Til' Debt Do Us Part (NY Times Article)

[FrekeChild]

My overly educated husband has around $30k in debt. Student loan debt. Will he ever make fabulous money to show for it? Doubtful.

He also should have about $100k in medical debt (open heart surgery 4 years ago) but thank goodness for us, his cardiologist and surgeon waived their fees and did his surgery pro bono.

He also had about $6k in credit card debt. Not from buying stupid stuff he didn't need, like TVs, flashy cars or something else frivolous, but from tuition, textbooks, related educational costs and the cost of living directly after he had his surgery, when he was laid up and couldn't lift more than 5 pounds.

I knew about everything before we got engaged.

Would I like it if he had sprung this on me after getting engaged? Heck no! But if he had spent all of that money on stupid stuff? I'd really have to think twice about his values and if I wanted to be married to those values for the rest of my life. There are $1k mistakes and $25k mistakes and $100k mistakes. I think that everyone has their own tolerance level.

Better to at least know about it before you get married rather than after right?

 

[random_thought]

I married dh knowing he had over 100k in student loans because I love him and him I with about 10k in various debts car, credit, etc). There is more to life than money and we will work our way through this as we have other things

My DH had a decent amount of debt from being laid off, but I had some, too. So we found our own solution for it.

My problem with debt for student loans would be if he didn't have a really brilliant job with fabulous income to show for it. Where did the hypothetical 100k go if he isn't making bank afterward?

But to be realistic, not a lot of people are gonna have really brilliant jobs upon coming out of school. Some of them have to work hard towards it as well which is what we are both having to do, and also which doesn't bother us. I'd rather not just have it handed to me personally...

 

[Dancing Fire]

I would never be with someone who is fiscally irresponsible, much less marry someone like it. I've work too damn hard to keep my credit score near perfect, have zero debt, and a substantial retirement savings, a good stock portfolio, and a good savings account to have it tarnished by someone else. While I understand that love is important, being fiscally irresponsible = character flaw = dealbreaker.

agree with FK...

 

[stephbolt]

DH has around 70K in student loans from law school, which I was fully aware of when we got married. Although I sometimes wish we didn't have those payments every month, I know the current and future earning potential it has given him is well worth it. He also has some credit card debt (from living expenses during and right after law school) and an auto loan. I have an auto loan as well.

When we started talking about moving in together and getting engaged, we laid out all of our financial details on the table to figure out how we would manage a budget moving forward. I'm ok with DH's debt because he was so forthcoming about it, and because we agree that it's a priority to pay it off on an accelerated schedule.

I think going into debt for an education is sometimes unavoidable, and in today's world it's hard to get anywhere without at least a bachelor's degree. But, there's plenty of different ways to get that degree. The difference between a private vs. public college, or an out of state vs. in state one, could be the difference between being 30K in debt vs. 100K+ in debt. Most 17 and 18 year olds aren't going to see that though, they are just going to see what school they like.

 

[elrohwen]

I married dh knowing he had over 100k in student loans because I love him and him I with about 10k in various debts car, credit, etc). There is more to life than money and we will work our way through this as we have other things

My DH had a decent amount of debt from being laid off, but I had some, too. So we found our own solution for it.

My problem with debt for student loans would be if he didn't have a really brilliant job with fabulous income to show for it. Where did the hypothetical 100k go if he isn't making bank afterward?

But to be realistic, not a lot of people are gonna have really brilliant jobs upon coming out of school. Some of them have to work hard towards it as well which is what we are both having to do, and also which doesn't bother us. I'd rather not just have it handed to me personally...

I have to agree with MonkeyPie on this one - what's the point of $100k in student loans if you're not going to make a great salary afterwards? Why not go to a more reasonably priced college that could have got you the same job anyway?

And I wouldn't say those who make high salaries have anything handed to them - doctors works their butts off for those high salaries, but at least they're making enough to pay back the student loans eventually. I wouldn't want the same debt on 1/5 the salary.

 

[megumic]

I married my husband for love, and now we're working on his credit. No regrets.

This. Although my FI has no debt, love is so much more than money, no matter if it's in the clear or in the red.

 

[elrohwen]

I realized I never answered the question. I did marry someone with some college debt, around $40k, though he got a great job out of school to pay it off. Just a few years later and we're down to less than $25k. I graduated with no debt, because my mom wouldn't let me attend a school that required me to graduated with debt (some family members were nice enough to step in and help pay for my expensive education - otherwise I would've gone to a state school, which would've been fine as well). DH also had a car loan, but I think that's typical. It's already paid off.

I would absolutely hesitate to marry someone with over $100k in student loans, unless they were acquired in law or med school with a high paying job to back them up. I think $100k for undergrad, unless you're going into a high paying field, is irresponsible and I wouldn't want to be saddled with that kind of debt for 20 years. I don't know if I could call off a wedding if I found this out at the last minute, but I would be extremely hurt by a FI keeping this from me until right before the wedding.

 

[purselover]

I married dh knowing he had over 100k in student loans because I love him and him I with about 10k in various debts car, credit, etc). There is more to life than money and we will work our way through this as we have other things

My DH had a decent amount of debt from being laid off, but I had some, too. So we found our own solution for it.

My problem with debt for student loans would be if he didn't have a really brilliant job with fabulous income to show for it. Where did the hypothetical 100k go if he isn't making bank afterward?

But to be realistic, not a lot of people are gonna have really brilliant jobs upon coming out of school. Some of them have to work hard towards it as well which is what we are both having to do, and also which doesn't bother us. I'd rather not just have it handed to me personally...

I have to agree with MonkeyPie on this one - what's the point of $100k in student loans if you're not going to make a great salary afterwards? Why not go to a more reasonably priced college that could have got you the same job anyway?

And I wouldn't say those who make high salaries have anything handed to them - doctors works their butts off for those high salaries, but at least they're making enough to pay back the student loans eventually. I wouldn't want the same debt on 1/5 the salary.

I completely agree, DH will owe about $120-$140 when he graduates law school in May, but he's already been offered a job that will allow us to pay that off in a few years. That makes it well worth the cost in our opinion, and I know he never would've taken out all those loans if there weren't really good job prospects after.

 

[purselover]

To comment on the article no I never would have married DH if he had any amount of debt that he wouldn't be able to pay off in a few years. Like it or not money is a major topic in a marriage and I could never be with someone who didn't manage money well. I refuse to pay (literally and figuratively) for others mistakes.

 

[PilsnPinkysMom]

My husband brought 170k in student loan debt to our marriage and when all is said and done, I will have ~80k. I wouldn't change a thing. No regrets. He is the breadwinner and I am a full-time grad student, and he has graciously paid for both of our debts. His 6 years of school was costly, but allowed him to have a career he adores. And that career allows us to channel a lot of extra money into our student loans.

What we've learned? We hope to save as much as we possibly can to pay for our kids' college educations so that they don't enter the working world with substantial student loan debt.

ETA: I guess I'm 'okay' with it because DH was getting his PharmD. If he was getting his BS in Political Science it'd be another story... But I still can't imagine life without him, so we'd have to find a way to make it work.

 

[NovemberBride]

I have a law degree and my husband has an MBA, both from top programs. We both have no debt from undergrad (I went to a state school that my parents paid for, he had a full academic scholarship). When we started out we had about $150k in loans between us and now we're down to about $100k after 3 years of paying down aggressively. We are lucky to have well paying jobs that enable us to pay back our loans. For our careers, there was no way to achieve our dreams other than to incur debt. We did not have any wealthy relatives offering to pick up the tab. Going to a state school was not an option because we would not have the job opportunities and earning power we have now - the top companies in our fields only hire graduates of the very top programs. Full-time law students are not allowed to work, but I did work during the summers and earned money which reduced the amount of loans I needed. DH worked and attended school at night, also reducing the loans he needed. We both had no problems with the debt, since we had similar views on finances and similar goals. Our increased earnings as a result of these degrees more than makes up for the student loan payments. We could pay them off today if we wanted to, but we choose not to because they are fixed at such low rates.

 

[princesss]

Love is more than money, but life is more than love. Perhaps I'm too practical and not romantic enough about relationships, but I couldn't respect somebody who consistantly made unwise financial decisions (either by accruing major frivolous debt, or by being unwilling to pay it down aggressively), and I refuse to spend my life with somebody I don't respect. Obviously we all have different tolerances, and I respect those of you who are willing to tighten your belts to be with your partner. I think it's easier for me to think this way because I don't have a serious SO right now and am free to choose not to remain involved with somebody with major debt. I do have student loans that I am paying off, but I just couldn't bring myself to help finance somebody else's desire to live above their means (which, to me, is what helping pay off somebody's debt is doing).

No matter what, I think it's important that both partners be on the same page about their financial situation, and as long as you're doing what works for your relationship, more power to you.

 

[rosetta]

I agree with princess 100%

Also, that's some crazy amounts of debt for school you guys rack up in the US (British education is cheap as chips in comparison) I'm sure it's completely necessary though, but wow!

 

[Haven]

This is a tough one, and I agree with those who said that they would probably walk away from a very new relationship upon learning about huge debts. However, once you get very close to someone, I imagine it's harder to say "Sorry, but you have a lot of debt and that's a deal breaker." I'm just thinking of my own husband and what I would have done a year into the relationship if I suddenly learned he had been hiding huge debt. I loved him so much at that point, and knew that I wanted to be with him for a long time, so it's a tough situation.

On the other hand, racking up huge amounts of debt goes against my fundamental beliefs about money. I turned down admittance into some top laws schools in order to attend a law school with a bit less prestige because they offered me a full scholarship. I did pay for my first master's using student loans which I paid off very quickly because it wasn't much, and my second master's was paid for entirely by my former employer. While I *needed* those master's degrees to pursue my dream job, I made them happen for myself without racking up debts that would haunt me for years. I don't know if I would be comfortable being with someone who didn't do the same.

I can definitively say that I would walk away from a relationship with someone who racked up debt buying "things" because that would just be a sign that we don't really have the same values, so it wouldn't work, anyway.

 

[Dancing Fire]

I married my husband for love, and now we're working on his credit. No regrets.

This. Although my FI has no debt, love is so much more than money, no matter if it's in the clear or in the red.

but love ain't gonna payoff the $100K debt. ..

 

[Imdanny]

I found the reader comments to be intriguing, but a bit depressing: there seems to be a strong belief in operation that liberal arts degrees are now the purview of the independently wealthy. As a corollary to that, there's the belief that women, specifically, are getting these degrees in the belief that some dude will come along to rescue them from their "magical thinking" ... and that's before we even get into the deeply weird commentators out there who use every. single. article. related to marriage to tell people not to do it, and how they now only date women from other countries because American women are so entitled.

I swear, the comments sections on NYT pieces are like seething pits of national neuroses.

Yes, it's true about the NYT.

They always write these weird stories where you can't seem to make heads or tails of the actual events and motivations in the narrative and often these stories are about people who have more money than anyone would ever need, or more debt than can be believed, or live one $1 a day and love their life.

I think their articles about people and money are very strange.

 

[MonkeyPie]

So I am going to share something here, because everyone seems so against debt.

My husband and I each had about 3k in debt apiece when we met. He had lost a job and had to let a car get repossessed, I made a teenage mistake of co-signing on a car that also got repossessed. It wasn't really "bad" debt - we both had them on credit cards so we could pay them off as we were able. We both got amazing jobs paying us really well, so since we were recently married, I sold my old car and got a new one. And what happened? I took a paycut, he lost his job. We built up a huge amount of debt because of this. During this time, he was in school to be a lab tech, and got meningitis and they didn't let him return after missing a month of school. More debt.

We found our solution to it, and are now debt-free.

I would consider that not everything goes as planned, no matter how well you try to make things work. Being all self-righteous about it and assuming that just because they bought a big screen tv that is now part of their debt means that a person is irresponsible is just folly.

 

[Arkteia]

You know, and I am not surprized by 170 K for photography at all.

I have a distant acquaintance, who is an amazing photographer. He planned to apply to NYU for BA in photography, they have a very good program, but a yearly tuition is $ 50 k. Given the fact that he would have to live in NYC, room and board and everything else... he realized he could not afford it. He is very money-savvy but would have ended with the same amount of debt if he graduated from NYU. We do not know where this girl got her degree, do we? Good education in photography can be very expensive.

I, too, did not like reader's comment. What did he mention, Ph.D., M.D. and M.A.? I bet if this girl worked as a photographer at top-notch fashion magazine he would not be so snobbish. Nor would her fiance leave her. She just could not turn her education into a money-making business, tough luck!

And there is something in comparing the situation of these two women, one of whom is going to be a doctor and no doubt, pay off her medical bills, and the other one has an uncertain future and a mass of bills which she will likely not pay off, that rubs me the wrong way.

I liked reading through Freke's post. A young woman who marries a man with huge debt in medical bills deserves respect.