To J or not to J...Please help!

[shamrock1228]

This is my first post on pricescope!! My soon to be fiance and I went ring shopping and picked out a setting that we love, but now we are just trying to choose a diamond. I didn't know this process would be so stressful!

We originally chose a 1.30 carat round brilliant diamond, ideal cut, SI2, J in color, strong fluoresence. I was a little concerned with the stone being a J in color, but I loved everything else about it. It had tons of fire and brilliance. It did have a small inclusion that was on a corner but it would be covered with a prong. My concern with the stone being a J in color, was the fact that the side stones on the setting are F-G in color. I was worried that they would have an obvious color difference. Before the jeweler actually set the diamond, he had me come in and look at the stone just sitting in the setting. When I took it outside, it looked fine, but inside the store, at certain angles, in certain lights, it looked slightly yellow.

The jeweler is holding that stone for me, but also ordered in 3 more stones for me to look at, one imparticular that he really likes. The only problem is the one that he thinks is an awesome stone is $1100 more than the original one that we chose. It is still within our budget, but I just want to know if you guys think it's worth the extra money. The stone we are talking about is a 1.13 carat round brilliant, ideal cut, SI1, G in color, no fluoresence. Is a 3 color grade and 1 clarity grade jump worth an extra $1100, even though we are going down slightly in carat weight (which is not an issue to me by the way).

Also, all stones are EGL USA certified. My cousin works for the jeweler and he seems to be giving us a pretty good deal...I think...

What do you think??? Thanks in advance

 

[shamrock1228]

Here is a picture of the setting so you can see what I'm working with...The center stone in the pictures is not a diamond, just a placeholder stone if you will

 

[TRIALnERROR]

This is my first post on pricescope!! My soon to be fiance and I went ring shopping and picked out a setting that we love, but now we are just trying to choose a diamond. I didn't know this process would be so stressful!

We originally chose a 1.30 carat round brilliant diamond, ideal cut, SI2, J in color, strong fluoresence. I was a little concerned with the stone being a J in color, but I loved everything else about it. It had tons of fire and brilliance. It did have a small inclusion that was on a corner but it would be covered with a prong. My concern with the stone being a J in color, was the fact that the side stones on the setting are F-G in color. I was worried that they would have an obvious color difference. Before the jeweler actually set the diamond, he had me come in and look at the stone just sitting in the setting. When I took it outside, it looked fine, but inside the store, at certain angles, in certain lights, it looked slightly yellow.

The jeweler is holding that stone for me, but also ordered in 3 more stones for me to look at, one imparticular that he really likes. The only problem is the one that he thinks is an awesome stone is $1100 more than the original one that we chose. It is still within our budget, but I just want to know if you guys think it's worth the extra money. The stone we are talking about is a 1.13 carat round brilliant, ideal cut, SI1, G in color, no fluoresence. Is a 3 color grade and 1 clarity grade jump worth an extra $1100, even though we are going down slightly in carat weight (which is not an issue to me by the way).

Also, all stones are EGL USA certified. My cousin works for the jeweler and he seems to be giving us a pretty good deal...I think...

What do you think??? Thanks in advance

I think most, if not all, would recommend only either GIA or AGS stones. EGL is notorious for soft-grading, so it's very difficult to say whether or not you're getting a good deal. For example, an EGS J could be graded as low as a GIA M or worse... Is your cousin able to access GIA or AGS diamonds? If not, your best bet will likely be to work with a recommended online vendor like James Allen, White Flash, Good Old Gold, IDjewelryonline, etc. Here is an example of a similar GIA stone:

http://www.jamesallen.com/diamonds/I-SI1-Excellent-Cut-Round-Diamond-1492353.asp

 

[shamrock1228]

I don't know much about diamonds, but the previous diamond alone is almost $2000 more than we paid for the 1.30 carat J stone, setting and the wedding band including sales tax.

My cousin just works for the jeweler, but she sells Pandora and nothing else. He does have access to GIA stones, but he told me that we would save more money going with an EGL USA certified stone. He is GIA certified (or whatever you call it) so he has been pretty honest with me about grades being off, etc. There was one EGL stone that we looked at that he said absolutely not because he felt it was way off.

 

[TRIALnERROR]

I don't know much about diamonds, but that diamond alone is almost $2000 more than we paid for the 1.30 carat J stone, setting and the wedding band including sales tax.

Diamonds are like anything else... You get what you pay for. I suggest searching these forums and getting as informed as possible before making a decision. As long as you are happy, that is all that matters.

TampaBull recently posted some excellent tips:


"Post by tampabull » 15 Jul 2012 14:01
Assuming you're looking at Round Brilliant since you didn't mention a different shape, here are a few notes from my search (same budget as you, just purchased a diamond 3 days ago).

For starters, I would recommend, as would the rest of this forum, that you only consider GIA or AGS certified stones.

1. Cut: Most would recommend that you consider only GIA Excellent cut, or AGS 0 cut stones. The cut is definitely the most important and will make the biggest difference in the way the stone looks.

1a. Aside from the "Cut Grade" from the certificate, you should look closely at the Depth %, Table %, Crown Angle and Pavilion Angle. These 4 factors can be plugged into the Holloway Cut Advisor or "HCA" for an estimate of the stone's light performance. You can find it under the "Tools" tab at the top right of the forum page. I used the HCA as a point of differentiation, automatically throwing out anything +2 (my preference, others would consider a GIA Ex, or AGS 0 that was slightly over 2 on the HCA, which you could also argue is fine in some cases).

2. Carat There are two factors here that will be important. One is the actual Carat measurement, the other is the actual size in mm. Two different 1 carat stones might "face up" very differently size-wise depending on how deep or shallow they are cut. If you're sticking within the Cut guidelines above, most should be close, but when you're down to the last few options sometimes that extra .1mm might be the quality that sets one stone above the other.

As far as what Carat to choose for your girlfriend, I determined this largely on budget, but also on looks. I just chose a 1.5 for my girlfriend who is a 5.5 size ring, I personally think that would look nice on your girlfriend's size 4.5 as well, and by choosing 1.5 as my size benchmark it allowed me to keep from compromising too much on the other qualities (Don't get caught up trying to go too big and end up with a stone that doesn't perform well. You wouldn't want her running around with a 2ct that dulls in comparison to her friend's 1.5 that was the same price!).

3. Color Most consider the "sweet spot" for value between G and J colors. If you're exceptionally sensitive to color, something above G might be up your alley. People who aren't very color sensitive find that a compromise to J color can allow them to get a diamond that's bigger, clearer, or better cut while staying in their budget. I started looking at H stones only, but ended up with an I that I'm very happy with.

The thing to also consider here, is that the majority of stones that you'll see out and about aren't D-F stones. When you see an H compared to a D, you can see some color, but the odds of that happening while she wears the stone isn't very likely. It's much more common for her and her friends all to have D-F stones and you can't really tell the difference.

Here's a helpful video on color: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcmSj8dOLRI

Another interesting topic is Fluorescence, which you can google for an explanation. Some say that Faint - Medium blue fluorescence helps offset the faint yellow tint of an I+ colored stone (although I don't think this is 100% proven?). I compromised to an I stone with Faint Blue Fluoro, and I think it looks very white.

4. Clarity Like color, there is a "sweet spot" for value in clarity, and most say it's somewhere between VS2-SI2. When you go higher than VS2 you're paying for clarity that you can't see with the naked eye anyway. When you go lower than SI2 you are talking about stones with easily seen inclusions and I would recommend compromising in another area before going that route. In the SI1-SI2 range you want what's called an "eye clean" stone, which means that you can't see the inclusions with the naked eye. This is accomplished by finding a stone with small inclusions (as opposed to large crystals or something), and inclusions that aren't directly under the table of the diamond (the flat part in the center). Inclusions are less-easily seen when they're outside of the table.

I chose an SI1 stone because trying to find an SI2 that was eye clean stressed me out. Rather than fret over the inclusions I decided to just step up top an SI1 (still need to find an eye clean stone, but it's a little easier because the inclusions are smaller and/or less frequent).




Hope that helps, you caught me at a bored moment so I thought I'd try to "pay it forward" and give someone some good info since I received so much from this site. As a frame of reference, I started my search 2.5 weeks ago, and just typed that whole thing without reference material. So hopefully in a few weeks you'll be confident enough to make the purchase!"

 

[Dreamer_D]

With round brilliant cuts, EGL stones only seem like they cost less than GIA stones. In reality, EGL stones trade for *more* with the EGL report than the same stone would sell for with a GIA report. So it is in your best interests to buy a stone with an honest report. You actually pay less for what you get, with a GIA report.

And I don't typically recommend buying diamonds from friends or friends of friends or friends of family. Mixibg business with freindship seems to often end badly from what we see here on PS.

 

[TRIALnERROR]

I don't know much about diamonds, but the previous diamond alone is almost $2000 more than we paid for the 1.30 carat J stone, setting and the wedding band including sales tax.

My cousin just works for the jeweler, but she sells Pandora and nothing else. He does have access to GIA stones, but he told me that we would save more money going with an EGL USA certified stone. He is GIA certified (or whatever you call it) so he has been pretty honest with me about grades being off, etc. There was one EGL stone that we looked at that he said absolutely not because he felt it was way off.

GIA doesn't certify anything, including diamonds or people. Directly from GIA website: "It is incorrect to state that students, graduates, their businesses, or particular gemstones are "certified" by GIA. GIA does not "certify" anyone or anything. Neither a student nor a graduate who has been awarded a certificate or diploma, nor a gem which has been graded or identified by GIA has been "certified" by GIA."

In my opinion, if a stone is graded by EGL, there is a reason. Otherwise, it would be sent to GIA.

 

[yssie]

With round brilliant cuts, EGL stones only seem like they cost less than GIA stones. In reality, EGL stones trade for *more* with the EGL report than the same stone would sell for with a GIA report. So it is in your best interests to buy a stone with an honest report. You actually pay less for what you get, with a GIA report.

Ditto.

In my opinion, if a stone is graded by EGL, there is a reason. Otherwise, it would be sent to GIA.

And ditto.

 

[MissGotRocks]

The chances that the EGL J stone is on par colorwise with a GIA or AGS J is slim to none. The stone is most likely cheaper than a GIA/AGS graded stone for a reason. Do not be swayed from this line of thinking - it is simply true. You absolutely get what you pay for and nothing more.

A larger stone will generally show more color than the melee in your setting. Whether or not it is apparent enough to you to be a turn off is a question that only you can answer. Some folks are more color sensitive than others; it really is a matter of personal preference. Diamonds will look different in outside daylight than they will in interior rooms with lighting. They are reflectors and will reflect the color around them. If the yellow tone seen in the store bothers you, pass it up. Chances are that it will continue to bother you and become worse, not better.

I would go to another source and view some GIA/AGS graded stones if at all possible. Those are more true to color grading due to stricter parameters. I can only second everyone's advice to not mix business with family or friends. Those arrangements seldom turn out to be good ones.

If going with a smaller or more expensive stone means getting a color and cut combination that you love, it is well worth it IMO. That stone will always be more eye pleasing to you than settling for a larger, less desireable diamond.