New Here.... a question

[dageman]

Hi Everyone

I have been lurking here for a month or so now, just gathering info... just wanted to say this site has been incredibly informative! There is nothing worse than spending a ton of money without doing the research first and having regrets about what you have done... hopefully this site will help prevent me from doing that!

Anyways, I am in the market for a ring within the next 6 months or so, and my GF has her heart set on a certain Tacori (of course, damn expensive those things are)

So the setting she wants has a 1ct emerald cut centre stone. So I went to a couple of the mere 3 Tacori dealers in all of the Greater Toronto Area and one of them told me to choose whatever quality diamond I thought was apporpriate and he would source it for me. At first I was thinking maybe VS2, maybe an eye clean SI1, G colour, very good cut and polish, symmettry all that jazz. Then I go to another dealer to compare pricing and hes all up in arms telling me that if you want an emerald cut that doesnt look like crap you have to get MINIMUM VS1, and he strongly reccommends something in VVS. He said G was fine, but winced a little saying it. He said "you are buying a Mercedes setting, why go with a Honda centre stone" or something to that effect. His main argument was that the EC is so "clear and glasslike" that even VS2 stones will be visibly "lower quality". He said if I was going with an RB he would have no problem selling me an H or I, SI clarity, because the fire and whatnot tends to mask any visible problems with the stone.

Anyways just wanted to ask for everyone''s opinion. People here are so knowledgeable! I am just starting out and have gathered a lot of information but havent had time to synthesize or make perfect sense of all of it yet. As a side note, Im 22 turning 23 and want to knock out most jewellers who take one look at me and act like I am poor, totally diamond ignorant, and basically should not be in their store! haha... Maybe I should grow a winter beard to try to gain a little more respect.

Looking forward to your responses
Mike

 

[Lorelei]

Welcome Mike!

Basically some of what you have been told has some worth; step cuts such as EC's, Asschers etc often do better with a higher clarity of VS and up, the faceting can show inclusions more readily, so apparently it is rare for an SI in this shape to be eyeclean. Colour it depends, some make an H their cut off point, but colour sensitivity varies, so if you can, it is best to try to see some for yourself of similar shape, size and colour grade ( same lab such as GIA.) Also if you can find a well cut and eyeclean VS2 so much the better, this definitely isn't beyond the realms of possibility. We also have a poster here with an I colour EC in a Tacori setting, she may chime in if she sees this, but her EC is fabulously white and her setting stunning, so colour can also depend on the individual diamond.

Personally I would recommend you put yourself into the expert hands of one of the online vendors such as Good old Gold, Whiteflash etc, tell them what you want and they will help you find a stunning diamond. Cut is critical, much harder to judge by numbers and crown heights etc, than by using your own eyes, but many online vendors have cut analysis such as ASET which can help judge light performance, plus their own expertise. This way you can avoid many of the EC's which may bark and find a stunner more easily! Other than that, I see you are in Canada and may not have considered buying online, find a vendor you can trust in a store etc and don't be afraid to ask questions and see as many diamonds as you can. Fancy shapes are best judged by the eyes, so look at as many EC's as possible, then trust what YOU find beautiful and look at it in as many different lights as possible before pulling the trigger. Many online vendors have a great return policy if you decide to go that way BTW.

Take your time to do this also, sourcing a well cut EC may take a little time, but it will be time well spent.

 

[Regular Guy]

Date: 12/17/2007 11:14:47 AM
Author: Lorelei
Welcome Mike!

Basically some of what you have been told has some worth; step cuts such as EC''s, Asschers etc often do better with a higher clarity of VS and up, the faceting can show inclusions more readily, so apparently it is rare for an SI in this shape to be eyeclean. Colour it depends, some make an H their cut off point, but colour sensitivity varies, so if you can, it is best to try to see some for yourself of similar shape, size and colour grade ( same lab such as GIA.) Also if you can find a well cut and eyeclean VS2 so much the better, this definitely isn''t beyond the realms of possibility. We also have a poster here with an I colour EC in a Tacori setting, she may chime in if she sees this, but her EC is fabulously white and her setting stunning, so colour can also depend on the individual diamond.

Personally I would recommend you put yourself into the expert hands of one of the online vendors such as Good old Gold, Whiteflash etc, tell them what you want and they will help you find a stunning diamond. Cut is critical, much harder to judge by numbers and crown heights etc, than by using your own eyes, but many online vendors have cut analysis such as ASET which can help judge light performance, plus their own expertise. This way you can avoid many of the EC''s which may bark and find a stunner more easily! Other than that, I see you are in Canada and may not have considered buying online, find a vendor you can trust in a store etc and don''t be afraid to ask questions and see as many diamonds as you can. Fancy shapes are best judged by the eyes, so look at as many EC''s as possible, then trust what YOU find beautiful and look at it in as many different lights as possible before pulling the trigger. Many online vendors have a great return policy if you decide to go that way BTW.

Take your time to do this also, sourcing a well cut EC may take a little time, but it will be time well spent.

Consider helping yourself with ASET analysis, as well. $50 - $100 for your own utilities...

 

[chrono]

Hello and welcome to Pricescope, Mike. I''m so happy to see another EC appreciator.

Here''s stats that will help you get started:
Colour: H and better because fancies like ECs do show colour. This is subjective to the wearer''s taste/tolerance level.
Clarity: VS2 and better. No point getting VVS because even with a VS, you can''t see a thing and I haven''t seen any eye clean SI1s.
Table: 65% and under to avoid a glassy look and for more fire
Depth: 68% and under to avoid having a smaller diameter diamond
Crown height: 10% and higher is better for more fire
Girdle: Avoid very thin and under, very thick and over to avoid chipping and hidden weight. An even medium girdle is very hard to find so don''t aim for one.
Polish: Very Good and better
Symmetry: Very Good and better

Step cuts do show everything so my minimum recommendation for clarity is a VS2. I have yet to see an eye clean SI1 in person and on PS. Having top colour and clarity does NOTHING to make an EC more sparkly. It is the cut that makes it happen. Even everything that I posted above is not guaranteed to have a gorgeous EC but it does eliminate many ugly ones. My recommendation comes from reading this, so you know I didn''t pull it out of thin air:
http://www.gemappraisers.com/oldcutgraderules.asp

I used it to shop for my own EC and it served me well. I had my local jeweller line up 3 stones for me with similiar specs as the above and I picked the best one. In the mean time, I also "taught" my eyes to see the difference between well cut and dud stones by viewing as many ECs as possible. An Idealscope (just $25 from www.gemappraisers.com too) will help. An ASET would be far better though.

If you choose to go with an online dealer, you can use the same specs above, and have the vendor take ASET pictures for you to review. Good luck!

 

[Lorelei]

No point getting VVS because even with a VS

Chrono I just wanted to say, if Mike found a well cut VVS he likes, even though the clarity is high, he perhaps should still consider it, as nice EC's are hard to find, that way he broadens his options.

 

[chrono]

Date: 12/17/2007 11:47:25 AM
Author: Lorelei
No point getting VVS because even with a VS

Chrono I just wanted to say, if Mike found a well cut VVS he likes, even though the clarity is high, he perhaps should still consider it, as nice EC''s are hard to find, that way he broadens his options.

Of course. Basically, I''m saying not to specifically look for a VVS only stone but if the well cut EC happens to have a VVS AND is within budget, then why not. I''d start out my search with a VS and if nothing nice comes up, then I''d broaden the search to include a VVS.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 12/17/2007 11:56:10 AM
Author: Chrono

Date: 12/17/2007 11:47:25 AM
Author: Lorelei
No point getting VVS because even with a VS

Chrono I just wanted to say, if Mike found a well cut VVS he likes, even though the clarity is high, he perhaps should still consider it, as nice EC''s are hard to find, that way he broadens his options.

Of course. Basically, I''m saying not to specifically look for a VVS only stone but if the well cut EC happens to have a VVS AND is within budget, then why not. I''d start out my search with a VS and if nothing nice comes up, then I''d broaden the search to include a VVS.

Gotcha!

 

[Gypsy]

Ditto everything Chrono said. But wanted to add... what''s the price on the tacori? Maybe we can find you a better deal?

 

[dageman]

Thanks for the opinions thus far.

I have been looking through some online vendors but living in Canada I am uncertain about how that would work out. Shipping over the border has been a hassle for me in the past and I would be hesitant to do it with a diamond. Has anyone ever done this? Besides this the jeweller is giving me a much better price on the setting/diamond combo if I also buy the diamond from him.

Its so difficult to get a look at a number of stones in a B&M store. They just do not have a good selection of ECs. I guess I''m lucky that I still have 6-7 months. I feel this is going to take me a long while to get my hands on a nice quality stone.

 

[chrono]

Many stores do not have many ECs in-store (much less well cut ones). However, good quality B&Ms can call in stones for you. If you give them your specification, they should be able to get in at least 2 or 3 at a time for you (after several weeks).

 

[Regular Guy]

Adding on just one more option for you to consider...and I don't know if he can coordinate in any way with Tacori, etc...but Martin is in your area...and even though his website is a bother, he has earned a good reputation here.

 

[dageman]

Just saw the post about the Tacori price. I am looking at the HT2273 the "small" version because they make 2 different sizes of it. Here is the pic from Bill Barnes

http://www.billbarnes.com/product.asp?product=14897


its got the baguettes 1/2 way around the band and is 0.70ct for the entire setting. I was quoted a price of $4500(CAD) for platinum and $3500 for 18K white. Im thinking its a pretty good price since its equal to the USD amount on this site (thank god for the strong Canadian dollar right now haha) but it doesn''t hurt to see if I can get a better price somewhere else.

I suppose I''m still kind of torn between the age old question of platnum vs. 18K... arrgg so many tough decisions...