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OEC Diamond Advice

pixie712

pixie712

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 8, 2011
Messages
15
Hi, Everyone!

I am a long time lurker here on the PriceScope forums and have always had a love for Old European Cut diamonds. My fiance and I came across an OEC from Old World Diamonds that we both really like, and we would like to ask for your opinion about this particular diamond before we take the leap. In terms of the color and clarity, we wanted the diamond to be at least a J and a VS2 - we also were looking for at least a thin to medium girdle as we believe that will hopefully make the diamond less prone to chipping in the future (please let us know if that is incorrect! :) ). I also emailed Adam from Old World Diamonds about the tonal color that the body of the diamond graduates to and am waiting for his response. This particular diamond seems to fit our requests and budget; however we are completely new to diamond buying and would greatly appreciate your knowledgeable feedback! Thanks so much in advance!

Please find the specs below:
Carat Weight: 1.42
Color: J
Clarity: VS2
Measure: 7.20*7.19*4.22
Cert: GIA
Depth: 58.6
Table: 47
Polish: Good
Symetry: Good
Girdle: m
Flourescence: None
Culet: Large
Price: 8,000.00

Although the listing did not include an image, I emailed Adam and he sent me this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3bOVSmCRfE&feature=youtu.be
 
Hello,
It is hard to evaluate an older cut based on the numbers alone but the relatively (compared to other OECs) lower depth leads me to think that this will be a bright stone. The high crown is also very appealing and would likely mean a really fiery stone in the right lighting. Looks like a real beauty to me. Great color too! There is often much variation in patterning in OECs so in the end you must see it in real life and decide if you like it. As you know, it is harder to find higher color stones in these larger sizes. You might find better pricing if you were to poke around at estate auctions and estate jewelry shops but there is great value in buying from an established outfit with a great reputation for knowledge, service, and ability to recognize good cuts in old stones.
 
The stone looks beautiful in the video, but I will let some other OEC experts chime in. I've heard Adam is fantastic to work with though, so you're in good hands.
 
Adam helped me choose a great pair of OECs for studs and he's awesome. Can you ask him for still macro shots? I like the stone in the video but I see some dark areas and I can't tell if it's from the angle of the shot or the spinning of the table.
 
bluelotus: Thanks so much for your detailed advice, particularly about the table and crown dimensions as that is an area we really have no clue about! I agree, it is much harder to find the higher color in larger stones, so we were happy to come across this particular diamond. Thank you for letting us know about the price relative to the diamond as well - we definitely are happy to pay a little extra for an established vendor; I feel like we would be pretty lost at an estate sale and might be unknowingly gypped! Thanks again for your advice. :)

two_little_birds: Thank you! Yes, I have read about Adam's very good reputation here on the forums and the diamond does look lovely in the video. We are hoping this might be the one - fingers crossed!

liaerfbv: It is great to hear from someone who has purchased from Adam before - thank you very much for your comment. :) Yes, I will ask him for the still macro shots - hopefully those dark spots are not from within the diamond!
 
bluelotus|1420808718|3813957 said:
There is often much variation in patterning in OECs so in the end you must see it in real life and decide if you like it.
Click to expand...

I agree with this completely. I have looked at a number of OECs and there is a certain facet pattern I particularly love, and if it doesn't have that pattern, the stone is kind of "eh" for me. You can't tell this from paper, of course, so seeing it in person (or lots of photos and videos) is necessary.

Interestingly, I was browsing through the AVRs from Good Old Gold the other day, and I thought the facet pattern would be consistent across stones given the modern cutting technology. There was definitely variation though, some I liked, others were "eh".
 
Do post photos as you move ahead in your quest!
 
TrakHack: That is good to know, thank you for the advice! I actually did take a look at the August Vintage - that's so surprising even these new "old" cuts have some variation on the patterning. Definitely will be something to consider if I get to take a look at this diamond in person.

bluelotus: Yes, I actually have an update for everyone! :) Adam just sent over the macro image; please find it below:

oec_old_world_diamonds.jpg

I would appreciate your thoughts on the pic - thanks a bunch!
 
Hi, everyone! Just checking in to see if you have any thoughts on the macro picture - thanks so much for your guidance! :)
 
I hope someone else chimes in with me here - but I'm not a fan of this one. It seems really dark under the table, but I still can't tell if it's glare from the photo or actual obstruction. That said, it could just be a stone that doesn't photograph well (and there are plenty out there) but is a knock out in person. It also looks like it could have a snowflake pattern but it's hard to tell from just this one picture, and it also looks like it has a lot of body color for a J, but that could be monitor settings. Ask Adam to level with you if the stone is worth seeing or if he has something else in your budget he likes better.
 
Can he provide a better face-up photo? i.e. dead center? Not sure if it's the photography but I'm not liking it in the marco shot.
 
Kind of hard to tell from that photograph. It looks like it has a strong contrast pattern (hence the darkness) but again, it seems you must see it in person to make a call. Perhaps a closer straight on shot taken in natural daylight (shade) in order to get a clearer sense of the facet pattern? Still looks promising to me.
 
liaerfbv: Thank you again for your advice! I agree, when I first saw the picture, the stone definitely looked warmer than I expected - I'm thinking of going with a platinum setting with micropave on the sides, so I hope the stone is whiter than it photographs. :( As you suggested, I asked Adam if he could take some more straight forward shots and also asked for his honest opinion of the stone (whether he has other stones in our budget that he likes better in his inventory as well). I will update once I hear back from him! Hopefully the new pictures will be more informative. :confused:

two_little_birds: I'm with you, I definitely wasn't as 'wow-ed' by the macro shot compared to the video - fingers crossed, the new pictures will look better!

bluelotus: Thanks a bunch for coming back as well! I appreciate the feedback. :) Yes, it's so difficult to tell based on this picture what the facet pattern looks like - it's not very clear at all. I will post the new pictures as soon as I receive them!
 
Buying an OEC can be tough, I feel your pain. Have you looked at Love Affair Diamonds or Jewels by Grace? They are 2 other excellent old cut vendors you could contact.
 
liaerfbv: Yes, actually I have been a long time fan of their work, even back when they were JbEG - they were the first place I looked to be honest. It just happens that LAF's stock is super limited right now as I just missed their holiday sale (my proposal was post-sale, shucks! :silenced: ). JBG had two stones I was actually interested in, both J and VS1/VVS2 - the only thing holding me back was that the GIA report showed either an extremely thin girdle or a very thin to slightly thick girdle. The stone at OWD had a medium girdle, which I thought would be sturdier. What are your thoughts on girdle thickness? Do you think it's a major spec to consider, or is it not a deal breaker? Here are the two JBG stones I was looking at - the pictures and videos are really lovely.

http://www.jewelsbygrace.com/loose-...opean-cut-diamond-gia-j-vs1.html#.VLbrRnoo7qA

http://www.jewelsbygrace.com/loose-...pean-cut-diamond-gia-j-vvs2.html#.VLbuznoo7qA

Thanks so much!
 
Well you have 3 great choices here IMO! I personally prefer the 1.34, then the 1.55, then the 1.36. The thin girdle is something to consider - how do you plan to set the stone? I have a thin girdle, and my stone was originally set in a 8prong JBEG Julia and I was still very nervous. Now mine is in a bezel and I feel much more secure (but I'm very hard on my hands and general klutzy).

As to upping the budget for the largest stone - do you plan this to be your forever ring? I know many people recommend putting the majority of the budget in the stone... but there's something to be said for getting a ring once with the setting you love. I've had a million e-rings and it took me 5+ years to get it right. Will you regret it if you compromise on the setting?
 
liaerfbv: Thanks so much for your feedback! I personally prefer the look of the six prong, which is why the thin girdle concerned me and I initially thought the JBG stones were out of the running. :( I am a bit klutzy as well, but just love that classic six prong look. Do you think it will be best to stick with a thicker girdle since that's the case?

I do plan on this being my "forever ring" and I completely understand what you mean - the good thing is I haven't found a setting that I LOVED yet, so I don't think I will be regretting just yet. I am still doing research. :)

Just to update you on Old World Diamonds, Adam seems to only reply to half of my email most times for some reason? :confused: I asked him about the body color of the diamond twice, but he has not commented on that. I also asked for additional images of the stone I requested, and followed up with a comment asking for his honest feedback and whether there was another stone in his inventory that he liked better. He disregarded my request for additional images and just said he will take a look at his stock and find some of his favorites for me (but then said to feel free to let him know if I have any additional questions??).

I'm wondering if the lack of enthusiasm to provide additional info/pictures about this stone shows it's not one of his best? :silenced:
 
To be safe, if you want to do a 6 prong I'd probably stay away from extremely thin girdles. Thin might be okay, depending on how much of the circumference is "thin." You could email Grace and ask her if you think either of those stones is safe to put in a 6 prong. And I obviously recommend insurance or self-insurance (depending on your view of insurance).

I did not have a lot of email correspondence with Adam so I can't comment on that unfortunately. We mostly spoke over the phone. But I did have an issue with another vendor who only responded to half my emails so I started numbering my questions (rather than paragraph form), that way it made it easier to address each point (and easier to say, but what about #2 if it wasn't addressed in the reply).
 
liaerfbv: Thanks for the tips! I did end up emailing Erica about the 1.55 carat and she said the girdle in a 6 prong should be perfectly fine since it's 'thin to medium' and not extremely thin (as you mentioned :) ). She said she's going to take a look under the loupe this weekend to see how much of the girdle is thin and she will let me know.

One thing my fiance was concerned about for this particular diamond was that the 'cut grade' on the GIA report was 'fair'. It's interesting, because I actually don't see the cut grade listed on most other GIA reports; to my amateur eyes, the cut and faceting of the stone looks lovely. :silenced: Do you know how important the cut grade is?
 
I don't worry about the cut grade. OECs don't fit into neat boxes by the numbers like MRBs do. I hope Erica has great things to say about the 1.55!
 
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