage your economy it is that Trump is by in large an incredibly inappropriate choice for the leader of the free world.
 
And what exactly do you think causes higher interest rates? Are you going to blame Obama for them too?
No it would never happen under a slow growth Obama policy, but now that our economy is booming which can cause hyperinflation, inflation brings higher interest rates.
 
@ Tekate - but according to DF Obama did everything wrong (despite Bush largely causing the GFC) and Trump is now doing everything right. He seems to wish to overlook that economics is cyclical and economic measures (including ones made on both political sides) can take years to actually fully impact those economies...
Oh, i'd agree no matter which party is in power our economy is cyclical. During Obama's last two yrs he should have taken the advantage of our upcycle economy, had he done that Trump wouldn't be POTUS today. Hillary's Email and corruption was only part of the reason she lost the election.The other reason is b/c she ran on a 3rd term of Obama policies.
 
I don't know why anyone is surprised he thought about firing Mueller. He thinks the entire investigation is a witch hunt. Just like the other one thought hers was. Mueller wasn't fired and the investigation continues. We'll see what happens in the end.

I'd venture to say if she had won there would be no investigation.

It is my understanding that thinking about firing Mueller and sending out the order to have him fired are two different actions.
 
It is my understanding that thinking about firing Mueller and sending out the order to have him fired are two different actions.
It is my understanding that it was a discussion in a meeting that included talk of firing him. I have issues with what appears to be hinky crap by partisans in the DOJ and FBI. I am surprised that people have not lost their jobs.
 
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It would be very foolish of Trump to fire Mueller if he have nothing to hide.
 
I have issues with what appears to be hinky crap by partisans in the DOJ and FBI. I am surprised that people have not lost their jobs.

Please explain what you mean by "hinky crap by partisans in the DOJ and FBI". I can honestly say I am unaware of anything at all "hinky" going on in the FBI or the DOJ, but I am interested in your perception.

Deb
 
Please explain what you mean by "hinky crap by partisans in the DOJ and FBI". I can honestly say I am unaware of anything at all "hinky" going on in the FBI or the DOJ, but I am interested in your perception.

Deb
Peter Strok and Lisa Page who were removed by Mueller. Hopefully the IG report from Horowitz will shed some light.
 
Peter Strok and Lisa Page who were removed by Mueller. Hopefully the IG report from Horowitz will shed some light.

If that is all you are talking about I think you are being silly. Those two agents were friends and having an affair. They were simply chatting about their opinions, which they had and have a right to do as American citizens. Nothing sinister is going on at the FBI. If you need that proven to you, by all means wait for the report from Horowitz.
 
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