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Need Help Finding Round Diamond and Setting (Details Included)

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Paul8235

Rough_Rock
Joined
Oct 14, 2017
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Hello all! I have been reading up as much as I can on this forum but still feel I have so much left to learn.

I am now searching for a round diamond and below are my criteria and would greatly appreciate any and all help in finding a great diamond:

Shape: Round
Size: 1.7 to 1.85 carats
Cut: Near Ideal to Ideal
Color: H or higher
Clarity: SI1 or higher (must be eye clean)
Ideal budget including setting: approx. $12k

I'm open to tweaks on the above criteria if anyone feels there is a compromise available that would still yield what I am looking for.

I'm also looking for a cathedral setting with sidestones, 6 prongs, without a basket and without a halo in platinum.
Something similar to this:
image2.jpg

The main criteria she is looking for is a diamond that sparkles! She also says this is her forever ring so trade-in policy is not as important of a criteria.

I'm looking to purchase within the next 3-4 weeks.

Please let me know if you have any questions or if I can clarify anything. Thanks in advance for the help!
 

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Paul8235 said:
I am now searching for a round diamond and below are my criteria and would greatly appreciate any and all help in finding a great diamond:

Shape: Round
Size: 1.7 to 1.85 carats
Cut: Near Ideal to Ideal
Color: H or higher
Clarity: SI1 or higher (must be eye clean)
Ideal budget including setting: approx. $12k
Click to expand...
That would a tough task. A nice GIA/AGS stone will cost you about $15k w/o the setting.
 
Tough to meet your size reqs with your current budget unless you drop to an I color or increase your budget...or as RS already suggested, you could meet your color req by going slightly smaller. I'll post a few I options that will get you a slightly larger size:
:love: https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...rat-i-color-vs1-clarity-ideal-cut-sku-4840785
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...i-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-4883541
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...i-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-4881762
60/60 style that will favor white light return but also gets you the spread of a 1.8 ct stone: https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...i-color-vs2-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-4794597
If clouds aren't an issue: https://www.bluenile.com/diamond-de...ATIONS&track=viewDiamondDetails&action=newTab

A couple of other settings that have the 6 prongs you're looking for. Although I like RS' suggestions, they have 4 prongs - they may be able to customize the setting to a 6 prong but it would probably make it non-refundable:
https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...-gold-trellis-pave-engagement-ring-item-58991
Not a real cathedral but the sides go slightly up: https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...ench-cut-six-prong-engagement-ring-item-49518
For example, if you look at the recently purchased rings, the 2ct ring has a 6 prong head: https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...ound-shaped-diamond-engagement-ring-item-1105
 
Thanks for the quick replies and information. I would prefer to increase my budget rather than decrease the size at the moment.

I've only seen an I diamond one but it seemed much more yellow than the H. It's very possible this was due to a bad I stone or bad lighting, or a combination of both. If people feel there isn't much difference between an I and H stone, I could find another place to look at stones to see if I still see them in that manner.

For the setting, I forgot to mention she prefers a thin/petite band with thin prongs.
 
I'm still searching and just came across this WF stone from their premium select line - it's not their ACA/ES super ideal cut stone, but it will get you into their excellent upgrade policy for any future needs ;)2 https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/round-cut-loose-diamond-3855518.htm

They could probably customize this lovely setting for a 6 prong head: https://www.whiteflash.com/engageme...eek-line-pave-diamond-engagement-ring-422.htm
Here a couple of other options from Vatche but more expensive:
https://www.whiteflash.com/engageme...ond-engagement-ring-by-vatche-1650.htm#size=6
https://www.whiteflash.com/engageme...-pave-diamond-engagement-ring-2820.htm#size=6
 
Does anyone know when the sale on settings at James Allen ends?
 
Paul8235 said:
Does anyone know when the sale on settings at James Allen ends?
Click to expand...

I thought it was supposed to end at the end of April...but now I see the website says it ends May 2 at 11:59PM EST!
 
 
Thanks everyone.

Is there a big difference between H and I for color? As I mentioned, the I that I saw seemed yellow but it may have been bad lighting or a bad stone.

Also, I would like to stay above the 1.7 mark even though it will be more expensive. Would $14k for the stone be more reasonable?
 
Paul8235 said:
Thanks everyone.

Is there a big difference between H and I for color? As I mentioned, the I that I saw seemed yellow but it may have been bad lighting or a bad stone.

Also, I would like to stay above the 1.7 mark even though it will be more expensive. Would $14k for the stone be more reasonable?
Click to expand...

I went through a similar struggle myself before finally deciding on a Brian Gavin Blue series diamond. Before getting there I was looking at stones at JamesAllen & WhiteFlash. I was about to pull the trigger on one of the WF stones when I found the BG stone.

In my case, I was wanting a G or better. Some of the competition was H stones. Just one color grade of difference, but mentally was disturbing to me. I worked with a rep at WF and BG to confirm colors. Essentially what I was told is that it is nearly impossible for all but experienced eyes to see one color difference between two stones unless something else is amiss.

That said, all the H's I looked at were facing up bright & white, and not yellow. The BGD Blue stone I opted for is an H. However, it also has some fluorescence which can actually help whiten the stone a bit. More than that, the stone is a hearts & arrow and a super ideal cut so it is full of fire & sparkle.

I am not certain your obsession with 1.7+ carats, but I think you will be better served and happier by buying a diamond with a superb cut and slightly smaller. I will use myself as an example. My target goal was 1 carat. Many of the stones I found were .90 and thereabouts. The G I almost bought from WF was exactly .90 and the H I am buying from BGD is actually 0.867. Not much difference, but because the way the stone is cut, the BGD diamond is actually slightly larger in diameter. Not much, but 0.05mm. Still I will take that. All because the stone is cut better and has slightly better proportions. Also, did I mention my stone is $1,000 less than the WF one?

Be open minded here, and I'm sure you can find what you want for your budget. However, as you become more educated what you want and find important may slightly change from your initial perception. Good luck!

FYI....here is a quote from WF concerning a review one of the gemologists did on my behalf. I am quoting so you can see what they say about the colors.

Hi Sledge,

I hope your day is going well. Thank you for placing your diamond on reserve with Whiteflash! I tired reaching you by phone, but got your voicemail.

I had a chance to take a look at the diamonds you are considering, and I can see why you are having a difficult time deciding, they are both very beautiful and very similar. https://www.whiteflash.com/loose-diamonds/compare.aspx?idnos=3945630,3586209 In terms of color, the diamonds were indistinguishable from the top view and faced up nice and bright white. From the side, you could see an extremely slight difference in color, however this is to be expected.

The H SI1 did have an inclusion that you may be able to see from the side and when looking at the diamond as close as 6 inches, depending on your eye site. The G VS2 will require at least 10X magnification to see any inclusions.


In terms of sparkle, fire, and brilliance, both of these diamonds are amazing performers! There was not much separating them in terms of performance, and we have the technical conformation of the sparkle with the Aset and Ideal Scope images.
https://www.whiteflash.com/whiteflash-diamond-imaging/

I hope this helps! Please let me know if you have any questions!

Thanks,
Click to expand...
 
Paul8235 said:
Thanks everyone.

Is there a big difference between H and I for color? As I mentioned, the I that I saw seemed yellow but it may have been bad lighting or a bad stone.

Also, I would like to stay above the 1.7 mark even though it will be more expensive. Would $14k for the stone be more reasonable?
Click to expand...

Just to check, was the I colour you saw GIA graded? That can make a big difference if another lab graded the diamond.

To my eyes, I can't see a difference between reliably graded H and I colour of a similar size and similar cut quality but some are more sensitive with colour than others. An I colour is where those in the industry believe the average consumer might begin to notice a hint of warmth from the side view usually but an accurately graded I should not look in any way yellow.

If this is her forever ring then go with what you and she are most comfortable with, 14k is a very nice budget and you should find something in the size you mention for that.
 
Thanks for the information, that was really helpful.

I do not particularly have any attachment to the 1.7 mark. My girlfriend originally wanted a 2+ carat stone but was really impressed with a 1.7 we saw and said she didn't want anything smaller than that. While 1.65 and 1.7 are very similar, I think it will be a mental thing for her if its smaller than 1.7. However, I agree with you in that the dimensions can make a 1.6X appear larger than a 1.7+ and will definitely keep that in mind as I am searching.

sledge said:
I went through a similar struggle myself before finally deciding on a Brian Gavin Blue series diamond. Before getting there I was looking at stones at JamesAllen & WhiteFlash. I was about to pull the trigger on one of the WF stones when I found the BG stone.

In my case, I was wanting a G or better. Some of the competition was H stones. Just one color grade of difference, but mentally was disturbing to me. I worked with a rep at WF and BG to confirm colors. Essentially what I was told is that it is nearly impossible for all but experienced eyes to see one color difference between two stones unless something else is amiss.

That said, all the H's I looked at were facing up bright & white, and not yellow. The BGD Blue stone I opted for is an H. However, it also has some fluorescence which can actually help whiten the stone a bit. More than that, the stone is a hearts & arrow and a super ideal cut so it is full of fire & sparkle.

I am not certain your obsession with 1.7+ carats, but I think you will be better served and happier by buying a diamond with a superb cut and slightly smaller. I will use myself as an example. My target goal was 1 carat. Many of the stones I found were .90 and thereabouts. The G I almost bought from WF was exactly .90 and the H I am buying from BGD is actually 0.867. Not much difference, but because the way the stone is cut, the BGD diamond is actually slightly larger in diameter. Not much, but 0.05mm. Still I will take that. All because the stone is cut better and has slightly better proportions. Also, did I mention my stone is $1,000 less than the WF one?

Be open minded here, and I'm sure you can find what you want for your budget. However, as you become more educated what you want and find important may slightly change from your initial perception. Good luck!

FYI....here is a quote from WF concerning a review one of the gemologists did on my behalf. I am quoting so you can see what they say about the colors.
Click to expand...

Good point, I'm not sure if it was GIA certified or not. I'll go to another jeweler to take another look at I and H stones.

Lorelei said:
Just to check, was the I colour you saw GIA graded? That can make a big difference if another lab graded the diamond.

To my eyes, I can't see a difference between reliably graded H and I colour of a similar size and similar cut quality but some are more sensitive with colour than others. An I colour is where those in the industry believe the average consumer might begin to notice a hint of warmth from the side view usually but an accurately graded I should not look in any way yellow.

If this is her forever ring then go with what you and she are most comfortable with, 14k is a very nice budget and you should find something in the size you mention for that.
Click to expand...
 
Glad it helped, and I wish you luck on your search.

FYI, I see you keep increasing your budget. I don't know your money situation (nor is it any of my business), but I would encourage you to set a maximum dollar and stick to it. Like you, I had a fluid budget; however, I always had a maximum dollar amount in mind. I just choose to start below my max number as I anticipated I would find something that would make me want to increase it. With the diamond I selected I am a little below the initial amount I started at, but I am personally struggling with a setting so some of that fluff may get ate up in that.

Either way, I have some wiggle room but I refuse to go over my max number. I would encourage you to determine your own max number and stick to your guns. Being financially stable and controlling your money will bring more relief and happiness to you and your relationship than having a 1.6, 1.7 or 2ct diamond.

I might also add that as a guy we fall prey to trying to please our women. I don't know the tone or demeanor it was stated, but if a 1.65 carat caused my girl distress, I would have bigger issues than a diamond. It has less to do w/ money and what I can or can't afford, and more to do with my girl being grateful and respectful for whatever ring she gets.

Of course in the past I've dated some real bimbos and could have gotten away with telling them a 1.65 was really a 1.7 because of rounding. :lol:

My girl now has a masters degree and is too smart for tricks like that. But she also has a heart of gold and doesn't care about diamond size, and at one point suggested just plain metal bands. Since she doesn't expect or demand it, I want to give her more -- as long as it's within my max budget.

Paul8235 said:
Thanks for the information, that was really helpful.

I do not particularly have any attachment to the 1.7 mark. My girlfriend originally wanted a 2+ carat stone but was really impressed with a 1.7 we saw and said she didn't want anything smaller than that. While 1.65 and 1.7 are very similar, I think it will be a mental thing for her if its smaller than 1.7. However, I agree with you in that the dimensions can make a 1.6X appear larger than a 1.7+ and will definitely keep that in mind as I am searching.

Good point, I'm not sure if it was GIA certified or not. I'll go to another jeweler to take another look at I and H stones.
Click to expand...
 
The diamond looks good to me no light leakages....good shaped arrows, wait for some expert comments to confirm the same.
Looking at the numbers would this combination of CA/ PA angles be a concern???? Some expert opinion would help....
 
Hi Paul,

The diamond looks great, what I call ' near' H&A. The cut precision isn't as good as with one of the true H&A Superideals, but it's still very good and it should be a beautiful diamond.

No concerns with the proportions, the crown angle is a tad shallower than the usual 34> range but it shouldn't make a difference and hardly any visually.
 
Lorelei said:
Hi Paul,

The diamond looks great, what I call ' near' H&A. The cut precision isn't as good as with one of the true H&A Superideals, but it's still very good and it should be a beautiful diamond.

No concerns with the proportions, the crown angle is a tad shallower than the usual 34> range but it shouldn't make a difference and hardly any visually.
Click to expand...

Geez....shall I call you the diamond whisperer?

Using this as reference:
http://www.heartsandarrows.com/hearts-arrows-diamond-ideal-cut-dna.aspx

Diamond is in the yellow box for a true H&A, meaning it "has remote chance of working as H&A only with narrow combinations of table size & star lengths".

Analyzing further....
Table Size: 53% To 58% (54%-57% is optimum) - This diamond = 56%
Star Facet Length: 40% To 58% (45%-50% is optimum) - This diamond = 50%

My knowledge isn't in-depth enough (yet, hopefully, lol) to understand if the 56% & 50% values fit within the "narrow combination" talked about in reference to the yellow box. However, they are optimum values as individuals.

All this just echos what @Lorelei said in plain english instead of nerd jibberish. :geek2:
 
:lol:
 
rockysalamander said:
Diamond Whisperer...how sweet.
Click to expand...

Not as sweet as Glitter Fairy.
daydreaming.gif


sparkle.gif
 
Is there any issue with the HCA score being 0.8? Will it be noticeably darker than a diamond that is in the 1-2 range?

Lorelei said:
Hi Paul,

The diamond looks great, what I call ' near' H&A. The cut precision isn't as good as with one of the true H&A Superideals, but it's still very good and it should be a beautiful diamond.

No concerns with the proportions, the crown angle is a tad shallower than the usual 34> range but it shouldn't make a difference and hardly any visually.
Click to expand...
 
No there won't be any such issues as far as I am awarr. HCA tool is used for elimination of diamonds whose score is more than 2. Since your pick is less than 2 it should be fine. Nothing to do with dark portions of diamond.
 
Rpb said:
No there won't be any such issues as far as I am awarr. HCA tool is used for elimination of diamonds whose score is more than 2. Since your pick is less than 2 it should be fine. Nothing to do with dark portions of diamond.
Click to expand...

Rp is right, the HCA is a rejection tool only, all stones scoring <2 are considered worthy of further evaluation. The HCA can't really predict performance nuances, only tell you which set of proportions are likely to work well together.
 
Thanks all.

I was really interested in that Four Mine diamond, but its now been sold. I tried to put it on hold last week but they told me they were not able to do that.

It seems the setting will cost more than I was anticipating so I'm more so targeting a $12-$13k budget for the diamond.

Please let me know if you come across something that would work.
 
Last edited:
Paul8235 said:
Thanks all.

I was really interested in that Four Mine diamond, but its now been sold. I tried to put it on hold last week but they told me they were not able to do that.

It seems the setting will cost more than I was anticipating so I'm more so targeting a $12-$13k budget for the diamond.

Please let me know if you come across something that would work.
Click to expand...

Are you looking at a specific setting somewhere?

this JA Is similar and is under $1k in platinum.
https://www.jamesallen.com/engageme...ite-pave-cathedral-engagement-ring-item-50083

It would help to know your ALL IN budget. It would help for people to make specific recommendations for each site on stones and setting.

for the above JA setting, to stay under $14k:
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...color-si1-clarity-true-hearts-cut-sku-3257551
https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...color-si1-clarity-true-hearts-cut-sku-4309061 crown angle is a tad high but i really like it.

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...h-color-vs1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-4632202 :love::love:

https://www.jamesallen.com/loose-di...i-color-si1-clarity-excellent-cut-sku-4883541
 
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