Republicans -- The Party of Destruction

[monarch64]

Uhhhh, because we don't have a one child limit here in the US? said Monarch

One is too many if you do not have the ability to support it.

No one is telling anyone how many children they should have as long as they are prepared to raise and support them.

But having a baby you cannot take care of and then another and another after that, whose fault is that?

Do you think everyone has the ability to predict whether they will lose their job(s) or face undue hardship or know whether the child will have a disease that sucks up all of the family's resources? Do you think everyone who applies for aid and receives it had a baby simply because they thought they'd take advantage of the system? (Because babies are SO EASY, you know! Easy to transport in inclement weather in a stroller, easy to stuff on a bus or a train, or into a homeless shelter. Easy to take to job interviews.)

And let me get this straight: the only people ALLOWED to have children in this country are those who can AFFORD it on their own. Ok. Then the government doesn't need to pull funds from Planned Parenthood and the like, and the government CAN pay (hell, we ALL can, those of us who CAN afford to do so) for abortions when these awful terrible people go and get themselves pregnant knowing FULL WELL they can't afford it. Because I am sure that's their intent every time. I'm sure it has nothing to do with their education or lack thereof. I'm sure it has nothing to do with their own upbringing or lack thereof and the fact that they sometimes/many times think that at least a baby will depend on them and love them when no one else does.

Conservatives are far more in line with Margaret Sanger's way of thought than they even realize. How very ironic.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Some of us are married for over a decade, have kids, sh!t happens, and we find ourselves supporting them entirely on our own.

I should have just consulted a crystal ball and gotten rid of them, right? In those Planned Parenthoods you guys are so keen to shut down? Or maybe I should have remained celibate during my marriage?

I'm lucky that I don't need assistance at the moment. If I ever do, please have the guts to tell me to my face that I shouldn't have kids, I'd welcome it.

 

[monarch64]

I just think it's super funny when people who don't work and didn't vote have such strong opinions about people's work/life ethic and how they voted

e

Ahahaha, well, why bother voting when you've worked so many years for what you have, have a few left to live and only care about maybe 3 other people besides yourself? What do you do then? Why, you buy very expensive watches and diamonds and mock the rest of the world, that's what! It's so strange to watch the dichotomy between people like Ruby who are actually fiscally conservative (as far as jewelry) and people like DF who live in most people's idea of the literal lap of luxury, unfold here. They're from different worlds, but each wants the American, capitalist dream for their children. They just refuse to admit that the scam they were sold from the beginning is crumbling before their very eyes...no, wait, never existed to begin with. Welcome to your solid seats in the middle class, guys. We still love you.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Uhhhh, because we don't have a one child limit here in the US? And by "traditional values" do you mean those that say don't educate children too much about sex because then they'll do it--make sure to emphasize that abstinence is best and expect everyone to follow through on that? I mean it's worked out SO WELL throughout history.

Wife and I were planning on having more kids, but too bad for us b/c we can't afford a 3rd child. We were young and stupid for not depending on taxpayer's $$$. We are proud parents of two young adult daughters who both graduated from college and working full time now.

 

[ruby59]

Do you think everyone has the ability to predict whether they will lose their job(s) or face undue hardship or know whether the child will have a disease that sucks up all of the family's resources? Do you think everyone who applies for aid and receives it had a baby simply because they thought they'd take advantage of the system? (Because babies are SO EASY, you know! Easy to transport in inclement weather in a stroller, easy to stuff on a bus or a train, or into a homeless shelter. Easy to take to job interviews.)

And let me get this straight: the only people ALLOWED to have children in this country are those who can AFFORD it on their own. Ok. Then the government doesn't need to pull funds from Planned Parenthood and the like, and the government CAN pay (hell, we ALL can, those of us who CAN afford to do so) for abortions when these awful terrible people go and get themselves pregnant knowing FULL WELL they can't afford it. Because I am sure that's their intent every time. I'm sure it has nothing to do with their education or lack thereof. I'm sure it has nothing to do with their own upbringing or lack thereof and the fact that they sometimes/many times think that at least a baby will depend on them and love them when no one else does.

Conservatives are far more in line with Margaret Sanger's way of thought than they even realize. How very ironic.

As to your first paragraph I am well aware that crap happens. And this is not whom I am referring to, and you know it.

As to those who had unhappy childhoods and just want someone to love and love them, I sympathize with them. But after the first one, someone needs to sit them down and say, enough, raise that baby but no more until you are in a better place to care for them.

But just making excuses for it has gone on too long.

 

[ruby59]

Some of us are married for over a decade, have kids, sh!t happens, and we find ourselves supporting them entirely on our own.

I should have just consulted a crystal ball and gotten rid of them, right? In those Planned Parenthoods you guys are so keen to shut down? Or maybe I should have remained celibate during my marriage?

I'm lucky that I don't need assistance at the moment. If I ever do, please have the guts to tell me to my face that I shouldn't have kids, I'd welcome it.

Elliot, I am assuming you were in a stable relationship when you had your kids.

Would you have had them after your Ex's true colors came out?

 

[OreoRosies86]

Elliot, I am assuming you were in a stable relationship when you had your kids.

Would you have had them after your Ex's true colors came out?

Ruby, have you ever been in an abusive relationship? Have you ever been married to an abuser? I'm not commenting on my relationship here I am asking you. Because you seem to have MANY opinions about it. As if women who have children with men who abuse them somehow just thought "Oh well!" and started cranking out children.

 

[ruby59]

e

Ahahaha, well, why bother voting when you've worked so many years for what you have, have a few left to live and only care about maybe 3 other people besides yourself? What do you do then? Why, you buy very expensive watches and diamonds and mock the rest of the world, that's what! It's so strange to watch the dichotomy between people like Ruby who are actually fiscally conservative (as far as jewelry) and people like DF who live in most people's idea of the literal lap of luxury, unfold here. They're from different worlds, but each wants the American, capitalist dream for their children. They just refuse to admit that the scam they were sold from the beginning is crumbling before their very eyes...no, wait, never existed to begin with. Welcome to your solid seats in the middle class, guys. We still love you.

Every parent wants their child to have more than they did.

But if the middle class is slowly crumbling, whose fault was that. 8 years of Obama, maybe.

And yes it did exist before him as I lived through it.

 

[ruby59]

Ruby, have you ever been in an abusive relationship? Have you ever been married to an abuser? I'm not commenting on my relationship here I am asking you. Because you seem to have MANY opinions about it. As if women who have children with men who abuse them somehow just thought "Oh well!" and started cranking out children.

Elliot didn't you read a past post to you where I alluded to my sister and the doufus she is married to?

And yes, some do have a baby with them, mistakenly believing it will improve the relationship. And when that does not help, they have yet another one.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Every parent wants their child to have more than they did.

But if the middle class is slowly crumbling, whose fault was that. 8 years of Obama, maybe.

And yes it did exist before him as I lived through it.

That's the way how Chinese parents feel. We want our kids to have a better lives than we did.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Elliot didn't you read a past post to you where I alluded to my sister and the doufus she is married to?

And yes, some do have a baby with them, mistakenly believing it will improve the relationship. And when that does not help, they have yet another one.

I don't even know where to start. Just because you KNOW a person who experienced something, does not mean YOU experienced it. And no, having a baby with an abuser has absolutely nothing to do with trying to "fix" the relationship. Are you out of your mind? Is this how you speak to your sister? I seriously hope not!

 

[ruby59]

I don't even know where to start. Just because you KNOW a person who experienced something, does not mean YOU experienced it. And no, having a baby with an abuser has absolutely nothing to do with trying to "fix" the relationship. Are you out of your mind? Is this how you speak to your sister? I seriously hope not!

Know a person? How about getting a phone call at 2 AM and going there in my pajamas to try and calm her own.

I am not pulling things out of a hat, Eliot. She admitted to doing this, twice.

I do not sugar coat it anymore, especially at 2 in the morning. Now I tell her the cold hard facts, hoping to get her to change her behavior and break the cycle. I wish I had done that before she stupidly had a second child with him.

 

[lovedogs]

I don't even know where to start. Just because you KNOW a person who experienced something, does not mean YOU experienced it. And no, having a baby with an abuser has absolutely nothing to do with trying to "fix" the relationship. Are you out of your mind? Is this how you speak to your sister? I seriously hope not!

Elliot, having also been in an abusive relationship, these ignorant and rude posts make me as angry as they make you. But engaging is pointless. There is no logic here, and a huge lack of understanding and empathy. I don't want to see you more upset

 

[OreoRosies86]

Elliot, having also been in an abusive relationship, these ignorant and rude posts make me as angry as they make you. But engaging is pointless. There is no logic here, and a huge lack of understanding and empathy. I don't want to see you more upset

The ignorance and sheer arrogance is astounding. WOW. And this is a person who volunteers on a crisis hotline? The mind reels.

 

[ruby59]

Elliot I was sharing something with you that I never thought I would on here. I was holding you up as a role model to my sister.

And it is thrown back in my face. I am done.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Elliot I was sharing something with you that I never thought I would on here. I was holding you up as a role model to my sister.

And it is thrown back in my face. I am done.

I'm glad you are done. Because blaming people for their abuse is sick.

 

[lovedogs]

The ignorance and sheer arrogance is astounding. WOW. And this is a person who volunteers on a crisis hotline? The mind reels.

I'm just going to drink tea, eat chocolate, and continue watching bad TV on netflix That way I can ignore the word vomit happening here. I recommend you doing something similar, but wish we could do it together (plus, I'd love to cuddle Oreo!!!!)

 

[OreoRosies86]

I'm just going to drink tea, eat chocolate, and continue watching bad TV on netflix That way I can ignore the word vomit happening here. I recommend you doing something similar, but wish we could do it together (plus, I'd love to cuddle Oreo!!!!)

Ugh, I feel like I need a shower. Woooooosahhhh.

Do love to snuggle with that cat. Hugs.

 

[ruby59]

I'm glad you are done. Because blaming people for their abuse is sick.

Is that how you interpreted it?

Why do you always think the worse of me?

 

[ruby59]

I'm just going to drink tea, eat chocolate, and continue watching bad TV on netflix That way I can ignore the word vomit happening here. I recommend you doing something similar, but wish we could do it together (plus, I'd love to cuddle Oreo!!!!)

You should have done that from the very beginning.

 

[House Cat]

I can think of so many scenarios where a spouse would be left abandoned with multiple children and might need some financial assistance. It isn't all about making babies to get on the welfare.

Furthermore, many people are living in conditions that we can't even comprehend. They are afraid for their lives on a daily basis because their neighborhoods are so violent. They are so poor that they don't know how they will pay their rent or buy food. There is very little comfort in a world such as this. People will seek out escape and comfort wherever they can. We all do it. Some people use food. Others might use retail therapy. Of course there is always drugs and alcohol. One of the biggest sources of comfort a human being has is sexual contact. The fact is, while living under these violent and fear inducing conditions, these people will be hard wired to seek out comfort where they can. Sex will always be a big one. The most logical thing we can do is provide services to prevent unwanted pregnancies. Unless, of course, we would like to vote to put programs into place to eliminate lower level living and allow these people to truly thrive....

 

[E B]

Elliot, having also been in an abusive relationship, these ignorant and rude posts make me as angry as they make you. But engaging is pointless. There is no logic here, and a huge lack of understanding and empathy. I don't want to see you more upset

The longer we sit on this merry-go-round, the more I realize how large a factor this is. Being able to really and truly see the grays between the black and white. Considering the grays vs. going to or feeling comfortable immediately pointing to the black and white.

Remember, sympathy and empathy are two different things. Some truly cannot see, or understand, the shades of gray. And that's as gently as I can put it. It is probably one of, if not THE biggest snag in these political discussions. Possibly in our political climate.

 

[siamese3]

Ruby, I genuinely get so frustrated reading your posts. You seem to play the victim, over and over, casting blame on progressives, liberals, Obama... chiding and scolding for name calling and intolerance for other points of view, but I can't help but feel that you exhibit many of the behaviors you constantly "call out" yourself. I am not trying to pick a fight with you, but you seem so angry most of the time. Then, I will read a post of yours that seems to come from somewhere else (viewpoint) altogether where you have a constrained and very civil conversation with a poster, even if it's a poster you normally argue with relentlessly. Maybe it's just the subject of politics that is the problem.

 

[AnnaH]

Online discussions are inherently difficult because just words on a screen isn't the best form of such personal communication. We all know this.
Maybe Ruby's intent isn't to offend, and maybe others' intent isn't to gang up on her.
Peace

 

[Arkteia]

I would never blame the kids. I'm will always point my finger at the irresponsible parents. Why are they bringing babies into this world if they can't afford to support them? What happened to our traditional values?

Sometimes, sad to say, because their moms did it and they do not see any other way of life. But it goes in parallel with jobs disappearing from areas. I once worked in a, place that used to have microbreweries. Later they were bought by Sam Adams, I think, and closed, thus cutting people off their main source of income.
Fast forward - when many years down the road I was watching inhabitants of West Baltimore burning their own city during the riots, I understood how it could happen. History of West Baltimore was exactly the same as that of the place I worked in - W. Baltimore was a normal blue-collar community, till the steel mills were closed in the 80-es, with no more job coming. All the rest that you see in these communities, drugs, moms on welfare, crime - comes out of deep-rooted hopelessness. You see the same in Detroit. I think traditional values work in places where life is still traditional - you earn your daily bread. If life somehow has been uprooted by no jobs in the area, watch how rapidly traditional values get thrown out of the window. The fact that the older generation, the one that had been laid off still finds the energy to find some scanty jobs, but younger people who grew up in job-poor areas do not have the mindset to do it probably gives credence to what I think.

 

[Arkteia]

Not sure about elsewhere, but in our schools, children are fed breakfast and lunch.

And the ones who go to after care, are fed dinner and given meals to take home for the weekend.

And I am sure this is not unique to our school system.

In our school district, too, but there are not many such kids. I am speaking about the new bills being signed, and how it would affect the kids.
The way I see it, unless there are blue-collar jobs brought back into the country, the haves have to support the have nots, and not blame them for being such. Even relocation from job-poor areas is difficult because of obvious discrepancy in housing prices.