Teen High School Common Core Math RANT

[autumngems]

Ok, I just need to vent!
My teen is a Junior and she is failing Math 3, this Common Core is rediculous!!!!! More than half of her class is failing. We had a student teacher meeting last week (I asked the prinicpal to attend as well) because she has been complaining that the teacher doesn't explain, she just has them copy things from the board. She talks terribly to the kids and gets mad when they ask questions. My daughter was a crying a mess at the meeting.

Should tell you something when only 4 kids in the class turn in homework because nobody understood it. My daughter has a 54 in this class, Others have 23, 37, 28, 29 to list a few. I even have her in a Math Support class that isn't helping because that teacher is just as bad.

I am at my wits end.

 

[House Cat]

I wondered if high school kids were doing CC. Can you look up what she is doing on YouTube? It has been our lifesaver whenever we get lost. My son is only in the 5th grade but we always find several videos of teachers performing the various concepts that my son needs to learn. Hopefully your daughter can find examples too.

 

[AprilBaby]

Enough of the stupidity. Go back to regular math!!

 

[lambskin]

In my area, math is getting pushed up-meaning the goal is not to have the freshmen start with Algerbra 1. Algebra 1 is taught in the 8th grade so the first math class in high school is Geometry. Then Sophomore year, Algebra 2. I do not know what is the reason for this as no one from any school or administration has explained this change. Both my 7th and 8th graders are studing high school Algebra. During grade school they both blasted through the basics (getting A's) and, frankly, mess up on simple division, multiplication and fractions. I can not do any math so I am unable to really grasp the overall impact the new core curriculum is mandating as they have far exceeded my math level. But I really do believe that math is important and should be studied. I have also observed that there is so much independent math tutoring for high schoolers. I went to high school in the mid 1970s and only two years of math (Algebra and Geometry) were required for college prep. The smart kids took Calculus and Trig. which was taught in Junior or Senior years. If any student was having problems, they stayed after school with the teacher and got some help. That was all that was needed. My father (a CPA) helped me through Algebra and Geometry but I wonder if he could have done the higher level math that I see the kids take today in high school. Fellow parents-college and post grads- complain that they can not help their kids. Interestingly, as the math is getting tougher and more difficult in high school, the English requirements seem to be getting more lax or ignored. Ever read a high school term paper? Grammar, spelling and syntax are not what they used to be. My brother in law was a college English professor and said that the level of his students was about junior high or below. I know that each child and school is different but I do not like the trend. Don't get me started on Common Core....

 

[packrat]

hahahahaha ahhhhhh the joys of people deciding what and how to teach when they don't know anything about education or children or how minds work. It's grand.

We had a staff meeting a couple weeks ago and if there was a staff member in that room NOT doing this: I would be shocked.

We learned the 3rd graders are to type a paragraph, on the computer. And they have X amount of time to do it. One of the teachers said "Um, are we going to teach them how to type?" and the response was "No." They're not going to write it out beforehand, they're going to sit down at a computer and type it, on their own, in X time, end of story. And if they can't do it, well, then that means they need extra help. We're not going to tell them even what the paragraph should be about. "Sit down and type me a paragraph"

THIS is not going to get us off the SINA (School In Need of Assistance) list. No.

When I go to get my moolatte and the kid behind the counter can't count back in his head that I get .41 back from my $5 bill on a 4.59 moolatte, and instead has to pull out a piece of paper and make tally marks or make those stupid arc jump things .1 to get 4.60 and then .10 to 4.70 and then .10 to 4.80 and then .10 to 4.90 and then .10 to 5, I'm going to slide over that counter and count that shit out myself. In my head.

 

[Lady_Disdain]

That sounds like the teacher is the problem, not Common Core. She could be teaching bu any method but no one is going to learn by copying things down, not having explanations and being yelled at. I would focus on those instead of Common Core.

 

[packrat]

We had a teacher like that when we were Sophomores. She told one of my friends she was "stupid and shouldn't bother going to college". All she did was write stuff out and put it on the over head projector and then we copied it down. No explanations of anything. It was Geometry and the..see I don't even remember now, rules and whatnot, that's basically all she wrote, w/a picture from the book. My mom used to help me when I would get home and then I would hold court during our study hall that luckily was right before Geometry and teach it back to my classmates. We ended up raising hell in class and she would run out crying b/c she couldn't handle us asking questions-we only had her a semester before seriously checking into the mental institution for whatever issues she had, and then we got someone different.

I used to get so upset when London would bring her math home and it would be a worksheet w/10 different concepts on it, 2 of each concept, rather than just working on ONE thing for a couple days, or learning one thing and building off that. And it would say "complete" ...um..complete what exactly? There's a bunch of squares in a row..what do I do w/that? Is this exponents? You're doing exponents in third grade? and then what's this over here? now graphing and then we're..what the heck is this? Negative numbers..what're we doing w/them? And there'd be no explanations so I'd have to flip the page over and look at what they did in class and figure it out from there.

 

[tyty333]

Can I add on to your rant??? At my DDs school, 3rd grade is where they used to learn their multiplication tables and were taught to have
them memorized. They had to do a test with so many problems in a minute I believe. Well, the year my DD was in 3rd grade was
the first year CC was being taught at our school. And guess what? No more memorization...you dont memorize your multiplication
tables. You learn different ways to figure out what the product is. So, my DD was never forced to have them memorized. She
moved on to 4th grade where they said they should have memorized them in 3rd (and I tell them it didnt happen).

I am so irritated. There are some things that DO need to be memorized in order to move forward in a subject. I dont care that
CC says no rote memorization. They can teach other ways of figuring out a product BUT they also need to have them memorized!!!

I feel for you autumngems. My DS is a 9th grader taking geometry. He is doing fine in the class but when I registered him I told
them I wanted him to to Algebra 1 again because even though he made Bs, I dont feel like he really knows what he is doing and
why. They said they cant put him in Algebra 1 again (because he already has the credit) but they could put him in a remedial math
class (well that would be useful-NOT). Thanks, we'll stick with geometry. I just have a feeling when he gets to Algebra 2 it's going
to be ugly. Luckily both my DH or I can help him but its still NOT GOING TO BE FUN.

I echo whoever said go on Youtube or google for help. There are lots of good math sites out there. It just takes a lot of time
to reteach/relearn every night what should have been taught in class that day.

 

[Tekate]

My husband has a degree in math and a degree in computer science... he loves logic... he loves analytical analysis he can do word problems! easily... he looked at the common core mathematics and said "this is the best way to learn math, it is how a person thinks who is a mathematician" okaaaay! so I believe the common core developers of math curriculum is trying to teach math in the way a person who is good at math thinks.. unfortunately for the few (many)??)) like me I had a hard time grasping the old school way, little own the common core way.. this does not help your girl though... if she is not going into a math/science/technology field can she be transferred into a different curriculum that fits her needs?

my sons inherited the math gene from Dad so they excelled at math.. (not chemistry mind you).. I never had to encounter a problem with them in math (other classes for sure!) ... you are her advocate and her voice with management (I was great in business btw ) and her needs should be the most important thing to the school... they are just making her hate math more... high school is hard any day of the week without the added stress of understanding the hard to understand new math concepts..

My heart goes out to you.!

 

[Queenie60]

My daughter is now a college freshman however her Junior year of high school math was difficult for her. We used this website which was very helpful as they have tutorials which will walk them them through each and every step: www.khanacademy.org/math.. Hope this can help. Sorry you're going through this I certainly understand the struggle. If it makes you feel any better, our daughter attended an all girls private high school and there were bad teachers there too, despite the fact that we paid a small fortune for her to attend. Good luck you.

 

[packrat]

Cuz it's a good thing parents that care and involved have all this free time to also learn (re) learn everything their kids are doing at school... so frustrating.

 

[House Cat]

Cuz it's a good thing parents that care and involved have all this free time to also learn (re) learn everything their kids are doing at school... so frustrating.

Math homework took 1.5 hours last night, complete with a private lesson from mom. There are nights where I have to hold his hand through the entire assignment because the concept just isn't sinking in. I am getting a great new math education!!! After Math, there was English and Social Studies.

I have often wondered what working parents do. I had to get dinner done in the middle of that mess and resorted to leftovers. If I were weary from working all day, my kid would definitely have a tutor out of necessity.

 

[momhappy]

Common Core - otherwise known as Obama Core - stinks. I believe that my state is trying to move away from it and I suspect others will too. My husband and I couldn't even teach our child long division the way we learned it because our child informed us that there was a "chart" that needed to be filled for every problem I noticed that this year, the teachers seem less rigid with common core (in other words, they allow for more freedom in solving problems other ways and not just the common core ways).

 

[kenny]

America is falling behind in math and science!

What's the answer?

 

[zoebartlett]

Common Core is stepping things up, no doubt, but it's trying to encourage thinking beyond relying on rote memorization. Kids often want the answer without really understanding how you get there and why it makes sense. I don't agree with everything CC related but I get that it's supposed to promote critical thinking skills, which students seem to lack.

Eta: Teachers need to understand that not everyone will rely on the same method to arrive at an answer, but we need to show kids a few ways and then let them use whichever one(s) works best for them.

 

[zoebartlett]

I agree with much of what the CC is trying to do, but I don't agree with how it was implemented. School districts should be providing information sessions on it in various disciplines so parents understand it more. I work in a district that adopted the standards and then unadopted them in just a year's time or so. The way it was rolled out wasn't the best, and I definitely understand the pushback.

 

[LLJsmom]

Ok, this is going to be a long post.

My DD is in 5th grade. Also. Common Core. I get what they are trying to do. In some ways, it is good for the kids to understand the deeper math concepts. BUT!!!!! FOR GOD'S SAKE, MAKE THEM MEMORIZE THE MULTIPLICATION TABLES FIRST!! LEARN THE LONG DIVISION. UNDERSTAND HOW TO DIVIDE DECIMAL NUMBERS. UNDERSTAND FRACTIONS. LOWEST COMMON DENOMINATOR AND HIGHEST COMMON FACTOR.

So what I did was FORCE my kids to sit down with me and I would teach them all the old school way. And they would learn the school way too because they had to. And YES, this took a TON of time, and frustration, and anger. But I sucked it up and made my kids suck it up, through no fault of their own, and made them learn it.

GOD. COMMON CORE. The school originally was saying that kids and parents were complaining that homework should be fun (prior to common core). And all that rote memorization, and drilling, and repetitive problem solving was NOT fun. So they brought on COMMON CORE. I don't know the real reason. I just know it sucks.

My opinion, and personal experience, is that learning is often not fun. But guess what. IT MUST BE DONE.

ALRIGHT. SORRY. COMMON CORE. SHIT. MAKE THE KIDS DO 5 PAGES OF 100 MULTIPLICATION PROBLEMS EACH EVERY NIGHT FOR THE WHOLE OF 3RD GRADE. 3 MINUTES A PAGE. PROMISE. YOU WILL KNOW YOUR MULTIPLICATION AFTER THAT. I'M NOT JOKING.

TO THE OP: SO SORRY. I CAN ONLY THINK OF JUST MAKING SURE YOUR DAUGHTER UNDERSTANDS THE STUFF SHE IS SUPPOSED TO LEARN, ENOUGH TO DO WELL ON THE SAT. I GUESS YOU'LL HAVE TO FIGHT THE SCHOOL ABOUT THE CLASS B/C THOSE GRADES AFFECT HER COLLEGE APPLICATIONS. IT'S REALLY BAD IF ONLY 4 KIDS TURN IN HOMEWORK. WHAT IS THAT??? YEAH, I GUESS I WOULD BE RAISING HELL TOO. THERE WILL BE HELL TO PAY IF YOU F*** AROUND WITH MY KIDS' FUTURES.

 

[packrat]

My kids don't know their tables. They try, they do. But there is very little time spent on them in school. They spend more time putting numbers in order least to greatest and writing in the missing number in a grid than they do on *basic* things. Basic has to come first--that's your stinking ground floor! I remember spending entire math classes playing around the world. We had 25 or so kids in 5th grade, and we did around the world w/multiplication tables until we'd gone thru all of them for every student-I remember b/c we got white paper crowns we got to put a colored star on every time we got around.

 

[kenny]

I'm so glad I don't have kids.

 

[azstonie]

I'm so glad I left the teaching profession!!!

(Liked the students, they were terrific.)

 

[monarch64]

I gotta say, sometimes I have forgotten multiplication tables (usually the 9's or 12's) and have used what would probably be referred to as CC math to figure out the answer in my head. (Without those weird little arches and circles, wtf?) I understand it, but I agree with Zoe, the way it was implemented left a lot to be desired. But that seems to be the way things are done in this country--don't like it? Don't agree with it? Have a better idea how to make it happen in a way the public will be more accepting of? Too bad, we're pushing it through anyway!

 

[partgypsy]

I understand why they are implementing common core, but the way it is being implemented, is like trying to go from 0 to 60. And the troubling thing is there may be negative implications (funding pulled etc) if schools don't perform up to what may be unrealistic standards. It's not just the kids who need to learn common core, it's the teachers too. It's a different way of teaching and they need to figure it out too.
My youngest is in 3rd grade, behind in all subjects due to learning differences. Though they are teaching common core, I was also frustrated that they are not teaching the multiplication tables but instead have all these worksheets that kind of work around that issue. I ended up communicating with the teacher and she let me know it is OK to teach my daughter the multiplication table. It's ok if they memorize it, just they are not going to do it at school. Basically I feel the more tools the child has to arrive at the correct answer the better, and I remember for myself lightbulbs going off for myself when I noticed relationships like that when I was a kid.

 

[autumngems]

It's so stressful my daughter is in depression now because of her grade. SHe is going in early twice a week to the math teacher now but I don's see how that is going to help since she won't even explain it in class and you want her to come to you for tutoring?

I talked to my neice last night who is a teacher is Ohio and she is flaberghasted at all this. She said the class grades should be showing the principal that something is wrong.

 

[momhappy]

I understand why they are implementing common core, but the way it is being implemented, is like trying to go from 0 to 60. And the troubling thing is there may be negative implications (funding pulled etc) if schools don't perform up to what may be unrealistic standards. It's not just the kids who need to learn common core, it's the teachers too. It's a different way of teaching and they need to figure it out too.
My youngest is in 3rd grade, behind in all subjects due to learning differences. Though they are teaching common core, I was also frustrated that they are not teaching the multiplication tables but instead have all these worksheets that kind of work around that issue. I ended up communicating with the teacher and she let me know it is OK to teach my daughter the multiplication table. It's ok if they memorize it, just they are not going to do it at school. Basically I feel the more tools the child has to arrive at the correct answer the better, and I remember for myself lightbulbs going off for myself when I noticed relationships like that when I was a kid.

I agree - the way it was designed and implemented seems all wrong. If teachers and parents are feeling left out of the process, that's because they are - they were left out of the process when the standards of the program were being developed. Many teachers complain that CC has a lack of creativity, lesson plans that offer no flexibility, and that it has removed the joy from the learning process & their classrooms.

 

[House Cat]

For those with younger kids who are frustrated because their children aren't learning multiplication tables/division, the best advice I can give is to download a google app or two onto your computer for multiplication/division games and have your child play for 10 to 15 minutes per day. They will learn their tables this way and have a little bit of fun doing it.


Autumngems, If my child had CC dumped on them in the middle of their high school career, I would see no other alternative than to hire a very good tutor. CC is horribly difficult at the grade school level. I can't even imagine what it would look like for intermediate algebra or pre-calc. The other factor is that your daughter needs to keep her GPA up for college admissions. I believe this teacher isn't explaining the concepts behind CC because she doesn't understand them herself.

My son's girlfriend's mom is a math professor. She taught common core concepts to teachers. Her class was voluntary.

 

[tyty333]

I've tried apps but most of the ones that I've seen are meant for younger kids (not a 5th grader). I downloaded 2 and my DD played
them both and pronounced them boring.


I understand CC and why they are doing it. CC ways are ways that many of us have figured out over many years. I get that. The problem is...instead of learning one way really well, they have to learn 3 to 4 different ways to do the same thing and dont get
enough practice at any of them to be able to do it well. The time the teachers have to teach 1 skill has not changed. But now
they have to learn 3 different ways to do that 1 thing. Time is the issue here. I think they have made a big mistake in
their implementation of CC and our children will be suffering for many years due to it.

 

[JulieN]

Start a new thread, CC Math HW Help. Post problems/questions there, we'll see if we can get the ball rolling for your daughter and help her understand.

 

[ksinger]

And we wonder why we are suffering an arterial bleeding out of career teachers. They can't keep up anymore with the reform-du-jour and are weary of the country-wide push to privatize public schools virtually out of existence. Parents slag them daily, the admins ignore them daily and increasingly don't have their backs and seriously violate their contracts. They get no supplies, and have their plans taken up by more and more meetings instead of planning. The comprehensive schools are being increasingly bled of funding in order to fund the publicly funded privates that are charters. And none of them can even get the TSA'ers and the imports from other countries to stay, once they get the lay of the land. In fact, the thing going on now, is many of the supposedly smarter-more idealistic-more adaptable-teachers-are-born-not-made TSA'ers are simply using the TSA's pitiful excuse for training, to bypass traditional certifications, for what is increasingly seen as a very short-term gig until they can find "real" jobs.

I suspect for many, even if they are believers in a national standard, CC (which is by most accounts badly designed and very difficult to implement well), is simply the straw that is breaking the camel's back.

 

[partgypsy]

I'm in NC and yes they pass budget after budget that is gutting public education. In the school my child goes to, they pretty much had to get rid of all TA's, and my kids have had some pretty awesome TAs, that were making a difference. My kids have had some great teachers. The school lost two of them, relocating to other states with better compensation. I don't blame them, it is their career that they have invested in. It is a loss to our kids, really all the kids in NC.
Yes, I also feel like they need to be teaching or educating the parents as well! Because when it comes down to it, if they don't understand a concept or their homework, it is the parents they turn to, and much of this stuff doesn't make intuitive sense to me. I felt bad for one homework for my daughter, I told her to fill it out a certain way, and she ended up getting it wrong because it wasn't the way they wanted it filled out .

 

[House Cat]

I've tried apps but most of the ones that I've seen are meant for younger kids (not a 5th grader). I downloaded 2 and my DD played
them both and pronounced them boring.


I understand CC and why they are doing it. CC ways are ways that many of us have figured out over many years. I get that. The problem is...instead of learning one way really well, they have to learn 3 to 4 different ways to do the same thing and dont get
enough practice at any of them to be able to do it well. The time the teachers have to teach 1 skill has not changed. But now
they have to learn 3 different ways to do that 1 thing. Time is the issue here. I think they have made a big mistake in
their implementation of CC and our children will be suffering for many years due to it.

Yes, learning multiplication tables is boring. Sigh.

I have to agree, they are blazing through these concepts at lightening speed. I have wondered if they will be repeating these concepts again and again throughout the years. I bet my thoughts are naive.