Reliability of Idealscope

[mr.sparkles]

I recently contacted icestore in reference to a few diamonds which I am interested in.

I requested GIA information and Idealscope, but I was informed that they don''t believe in Idealscope because it''s too easy for things to go wrong and give an incorrect result. I believe they said something along the lines of if the light source is too bright/not bright enough, or if the Diamond is held at a slight angle to the lens.

I realize not every Diamond vendor is going to have Idealscope pictures, but I was wondering then: how valid is Idealscope? Can you trust it at all, or is it more just an extra piece of information that you don''t rely so heavily on. TIA.

 

[valeria101]

Any pictures can go wrong. And the two conditions they mentioned (lighting and tilt) had to be dealt with by all those sellers (and buyers) who do take IS pictures. Some did it...

Using it yourself may be easier than taking pictures.


Have you seen THIS? (The ''idealscope'' clip).


I don''t think the IS is useless, but without a certified standard environment for sellers to take their pictures, no wonder there are more problems for them to use it than there are for you. There''s more, I suppose, that makes the IS use by sellers difficult. Garry should have a long list of such reasons on record by now

My 2C

 

[JohnQuixote]

Date: 12/6/2005 3:17:14 PM
Author:mr.sparkles

I recently contacted icestore in reference to a few diamonds which I am interested in.

I requested GIA information and Idealscope, but I was informed that they don''t believe in Idealscope because it''s too easy for things to go wrong and give an incorrect result. I believe they said something along the lines of if the light source is too bright/not bright enough, or if the Diamond is held at a slight angle to the lens.

I realize not every Diamond vendor is going to have Idealscope pictures, but I was wondering then: how valid is Idealscope? Can you trust it at all, or is it more just an extra piece of information that you don''t rely so heavily on. TIA.

Reflectors such as firescope, ideal-scope and ASET are the oldest and most proven tools for judging a round diamond''s performance potential. They have no moving parts and assess the diamond in simple, natural terms. The AGS developed ASET for use in their new cut grading metric for light performance.

Any such tool can be used poorly, but if the diamond is level and the girdle is flush with the bottom of the scope you will get a good indication of overall performance. With the light too bright or dim you may get a washed out or dark image. Even so, you will still be able to discern areas of leakage because they appear whiter/lighter than surrounding hues. When taking a photograph proper exposure and focal depth are important for resolution - and if the photo is a good one you can also tell many aspects about the crown''s (and overall) optical symmetry.

An ideal-scope photograph simply shows what areas of a diamond return light to the viewer’s eye and what areas do not. It''s not for hair-splitting analysis, but you can tell whether the diamond is top quality as opposed to average or poor.

Video on this page showing how it is used.

 

[perry]

I don''t believe that their really is a good - off the shelf - system for IdealScope photography. The vendors that I have talked to that take pictures had to tinker with a few things on the optical end (correct lens, focal lenght, holders for the diamond, etc). Yet, anyone interested in doing so has been able to profide suitable photographs of their diamonds without all that much effort. I do note, that most of those shops also tend to sell on the net almost exclusively well cut diamonds (although they may sell more average ones in their store).

I do not belive that any valid claim can be made that "it is to easy for things to go wrong." I do belive that many a vendor feels that with the idealscope - it is to easy for a customer to see the truth.... shich is why you do not see them on display or available in most diamond stores (NiceIce has a firescope for its customers to use).

Perry

ps: have you purchased your own idealscope yet: great for verifying things yourself (I also recommend the light table).

 

[squarediamondlove]

I agree,

Just got my idealscope last month and I have to say I will never purchase another diamond without it. You use it to weed out the average cut stones. But the idealscope doesn't really lie. Yes I did notice the results differ if you move into a different lighting conditions and I understand that jewelers may feel frustrated with using it b/c they may not get the best image out of it. However, some kind of image is better than no image. If the stone is bad, its bad and its clear on the idealscope. It also gives you a great idea of the symmetry of the stone, which is someting that you may not realize right away by just looking at it. Idealsocpe lets you see things or makes clear things you otherwise would have a hard time seeing.

My opinion. They may just not feel that confident about their diamonds and may not want to send idealscope image of it. Any laymen can tell a nice idealscope image form an un-nice, however not many people can tell right away which is a better stone by looking at them with the naked eye. If it is a great stone, what would they have to fear in sending you an image? Too much red, lol?

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 12/6/2005 3:17:14 PM
Author:mr.sparkles
I recently contacted icestore in reference to a few diamonds which I am interested in.

I requested GIA information and Idealscope, but I was informed that they don''t believe in Idealscope because it''s too easy for things to go wrong and give an incorrect result. it is very hard for them to make a bad stone look good, and nearly impossible to make a good stone look bad unless they have way too strong a backlight - and they need not be rocket scientists to work that out. I believe they said something along the lines of if the light source is too bright/not bright enough, or if the Diamond is held at a slight angle to the lens. if the diamond is not straight on then the symmetry will not look so good.

I realize not every Diamond vendor is going to have Idealscope pictures, but I was wondering then: how valid is Idealscope? Can you trust it at all, or is it more just an extra piece of information that you don''t rely so heavily on. TIA. They can simply tell you if it looks good or bad, knowing that for $25 you can see if they are honest and return the stone if it is not as promised.

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Date: 12/6/2005 8:08:27 PM
Author: perry
I don''t believe that their really is a good - off the shelf - system for IdealScope photography. Perry

ps: have you purchased your own idealscope yet: great for verifying things yourself (I also recommend the light table).

http://ideal-scope.com/manuf_iscapture.asp
This system comes with automatic computer interface software and a manual on how to set it up.
· Auto Cropping - no wasted Photoshop time
· High quality Print or fast loading Web images
· Images automatically named and filed
· Use your own report numbers

Use the Ideal-Scope Light Use "Natural Light"
· Place stone in the tray
· Place pink reflector over the stone
· Orientate stone
· Mouse click- photo is cropped & filed · Remove pink reflector
· Position white reflector
· Slide black background in place
· Click the mouse - photo is filed



Photograph all shapes and sizes from 5mm to 8.3mm*
(*this range will extend in the near future to 15mm)

Ideal-Scope RPS Software $1,500 Extra Components Required
Ideal-Scope Components $100 (approx prices - obtain from quality camera store)
Diamond trays with 3 different seat sizes

System works with Canon G5 or Canon G6 camera
US $500 - $700
Reflector templates Manfrotto copy stand US $185
Ideal-Scope reflector Cabin CL-5000N Light US $150
Macro Lenses (2) US $280
G5 Lens Adapter or G6 Adapter US $50

 

[perry]

Garry:

Looks like you have refined the system from before. I had talked to several vendors when I started looking and they indicated that they had to "tinker" with your system back then to get it to work well.

Perry

 

[Garry H (Cut Nut)]

Maybe they are finding ways to dim the light etc Perry