rising gas prices

[phoenixgirl]

How is this going to affect our economy?

Prices have risen over ten cents a gallon just in the last week. What if this trend continues? Then there''s the effect on the prices at our grocery stores and Target and Walmart, where they ship a lot of their goods a long distance.

So I''m asking, should I be freaking out? It hasn''t made me drive any less, but the extra $ going towards gas does mean less for other things. Thankfully right now it''s just taking away from discretionary purchases, but if everything gets more expensive, it could be bad.

 

[IrishEyes]

Yup, it''s really freaking me out! In central Illinois right now it''s like 2.65 a gallon, and up in the city,in chicago its almost at 3 dollars. I know some other places in the country are over 3 a gallon

Unbelievable. This effects every industry. It''s really upsetting if you think about it.

 

[sasa]

I feel you phoenixgirl, I already see the price jump at walmart and Costco. I''m getting freaking out too, everything is going up except the salary (according to upper management, no raise and bonus this year because factory cost and other cost went up)

.

 

[Blue824]

Date: 8/16/2005 12:05:17 PM
Author: Bobo ^__*
I feel you phoenixgirl, I already see the price jump at walmart and Costco. I'm getting freaking out too, everything is going up except the salary (according to upper management, no raise and bonus this year because factory cost and other cost went up)

.

Yep, this year no one got raises (unless they were promoted) where I work, and a lot of people rely on their cars...not cool. Maybe it'll make people take public trans more. I dont drive enough where the gas prices really affect my budget, I spent *maybe* $40/month on gas, so now it might be like $60, but I can easily absorb that. Now, if I drove more, that would make it very difficult. I do think it will maybe kick the american manufacturers butts into gear for developing new technology instead of gas guzzlers, and that will be the only plus. Aren't we still paying considerably less than what Europeans are paying though?

I havent noticed any changes at the grocery stores or other stores in my area yet though, I'm sure that will come soon.

ETA: Well, my dears, it has happened in Chicago, we broke the $3 mark, at least the first I've seen...$3.09 at the BP on North Ave & Elston (I think its Elston). just passed gas on my way into work.

 

[kenny]

I feel very bad for people.
Gas is so expensive now.
And so many people have low-mileage vehicles.
There is a story that WalMart is worried.
They ship a lot by truck and their customers are low to mid income who will be hurt by high gas prices.

I'm glad I bought my Honda Civic Hybrid last year.
I'm actually getting over 60 MPG.
These cars are amazing.

I wish more people would buy hybrids.
They also have very low emissions.

 

[ame]

In St Louis this morning it was $2.59 but my mom said she went to work in West County and it was at $3.05 on Manchester. GOD I hope that was only one place.

I wouldn't be so pissed about this if I felt like the oil companies weren't making an insane killing. Can't claim you are having financial troubles to justify your huge gas price jumps when you are posting $7+BILLION dollars profit in just one quarter...

Kenny there are waitlists of over 2 years for Hybrids.

 

[soulsis]

Ack...my little heart is WEEPING!!!

We get the oil from here (Alberta) and ship it everywhere in the world and we pay $1.00 a litre which translates to $3.79 a gallon. Three years ago gas was around half of what we pay now.

 

[teebee]

Prices rose over 20 cents in 3 days here. Gas prices in Oklahoma have historically been significantly lower than most of the rest of the US, but now, it may be lower, but not by very much... I sold my SUV last year - partially because of rising gas prices & partially because I just didn''t need anything that big anymore. Even so, filling up my Nissan Maxima affects me to a point that it has curbed my discretionary spending somewhat.

I used to work for a commercial real estate/property management company & I know that even when I left the company last year, some of the tenants - $1 store & affordable furniture store - were struggling somewhat & felt that rising gas prices that affected their biggest customer base (low & low middle income) were to blame. I talked to a former coworker last week & she confirmed that those businesses have closed recently... Then again, I can also confirm that they did not have very strong business plans to begin with...

If nothing else, I have become more efficient when running errands & try to plan my routes ahead of time - and I drive slower, which has helped more than I expected.

 

[movie zombie]

anyone heard of and/or understand ''peak oil''? yes, we should all be freaking.

its not just the price of gas: think about all the things around your house that are made with petrochemicals....fertilizer for house plants, car parts, shopping bags, food containers, clothing, etc.

everything will be going up.....

peace, movie zombie

 

[Diamonds4Me]

It went up overnight here. I paid 2.47 on Sunday. Monday when I drove past the same gas station it was 2.76. Niiiice. I can tell you right now that its effecting what I buy and don't buy. I have to use artificial sweetners and can only use Splenda because of taste. But at $8.00 a box every week...I can't do that when I can get the same amount of sugar for $.99 and it lasts a month. Personally, I'd rather take my chances with the sugar. I've already started working more out of my home office so I don't have to drive all over the place. Right now crude oil is at $66.28 a barrel (as of 10 hrs ago). I never ever thought I'd see oil at these prices. Two years ago I was paying .98/gallon, regular unleaded. Its insane.

 

[pricescope]

this is pretty cool project: GasBuddy.com + Google Maps = http://www.ahding.com/cheapgas/

 

[KittenKat]

It''s terrible!

Out in my area in Los Angeles, I recently paid $3.20 for gas. (91)

Next June, my Jaguar is getting traded in for a Hybrid. I cannot stomach blowing so much cash on gas. Especially with the amount of driving my honey and I do...

 

[laney]

I carpool with my husband and we moved closer to work which is helping in using gas.

But.. we have lots of friends in europe who don''t listen to our whining. They pay a lot more than us for many years now..

We are considering a new car right now - we both drive low mileage vehicles... and with the gas the way it is - we are considering a hybrid. But of course the models we want - won''t really balance out the price of gas.. it''s either gas.. or carpayment.

I WISH we''d look into hydrogen or alternative fuels as a real option.. not the "let''s placate them" option that it seems like. It will take government infrastructure unfortuntately to get anywhere.. and who knows how long that''ll take.

But the BMW hydrogen cars.. and filling stations look pretty darn cool!

 

[Blue824]

Date: 8/16/2005 3:10:05 PM
Author: Pricescope
this is pretty cool project: GasBuddy.com + Google Maps = http://www.ahding.com/cheapgas/

I tried that this weekend, because I had heard about it...and it told me that the gas in my neighborhood should've been 2.57, when it was 2.75...so i'm not sure how often it is updated, because it was significantly off for me!

ETA instead of posting again...I know some cities are considering dropping their gas tax, which would make a nice little dent i guess until it drops back down. if it drops back down. then if it never goes down we'll probably get taxed somewhere else

so it'll all even out one way or another.

 

[phoenixgirl]

Date: 8/16/2005 1:28:35 PM
Author: ame
In St Louis this morning it was $2.59 but my mom said she went to work in West County and it was at $3.05 on Manchester. GOD I hope that was only one place.

I wouldn''t be so pissed about this if I felt like the oil companies weren''t making an insane killing. Can''t claim you are having financial troubles to justify your huge gas price jumps when you are posting $7+BILLION dollars profit in just one quarter...

Kenny there are waitlists of over 2 years for Hybrids.

My mom went to the Honda dealer just to check out a hybrid, and drove home in a hybrid Accord. I think they were trying to get rid of the ''05s, but that certainly made it sound easy to get them in some areas at least.

I will definitely get one for my next car. It''s funny, I know a former VP at GM who hates hybrids with a vengeance. His reasoning was that diesel fuel is somehow superior, so if we care so much why don''t we use diesel more like Europe. I got the impression that he thought environmentalists were pro-hybrid without really knowing the facts, but effects on the environment aside, there are political and economic consequences to our dependence on oil right now, not to mention that the supply is finite.

Has anybody read Collapse by Jared Diamond? (You might have caught the PBS series on his book Guns, Germs, and Steel last month). He looks at isolated civilizations that used up all the resources available to them (like the people of Easter Island, who literally cut down the last tree on their island so that they could transport those giant heads the island is famous for) or who couldn''t adapt to use resources that were at their fingertips (like the Norse in Greenland, who starved while clinging to European traditions, whereas the Inuit survived by eating food the Norse wouldn''t touch). I hope we''re not making these types of mistakes with our dependence on oil.

 

[ame]

maybe where she is there is a bigger supply. I know around here people clamor!

I do work for a big dealer so I am hoping he can hook me up with one.

 

[fire&ice]

It is causing inflation, especially at the grocery store. Our "pet sitter" is charging an extra dollar just to keep up with rising gas prices (they specialize taking care of the countryside - hence quite a bit of driving) - just a small example.

Next car will be a hybrid. Both our cars get pretty good gas mileage.

 

[movie zombie]

Date: 8/16/2005 1:28:35 PM
Author: ame
In St Louis this morning it was $2.59 but my mom said she went to work in West County and it was at $3.05 on Manchester. GOD I hope that was only one place.

I wouldn''t be so pissed about this if I felt like the oil companies weren''t making an insane killing. Can''t claim you are having financial troubles to justify your huge gas price jumps when you are posting $7+BILLION dollars profit in just one quarter...

Kenny there are waitlists of over 2 years for Hybrids.

the oil industry makes no claim re having financial troubles and they make no claim that this is the reason for price hikes. they are passing along ''costs''. however, when posting plus $7 BILLION profit, i find it hard to understand why a part of the new energy plan included giveaway taxpayer dollars to the oil industry. not only are the getting us at the pump, they''re getting us at the US Treasury.

F&I called it right: INFLATION. its here and its going to stay. crude will go no where but up. no amount of wars for oil is going to change the fact that peak oil has come and gone and we''re on a downhill slide of prosperity based on oil.

peace, movie zombie

 

[Lord Summerisle]

i WISH it was $3 a gallon!

ave is $7.24 a gallon here in blighty and its rising.

rapidly.

 

[Sparkster]

Regular unleaded petrol in Melbourne Australia is about $1.20 per litre. 1 litre equals about 1/4 gallons (correct me if I''m wrong) so it equates to $4.80 per gallon. To give you an idea what $1.20 means here, a litre of milk costs about $1.90.

 

[kenny]

In Amsterdam they pay $6.48 per gallon.
In Caracas Venezuela they pay 12 cents a gallon.

http://money.cnn.com/pf/features/lists/global_gasprices/

Diesel cars produce much more smog than gas cars, which produce much more smog than hybrids.

They just passed a law that solo hybrid drivers can drive in the carpool lanes in California if you have one of the 3 models that get at least 45 MPG, the Prius, Civic and Insight.
I applied for my DMV sticker last Thursday.

Here in Los Angeles there are red lights at many freeway onramps.
There is also a carpool lane that doesn't have to stop.
I can't tell you how good it will feel to drive by all those SUVs waiting at the red light.
Yippeeeee!

The Accord Hybrid doesn't qualify for the sticker, neither does the Ford Escape Hybrid.
They get under 45 MPG.
Ford was pissed, they tried to fight the law.
What bozos!

I hear people are paying thousands OVER MSRP for hybrids now.

I was lucky.
I got mine in April 2004 just before gas started going up and got it for $2000 under MSRP (after several hours of negotiating).


Everybody at work thought I was such a dork.

 

[Blue824]

Date: 8/16/2005 6:12:37 PM
Author: Lord Summerisle
i WISH it was $3 a gallon!

ave is $7.24 a gallon here in blighty and its rising.

rapidly.

Wow....I couldnt remeber what it was the last time I was out there, but I always knew it was considerably higher. How do you handle those prices? Do most people rely on public transportation? Or are you just used to higher prices for gas?

 

[Kamuelamom]

I just glanced at the sign my son observed this afternoon:

$3.00 #87
$3.12 #89
$3.25 #92

 

[sjz]

Date: 8/16/2005 12:03:24 PM
Author: IrishEyes
Yup, it''s really freaking me out! In central Illinois right now it''s like 2.65 a gallon, and up in the city,in chicago its almost at 3 dollars. I know some other places in the country are over 3 a gallon

Unbelievable. This effects every industry. It''s really upsetting if you think about it.

It''s up to 2.75 per gallon is Central Illinois as of today. Last week it went up 40 cents in one day.

 

[perry]

To answer the original questions....

The world is now at a point where demand for oil has essentially reached production capacity.

With the growing Chinease market for auotmotive transportation the demand for oil will continue to rise.

pure supply and demand pricing takes over.

While more resources can be brought on line, the fact is that the growing demand will outstrip those new resources as they are brought on line. There are no major resources that can be brought on line that will produce a surplus oil market again (where countries delibertly restrict production).

The price trend will continue until people and industries cut back on usage.

My personal estimate is that we will be between $4 and $5 per gallon for gasoline (within months). It would not surprise me to see $6-$7 per gallon in a year or two.

The effects on the economy; worldwide - huge.

I would not want to be an auto maker or dealer who largly depends on large consumer vehicles (SUV''s, Pickups, etc). People will start to buy vehicles with better gas milage (smaller vehicles). Although, it will take about 10 years for most of the vehicle mix to change.

There will always be some who are not affected by gas prices. They will always drive big vehicles. I have a Ford Aspire (the little ford car with a positive attitude - It''s aspireing to be a "real" car). It gets 30-40 MPG depending on driving conditions and weather. I also now have a full size van, which gets 12-14 MPG. The van has its uses, but other than those specific uses it stays parked.

Transportation cost for many a goods will go up - substaintially. It will affect consumer prices.

However, there are some potential good things that will probably come out of this. Rail transportation is 100 times more fuel efficient than truck transportation. Look for more long haul bulk goods transportation to shift back to rail - revitilizing the US railroads, and reducing road traffic and wear.

Another thing, it will affect the economics of farming out a lot of US production overseas as cheap labor only makes sense as long as the transportation cost is also cheap. Look for more production jobs to stay in the home country where the demand for the goods are, and look for some production jobs to return to the US.

Tourism, huge temporary effect as people cut back on travel (not sure I would want to be in the hotel business where most of the business was from tourism).

Airlines, huge temporary effect as people cut back on casual travel.

It will produce a noticible shift in how the US and world works.

However, within a few years we all will adjust just fine with some differnt priorities. In some ways, we may return towards some things in the past. In other ways, new technologies will change how we do things.

The price of oil will finally drive the serious consideration and implementation of consumer energy savings and adoption of more energy efficient lifestyles (why has the normal consumer usage of energy kept going up per person in the US - substantially, when the Manufacurures have significantly reduced the amount of energy per item produced over the last 20 years).

Massive construction of Nuclear power plants (and possibly hydrogen conversion plants in the future) will be started in order to supply the electricity needed independent of fossil fuel prices (fossil fuel prices are all linked. Increase in Oil price increases natural gas and propane and increases coal). Modest construction of other alternate energy methods (wind, solar, wave, etc) that can never be baseload power (too diverse, intermittent) - but will have a place.

Diamond prices will go up as well, and many of us will still be here debating them and other issues (some things never change).

Someone will post a thread on how gasoline is approaching $8 per gallon and wonder how it will affect the economy.


Note: I remember 33 Cent per gallon gasoline.... We have adjusted rather well over the year, we will adjust to the new prices as well. There were a few bumps in the road in the past, there will be again in the future.

Perry

 

[movie zombie]

yep, adaptation is possible. perry, did you see the article i posted re Oil, the American Legion, and Mad Max? community in california is doing just that: adapting.

peace, movie zombie

 

[Dancing Fire]

just fill up my wife''s car at costco $50+ $2.84 per gal for 91 grade.

 

[Lord Summerisle]

Date: 8/16/2005 7:59:24 PM
Author: Blue824

Date: 8/16/2005 6:12:37 PM

Author: Lord Summerisle

i WISH it was $3 a gallon!


ave is $7.24 a gallon here in blighty and its rising.


rapidly.

Wow....I couldnt remeber what it was the last time I was out there, but I always knew it was considerably higher. How do you handle those prices? Do most people rely on public transportation? Or are you just used to higher prices for gas?

we are ''used'' to the price of petrol.. but remember for that the price is 75% duty + 17.5% VAT added to the origonal price so Petrol before take is $3.50 a gallon. which means when the price of oil goes up... the price goes up even quicker - for every cent a gallon - it goes up 2cents at the pump.

outside of London, there really isnt many alternatives. and even then our public transport more often than not costs FAR more to do the same journey, it takes FAR longer. and they are putting the prices up to disayed people from using public transport as the buses and trains are full to capacity and the network is full to capacity, while we have a transport minister and agency who are commited to making life as difficult as possible for the car user.

oh yeah, the gov. are currently talking about having a back box fitted to ALL cars in the uk and use GPS to keep track of them all and charge car use by the mile at upto £1.34 a mile on the busyest streaches. - im currently spending £1500-2000 a year on petrol, under this scheme i''ll be paying £2000-3000 A MONTH to get to work. which is double my wage ATM. which yep will get alot of people off the road - but ALOT of people on the dole, and not many folk to support them through working to pay taxe.

 

[perry]

To Movie Zombie:

Yes I saw that. However, they don''t have anything on the Kickapoo (spelling?) region in Wisconsin (another area where hippies settled - and these were the ones who realized they needed to work for a living and wanted to raise a family in an alternate lifestyle, and quickly determined how destructive drugs were to actually producing things).

We have an whole town that essentially went solor in the 1970''s; and all kinds of other things. The area now has a huge organic farming industry as well.

Perry

ps: I know some of those "hippies...." Many years ago the Milwaukee Journal did an article about the "Hippies in the Kickapoo Valley" because there are all of these stories of all the things they have done. They wrote a huge article about all of the evidence of what they found (and the list goes on and on: The "best" seasonal workers (and best paid too), entire buildings that are important to the community - even new buildings under construction, rave reviews from the local sherrif on how they helped drive out drug abuse in the area, how the hippies modified and control the local building codes, etc). However, they couldn''t seem to find a single one to talk too. I had to laugh as I read the article. I had the phone numbers of a bunch of them at my fingertips, and have spent many a pleasant hour in their houses with them.

 

[MissAva]

This is just making me nuts. I drive a ton my four years ago I was paying 88 cents a gallon for premium gas. Now I am paying 2.38$ beh...
It will hit stores like Wal-Mart soon. Most of our good are delivers that way and trucking companies must be taking a hit everytime the number jumps.