Selling in Preloved - Safe International Payment

[stargurl78]

Hi all,

I have someone who wants to purchase a tsavorite I have listed. He lives in Austria and informed me that it costs him more to pay through Paypal and prefers to do a wire transfer. He wanted to exchange business email addresses to verify names. From this I can see that he is the director of a Dutch bank. He has asked me for the following information:

bank name
account holder name
account holder address: street, city, postal code, state
account number
routing number

I've never done a wire transfer before and providing this information makes me a bit nervous. From what I've read online, wire transfers are a secure way of transferring funds. I'm sure some of you have sold internationally before and can let me know if this is safe or what you consider to be the safest method of payment? From the emails back and forth, he seems like he legitimately wants to purchase the stone but it's just hard to trust people in today's world.

Thanks!

 

[the_mother_thing]

This seems fishy to me. Why does/would it cost him more to pay through PP from the Netherlands? Especially as the buyer, because usually the seller pays the PP fees.

And I would *think* any exchange rate would be the same via PP or a wire.

Maybe Scandinavian will pop in with some insight.

 

[marymm]

AFAIK buyers do not pay any fees when they purchase via PayPal ... The whole point of PayPal is safe purchases/sales among consumers who have been verified by PayPal so personal information need not be exchanged among strangers.

Also, have you figured out a safe way to ship the item internationally? AFAIK individual consumers cannot ship gemstones via FedEx and UPS with any kind of insurance.

Per USPS Country Code for the Netherlands http://pe.usps.com/text/Imm/mo_022.htm#ep1730218, loose gemstones are prohibited via Priority Mail Express International. If you were to ship via USPS Global Express Guaranteed (GXG), insurance coverage is limited to $2499. If you were to ship via USPS First Class International Registered Mail, insurance coverage is limited to $41.91.

 

[ksinger]

Hi all,

I have someone who wants to purchase a tsavorite I have listed. He lives in the Netherlands and informed me that it costs him more to pay through Paypal and prefers to do a wire transfer. He wanted to exchange business email addresses to verify names. From this I can see that he is the director of a Dutch bank. He has asked me for the following information:

bank name
account holder name
account holder address: street, city, postal code, state
account number
routing number

I've never done a wire transfer before and providing this information makes me a bit nervous. From what I've read online, wire transfers are a secure way of transferring funds. I'm sure some of you have sold internationally before and can let me know if this is safe or what you consider to be the safest method of payment? From the emails back and forth, he seems like he legitimately wants to purchase the stone but it's just hard to trust people in today's world.

Thanks!

Before I did anything giving up any info, I would contact your own bank, and put this situation to them, and see what they say.

Something smells a bit wrong on this...better safe than sorry I'm thinking.

Remember, scammers are inventing new methods to extract your info and money, faster than most people can keep up with it.

I would be VERY wary, and sending that info via an unencrypted email? Just NO. Nope. Nopetty nope nope.

 

[stargurl78]

double post.

 

[stargurl78]

AFAIK buyers do not pay any fees when they purchase via PayPal ... The whole point of PayPal is safe purchases/sales among consumers who have been verified by PayPal so personal information need not be exchanged among strangers.

Also, have you figured out a safe way to ship the item internationally? AFAIK individual consumers cannot ship gemstones via FedEx and UPS with any kind of insurance.

Per USPS Country Code for the Netherlands http://pe.usps.com/text/Imm/mo_022.htm#ep1730218, loose gemstones are prohibited via Priority Mail Express International. If you were to ship via USPS Global Express Guaranteed (GXG), insurance coverage is limited to $2499. If you were to ship via USPS First Class International Registered Mail, insurance coverage is limited to $41.91.

Wait, nevermind I just realized he lives in Austria, not the Netherlands... Just corrected my original post. I wouldn't be shipping Priority Mail Express International anyways, I'd use just regular Priority Mail International.

He didn't say that he has to pay fees through Paypal, this is what he stated - "PayPal charge me 3,5% for the FX transaction. PayPal calculates with 1,03 EUR/USD instead of 1,07 EUR/USD".

Still definitely seems fishy though! I would love to sell this stone though and get it off my hands.

What about opening a separate bank account with a small amount of funds in it just for the purposes of this transaction? Then close it after I receive the funds? Can you see any risk with that option?

 

[stargurl78]

Before I did anything giving up any info, I would contact your own bank, and put this situation to them, and see what they say.

Something smells a bit wrong on this...better safe than sorry I'm thinking.

Remember, scammers are inventing new methods to extract your info and money, faster than most people can keep up with it.

I would be VERY wary, and sending that info via an unencrypted email? Just NO. Nope. Nopetty nope nope.

I did call my bank and they seemed to think the information he was asking for was fair. She did think my idea of opening a separate account was safe. But I just don't know enough about this sort of thing to feel safe with it.

 

[marymm]

AFAIK buyers do not pay any fees when they purchase via PayPal ... The whole point of PayPal is safe purchases/sales among consumers who have been verified by PayPal so personal information need not be exchanged among strangers.

Also, have you figured out a safe way to ship the item internationally? AFAIK individual consumers cannot ship gemstones via FedEx and UPS with any kind of insurance.

Per USPS Country Code for the Netherlands http://pe.usps.com/text/Imm/mo_022.htm#ep1730218, loose gemstones are prohibited via Priority Mail Express International. If you were to ship via USPS Global Express Guaranteed (GXG), insurance coverage is limited to $2499. If you were to ship via USPS First Class International Registered Mail, insurance coverage is limited to $41.91.

same USPS shipping restrictions/insurance limitations for Austria http://pe.usps.com/text/Imm/ab_013.htm#ep1575171

and, again, PayPal doesn't charge buyers anything so I still don't know why your Austrian buyer is reluctant to use PayPal. If it is an exchange rate thing, that would apply regardless of payment method, no?

 

[stargurl78]

AFAIK buyers do not pay any fees when they purchase via PayPal ... The whole point of PayPal is safe purchases/sales among consumers who have been verified by PayPal so personal information need not be exchanged among strangers.

Also, have you figured out a safe way to ship the item internationally? AFAIK individual consumers cannot ship gemstones via FedEx and UPS with any kind of insurance.

Per USPS Country Code for the Netherlands http://pe.usps.com/text/Imm/mo_022.htm#ep1730218, loose gemstones are prohibited via Priority Mail Express International. If you were to ship via USPS Global Express Guaranteed (GXG), insurance coverage is limited to $2499. If you were to ship via USPS First Class International Registered Mail, insurance coverage is limited to $41.91.

same USPS shipping restrictions/insurance limitations for Austria http://pe.usps.com/text/Imm/ab_013.htm#ep1575171

and, again, PayPal doesn't charge buyers anything so I still don't know why your Austrian buyer is reluctant to use PayPal. If it is an exchange rate thing, that would apply regardless of payment method, no?

I would be shipping just regular Priority Mail rather than Priority Mail Express. So would that same restriction still apply?

I'm not sure with the exchange rate - I think he's saying that doing the transfer in Paypal does not provide the same exchange rate as the bank. However, I'm not sure about this as I've never done a transaction like this before.

 

[maccers]

It's possible that he might get a more favourable exchange rate through his bank than PayPal. I was in the USA recently and it was considerably better for me to use my credit cards than my debit card.

Regardless, proceed with caution and good luck!

 

[the_mother_thing]

He didn't say that he has to pay fees through Paypal, this is what he stated - "PayPal charge me 3,5% for the FX transaction. PayPal calculates with 1,03 EUR/USD instead of 1,07 EUR/USD".

Still definitely seems fishy though! I would love to sell this stone though and get it off my hands.

What about opening a separate bank account with a small amount of funds in it just for the purposes of this transaction? Then close it after I receive the funds? Can you see any risk with that option?

Ohhh ... I *think* the "FX" he's noting is a foreign (exchange) transaction fee vs. the PP transaction fee, and he is trying to not have to pay that. I don't know, however, if PP uses a different rate than what banks, etc. do. So, I agree with KSinger - call your bank and see what they say.

I know you want to unload it, but the hassle & stress created (whether it's legit or a scam) would be enough for me to insist upon PP, or pass. JMHO.

 

[vintagelover229]

No feedback in regards to if it's safe or not but I've only shipped internationally being from Canada. I use u-pic as a 3rd party insurer. Its a LOT cheaper than most of the rates by Canada post, usps, fed ex, etc. coverage is great, includes jewelery/etc and you have 24 hours within shipping it to pay for it via a simple online form. I use it to ship expensive things such as handwoven fabric as well. So if your going that route I highly recommend it!

 

[stargurl78]

It's possible that he might get a more favourable exchange rate through his bank than PayPal. I was in the USA recently and it was considerably better for me to use my credit cards than my debit card.

Regardless, proceed with caution and good luck!

I just read on one site that Paypal charges a hidden currency conversion fee, that may be what he is referring to.

 

[Snowdrop13]

I've done several wire transfers between the US and the UK and also within the U.K. My bank gives a good exchange rate and only charges a small fee so it is a sensible way to do it. The info requested by your buyer seems standard to me. I've never had any problems although I've noticed that an international transfer can take up to 5 days to go through. Hope you sort it out!

 

[vintagelover229]

It's possible that he might get a more favourable exchange rate through his bank than PayPal. I was in the USA recently and it was considerably better for me to use my credit cards than my debit card.

Regardless, proceed with caution and good luck!

I just read on one site that Paypal charges a hidden currency conversion fee, that may be what he is referring to.

Oh, they do. You have to 'click' a box to change it to your credit card exchange rate and trust me-you totally want to do this option. It saved us nearly 250$ when we bought from the states a gold trio set vs using our own exchange rate. It was seriously that much.

 

[stargurl78]

I've done several wire transfers between the US and the UK and also within the U.K. My bank gives a good exchange rate and only charges a small fee so it is a sensible way to do it. The info requested by your buyer seems standard to me. I've never had any problems although I've noticed that an international transfer can take up to 5 days to go through. Hope you sort it out!

Thanks Snowdrop13. So if I were to open a separate account just for this transaction, do you think I have any reason to be concerned? I just feel weird about him having my name, address, and bank information.

 

[the_mother_thing]

I would feel uncomfortable providing that information, but I'm super-skittish about that stuff.

Another option to consider that DS just posted elsewhere:

Most PSers watch LoupeTroop. There have been items of all prices listed there. People remove listings once the item is sold. If you try to sell yourself, you can use an appraiser such as Neil Beaty as your middleman. He can hold your ring, buyer pays for appraisal, and he holds the ring until you have received the payment for the item, or he offers escrow service for a fee.

Just a thought.

 

[stargurl78]

I would feel uncomfortable providing that information, but I'm super-skittish about that stuff.

Another option to consider that DS just posted elsewhere:

Most PSers watch LoupeTroop. There have been items of all prices listed there. People remove listings once the item is sold. If you try to sell yourself, you can use an appraiser such as Neil Beaty as your middleman. He can hold your ring, buyer pays for appraisal, and he holds the ring until you have received the payment for the item, or he offers escrow service for a fee.

Just a thought.

Thanks for the suggestion! I decided to just to offer to pay the extra cost in Paypal. Seems like it should be around $15 more for him so I am happy to cover it in order to feel like the transaction is safe. We'll see what he says to that...

 

[Snowdrop13]

I've done several wire transfers between the US and the UK and also within the U.K. My bank gives a good exchange rate and only charges a small fee so it is a sensible way to do it. The info requested by your buyer seems standard to me. I've never had any problems although I've noticed that an international transfer can take up to 5 days to go through. Hope you sort it out!

Thanks Snowdrop13. So if I were to open a separate account just for this transaction, do you think I have any reason to be concerned? I just feel weird about him having my name, address, and bank information.

Actually, I've never needed the seller's business address, it's only been the bank's details, you're probably right to proceed with a method that makes you feel relaxed and safe about the transaction. Hope it goes well!

 

[minousbijoux]

I would feel uncomfortable providing that information, but I'm super-skittish about that stuff.

Another option to consider that DS just posted elsewhere:

Most PSers watch LoupeTroop. There have been items of all prices listed there. People remove listings once the item is sold. If you try to sell yourself, you can use an appraiser such as Neil Beaty as your middleman. He can hold your ring, buyer pays for appraisal, and he holds the ring until you have received the payment for the item, or he offers escrow service for a fee.

Just a thought.

Thanks for the suggestion! I decided to just to offer to pay the extra cost in Paypal. Seems like it should be around $15 more for him so I am happy to cover it in order to feel like the transaction is safe. We'll see what he says to that...

This is exactly what I was going to suggest you do. It sounds implausible to me that a director of a dutch bank would be devoting his important time to haggling over such a small amount of fees. I think you are wise to proceed with caution and to go through PP.

 

[jaaron]

It's the exact same information someone would have about you if you were to pay them with a paper check-- name, address, routing number and account number, so I wouldn't be too concerned with that aspect.