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Princess Cut question...

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ardentazn

Rough_Rock
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Jun 1, 2009
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Hello All,
I was referred to this forum for some expert advise. I have been doing some research and understand some of the tricks/trades... Applying these knowledge, I was able to narrow down to about 3 stones of interest:
1.)
Diamond Information
Stock number: LD01135956
Price: $16,254
Carat weight: 2.01
Cut: Very Good
Color: E
Clarity: VS2
Depth %: 74.0%
Table %: 73%
Symmetry: Very good
Polish: Excellent
Girdle: Thick to very thick
Culet: None
Fluorescence: None
Measurements: 6.91 x 6.85 x 5.07 mm
Length/width ratio: 1.01

2.)
Diamond Information
Stock number: LD01471839
Price: $15,359
Carat weight: 2.02
Cut: Very Good
Color: E
Clarity: VS1
Price per carat: $7,603
Depth %: 73.4%
Table %: 78%
Symmetry: Good
Polish: Very good
Girdle: Thin to very thick
Culet: None
Fluorescence: Medium
Measurements: 7.17 x 6.80 x 4.99 mm
Length/width ratio: 1.05

3.)
Stock number: LD01127819
Price: $16,422
Carat weight: 2.04
Cut: Very Good
Color: E
Clarity: VS1
Price per carat: $8,050
Depth %: 70.7%
Table %: 71%
Symmetry: Good
Polish: Excellent
Girdle: Medium to slightly thick
Culet: None
Fluorescence: Medium
Measurements: 6.93 x 6.92 x 4.89 mm
Length/width ratio: 1.00

I guess I understand the 4 Cs and these are within range that I prefer. However, I have a few questions:

1.) would the medium blue Fluorescence be of concern?
2.) Is there a HCA for princess cut??? If not, is there any way to tell if the cut is good(other than the GIA grading)???
3.) I was informed that all VS grades are eye-clean. Is that true? I am only interested in eye clean stones.
4.) anything else (negative & positive)I should know about this?

Thanks all!
 
Princess cuts (and any other fancy shapes) are almost impossible to buy from numbers alone--sometimes you can reject a stone, but saying for sure one will be really nice based on numbers isn't possible. There are some basic guidelines that can help, but it comes down to either physically examining the stones or at least having high quality photos and IS or ASET images.

AGS now has a cut grade for princess. If you can find somone that carries AGS0 princess, you will most likely have a good light performer.

Of the ones you posted, #1 could be worth examining, though it is hiding some extra weight in that thick girdle. I would pass on #2 based on the table being larger than depth (the reverse is preferred) and the l/w ratio is just enough that someone could notice it is not square. #3 may also have possibilities.

Are these with an online vendor that could supply photos and images?

Also, there is nothing wrong with E color if that is what you prefer. Just as long as you know that vendors charge a premium for colorless and with a princess, you could easily drop to G color and still have a very white diamond, while spending less on this size range or going larger.

The medium fluoro is not an issue and VS clarities are almost always eye clean. If you are working with a trusted vendor that will physically examine the stones for you and confirm eye-clean, it is possible to drop to SI1.
 
Good advice from jet there...also, I''d focus more on #1 by the numbers. For #3, the "good" symmetry puts it out of the running for me. I''m a stickler for optical symmetry, so I''d stick with VG or better.

Regarding color, particularly in this size range, you can save a TON of cash by going to G-H color (GIA or AGS graded) and still have a perfectly white stone. In fact, my princess is an I...it''s only 1ct as opposed to 2, but to me it''s indistinguishable from an F. Which lab did the grading on these stones?

If you prefer to stick with E color, diamond #1 definitely has potential, so see if you can get an ASET image if the vendor offers it. The next best thing would be detailed photos and an idealscope image. If none of these are offered, I''d pass...princesses are just too variable to buy online without images.
 
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Hi, jstar, congrats on the wedding. Great to have you back keeping us straight on princess cuts.
 
Hey all, thanks for the prompt reply. I expected some expert advise but did not realize it would be that speedy. Thanks again.

I had thought that princess cut would be as straight forward as round brilliant. How foolish was I..=) After reading your advise, I will definitely request for the IS or ASET images...

Some background info... I spent some time researching a round brilliant engagement ring about a yr ago. I leeched off alot of info here and on fatwallet... Apparently everyone thinks I am an expert now, so my brother has entrusted me with the research task...

Jet,
These are from Blue Nile and I will ask if they have the images/photos to supply me.

As for color, my brother is set on the E color... don''t know why, I tried to talk him out of it??? I even suggested F, and he sounds like he''s pretty set on E...perhaps his wife really want it??

I have mentioned to him about the SI1 possibility, I think he might be acceptable to that... I will do some more counseling =)

jstar,
I hadn''t realize about the symmetry. definitely VG or above is what we want... these stones are GIA graded... I will definitely ask for the images..

Thanks again for the help and the prompt reply!!!
 
Date: 6/1/2009 11:43:52 PM
Author: jstarfireb
Good advice from jet there...also, I''d focus more on #1 by the numbers. For #3, the ''good'' symmetry puts it out of the running for me. I''m a stickler for optical symmetry, so I''d stick with VG or better.

Regarding color, particularly in this size range, you can save a TON of cash by going to G-H color (GIA or AGS graded) and still have a perfectly white stone. In fact, my princess is an I...it''s only 1ct as opposed to 2, but to me it''s indistinguishable from an F. Which lab did the grading on these stones?

If you prefer to stick with E color, diamond #1 definitely has potential, so see if you can get an ASET image if the vendor offers it. The next best thing would be detailed photos and an idealscope image. If none of these are offered, I''d pass...princesses are just too variable to buy online without images.
Click to expand...
Ditto, he is doing fantastically well!!!
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Good to see you back doc!
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No point asking BN for images. They can''t and won''t supply it.
 
I would be concerned about the amount oif visuible effect from the "medium" amount of UV fluorescence present in #3 although I might prefer that diamond over the other two. It has the best girdle thickness and a good size for weight due to good depth and table measures. It is second in visual size tto #3 and a bit larger than #1 in visual size.

I doubt most folks can see the symmetry issues that the lab says are present with a "good" rating.

So, while I don''t seem to agree with the other advice you have been given, it shows there are opinions which must be examined in person to choose.
 
Date: 6/2/2009 3:14:58 AM
Author: Lorelei

Date: 6/1/2009 11:43:52 PM
Author: jstarfireb
Good advice from jet there...also, I''d focus more on #1 by the numbers. For #3, the ''good'' symmetry puts it out of the running for me. I''m a stickler for optical symmetry, so I''d stick with VG or better.

Regarding color, particularly in this size range, you can save a TON of cash by going to G-H color (GIA or AGS graded) and still have a perfectly white stone. In fact, my princess is an I...it''s only 1ct as opposed to 2, but to me it''s indistinguishable from an F. Which lab did the grading on these stones?

If you prefer to stick with E color, diamond #1 definitely has potential, so see if you can get an ASET image if the vendor offers it. The next best thing would be detailed photos and an idealscope image. If none of these are offered, I''d pass...princesses are just too variable to buy online without images.
Click to expand...
Ditto, he is doing fantastically well!!!
36.gif
36.gif
36.gif
36.gif


Good to see you back doc!
35.gif
Click to expand...
blusher.gif
Aww, shucks, I''m blushing here. Thanks, ladies. Just trying to apply the knowledge I''ve gained from you and all the other helpful PS''ers.
 
Date: 6/2/2009 9:37:05 AM
Author: jet2ks

Date: 6/2/2009 3:14:58 AM
Author: Lorelei


Date: 6/1/2009 11:43:52 PM
Author: jstarfireb
Good advice from jet there...also, I''d focus more on #1 by the numbers. For #3, the ''good'' symmetry puts it out of the running for me. I''m a stickler for optical symmetry, so I''d stick with VG or better.

Regarding color, particularly in this size range, you can save a TON of cash by going to G-H color (GIA or AGS graded) and still have a perfectly white stone. In fact, my princess is an I...it''s only 1ct as opposed to 2, but to me it''s indistinguishable from an F. Which lab did the grading on these stones?

If you prefer to stick with E color, diamond #1 definitely has potential, so see if you can get an ASET image if the vendor offers it. The next best thing would be detailed photos and an idealscope image. If none of these are offered, I''d pass...princesses are just too variable to buy online without images.
Click to expand...
Ditto, he is doing fantastically well!!!
36.gif
36.gif
36.gif
36.gif


Good to see you back doc!
35.gif
Click to expand...
blusher.gif
Aww, shucks, I''m blushing here. Thanks, ladies. Just trying to apply the knowledge I''ve gained from you and all the other helpful PS''ers.
Click to expand...
LOL!!!
 
Thanks Lorelei and jet! You guys are awesome!
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Dave is much more expert than I, and I second what he says about princesses needing to be seen. I would not buy a princess from a vendor that didn''t supply ASETs or IS and photos...too much of a gamble, regardless of what the numbers are.

Ardentazn, how about something like this?
http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond.php?d=4418&shape=64&ctMin=1.9&ctMax=2.1&resultsColumns=268435471&singleResult=1

The bank wire price is comparable to the BN prices, and G/SI1 is a nice combination. GOG is a great vendor to work with. They will even make you a video if you ask for it!
 
Also, this would be another option within budget...ASET isn't quite as tight looking as the GOG rock, but this one is slightly spreadier and has similar numbers to Diamond #3, which Dave was suggesting:

http://www.whiteflash.com/princess/Princess-cut-diamond-67218.htm

With any SI1, check with the vendor that the stone is eye-clean. Whiteflash is also great to work with (mine came from them), and both vendors will examine the stones in person for you.
 
Date: 6/2/2009 9:00:55 AM
Author: oldminer
I would be concerned about the amount oif visuible effect from the ''medium'' amount of UV fluorescence present in #3 although I might prefer that diamond over the other two. It has the best girdle thickness and a good size for weight due to good depth and table measures. It is second in visual size tto #3 and a bit larger than #1 in visual size.

I doubt most folks can see the symmetry issues that the lab says are present with a ''good'' rating.

So, while I don''t seem to agree with the other advice you have been given, it shows there are opinions which must be examined in person to choose.
Click to expand...

Why? I have no recollection of ever seeing a medium blue that was visual under normal viewing conditions. It would not concerm me any longer than it took me to walk into the sunlight to ascertain that the diamond was not an overblue.

But then I admit to being a strong fan of fluorescence.

Wink
 
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