Suicide in YOUR School District

[somethingshiny]

Thank you for all of your replies.

I don't think that teachers are to blame in any way. However, I do think that one suicide initiates the next. Obviously the kids are around it at school more so than home. So, it seems that the schools have to be more on the ball to deter it. Obviously the parents are supposed to be parenting. Unfortunately, it seems that there is more and more "to do" and less time with children. Teachers do have more time with some students than parents have with the kids. There has got to be some sort of education available to teachers to identify at-risk students and also for students to help each other out. Oddly, of the 4 deaths, none of the parents saw it coming. I don't believe this. There are many signs of depression that aren't outright "cries for help." Our entire community needs to learn what these signs are and what to do when they're identified. If the woman whose yard he mowed could have identified something wrong, perhaps one of the boys would still be alive. If the soccer coach saw that he was stressed to the breaking point, perhaps that boy would be alive.

It sounds cruel of me, but I see the rising suicide rate going hand in hand with the sense of entitlement that so many kids have these days. So many kids expect everything handed to them and when it's not they literally don't know how to deal with it. This is also a lack of parenting. But, parent or no parent, this is affecting the entire community, every family, every child. I'm beginning to think that every child should undergo a psychiatric evaluation at the same time as their standardized tests.

I also think that part of the problem is people trying to mind their own business. When we stop caring about one another, this is what happens.



eta~ sb~ The poster idea is along my train of thought too. It has to stop being swept under the rug. It has to be put out there. Just starting the conversation could save a child.

 

[Karl_K]

warning rant follows...

A friend of mines high school age son committed suicide about 8 months ago.
Some girls told his sister "why don''t you go kill yourself too (f-word) (b-word)"
Bad enough?

Gets worse

A teacher heard it and laughed.
sick %@%@^$^$^@^@#$$*&(&#$^#$^#$^#&$*$*$#$#

Reported it to the principle and he didn''t do jack to the teacher or the kids because the teacher denied it even though 4 students heard her and about 10 heard the girls, he didn''t even bother asking any of them about it.

 

[Madam Bijoux]

Karl K:

friend of mines high school age son committed suicide about 8 months ago.
Some girls told his sister "why don''t you go kill yourself too (f-word) (b-word)"
Bad enough?

Gets worse

A teacher heard it and laughed.
sick %@%@^$^$^@^@#$$*&(&#$^#$^#$^#&$*$*$#$#
Reported it to the principle and he didn''t do jack to the teacher or the kids because the teacher denied it even though 4 students heard her and about 10 heard the girls, he didn''t even bother asking any of them about it.

Are some of these teachers trying to recapture their youth by pretending they''re in the mean kids'' crowd? This isn''t the first time I''ve heard of teachers tacitly condoning what the mean kids do.

 

[Sizzle]

I just read a story about an 11 year old who was harassed at school. It was reported and pretty much blown off. The little boy hung himself ..http://www.bvblackspin.com/2010/04/09/a-mother-s-love/

 

[ksinger]

Date: 4/13/2010 10:16:30 PM
Author: somethingshiny
Thank you for all of your replies.

I don''t think that teachers are to blame in any way. However, I do think that one suicide initiates the next. Obviously the kids are around it at school more so than home. So, it seems that the schools have to be more on the ball to deter it. Obviously the parents are supposed to be parenting. Unfortunately, it seems that there is more and more ''to do'' and less time with children. Teachers do have more time with some students than parents have with the kids. There has got to be some sort of education available to teachers to identify at-risk students and also for students to help each other out. Oddly, of the 4 deaths, none of the parents saw it coming. I don''t believe this. There are many signs of depression that aren''t outright ''cries for help.'' Our entire community needs to learn what these signs are and what to do when they''re identified. If the woman whose yard he mowed could have identified something wrong, perhaps one of the boys would still be alive. If the soccer coach saw that he was stressed to the breaking point, perhaps that boy would be alive.

It sounds cruel of me, but I see the rising suicide rate going hand in hand with the sense of entitlement that so many kids have these days. So many kids expect everything handed to them and when it''s not they literally don''t know how to deal with it. This is also a lack of parenting. But, parent or no parent, this is affecting the entire community, every family, every child. I''m beginning to think that every child should undergo a psychiatric evaluation at the same time as their standardized tests.

I also think that part of the problem is people trying to mind their own business. When we stop caring about one another, this is what happens.



eta~ sb~ The poster idea is along my train of thought too. It has to stop being swept under the rug. It has to be put out there. Just starting the conversation could save a child.

Yes. It is the negative extreme of the "personal responsibility" mantra.

What I see on this board, is a whole bunch of people who really don''t have much experience with poverty. At least not the endemic kind. Maybe a few were on public assistance, but being on public assistance is not "poverty" per se. It sounds like the vast majority here had parents who were ambitious for them, even if times were tough for the family. And that alone, can mitigate many of the problems of not having "stuff". Very few of us here (judging by the tenor of many many posts I''ve read over the years) lived in grinding poverty - the kind that has a huge mental component of helplessness and despair and maybe even abuse - all our lives. Even I, being raised by a single mom in the 60s and 70s, and being probably only one good illness or injury away from welfare, did not experience the physical and mental deprivation of growing up in that condition. Most of us here are reasonably well-educated - in PUBLIC schools no less - and are set to be fully contributing members of society.

That said, I would say that there are different reasons for suicide. Perhaps some kids on one end of the spectrum are doing it out of "entitlement", but from where I stand, they would likely be doing it out of sheer despair of looking at the trajectory of their lives. A surprising number of the students who skip classes the most at my hubs school, do so because they are exhausted from working to help support the family. And with the economy on the outs, he''s seen that increase. He is seeing a return of the 1930''s, (typical history teacher mind) when every single family member who could, worked to keep the household afloat. The stresses on these kids are enormous.

I know I have taken the discussion into general areas where perhaps people really haven''t wanted to go, but I can see several posters dancing around it at least - the fact that the problems - like suicide - begin outside the home and affect the entire community. Addressing them in the schools will be a stopgap bandaid measure at best. But pointing the finger of blame all day long when the teachers cannot save every last kid, is the absolute worst form of "entitlement thinking" that I can think of, honestly. As Swimmer said, she''s paid to teach, not to be 24-hour friend, mentor and psychologist. Careful what you demand of her, that teacher who goes the extra mile and more, daily. Even those passionate and dedicated teachers burn out and leave the schools in droves, when they realize that they could give their last drop and have it never ever be enough.

 

[lilyfoot]

I''m not in touch with our school system, but when I was in high school (a few years back..), we had a few suicides. One that sticks out to me was a guy that hung himself on his ceiling fan .. his mom found him.

I''ve never personally known anyone who commited suicide.

 

[somethingshiny]

Nobody in our community seems to be pointing the finger at anyone currently (thankfully).

There have been lots of brainstorming sessions to figure out what to do with very little outcome. Mostly they just commiserate at this point. (I guess I can''t blame them.)

The reason I used the "sense of entitlement" (cruel as it is) is because these kids AREN''T the poor kids, the kids who are raised by a single mom or the kids who have a parent over sees. These are the kids that had a bad soccer game and failed a test. Obviously it runs deeper than a bad day, but like I said, the parents didn''t see it coming.

I grew up in real poverty and in a poor neighborhood. I would "get" suicide in that type of situation. It''s living in despair daily and not knowing what tomorrow holds. That can push a person over the edge in and of itself. But, in my years in that area, only 1 student successfully committed suicide. He happened to be one of the "rich kids" and got a bad grade on his algebra test that day. (My brother''s friend)

I agree that the schools are a stopgap measure, but at this point, it seems to be the only choice. And like I said in my initial post. This school district is looked to by many others. If even a small program could be started in our school, the rest of the schools would follow. I have several family members who are teachers in and around this school district. They feel as helpless as the rest of us. They don''t feel like they''ve been educated to respond to these situations. My uncle is the superintendent of one district and is trying to figure out to what extent the teachers can/should go.

Funds would be a major challenge, but I think that there really needs to be at least one full time counselor at each school. Currently, most of the districts share a counselor between the elementary, jr high and high school in each district. The off-shoot schools (that have very small enrollment and may have only 2 years at a time) have no counseling staff. In this area it really does fall to the teachers. Not saying it''s right, but it is true.

My biggest problem with the handling of these situations is how they''re continually swept under the rug. I''m in a very rural area. A few years ago a man ran over his small child on a tractor. That death was talked about and farm safety programs were implemented. Why isn''t something more being done to prevent more suicides?

 

[Madam Bijoux]

Somethingshiny:

Why isn't something more being done to prevent more suicides?

I don't think anyone sensed that anything was wrong in in my area: not the parents, not the school, not the kids' friends, not anybody.

In one instance, 2 girls were devastated over the accidental death of a friend of theirs. One day, they walked onto the train tracks together and were killed by an Amtrak train - they planned this. After their friend's death, they seemed to be doing OK outwardly - they were talking about what to wear to their prom, what college they wanted to get into, their plans for the summer. These girls had good relationships with their parents and were well liked at school. Nobody knew how they really felt.

A boy who killed himself did it after his band had finished practicing together. They practiced in an abandoned building, and he hung himself after the other band members had gone home. Again, nobody sensed that anything was wrong.

Another young man (I think he was in his early 20'S) jumped in front of an Amtrak train.

All the schools can do is put up signs with suicide prevention hotline phone numbers and maybe some phone numbers of churches or counselors and hope for the best. All that parents can do is keep the lines of communication open, emphasize that the kids should feel free to talk to them about anything and pray that what they say sinks in.

 

[lightningbug]

The American Foundaton for Suicide Prevention is the leading non-profit foundation for suicide research and advocacy. It is not a religious organization. I know some of the people involved at various levels, and it''s an excellent group.

If you click on Educational Resources on the sidebar, you can find a number of resources targeting college students and younger teens, including a teen suicide prevention campaign and a suicide awareness training program for teachers and school counselors called More Than Sad

You can also find your local chapter. To the OP: there is a Greater Chicago/Illinois chapter.

And for the record, if you or someone you love is in crisis, the telephone hotline number is:

1-800-273-TALK (8255).

 

[TooPatient]

Date: 4/13/2010 6:58:12 PM
Author: swimmer
SS, that number seems super high, but suicides tend to cluster, one inspires another... Did you see Heathers back in the early 90s? In my district of 2,000 kids we haven''t had a ''successful'' suicide in 7 years, but there is an epidemic of girls cutting themselves, and a variety of other terrifying ''cries for help.'' Your district is correct to keep pastors out of the schools, the ACLU and a variety of other groups will be on them with lawsuits so fast if they allowed that encroachment...lawsuits costing the district''s taxpayers tens of thousands of dollars. There are hours outside of the school day, usually about 15 or 16 a day when religion can be squeezed in. The school has to adhere to federal guidelines or they lose state and federal funding.

I am with Haven and Ksinger here. In a year my contractual job is to teach from 6,000BCE to today, all of world history to over 100 students that I see in 50 minute increments. They take a test at the end of the year, if they fail, I am inadequate and could have my pay docked, if they pass, they are talented students. I am also required by federal law to report warning signs of abuse (to self and by others), and next we are going to be required to stop these 17-18yr olds from teasing each other in the halls, online, and out of school. Somehow I need to stop them from drinking and driving too Dragonfly? Should I follow them home? be their friends on fb? How can I do this without magical Santa Clause like powers? Oh, and while grading hundreds of papers, writing them all letters of rec for college, coaching, advising 3 clubs, and running a program for depressed teenage girls all in my free (aka UNPAID) time?

How? Should I stop teaching history and ask them about their feelings? Quite honestly, my masters degrees are in history, I have limited training in Psychology. What percentage of my day should go into mothering these guys? They need it for sure, I call home and tell parents about carving into arms, clear cases of bulemia, anorexia, and bullying, but mostly parents tell me ''thanks, but it is under control.'' I''ve had a mom tell me that her daughter had no eating disorder b/c daughter was ''fatter than me'' -direct quote from mom in front of daughter. Fathers claiming that cuts on wrists were because of dropped glassware and black eyes were just accidental. Don''t worry, I will continue to call the parents, and guidance counselors, and the police. It is my job. But when will society ever decide that teachers are responsible for enough parts of kids'' lives and that the parents have to provide for their own progeny?

Swedish Bean, just so you know, there are hundreds and hundreds of helplines, drop in clinics, safe houses etc out there. Do a quick google and you will find huge resources out there for high risk or depressed teens. These are however mostly funded by donations or taxes and you know how people feel about ''helping the least among us!'' My deep and personal thanks to those who pay their taxes with gratitude and those parents who keep a close and realistic eye on their kids. You make it possible for teachers to keep going when the world seems to be falling apart around us. Teachers, you know you have to wait till some sort of afterlife for any thanks or recognition, but know that this almost mom is happy to know that there are true professionals out there like KSinger''s husband (though I pray my child will never be in a school like his!) and Haven, Zoe Bartlett and so many other dedicated teachers around the world.


PS: Sorry for my rant, stayed an extra 4 hours with a student to help him figure out some ways to get through the day without smoking pot...we worked on his research paper a bit too. I''m 37 weeks pregnant, what more do you want to ask from teachers I beg of you?

Thank you! All of you teachers out there who spend the long hours helping kids (of all ages) and going above and beyond what is in your "job description". I have many teachers I remember fondly -- teachers who taught their classes, stayed until all hours of the evening, and spent their own money buying supplies for their classes to use. Many of them are now retired (since they are old enough to have taught my mom, uncles, & aunt before me and some even taught my little brother) and I don''t know how to contact them -- Facebook just seems so impersonal a way to thank them for everything they did and I know I could never find them all.

So all of you teachers here on PS, THANK YOU!
Someday (probably a lot sooner than they expect), your students will be thinking back to the wonderful lessons and experiences they had in your classes.

 

[TooPatient]

As many have pointed out, these suicides are affecting our communities.

It should not fall only on the schools or teachers or parents. It is the community that should be looking out for each other -- not because they have to, but because it is the right thing to do.

Every one of us need to take more notice of those around us in our lives. Say "hello" to the neighbors. Ask the neighbor kid how he/she is doing today AND really listen to them.

I once read a great story (Chicken Soup for the Soul -- can''t remember which books this one is in) about a highschool boy. He cleaned everything out his locker and was carrying his books home. He dropped them and another student walked over to help him pick them up and carry them home. In the speech he gave at graduation (he finished at the top of his class) he shocked everyone by telling the story of that day he dropped the books. He had planned on killing himself -- the thing that stopped him was that someone had taken the time to help him.
(The story is very touching and I know I didn''t do it justice)


It doesn''t take much and you never know what small act of kindness is going to make the difference.

 

[Karl_K]

Date: 4/14/2010 6:44:06 AM
Author: Madam Bijoux
Karl K:

friend of mines high school age son committed suicide about 8 months ago.

Some girls told his sister 'why don't you go kill yourself too (f-word) (b-word)'

Bad enough?

Gets worse

A teacher heard it and laughed.

sick %@%@^$^$^@^@#$$*&(&#$^#$^#$^#&$*$*$#$#

Reported it to the principle and he didn't do jack to the teacher or the kids because the teacher denied it even though 4 students heard her and about 10 heard the girls, he didn't even bother asking any of them about it.

Are some of these teachers trying to recapture their youth by pretending they're in the mean kids' crowd? This isn't the first time I've heard of teachers tacitly condoning what the mean kids do.

I have heard first hand from many students and parents that it is not uncommon.
Personally I think it stems from teachers typing to be friends instead of authority figures.
The school district they are in has had a very bad reputation for years and has experienced a huge amount of growth with resulting overcrowding and low pay combined with poor leadership.
They cant get or keep the best teachers.
They spend million on the football team but not a dime for anything else.
The PTA had to pay for repairs to the heating system in one building or they were going to shut down a 1/4 of an already overcrowded school.

 

[somethingshiny]

MB~ Your post sums up how I feel. There''s really no SOLUTION to the problem. It''s just devastating.


lightningbug~ Thanks so much for the links. There''s lots of good info to be shared!

 

[Haven]

Date: 4/14/2010 2:52:41 PM
Author: Karl_K

Date: 4/14/2010 6:44:06 AM
Author: Madam Bijoux
Karl K:

friend of mines high school age son committed suicide about 8 months ago.
Some girls told his sister ''why don''t you go kill yourself too (f-word) (b-word)''
Bad enough?

Gets worse

A teacher heard it and laughed.
sick %@%@^$^$^@^@#$$*&(&#$^#$^#$^#&$*$*$#$#
Reported it to the principle and he didn''t do jack to the teacher or the kids because the teacher denied it even though 4 students heard her and about 10 heard the girls, he didn''t even bother asking any of them about it.

Are some of these teachers trying to recapture their youth by pretending they''re in the mean kids'' crowd? This isn''t the first time I''ve heard of teachers tacitly condoning what the mean kids do.

I have heard first hand from many students and parents that it is not uncommon.
Personally I think it stems from teachers typing to be friends instead of authority figures.
The school district they are in has had a very bad reputation for years and has experienced a huge amount of growth with resulting overcrowding and low pay combined with poor leadership.
They cant get or keep the best teachers.
They spend million on the football team but not a dime for anything else.
The PTA had to pay for repairs to the heating system in one building or they were going to shut down a 1/4 of an already overcrowded school.

That''s shocking.
I''ve never heard of teachers like this, but I do believe that a district is only as good as its community. Parents have a lot of power, should they choose to use it.

I''m so sorry for your friend.