Re: disappointment......

[oobiecoo]

I''m sorry you are dissapointed about your anniversary. My parents and I have always celebrated holidays together but I have to say that we have never celebrated their anniversary. I always think of it as more of "their thing" and I''ve just never done anything festive for it. Also, because my parents and I ALWAYS spent holidays together, I feel like I am still trying to break free from them and do my own thing. I didn''t visit for my dad or mom''s birthdays this year and I thought they were going to have a heart attack. Do you think its possible that she is still trying to assert her independence? Maybe I am just overanalyzing things way too much but that is how I feel about my family

Its also possible that she just didn''t realize how important this is to you. Congratulations though!

 

[diamondfan]

I think it depends how the family has celebrated in the past, what their traditions had been. Some might include all the kids etc, some might not.

To me, it might be more private generally but those milestones, especially a people are getting older, are amazing and should be noted.

But it seems the anni was sort of the last issue, that you have been feeling pushed aside and sort of neglected for a while.

I would say it is a good catalyst for starting a discussion with her, you can start with it and segue to the other things from there. It gives it some focus to start with.

 

[luckystar112]

Date: 4/7/2008 12:51:26 AM
Author: diamondfan
I think it depends how the family has celebrated in the past, what their traditions had been. Some might include all the kids etc, some might not.

To me, it might be more private generally but those milestones, especially a people are getting older, are amazing and should be noted.

But it seems the anni was sort of the last issue, that you have been feeling pushed aside and sort of neglected for a while.

I would say it is a good catalyst for starting a discussion with her, you can start with it and segue to the other things from there. It gives it some focus to start with.

I agree with DF!
There is no reason why you should not have at least had a phone call. Especially since you say that your family has always been big on celebrating occasions. I can see why you''re hurt, Isaku.

I would be too.
I hope that the email with your daughter opens up the communication, but honestly...I really feel she should have known better, 45 is such a milestone!

Congratulations Isaku, I hope you had a wonderful day with your husband and a lovely visit from your son!

 

[isaku5]

Date: 4/7/2008 12:49:10 AM
Author: oobiecoo
I''m sorry you are dissapointed about your anniversary. My parents and I have always celebrated holidays together but I have to say that we have never celebrated their anniversary. I always think of it as more of ''their thing'' and I''ve just never done anything festive for it. Also, because my parents and I ALWAYS spent holidays together, I feel like I am still trying to break free from them and do my own thing. I didn''t visit for my dad or mom''s birthdays this year and I thought they were going to have a heart attack. Do you think its possible that she is still trying to assert her independence? Maybe I am just overanalyzing things way too much but that is how I feel about my family

Its also possible that she just didn''t realize how important this is to you. Congratulations though!

I can understand the "breaking free" thing only from an intellectual point of view, but personally, it would break my heart. So please go easy with them as they may be just as hurt as I was yesterday.

 

[isaku5]

Absolutely, DF. In the earlier years, they didn''t always celebrate with us, but with milestones 25 plus every 5 years, I think it''s important that your parents'' be acknowledged. All I expected, really, was a phone call. As you''ve suggested DF, we have very much felt shoved to the side since their marriage 10+ years ago, but trying to be good parents and stay out of their business, we stood aside and let it go on while DD was studying for her accountancy papers.

There is a cultural sub-current here as well. His family is Greek and they celebrate even more things than I could have dreamt up. His parents were deathly afraid that they were losing their only son; instead, it was our loss. There are three kids (two girls and one boy)in their family two of whom are married to Canadians. Unfortunately, our other Canadian member has lost both his parents to illness, so we are definitely outside their loop.

His parents have a home in Greece that they visit for 6 months every year leaving after Orthodox Easter in April and returning in October. You would think that our family could and would celebrate like crazy during their absence. Well, think again. DD and family are off to their cottage every weekend with friends. Our family is invited for the long holiday weekend in August. That''s fine with me as it''s on an island accessible only by boat. Getting in and out of that boat is becoming more and more difficult, but DD, DH and DS manage to get me out and in. Fibromyalgia is one of three arthritic goodies I''ve picked up along the way. We have one heck of a good time and go home as happy as clams. The vino helps.

I realize now, maybe too late, that I was wrong to step aside for 10 years as it''s now being interpreted as acceptable. Sad lesson learned the hard way

Well, I did what I thought was right at the time.

Anyway, thanks to all of you, I will make arrangements for a much-needed (for me, anyway) discussion.

 

[ephemery1]

Date: 4/7/2008 12:49:10 AM
Author: oobiecoo
I'm sorry you are dissapointed about your anniversary. My parents and I have always celebrated holidays together but I have to say that we have never celebrated their anniversary. I always think of it as more of 'their thing' and I've just never done anything festive for it. Also, because my parents and I ALWAYS spent holidays together, I feel like I am still trying to break free from them and do my own thing. I didn't visit for my dad or mom's birthdays this year and I thought they were going to have a heart attack. Do you think its possible that she is still trying to assert her independence? Maybe I am just overanalyzing things way too much but that is how I feel about my family

Its also possible that she just didn't realize how important this is to you. Congratulations though!

Just wanted to add that Oobiecoo's post really resonated with me. Unfortunately there are no instruction manuals for how to handle the transition that comes when we break free of our original families and begin to form our own, and it can be very hard on both the parents AND the grown children to learn how to handle this. Especially when we are trying to please parents on BOTH sides. Lots of hurt and pain and resentment, and it is not only exhausting, but can be very detrimental to the new marriage. We are trying to establish our own ways of doing things as a new family, but simultaneously trying to wade through DOUBLE the amount of pre-existing tradition/expectation/obligation. It's really, really, really hard.

I mentioned before that we've been having a lot of communication issues with DH's parents lately, largely around these issues. They are VERY concerned with exactly how much time we spend with them, vs. my parents, to the point of keeping a running tally (which is often based on incorrect assumptions)!

Now that they've begun to slow down and approach retirement, they have more free time and like to spend it at their vacation home in a retirement golf community. They are VERY offended and confused about why we don't choose to spend more weekends at the golf community with them (3 hrs from us)... even though we go there at least once every 4-6 weeks, and see them other times in between those trips as well. It doesn't help that DH is an only child, so they put all the responsibility for their happiness on his shoulders. The one time he tried to gently bring up the fact that being an only child can be challenging, they told him angrily that "you need to let go of that".

My parents, on the other hand, also love spending time with us... but rather than resent the time we don't have, they've made an active choice to simply appreciate the time we DO have. It makes it MUCH more enjoyable for us to be around them (no worries about obligation/expection), and it makes it much more pleasant for them as well! They spent 28 years raising their 3 children, and now that they're reaching their "slowing down" years and we're reaching our "growing new families" years, they're choosing to focus more on themselves as a couple... time spent with their kids is a bonus, not a necessity for their happiness. Just a very, very subtle shift in perspective that has worked wonders for easing that transition I talked about before. And highlights what MovieZombie said earlier... if you're going to allow other people to determine your level of happiness, you have to be prepared for disappointment. To me (and my parents), it is much more satisfying to take it into my own hands.

Just wanted to share a bit of my perspective on all this... in case it adds any insight.

ETA -- Another thing worth mentioning is that I strongly believe not all relationships are, or should be, equal in all ways. Just like a relationship with one child might be different from a relationship with another, or one friendship is different than another, there is no reason to presume that a couple's relationship with one set of parents is going to be exactly the same as the relationship with the other set. Because there are ALWAYS other factors at play. So comparisons as to how much time is spent where, are not actually relevant... and definitely not helpful. If we could all just focus on making each relationship feel happy and healthy for what it is, rather than for what it is in comparison with another, we'd be a LOT happier as family members.

 

[ladypirate]

Date: 4/7/2008 12:19:44 PM
Author: ephemery1

Date: 4/7/2008 12:49:10 AM

Author: oobiecoo

I''m sorry you are dissapointed about your anniversary. My parents and I have always celebrated holidays together but I have to say that we have never celebrated their anniversary. I always think of it as more of ''their thing'' and I''ve just never done anything festive for it. Also, because my parents and I ALWAYS spent holidays together, I feel like I am still trying to break free from them and do my own thing. I didn''t visit for my dad or mom''s birthdays this year and I thought they were going to have a heart attack. Do you think its possible that she is still trying to assert her independence? Maybe I am just overanalyzing things way too much but that is how I feel about my family

Its also possible that she just didn''t realize how important this is to you. Congratulations though!

Just wanted to add that Oobiecoo''s post really resonated with me. Unfortunately there are no instruction manuals for how to handle the transition that comes when we break free of our original families and begin to form our own, and it can be very hard on both the parents AND the grown children to learn how to handle this. Especially when we are trying to please parents on BOTH sides. Lots of hurt and pain and resentment, and it is not only exhausting, but can be very detrimental to the new marriage. We are trying to establish our own ways of doing things as a new family, but simultaneously trying to wade through DOUBLE the amount of pre-existing tradition/expectation/obligation. It''s really, really, really hard.

I mentioned before that we''ve been having a lot of communication issues with DH''s parents lately, largely around these issues. They are VERY concerned with exactly how much time we spend with them, vs. my parents, to the point of keeping a running tally (which is often based on incorrect assumptions)!

Now that they''ve begun to slow down and approach retirement, they have more free time and like to spend it at their vacation home in a retirement golf community. They are VERY offended and confused about why we don''t choose to spend more weekends at the golf community with them (3 hrs from us)... even though we go there at least once every 4-6 weeks, and see them other times in between those trips as well. It doesn''t help that DH is an only child, so they put all the responsibility for their happiness on his shoulders. The one time he tried to gently bring up the fact that being an only child can be challenging, they told him angrily that ''you need to let go of that''.

My parents, on the other hand, also love spending time with us... but rather than resent the time we don''t have, they''ve made an active choice to simply appreciate the time we DO have. It makes it MUCH more enjoyable for us to be around them (no worries about obligation/expection), and it makes it much more pleasant for them as well! They spent 28 years raising their 3 children, and now that they''re reaching their ''slowing down'' years and we''re reaching our ''growing new families'' years, they''re choosing to focus more on themselves as a couple... time spent with their kids is a bonus, not a necessity for their happiness. Just a very, very subtle shift in perspective that has worked wonders for easing that transition I talked about before. And highlights what MovieZombie said earlier... if you''re going to allow other people to determine your level of happiness, you have to be prepared for disappointment. To me (and my parents), it is much more satisfying to take it into my own hands.


Just wanted to share a bit of my perspective on all this... in case it adds any insight.

ETA -- Another thing worth mentioning is that I strongly believe not all relationships are, or should be, equal in all ways. Just like a relationship with one child might be different from a relationship with another, or one friendship is different than another, there is no reason to presume that a couple''s relationship with one set of parents is going to be exactly the same as the relationship with the other set. Because there are ALWAYS other factors at play. So comparisons as to how much time is spent where, are not actually relevant... and definitely not helpful. If we could all just focus on making each relationship feel happy and healthy for what it is, rather than for what it is in comparison with another, we''d be a LOT happier as family members.

I''ve been lurking on this thread for the last couple of days, and i just wanted to say that this last post resonates with me. Once kids reach adulthood, it can be so difficult to redefine the parent-child relationship. BF and I are both super lucky because our parents are really low-key, but many of my friends are having more problems relating to their parents now than they did in high school.

Isaku, I''m glad you''ll be speaking with your daughter. I think that laying it out on the table is the only way for everyone to be on the same page here. Good luck with your talk and a BIG congratulations on 45 years!

 

[isaku5]

I have read every word of everyone''s post, and I appreciate all the different points of perspective.

I really don''t want posters thinking that we are demanding quality time for x number of hours per month. That''s not the way it is at all! Would we have liked a family get-together to celebrate our 45th? The obvious answer is "yes"; however, the fault lies with me in not verbalizing that wish as I''m 99% sure everyone would have come to share the celebration had we put forward the invitation.

My mother was very demanding and verbalized her wishes; I like the obedient child I was, obeyed. DH''s mom was an angel who, in her later years, made lots of coffee and dessert every Sunday hoping someone would drop in. Knowing that she did this no matter what we said, we dropped in quite often because she was always so happy to see us. As she lived alone in her little ranch house well into her late 80''s, either one of us would check on her daily: a visit or phone call or both.

On behalf of all the older parents, I''d just like to say, " We raised you to be the successful, kind, loving people you are now. Please don''t step on our hearts."

 

[phoenixgirl]

Isabel,

Congratulations on 45 years! That is wonderful!

It''s easy to say, oh, you should just tell them how you feel, but that''s definitely not how it works in my family. We just drop hints, and worse case scenario you tell somebody to tell the person for you. Actually, as I am getting older I have tried to break this cycle and just tell them when something is bothering me, but we''re just not used to doing it and it''s always awkward.

Several years ago I remember my dad dropping all these hints that he wanted a 35th anniversary surprise party. I was only 22 at the time, so I guess I figured that my 29 and 31 year old big sister and brother should be the ones to get the ball rolling. So it came and went. This past year was their 40th, and we did throw them a surprise party. Even that was a hassle because while my sister and I were all for making it a special night, my sister-in-law kept trying to make it as cheap as possible (she wanted to have a nice affair that people were flying from far away places to attend in a rec hall!). In the end it was only $3,000 to have 50 people for dinner at a nice-ish restaurant, and split between three siblings that seemed like quite a reasonable amount to spend for a really special gift. But anyway, I digress . . .

My parents knew they were going out to dinner with my brother and sister but thought I was too busy to attend. To throw them off the scent, DH and I spent the weekend prior with them in NYC where they met, even eating at the restaurant where they had their first date. But what surprised me is that during the surprise party, some of my dad''s friends told me how he was complaining that DH and I were blowing off the family dinner that weekend (a 4.5 hour drive for us) even though we had spent the prior one with them (and the family dinner was just a ploy to get them there -- "Oh, we''ll happen to be in town this weekend. Let''s go out for our joint anniversaries" -- not something my parents asked us to do).

Yes, it was all part of the plan, but if there was no surprise I might have missed the actual anniversary knowing I had spent a whole weekend with them already to celebrate. The friends were only telling me this because it was so funny for them to hear my dad complain when they knew there was a surprise party in store, but it still surprised me a little because I would have never known that would upset my dad. (He even complained to me and DH about my siblings wanting to go on this dinner to beginn with because he wasn''t relishing the thought of being with four small children in a restaurant -- not knowing we would have a private room, of coruse). I can only imagine what kind of complaining goes on that we never catch wind of! But I guess I like to complain too -- that my parents always plan things with my brother and sister and assume I''ll be free too and often forget to invite/inform me until the last minute, and that whenever we travel together they tell story after story about what a brat I was on trips as a tween and teen, etc. One of the confrontations I had recently was how my mother NEVER calls me, but when I call her she''ll say something like, "We were wondering when we''d hear from you!" So I told her to just call me, but she said I was always grumpy when she called so she found it best to let me call her. Yes, this was when I was in college and was living on my own for the first time . . . and I graduated six years ago! Perhaps I''ve become better at sounding chipper upon answering the phone since then!

I guess my point is that even in the best families where there is a lot of love, there can be misunderstandings. I don''t think your daughter understood how important your anniversary was to you. I think she was oblivious, not willfully neglecting you. Perhaps you can start dropping hints now for a 50th blow-out? DIL might be a good person to mention your secret wish to. Or maybe we should all just grow up and say what we''re thinking? I''m really trying to. It''s much better to say what we want rather than complain about the person without doing anything to change the situation. That''s what I want my parents to learn, and what I want to practice myself.

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 4/7/2008 3:28:07 PM
Author: isaku5
On behalf of all the older parents, I'd just like to say, ' We raised you to be the successful, kind, loving people you are now. Please don't step on our hearts.'

Oh, this is so sad...I have to agree with you, isaku. I am young and not married yet (I'm engaged), but I have 3 older siblings who are married with kids, and one of them never does anything with the rest of the family. I know it hurts my parents' feelings, and it hurts me and my other siblings' feelings as well. Plus my parents are awesome and we all have a great time when we get together (including this sibling when they do come), so there are no weird issues there. I've come to the conclusion that this older sibling and their spouse is just plain selfish and self-absorbed...sad but true.

I also don't understand what oobiecoo was saying about adult children trying to "assert their independence." I mean, you're an adult, possibly married with children...what is there to assert? I actually think it's pretty hurtful to purposefully not go home for your parents' birthdays just for the sake of asserting your independence, especially when it's clearly important to them. They're your parents and they raised you...how would you feel if they skipped your birthday because they were asserting their independence from their children and establishing themselves as empty nesters? Obviously if they treat you badly that's one thing, but otherwise, I just don't get it. I'm not trying to attack you, but that was my first thought-how hurt they must have been.

 

[isaku5]

Date: 4/7/2008 6:51:45 PM
Author: thing2of2

Date: 4/7/2008 3:28:07 PM
Author: isaku5
On behalf of all the older parents, I'd just like to say, ' We raised you to be the successful, kind, loving people you are now. Please don't step on our hearts.'

Oh, this is so sad...I have to agree with you, isaku. I am young and not married yet (I'm engaged), but I have 3 older siblings who are married with kids, and one of them never does anything with the rest of the family. I know it hurts my parents' feelings, and it hurts me and my other siblings' feelings as well. Plus my parents are awesome and we all have a great time when we get together (including this sibling when they do come), so there are no weird issues there. I've come to the conclusion that this older sibling and their spouse is just plain selfish and self-absorbed...sad but true.

I also don't understand what oobiecoo was saying about adult children trying to 'assert their independence.' I mean, you're an adult, possibly married with children...what is there to assert? I actually think it's pretty hurtful to purposefully not go home for your parents' birthdays just for the sake of asserting your independence, especially when it's clearly important to them. They're your parents and they raised you...how would you feel if they skipped your birthday because they were asserting their independence from their children and establishing themselves as empty nesters? Obviously if they treat you badly that's one thing, but otherwise, I just don't get it. I'm not trying to attack you, but that was my first thought-how hurt they must have been.

Since I had sent the e-mail last night, I expected some sort of response today. Well, I got it at about 5pm on her way home from work. Her comment that I thought about you guys several times during the day yesterday, but was too busy to pick up the phone: they were cleaning out their basement as it was a "6 garbage bags allowed day", and doing income tax. Please let's talk on the phone about these things because e-mails are hard to interpret. Fine with me.

I said that I wanted to get together and have "a meeting of the minds" so that we both know what's going on and there would be no more hurt feelings. I asked her to name a place and time and told her that I'd be there. Her response was that she'd have to get back to me on that. I'm fine with that too.

I also said that for every weddiing anniversary, and significant birthday, from here on we'd like to get together. Long pause at her end. Then, the inevitable question, Why? My answer: after a certain number of years, you really aren't sure what's going to happen in a year. Her response: now you're sounding like my in-laws. My response: yep! Her next question, How do you know that something won't happen to us? My response: very true; but the odds are against us.

I followed up with: When could we come and see you and your family? Her answer: Wednesdays are good.

Did I make any progress? I don't think so . As for getting together for a heart-to-heart? I'll wait a week, and then bring up the subject again. For an intelligent young woman, she sure can be "thick". I know that many accountants think only in numbers and leave very little space for sentiment. She used to be sensitive. What happened?? I must have missed something along the way.

In all honesty, by that time, I was sick of all the avoidance of dates and places, and the phone was running out of power, so I said, Well, let's get together soon. Her reply: Okay, Bye!

To all you English teachers out there, I apologize for the format above, I know better, but haven't got the energy to do better..today.

 

[oobiecoo]

Date: 4/7/2008 6:51:45 PM
Author: thing2of2

Date: 4/7/2008 3:28:07 PM
Author: isaku5
On behalf of all the older parents, I''d just like to say, '' We raised you to be the successful, kind, loving people you are now. Please don''t step on our hearts.''

Oh, this is so sad...I have to agree with you, isaku. I am young and not married yet (I''m engaged), but I have 3 older siblings who are married with kids, and one of them never does anything with the rest of the family. I know it hurts my parents'' feelings, and it hurts me and my other siblings'' feelings as well. Plus my parents are awesome and we all have a great time when we get together (including this sibling when they do come), so there are no weird issues there. I''ve come to the conclusion that this older sibling and their spouse is just plain selfish and self-absorbed...sad but true.

I also don''t understand what oobiecoo was saying about adult children trying to ''assert their independence.'' I mean, you''re an adult, possibly married with children...what is there to assert? I actually think it''s pretty hurtful to purposefully not go home for your parents'' birthdays just for the sake of asserting your independence, especially when it''s clearly important to them. They''re your parents and they raised you...how would you feel if they skipped your birthday because they were asserting their independence from their children and establishing themselves as empty nesters? Obviously if they treat you badly that''s one thing, but otherwise, I just don''t get it. I''m not trying to attack you, but that was my first thought-how hurt they must have been.

Its not that I have the time and money to visit and simply refuse... I have alot going on in my life right now and really couldn''t take the time to be with them. I am an only child (kind of) so there has always been so much pressure on me to be there for thanksgiving, christmas, mothers day, etc because if I don''t go, no one else will be there with them. However, with my life becoming more and more hectic, they simply have to realize that sometimes I CANT be there and they will need to celebrate by themselves. I know I am not the only person who feels this way...

 

[isaku5]

Date: 4/7/2008 7:33:28 PM
Author: oobiecoo

Date: 4/7/2008 6:51:45 PM
Author: thing2of2

Date: 4/7/2008 3:28:07 PM
Author: isaku5
On behalf of all the older parents, I''d just like to say, '' We raised you to be the successful, kind, loving people you are now. Please don''t step on our hearts.''

Oh, this is so sad...I have to agree with you, isaku. I am young and not married yet (I''m engaged), but I have 3 older siblings who are married with kids, and one of them never does anything with the rest of the family. I know it hurts my parents'' feelings, and it hurts me and my other siblings'' feelings as well. Plus my parents are awesome and we all have a great time when we get together (including this sibling when they do come), so there are no weird issues there. I''ve come to the conclusion that this older sibling and their spouse is just plain selfish and self-absorbed...sad but true.

I also don''t understand what oobiecoo was saying about adult children trying to ''assert their independence.'' I mean, you''re an adult, possibly married with children...what is there to assert? I actually think it''s pretty hurtful to purposefully not go home for your parents'' birthdays just for the sake of asserting your independence, especially when it''s clearly important to them. They''re your parents and they raised you...how would you feel if they skipped your birthday because they were asserting their independence from their children and establishing themselves as empty nesters? Obviously if they treat you badly that''s one thing, but otherwise, I just don''t get it. I''m not trying to attack you, but that was my first thought-how hurt they must have been.

Its not that I have the time and money to visit and simply refuse... I have alot going on in my life right now and really couldn''t take the time to be with them. I am an only child (kind of) so there has always been so much pressure on me to be there for thanksgiving, christmas, mothers day, etc because if I don''t go, no one else will be there with them. However, with my life becoming more and more hectic, they simply have to realize that sometimes I CANT be there and they will need to celebrate by themselves. I know I am not the only person who feels this way...

Oh, oobiecoo, I couldn''t disagree with you more!!! I kind of let the "asserting your independence thing" go, but I just have to address your issues:

Asserting your own independence: By all means, do that, just not on special family days. You''ve got about 300 days a year to asset youself. Do it then!!

You''re too busy??!!!Your life is too hectic??!! Really! We''re all given 24 hours in a day: prioritize, young lady

My heart bleeds for you having to attend Thanksgiving, Christmas, etc. Were your parents too busy while you were growing up to observe these holidays? I doubt it very much!!

I don''t wish you any ill will, but remember what you''ve said here when your kids throw it back at you. You know that "karma thing: it just might work against you.

 

[isaku5]

PS " I know I''m not the only person to feel this way"

Great!! You and the others who agree with you will be able to spend quality time when your kids leave you high and dry. Enjoy!

I''d say something about spoiled ****** here, but I''ll restrain myself.

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 4/7/2008 7:48:22 PM
Author: isaku5

Date: 4/7/2008 7:33:28 PM

Author: oobiecoo

Date: 4/7/2008 6:51:45 PM

Author: thing2of2

Date: 4/7/2008 3:28:07 PM

Author: isaku5

On behalf of all the older parents, I''d just like to say, '' We raised you to be the successful, kind, loving people you are now. Please don''t step on our hearts.''

Oh, this is so sad...I have to agree with you, isaku. I am young and not married yet (I''m engaged), but I have 3 older siblings who are married with kids, and one of them never does anything with the rest of the family. I know it hurts my parents'' feelings, and it hurts me and my other siblings'' feelings as well. Plus my parents are awesome and we all have a great time when we get together (including this sibling when they do come), so there are no weird issues there. I''ve come to the conclusion that this older sibling and their spouse is just plain selfish and self-absorbed...sad but true.

I also don''t understand what oobiecoo was saying about adult children trying to ''assert their independence.'' I mean, you''re an adult, possibly married with children...what is there to assert? I actually think it''s pretty hurtful to purposefully not go home for your parents'' birthdays just for the sake of asserting your independence, especially when it''s clearly important to them. They''re your parents and they raised you...how would you feel if they skipped your birthday because they were asserting their independence from their children and establishing themselves as empty nesters? Obviously if they treat you badly that''s one thing, but otherwise, I just don''t get it. I''m not trying to attack you, but that was my first thought-how hurt they must have been.

Its not that I have the time and money to visit and simply refuse... I have alot going on in my life right now and really couldn''t take the time to be with them. I am an only child (kind of) so there has always been so much pressure on me to be there for thanksgiving, christmas, mothers day, etc because if I don''t go, no one else will be there with them. However, with my life becoming more and more hectic, they simply have to realize that sometimes I CANT be there and they will need to celebrate by themselves. I know I am not the only person who feels this way...

Oh, oobiecoo, I couldn''t disagree with you more!!! I kind of let the ''asserting your independence thing'' go, but I just have to address your issues:

Asserting your own independence: By all means, do that, just not on special family days. You''ve got about 300 days a year to asset youself. Do it then!!

You''re too busy??!!!Your life is too hectic??!! Really! We''re all given 24 hours in a day: prioritize, young lady

My heart bleeds for you having to attend Thanksgiving, Christmas, etc. Were your parents too busy while you were growing up to observe these holidays? I doubt it very much!!

I don''t wish you any ill will, but remember what you''ve said here when your kids throw it back at you. You know that ''karma thing: it just might work against you.

Yeah, I completely agree with you, isaku. I don''t mean to gang up on you oobiecoo, but your parents won''t always be here. I seriously dread the day that I don''t have both of them to go visit, and sometimes when I feel like just sitting on my butt at my house instead of making the 1 hour drive to sit on my butt at my parents'' house, that thought gets me up and going.

I just find it hard to believe that life is too hectic to spend 10 special days a year hanging out with your parents...2 birthdays, Mother''s and Father''s day, Easter, Thanksgiving, Christmas Day...that''s only 7, actually. It might be a good idea to rethink your priorities. I''m sure your parents have always been there for you when you needed them or wanted them around.

God, I sound like a mom and I''m only 26! But in my opinion, family should always come first. Life isn''t really that hectic.

 

[lyra]

Happy belated anniversary Isabel!

I have so many thoughts about this situation, by they are all coloured by events that happened in *my* life that probably wouldn''t even be relevant to you. We are celebrating our 25th anniversary this year. One daughter is likely to want to do something special, as that is just her way. The other is mostly clueless about sentimentality in general. They''re just like night and day. I was wondering if your son and daughter and their spouses all get along well together. Perhaps there is some resentment in there somewhere. Your DDIL sounds like a real doll, you''re so lucky to have her.

I''m also wondering if your daughter''s husband is controlling? I''ve seen this situation, and maybe it''s just easier on your daughter to put your needs aside in order to avoid conflict with him and his family. It''s not right, but if she is under constant pressure like this, she may just feel that you would "understand" and would put up with her distance. Maybe she''s being torn in too many directions. Who knows?

I guess the best I''d hope for given all this information, is for her to at least commit to some quiet time alone with you. Lunch on a less busy day. If Wednesdays are good for her, get her to commit to a date for a Wednesday.

Finally, I just wanted to say if you were my mom, I''d definitely make time for you, even if it was actually scheduled and pencilled on to a calendar. I lost my parents when they were 52 and 65 and I was 23 and 36 respectively. My dad died 2 weeks before their big 30th anniversary party. So I guess your story really hits home with me. Take care!

 

[movie zombie]

you did make progress: you spoke to her about your needs. now the thing about being assertive is that it doesn''t mean you''re going to get what you want all the time.....or at all. but it beats being passive and waitiing for someone to read your mind. YES, YOU MADE PROGRESS!!!!!

call and make the arrangement for a family get together on wednesday as that is the day she suggested. get a date on the calendar.

i don''t know that its fair to say you expect her to be there for each and every date that is important to you: pick the most important. that gives you a bargaining tool with her and you both walk away from a compromise with something you want.

try not to take it personal or make it into a tally of hours spent with in-laws v. hours spent with you. while it may appear she is taking you for granted, she may very well be doing so: you''re her mother and will always be there for her, right?!

and abe prepared to accept her evasiveness and perhaps eventual unwillingness to set the date to clear the air and clear heads over this issue. you did raise her well. trust that some day she will realize that.

congratulations for addressing the issue with your daughter.

movie zombie

ps yes, the thing about being assertive doesn''t mean you''ll get what you want, but the worse that can happen is that you won''t......and you''re already not getting what you want so what do you have to lose?!

 

[ephemery1]

Date: 4/7/2008 8:02:29 PM
Author: thing2of2

Yeah, I completely agree with you, isaku. I don't mean to gang up on you oobiecoo, but your parents won't always be here. I seriously dread the day that I don't have both of them to go visit, and sometimes when I feel like just sitting on my butt at my house instead of making the 1 hour drive to sit on my butt at my parents' house, that thought gets me up and going.

I just find it hard to believe that life is too hectic to spend 10 special days a year hanging out with your parents...2 birthdays, Mother's and Father's day, Easter, Thanksgiving, Christmas Day...that's only 7, actually. It might be a good idea to rethink your priorities. I'm sure your parents have always been there for you when you needed them or wanted them around.

God, I sound like a mom and I'm only 26! But in my opinion, family should always come first. Life isn't really that hectic.

Thing2of2, I'm curious as to how you work this out with your husband/fiance/partner's family? I spent the first 28 years of my life hanging out with my parents on all special occasions... but now that we're married, it's unfortunately not quite that easy. Some people are lucky enough to have both families living close by, but for others, it can be incredibly difficult to coordinate schedules and plan things so that both families get "equal" quality time on a holiday that lasts one day/weekend. Especially if you have siblings who also have to divide their time. If you have any viable solutions (other than magically morphing from one place to the next, since I haven't quite mastered that yet), I am desperately in need of them!!

ETA -- I also grew up believing that family should always come first. I think the issue here is that when you get married and have your own children, the word family has to be redefined a bit. My parents taught me that their love for each other as husband and wife always comes first. So as far as "rethinking priorities", I agree with you completely... when we get married, we are choosing to re-prioritize and put our own spouses first, then eventually children come next. Parents/siblings are still important, but no longer THE most important.

 

[cara]

Hmmm. Does she visit and pay attention to you at other times, besides milestone events? Have you let her know you would like to celebrate your anniversary with her? As in, have to directly told her that it would be a wonderful treat to have your children visit or take you out to celebrate your anniversary?

There are a couple of things here. If you and your daughter are not close, or she rarely comes to visit at all, then that of course is sad, and the anniversary issue is just a sad reminder of that.

But if the specific problem is related to the anniversary, well then there are a couple of things to do. One is to realize that your daughter may not see your anniversary as the milestone on which to visit her parents. Some people are not milestone people, they are bad at remembering birthdays and anniversaries but visit and share and give at other times.

And some people simply don''t realize that an anniversary is an occasion on which children take out their parents - they view it more as a private celebration planned by the couple themselves. (One which the couple might choose to share with others, but fundamentally not a child''s responsibility). While many adult children do help celebrate their parent''s anniversary, some adult children might not have made this transition from the young age at which they would have been left at home while their parent''s went out on a date. As well, note that the anniversary is in remembrance of an event at which most children were not present.

Rather than be dissapointed again, you must either completely remove your expectation or make yourself plain. Tell said daughter what you want as an anniversary gift, if you are so fortunate as to make it to your golden. If you have already tried being plain, I would certainly plan my own 50th celebration or put your son in charge. That would certainly not be an occasion to let pass unnoticed!

 

[isaku5]

Once again, I thank you all for your wisdom. It really helps to get unbiased opinions.

Our family has always been close as there are so few of us. DH is an only child as well so our kids had neither uncles, aunts, or cousins until they married. When DH''s dad died at 65, we automatically took his mom into family gatherings without giving it a second thought. She became one of "us".

Our daughter and I are very alike, and when she was a teen, it was a battle of the wills

. She married the first time at 22 into a wealthy family who treated her like royalty. There was only one problem: On their first anniversary he decided to come out of the closet. We were dumbfounded and immediately left home to offer comfort and support to her. Needless to say, she was "gun-shy" and spent every weekend with us for several months.

She re-married when she was almost 34, and they just celebrated their 10th anniversary. Her now-husband had never been married before and was 33. I don''t think he''s controlling, but his parents and sisters are definitely more vocal than we are. Maybe, it''s the squeaky wheel thing, I''m not sure. As I''ve said before, we have been very passive allowing them their chance to "be their own kingdom". Those words were said by the priest at their wedding, and hit home with me.

I learned the hard way (illness) that I wasn''t Superwoman, and have tried to slow her down a bit, but it''s like stopping an out of control express train. I just don''t want her to go through what I did. That''s probably the reason that I haven''t been more assertive. I really don''t want to overwhelm her with more responsibility ( although it sounds as if I''m doing exactly that).

To think that all of this started over a hoped-for phone call really upsets me. I have never wanted to be that kind of controlling parent, but emotions got the best of me yesterday and those long-suppressed tears flowed.

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 4/7/2008 9:23:49 PM
Author: ephemery1

Date: 4/7/2008 8:02:29 PM

Author: thing2of2

Yeah, I completely agree with you, isaku. I don''t mean to gang up on you oobiecoo, but your parents won''t always be here. I seriously dread the day that I don''t have both of them to go visit, and sometimes when I feel like just sitting on my butt at my house instead of making the 1 hour drive to sit on my butt at my parents'' house, that thought gets me up and going.

I just find it hard to believe that life is too hectic to spend 10 special days a year hanging out with your parents...2 birthdays, Mother''s and Father''s day, Easter, Thanksgiving, Christmas Day...that''s only 7, actually. It might be a good idea to rethink your priorities. I''m sure your parents have always been there for you when you needed them or wanted them around.


God, I sound like a mom and I''m only 26! But in my opinion, family should always come first. Life isn''t really that hectic.

Thing2of2, I''m curious as to how you work this out with your husband/fiance/partner''s family? I spent the first 28 years of my life hanging out with my parents on all special occasions... but now that we''re married, it''s unfortunately not quite that easy. Some people are lucky enough to have both families living close by, but for others, it can be incredibly difficult to coordinate schedules and plan things so that both families get ''equal'' quality time on a holiday that lasts one day/weekend. Especially if you have siblings who also have to divide their time. If you have any viable solutions (other than magically morphing from one place to the next, since I haven''t quite mastered that yet), I am desperately in need of them!!

ETA -- I also grew up believing that family should always come first. I think the issue here is that when you get married and have your own children, the word family has to be redefined a bit. My parents taught me that their love for each other as husband and wife always comes first. So as far as ''rethinking priorities'', I agree with you completely... when we get married, we are choosing to re-prioritize and put our own spouses first, then eventually children come next. Parents/siblings are still important, but no longer THE most important.

Well I think it''s just a matter of making time, honestly. If you can''t be there on a big holiday like Christmas Day because you''re with your husband''s family, make time to come the weekend before and have Christmas then. Same goes for Thanksgiving. As for less major holidays like Easter/Mother''s Day/Father''s Day/etc., I think the best bet is to alternate. And as long as you make it a priority to spend time with your parents, they won''t feel left out if you miss spending a holiday with them.

The way I see it, I live with my fiance and see him pretty much 24/7. So although he''s obviously a priority, because I spend pretty much every second with him when I''m not working/in school/playing sports, I do make it a priority to spend time with my parents and siblings. I don''t have children, but two of my three siblings who do have children do the same thing. (The other one currently lives overseas, so obviously it''s a different situation.)

My parents love to spend time with the grandchildren too, and would be really sad if they didn''t see them often. I should point out that my parents also make it a priority to visit all of us children, so it''s not like we''re always the ones coming to see them. I guess my family is probably closer than other families, but we all just really try our best to see each other/talk to each other/e-mail each other often.

For example, I had a bunch of final exams starting on Monday last semester, but it was my niece''s 1st birthday party that Sunday, so I drove 3 hours there and then 3 hours back to make it to the party. I was only there for about 2 or 3 hours, but my sister called me a few days later to tell me how much it meant to her that I went to the trouble to come. Did I really feel like driving all that way? Not really, but I didn''t want to miss her birthday so I did it.

Don''t get me wrong-I''m not some perfect saint child at all, and my family''s not some perfect TV family. But we do try to go above and beyond to spend time with each other. I guess my parents just really instilled that in us. If I have kids (doubtful) I''ll do the same thing. I have friends who throw their kids in the car a weekend or two a month and go see their parents 2 hours away, so I don''t think it''s that unusual or difficult. My older siblings do it a lot, too.

I just can''t even imagine doing holiday stuff without my other siblings and parents around. It wouldn''t even feel like a holiday to me, really.

 

[diamondfan]

I am all for kids leaving the nest and forming lives. (but do not quote me when mine do it!!!

BUT BUT BUT. I have now had three friends lose a parent in the last two weeks. My mother is in her 80''s. And trust me, unless there is a terrible relationship there or some big problem that cannot be surmounted, you have limited time with your parents. And I know we all get busy and bogged down but sometimes it is just a question of effort and managing time better. There is free time there, not always, but so what if it means figuring out an option that works?

I go to every school play, on field trips, to every sports match I can. I do it with love and with pleasure. I drag myself out of bed ill with a migraine and fibromyalgia pain to make sure my son gets to school on a Saturday at 7:00 am to get on a bus for a track meet. I spend weeks getting them set for sleep away camp. I fully expect and hope they will grow up, go to college, and be independent young men. But I would be devastated if I felt like an old shoe after all of that. And I think Isabel''s daughter will regret not spending the time, especially when she is only 45 minutes away by car. I think and hope, Isabel, if you just tell her how you feel, something will move in a positive direction.

 

[ephemery1]

Date: 4/7/2008 10:58:18 PM
Author: thing2of2

Well I think it's just a matter of making time, honestly. If you can't be there on a big holiday like Christmas Day because you're with your husband's family, make time to come the weekend before and have Christmas then. Same goes for Thanksgiving. As for less major holidays like Easter/Mother's Day/Father's Day/etc., I think the best bet is to alternate. And as long as you make it a priority to spend time with your parents, they won't feel left out if you miss spending a holiday with them.

The way I see it, I live with my fiance and see him pretty much 24/7. So although he's obviously a priority, because I spend pretty much every second with him when I'm not working/in school/playing sports, I do make it a priority to spend time with my parents and siblings. I don't have children, but two of my three siblings who do have children do the same thing. (The other one currently lives overseas, so obviously it's a different situation.)

My parents love to spend time with the grandchildren too, and would be really sad if they didn't see them often. I should point out that my parents also make it a priority to visit all of us children, so it's not like we're always the ones coming to see them. I guess my family is probably closer than other families, but we all just really try our best to see each other/talk to each other/e-mail each other often.

For example, I had a bunch of final exams starting on Monday last semester, but it was my niece's 1st birthday party that Sunday, so I drove 3 hours there and then 3 hours back to make it to the party. I was only there for about 2 or 3 hours, but my sister called me a few days later to tell me how much it meant to her that I went to the trouble to come. Did I really feel like driving all that way? Not really, but I didn't want to miss her birthday so I did it.

Don't get me wrong-I'm not some perfect saint child at all, and my family's not some perfect TV family. But we do try to go above and beyond to spend time with each other. I guess my parents just really instilled that in us. If I have kids (doubtful) I'll do the same thing. I have friends who throw their kids in the car a weekend or two a month and go see their parents 2 hours away, so I don't think it's that unusual or difficult. My older siblings do it a lot, too.

I just can't even imagine doing holiday stuff without my other siblings and parents around. It wouldn't even feel like a holiday to me, really.

I totally agree... for somebody who also grew up in an extremely close family, having to make these adjustments now that I'm married has been incredibly hard for me. It is a nice idea to spend the weekend before Thanksgiving or Christmas with one family and then the actual holiday with the other, except that means we miss out on seeing my brothers/cousins/aunts/uncles who are all around only on the actual holiday.

And since DH is an only child, his parents DO feel neglected when we're not spending the holiday with them. So unfortunately still no good solution for us.

Keep in mind I'm speaking as a person who is almost excessively close to her family. I talk to both parents and both brothers on the phone almost every day, and each of them, plus 2 cousins, an aunt, and an uncle online several times throughout each day. I consider my mom one of my closest friends. I was raised in the same town where both my parents grew up, so ALL my relatives on both sides live there still... I still call that place "home" and probably always will. So I definitely understand WANTING to maintain that level of closeness... I've just come to recognize that it's not always possible OR healthy, after making the choice to get married. On the advice of the person we saw for pre-marital counseling, I have worked very hard in the past year to be sure that my connection to my family does not get in the way of my connection to my new husband.

Which means even though it's harder than I ever could have imagined to do holiday stuff without my siblings and parents around, and it really doesn't feel like a holiday to me without them, I HAVE to force myself to change that definition of "holiday". For the sake of my own new family.

 

[oobiecoo]

Date: 4/7/2008 7:48:22 PM
Author: isaku5

Date: 4/7/2008 7:33:28 PM
Author: oobiecoo

Date: 4/7/2008 6:51:45 PM
Author: thing2of2

Date: 4/7/2008 3:28:07 PM
Author: isaku5
On behalf of all the older parents, I''d just like to say, '' We raised you to be the successful, kind, loving people you are now. Please don''t step on our hearts.''

Oh, this is so sad...I have to agree with you, isaku. I am young and not married yet (I''m engaged), but I have 3 older siblings who are married with kids, and one of them never does anything with the rest of the family. I know it hurts my parents'' feelings, and it hurts me and my other siblings'' feelings as well. Plus my parents are awesome and we all have a great time when we get together (including this sibling when they do come), so there are no weird issues there. I''ve come to the conclusion that this older sibling and their spouse is just plain selfish and self-absorbed...sad but true.

I also don''t understand what oobiecoo was saying about adult children trying to ''assert their independence.'' I mean, you''re an adult, possibly married with children...what is there to assert? I actually think it''s pretty hurtful to purposefully not go home for your parents'' birthdays just for the sake of asserting your independence, especially when it''s clearly important to them. They''re your parents and they raised you...how would you feel if they skipped your birthday because they were asserting their independence from their children and establishing themselves as empty nesters? Obviously if they treat you badly that''s one thing, but otherwise, I just don''t get it. I''m not trying to attack you, but that was my first thought-how hurt they must have been.

Its not that I have the time and money to visit and simply refuse... I have alot going on in my life right now and really couldn''t take the time to be with them. I am an only child (kind of) so there has always been so much pressure on me to be there for thanksgiving, christmas, mothers day, etc because if I don''t go, no one else will be there with them. However, with my life becoming more and more hectic, they simply have to realize that sometimes I CANT be there and they will need to celebrate by themselves. I know I am not the only person who feels this way...

Oh, oobiecoo, I couldn''t disagree with you more!!! I kind of let the ''asserting your independence thing'' go, but I just have to address your issues:

Asserting your own independence: By all means, do that, just not on special family days. You''ve got about 300 days a year to asset youself. Do it then!!

You''re too busy??!!!Your life is too hectic??!! Really! We''re all given 24 hours in a day: prioritize, young lady

My heart bleeds for you having to attend Thanksgiving, Christmas, etc. Were your parents too busy while you were growing up to observe these holidays? I doubt it very much!!

I don''t wish you any ill will, but remember what you''ve said here when your kids throw it back at you. You know that ''karma thing: it just might work against you.

Why are you attacking me? I live almost 5 hours away from my parents. I am a full time student, have a part time job, and am in the midst of planning a wedding. I am sorry that I cannot drop everything to be with my mom on her exact birthday. She was here the weekend before for my shower so I saw her then... and I also called her and sent her flowers on her birthday. I acknowledged her special day but just couldn''t be there with her. She has to understand that I am an independent individual (the way she raised me to be) and that I have to make decisions that are right for ME. The same for Thanksgiving... I went to see my parents the weekend before thanksgiving because it would be too much to attend class the day before thanksgiving then drive the 5 hours to see them and 5 hours back. They were very dissapointed for the first few occasions because I am their only (good) child so that meant they would spend those occasions alone. That puts alot of stress and pressure on an only-child. My parents have also played the game where they want to practically tally each hour FI and I spend with them and compare it to how much time we spend with FI''s parents. They think that we are ALWAYS at FI''s parents'' since they live 30 minutes from us... this isn''t the case at all. We see them maybe once a month. FI has a huge family and my parents tried to demand that we spend an equal amount of time with them. It just isn''t possible. I have 2 parents. FI has 3 parents, 2 grandparents, 8 siblings, etc. Obviously we have to spend a little more time with FI''s side! I am sorry that your daughter didn''t acknowledge your anniversary, but I do not feel that it is ok to attack me for my personal beliefs regarding family.

I still think that I am not alone in my feelings. It seems that Ephemery feels at least a TINY bit like I do.

 

[iheartscience]

ephemery, (the quotes are getting too long, so I''m not going to quote you!) have you ever had your DH''s parents come to your family''s gatherings? It''s probably totally obvious, but I just thought I''d throw that out there! Sometimes my fiance''s mom comes for Christmas/Easter/Thanksgiving and stays with us and then my parents because she lives far away, isn''t married, and my fiance is her only child. Obviously your DH''s parents may have other relatives they spend those holidays with, but they might like to come to a big family thing of yours every now and then.

I totally get not letting your family get in the way of your relationship, and mine definitely doesn''t. I still spend tons of time with just my fiance and me. As for holidays, my siblings usually do Santa in the morning with their kids at their house and then come to my parents'' house afterwards. And if I do pop out some kids I''ll also definitely drag them with me to my parents''/sisters''/brothers'' house for pretty much every holiday!

Luckily my fiance is close to my parents as well so he really likes to visit with them. He actually goes to my parents'' house sometimes without me if I can''t come and hangs out with my mom and dad. So tender. He''s an only child and he really enjoys being around my big family, so he is always happy to go to any dumb family function, and always has been. He''s also very close to his mom and was close to his nana before she died, too.

I really don''t mean to attack anyone in this thread-I just have definite opinions on stuff like this, as I''m sure everyone else does!

 

[ephemery1]

Date: 4/8/2008 12:37:19 AM
Author: thing2of2
ephemery, (the quotes are getting too long, so I'm not going to quote you!) have you ever had your DH's parents come to your family's gatherings? It's probably totally obvious, but I just thought I'd throw that out there! Sometimes my fiance's mom comes for Christmas/Easter/Thanksgiving and stays with us and then my parents because she lives far away, isn't married, and my fiance is her only child. Obviously your DH's parents may have other relatives they spend those holidays with, but they might like to come to a big family thing of yours every now and then.

I totally get not letting your family get in the way of your relationship, and mine definitely doesn't. I still spend tons of time with just my fiance and me. As for holidays, my siblings usually do Santa in the morning with their kids at their house and then come to my parents' house afterwards. And if I do pop out some kids I'll also definitely drag them with me to my parents'/sisters'/brothers' house for pretty much every holiday!

Luckily my fiance is close to my parents as well so he really likes to visit with them. He actually goes to my parents' house sometimes without me if I can't come and hangs out with my mom and dad. So tender. He's an only child and he really enjoys being around my big family, so he is always happy to go to any dumb family function, and always has been. He's also very close to his mom and was close to his nana before she died, too.

I really don't mean to attack anyone in this thread-I just have definite opinions on stuff like this, as I'm sure everyone else does!

Yes, DH's parents are always made welcome at our big family events, but after last Thanksgiving all together, they made it clear to us that they prefer to spend holidays with us just one-on-one. They are a bit less social and don't always enjoy the big group. So we were back to the drawing board. You and your sisters are so lucky to be able to maintain your Christmas traditions and still go to your parents/sisters/brothers homes for every holiday!! I can't even imagine what a relief that would be. We are expecting a baby in October and I am already dreading the holidays because they feel so miserable to me when I'm not with my family, but unfortunately there is just no way to make it happen. DH is very close to my family as well (another only child) and loves having brothers now, so we have tried to explain to his parents that when we are spending time with my family, it entails more than just my parents... it is brothers, cousins, aunts, uncles, and all the people I grew up with in my hometown. They don't seem to understand though.

I think it's fine to have definite opinions on this kind of stuff, just important to take into consideration that not everyone is as lucky as you are with how your family arrangements have worked out!! If I could still spend every holiday with my family, I certainly would... it's just not realistic for us, and sounds like it's not for Oobiecoo either.

So it hurts to be told "you just need to prioritize", when I've spent hours upon hours thinking/planning/communicating this with my DH as well as our families over the past few years, and still can't find a good solution. And as I said before, all those hours of agonizing can really take a toll on my marriage itself... so I'm learning to be careful about that.

ETA -- I've actually started seeing a therapist because this has been so heartbreaking for me, and I know I can't continue to spend every holiday feeling sad when I'm not with my family. So I'm taking measures to address that, now that we have a baby on the way, and learn how to make room for change in our traditions. But gosh, it's hard not to be a bit jealous of you...

 

[icekid]

Ephem- I am so there with you on the splitting time between your fam and the in-laws. This is a constant struggle for me. And made even worse by the fact that hubby''s parents are divorced. And time is spent my parents >>> his dad/stepmom > his mom. The funny thing about the situation is that S is completely fine w/ spending the majority of our time w/ my fam. Perhaps b/c he is much closer w/ my fam than I am with his. I''m not sure. S also ends up playing wii into the middle of the night w/ my brothers. Maybe that''s the real reason hehe.

This is going to sound terrible, but we stay with my parents every time we go home. (and I too think "home" will always be where I grew up!) Partially this is practical, as our dog cannot stay with either set of his parents. But being completely honest, I wouldn''t want to stay with them ANYWAY. His parents are... much older. Doesn''t that sound horrible? There is always so much going on at my house! I have three siblings who are still there, whereas his Dad/stepmom mostly sit around and watch TV. Errrrrm.. I''d much rather be spending time w/ my sibs, with whom I am very close. I love his family. Truly. But not even close to as much as I adore my siblings and my parents. And we live 400 miles from our families, so we don''t exactly get to see them often. hubby''s sister lives in Atlanta, and she and her husband spend more holiday time with HIS family so then I feel like we are screwing over his parents even more.

We have tried inviting his parents to spend holiday w/ my fam a couple times, and while it went okay it just wasn''t ideal. His stepmom tells the same stories over and over. And again, his parents are much older than mine. My parents have busy active careers. His are very retired. Very different personalities. It''s just awkward.

When we have kids? Ahhh. I can''t even imagine not spending Christmas with my family. My parents will be the best grandparents ever, seriously. I don''t think I''ll have it in me to take my kids to spend holidays with the other grandparents

Fortunately, we do Christmas Eve w/ his dad/stepmom since it''s not a big deal for my family. So that is helpful. But... his mom doesn''t really fit into that plan either. So we end up stopping at her house for like 45 min or something. And we''ve only spent one thanksgiving w/ his parents since we''ve been together.

 

[iheartscience]

Date: 4/8/2008 8:15:08 AM
Author: ephemery1

Date: 4/8/2008 12:37:19 AM

Author: thing2of2

ephemery, (the quotes are getting too long, so I''m not going to quote you!) have you ever had your DH''s parents come to your family''s gatherings? It''s probably totally obvious, but I just thought I''d throw that out there! Sometimes my fiance''s mom comes for Christmas/Easter/Thanksgiving and stays with us and then my parents because she lives far away, isn''t married, and my fiance is her only child. Obviously your DH''s parents may have other relatives they spend those holidays with, but they might like to come to a big family thing of yours every now and then.


I totally get not letting your family get in the way of your relationship, and mine definitely doesn''t. I still spend tons of time with just my fiance and me. As for holidays, my siblings usually do Santa in the morning with their kids at their house and then come to my parents'' house afterwards. And if I do pop out some kids I''ll also definitely drag them with me to my parents''/sisters''/brothers'' house for pretty much every holiday!


Luckily my fiance is close to my parents as well so he really likes to visit with them. He actually goes to my parents'' house sometimes without me if I can''t come and hangs out with my mom and dad. So tender. He''s an only child and he really enjoys being around my big family, so he is always happy to go to any dumb family function, and always has been. He''s also very close to his mom and was close to his nana before she died, too.


I really don''t mean to attack anyone in this thread-I just have definite opinions on stuff like this, as I''m sure everyone else does!

Yes, DH''s parents are always made welcome at our big family events, but after last Thanksgiving all together, they made it clear to us that they prefer to spend holidays with us just one-on-one. They are a bit less social and don''t always enjoy the big group. So we were back to the drawing board. You and your sisters are so lucky to be able to maintain your Christmas traditions and still go to your parents/sisters/brothers homes for every holiday!! I can''t even imagine what a relief that would be. We are expecting a baby in October and I am already dreading the holidays because they feel so miserable to me when I''m not with my family, but unfortunately there is just no way to make it happen. DH is very close to my family as well (another only child) and loves having brothers now, so we have tried to explain to his parents that when we are spending time with my family, it entails more than just my parents... it is brothers, cousins, aunts, uncles, and all the people I grew up with in my hometown. They don''t seem to understand though.


I think it''s fine to have definite opinions on this kind of stuff, just important to take into consideration that not everyone is as lucky as you are with how your family arrangements have worked out!! If I could still spend every holiday with my family, I certainly would... it''s just not realistic for us, and sounds like it''s not for Oobiecoo either.

So it hurts to be told ''you just need to prioritize'', when I''ve spent hours upon hours thinking/planning/communicating this with my DH as well as our families over the past few years, and still can''t find a good solution. And as I said before, all those hours of agonizing can really take a toll on my marriage itself... so I''m learning to be careful about that.


ETA -- I''ve actually started seeing a therapist because this has been so heartbreaking for me, and I know I can''t continue to spend every holiday feeling sad when I''m not with my family. So I''m taking measures to address that, now that we have a baby on the way, and learn how to make room for change in our traditions. But gosh, it''s hard not to be a bit jealous of you...

Yikes, that does sound like a hard situation to be in...I definitely know that I am lucky because I live close (only 1 hour away) to my parents and am able to see them so often and so easily, and so do most of my other siblings. My twin sister is also an hour away (same place as me), my brother is an hour away in a different place and my other sister is 3.5ish hours away. The other brother is overseas, so obviously he''s not home as often.

I really do feel bad for you because I really don''t think I could deal with not spending time with them on a holiday, and it sounds like you''re really in the same mindset as me, but have to compromise due to circumstance. I don''t know, it sounds like your DH''s parents could really stand to compromise and come to your family''s holidays sometimes, or let you come do an early/late Christmas or Thanksgiving, since seeing them requires missing seeing your entire extended family. Obviously you''re doing everything you can do to make the most of the situation and be good to DH''s family as well.

These posts don''t really do a good job of conveying a person''s true situation because there''s so often a back story that clarifies a situation. I''m sorry if you were offended/hurt by my opinions, because I really did mean them in a general way, and was not trying to attack anyone, or tell you your business regarding prioritizing-I just explained that I personally make it a big priority of mine to spend time with my parents and siblings. I do think oobiecoo''s original short couple of posts painted a different, meaner picture than what the reality of her situation is, and her subsequent post made it more clear that she really does try to spend time with her parents. Stuff just doesn''t translate that well sometimes.

 

[Mrs Mitchell]

Date: 4/7/2008 3:28:07 PM
Author: isaku5
I have read every word of everyone's post, and I appreciate all the different points of perspective.

I really don't want posters thinking that we are demanding quality time for x number of hours per month. That's not the way it is at all! Would we have liked a family get-together to celebrate our 45th? The obvious answer is 'yes'; however, the fault lies with me in not verbalizing that wish as I'm 99% sure everyone would have come to share the celebration had we put forward the invitation.

My mother was very demanding and verbalized her wishes; I like the obedient child I was, obeyed. DH's mom was an angel who, in her later years, made lots of coffee and dessert every Sunday hoping someone would drop in. Knowing that she did this no matter what we said, we dropped in quite often because she was always so happy to see us. As she lived alone in her little ranch house well into her late 80's, either one of us would check on her daily: a visit or phone call or both.

On behalf of all the older parents, I'd just like to say, ' We raised you to be the successful, kind, loving people you are now. Please don't step on our hearts.'

Isaku, congratulations on your anniversary. I wish you and your husband every joy and I hope you have many more years together.
I'm so sorry for you disappointment and pain and I hope you'll understand what I'm trying to say here (I don't always get it to come out right.)

I don't see much of my parents, because there are a lot of barriers between us. Could that be the case with you and your daughter? My mother calls from time to time to arrange dinner, or lunch or another event and I hate to say this, but my heart sinks and I feel sick. We don't get on. Superficially, there is no quarrell, I do the duty visits when I have to and send the requisite cards and gifts.

My example is probably a bit more extreme than yours, because my parents raised me in a cold, disapproving and violent home. I am certainly not the person my parents tried to raise me to be. I worked very hard at that. Now I'm not saying this is the same as your situation, not at all, but my mother and father don't see that there should be a problem - that's the way they were raised, it didn't do them any harm etc (it did immeasurable harm, in my view, but that isn't the point). I can understand them to a certain extent, but I can't get them to accept that beating, slapping, punching a child is wrong. It breaks my heart too, but I can't let them have unsupervised access to my child. I just can't take the risk of the combination of temper and firmly held beliefs on child rearing. So the end result is that I avoid them wherever possible and only spend time with them when my husband is with me. It isn't an issue of prioritising, but an issue of emotional protection.

Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that there might be something small or bigger that stands between you and your daughter that you need to work out or consider from her perspective (please, please don't think I'm suggesting you did her any harm, I'm not - I'm just using my own experience as a parallel in the small hope that it might help). You mentioned conflict when she was a teenager - could something have been said or done that has left a deeper mark than you are aware? That isn't intended to be a criticism, just a suggestion for a starting point to understand your relationship now.

I really do hope that you can meet up and enjoy each other's company. Your son sounds like a kind, decent man too - you should be very proud of that.

Please don't take offense at what I've said. I thought long and hard before posting and maybe i shouldn't have, but I really, really hope you can take something useful from it (or ignore it- just please don't think I'm accusing or attacking you, that's the last thing I want to do).

Jen

 

[isaku5]

I''m really so glad you responded, Jen. As you say, there must be "something" at the root of this that I''ve missed. I''m hoping that she''ll be candid and truthful to me when we chat. There could be so many things that have bothered her about me/us, but I need to know if we''re going to move forward from this, what in the heck they are.

I purposely avoided so many things that my mom did to me that maybe I went too far the other way. I don''t know, but I want to.

Neither she nor her brother was abused in any way that I can think of. Since they were born 14 months apart, it was almost like having twins. DD was the scholar, and DS worked hard to get a C. I never compared them. She would say, why don''t you tell him to work harder so that he can get A''s too. My response was that he was working as hard as he could to get C''s. I told them both to their best and that''s all we expected.

I asked DH last night whether he could think of something that would have made her want to avoid us, but he couldn''t come up with anything either.

When she mentioned in our phone call that Wednesday was a good day. She actually meant that we should come to their place some Wednesday to be arranged.

I need to talk with her alone, and will set up a time and place to do so.

Thanks again to everyone who replied!