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mercinary

Rough_Rock
Joined
May 16, 2008
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9
Hello all!

I''m currently shopping for an upgrade to my wife''s engagement ring as a 5th year wedding anniversary gift. I''m now looking at two different options, and I am torn. Any commentary/suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Option #1:
- One of those Mall-based jewelers
- Unpleasant shopping experience (getting ANY information about the diamond itself has been like pulling teeth). Also feel like they are playing pricing games with me.

The Rock
EGL Cert.
Size: 1.26 carat
Measurements: 6.89 - 6.82 x 4.29
Depth: 62.6%
Table: 59%
Cut Grade: ideal
Clarity: SI1
Color: H
Florescence: faint blue
Girdle: 1.9% - 3/2%

Cost (after $4500 trade-in value): $5500

Note: This mall-based jeweler is where I got my wife''s current engagement ring. Therefore they are giving me a high trade in value. They are also willing to give us a new setting with upgraded side diamonds (moving from .25 on each side to .31 on each side).

Option #2:
- Much more upscale jeweler, not mall-based, have about 6 locations total.
- Awesome shopping experience. The jeweler has helped me review the ring details from the mall-based jeweler, has even repeatedly stated that if I like the deal, I should go for it. Seems to genuinely have my best interest in mind.

The Rock
GIA Cert.
Size: 1.15 carat
Measurements: 6.77 - 6.81 x 4.17
Depth: 61.4%
Table: 57%
Cut Grade: ideal
Clarity: SI2
Color: F
Florescence: none
Girdle: thin-med (I don''t have a percentage)

Cost (after $1000 trade-in value): $5650

My current thoughts

1. In comparing online prices of similar stones, the mall-based jeweler seems to be providing a better deal. I''m seeing similar online rocks for ~$6300 whereas the 1.15 rock I''ve seen at roughly $5600 online.

2. I''m NOT a fan of the experience I am getting at the mall-based jeweler. When the wife wants another upgrade after 10 or 15 years, do I really want to be stuck going back to them again? Maybe I should take a slight downgrade to go with the more upscale jeweler (so that I can rest assured that when I upgrade I will be able to work with them again). Plus, will we really be able to tell the difference between a 1.26 and a 1.15 carat?

So this is where I am stuck. Anyone have any thoughts they would like to share?

-Merc
 
Well I suspect it might be possible to tell the difference between a 1.26 and a 1.15 if they are cut the same, However these two stones seem pretty similar. It looks like most of the extra weight of the 1.26 is being used to make the stone deeper. So unless you mount the stone sideways it might be tough to tell. Selling diamonds by caret weight always seemed a little silly in this regard.


As for value vs online stores that is really tough to tell without more information. If you were able to get the GIA report # that would allow you to look up the details online and may get some better comparison data.
 
Welcome!

Well....from the info given, the second GIA graded diamond appears to be the better proposition, but we really need the crown and pavilion angles to be able to judge the cut. Could you ask the jeweller for this info? I would see if the jeweller who has offered you the best trade in value, could still offer you a decent sum and bring in some AGS0 and GIA Excellent cut grade for you to see. GIA Excellent cut grade can be broader than AGS, but by taking each on it's own merits, you could find a lovely stone. EGL graded diamonds can also be harder to trade in or resell, so you might want to take that into consideration, should you wish to upgrade again.

Alternatively, you could maybe consider keeping the original diamond ( if finances permit) and set it into a pendant perhaps, then starting with a clean slate with a new jeweller if you prefer that. Have you considered buying online?
 
Thanks for the quick feedback folks. Here is some of the info you''re looking for.

Rock #1:
Crown: 14%
Pavilion: 44.20
EGL Report #: US 85134904D

Rock #2:
Crown: 14%
Pavilion: 41.6
GIA Report #: 16319203

Also, it is funny that you mention the pendant. The upper scale jeweler has offered to put the old stone into a pendant if I didn''t like the $1000 trade in value. I would still need to purchase a chain, but the setting would be free. The old ring is a .70 carat. Comparable pendants run around $2000-2500.

-Merc
 
I would maybe think about looking online too; the more options the better, no?
2.gif
 
Skippy:

Believe me, I''ve explored the option. I''m not opposed to it, however it is incredibly daunting. Even after weeks of reading about diamonds, I don''t feel confident that I can really pick something out online and say "hey, this is definitely a better deal".

-Merc
 
Date: 5/16/2008 10:28:38 AM
Author: mercinary
Thanks for the quick feedback folks. Here is some of the info you're looking for.

Rock #1:
Crown: 14%
Pavilion: 44.20
EGL Report #: US 85134904D

Rock #2:
Crown: 14%
Pavilion: 41.6
GIA Report #: 16319203

Also, it is funny that you mention the pendant. The upper scale jeweler has offered to put the old stone into a pendant if I didn't like the $1000 trade in value. I would still need to purchase a chain, but the setting would be free. The old ring is a .70 carat. Comparable pendants run around $2000-2500.

-Merc
Click to expand...
Merc, to be honest, unless you love what you see with either of these diamonds, you can do better. I ran both of these through the Holloway Cut Advisor, and although angles are more accurate, using the info given, neither of these scored well, which is a useful way of us being able to get an idea whether a diamond is worth further consideration or not.

As you prefer working with the new jeweller if you don't want to consider online, then I would ask him to help you look among AGS0 and GIA Excellent Cut grade diamonds, as that should make it a bit easier to find a pretty stone for your wife. And if you don't want to let your original diamond go for 1k, think about the pendant idea. Some do this as they upgrade, as a way to keep the original diamond close to their heart.

Here are some proportions you can use to search for diamonds.

Depth - 60 - 62.4% ( which is my cutoff)
table - 54 - 57%
crown angle - 34 - 35 degrees
pavilion angle - 40.6 - 41 degrees.
girdle - thin to slightly thick, thin to medium, slightly thin to med etc - avoid extremes such as thin to thick.
 
Lorelei: Interesting. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Zerg: What are your thoughts?

-Merc
 
Lorelei:

So taking your advice, I did a quick price-scope search for rocks similar to the 1.15. I then used the cut adviser to help me select a diamond that I think would have a better cut. This is one I came up with:

http://www.bluenile.com/round-diamond-1-carat-very-good-cut-f-color-si2-clarity_LD01055909

This is just an example (not something I''m necessarily thinking of buying), but let''s test my understanding.

How would this diamond stack up against the 1.15?

-Merc
 
Don''t ask me I''m not an expert either :).


Personally though I bought online and was happy with the results. For the online route I would be more leery of using blue nile particularly if your looking at SI1-SI2 clarity diamonds. Without seeing the diamond you don''t know if that SI2 has a couple of inclusions that would be hidden by the prongs or there''s a big black spot right in the middle of the table. goodoldgold/whiteflash/niceice and I think jamesallen all provide at least photos of the diamond. Often a lot more info too that makes buying unseen a lot more comfortable.

The stone from the jeweler you liked actually does fall into GIA''s excellent range its just that most members here trust the HCA tool more than the GIA rating. That being the case if you like that jeweler it might be worthwhile asking about other GIA excellent cuts they have they might be of similar price as they are specced the same.
 
That one looks better, it is a tad shallow though. The crown and pavilion angles are in a better range. I would suggest checking out these vendors, as they often have the diamonds in house, and can advise you easily whether a diamond is eyeclean to your preferences or not. You need to make sure you and the vendor understand each other regarding whether a diamond is eyeclean or not, some SI2 grades may pass very close scrutiny and others may not.

I would check out these vendors too, also as they often have the in house diamonds whereas BN do not always, and also some of these vendors have great upgrade policies which are proving popular.

www.whiteflash.com

www.goodoldgold.com

www.winkjones.com

www.engagementringsdirect.com

www.jamesallen.com

Here is an example of a lovely diamond, it is around the 6k mark, so I don't know how flexible your budget is...This is a top make AGS0 hearts and arrows cut which may or may not be what you are looking for, but it may give you some idea. The colour grade is a little lower too, I don't know if dropping the colour to a J might be an option for you?

http://www.goodoldgold.com/diamond/3357/
 
OK, now my brain is exploding. :)

Thanks again for the help folks. I''m going to have to sleep on this.

-Merc
 
Date: 5/16/2008 1:17:21 PM
Author: mercinary
OK, now my brain is exploding. :)

Thanks again for the help folks. I''m going to have to sleep on this.

-Merc
Click to expand...
I am really sorry, I thought that might be the case of info overload! Have a think about things, and remember we are here to help. Many have been where you are, found out that there can be more to it than originally thought, but ended up enjoying the process and with a fabulous rock to show for it! It is so worth concentrating on getting a super cut, as it is so crucial to the beauty of the diamond. Also if you do decide to go online, the vendors are experts and can guide you every step of the way.
 
Getting back to my original question of comparing the two stones I outlined...

If you were going to pick one, you would go with the 1.15?

-Merc
 
Date: 5/16/2008 1:40:24 PM
Author: mercinary
Getting back to my original question of comparing the two stones I outlined...

If you were going to pick one, you would go with the 1.15?

-Merc
Click to expand...
Personally I wouldn''t choose either of those diamonds as I would want one with crown and pavilion angles in a tighter range which could aid sparkle and fire. But if you have seen it and like it, then that is the main thing. If it was me, I would ask my preferred jeweller to find me some AGS0 cut grade and some GIA Excellents which have similar proportions to those given above, and at least very good and above for polish and symmetry. It depends on you whether you feel the GIA diamond is a good buy. All we have to go on are the numbers, as we haven''t seen it then we can only give you an idea as consumers who do this for a hobby, how this diamond may perform. If you are really set on the GIA diamond and don''t want to look for others, then ask the jeweller if you can view this diamond away from the store lights, as they don''t give you an idea of how the diamond will look in more '' real life'' lighting. It is worth asking.
 
Got it. Thanks.

-Merc
 
Those aren''t your only two options. I definitely recommend checking out the online sites that others have posted. You can really have a great shopping experience and buy a high quality diamond for a reasonable price online! I don''t even shop in stores anymore because online is just so much better in terms of inventory, information about stones, price, and quality. Now this does not mean that all online sites are created equal, I do not recommend buying from just anywhere online...and please stay clear of ebay for large diamond purchases!
 
Date: 5/16/2008 10:28:38 AM
Author: mercinary
Thanks for the quick feedback folks. Here is some of the info you''re looking for.

Rock #1:
Crown: 14%
Pavilion: 44.20
EGL Report #: US 85134904D

Rock #2:
Crown: 14%
Pavilion: 41.6
GIA Report #: 16319203

Also, it is funny that you mention the pendant. The upper scale jeweler has offered to put the old stone into a pendant if I didn''t like the $1000 trade in value. I would still need to purchase a chain, but the setting would be free. The old ring is a .70 carat. Comparable pendants run around $2000-2500.

-Merc
Click to expand...
this stone and i have the same problem....too much weight below the belt.
9.gif
 
Date: 5/16/2008 7:49:27 PM
Author: Dancing Fire

Date: 5/16/2008 10:28:38 AM
Author: mercinary
Thanks for the quick feedback folks. Here is some of the info you''re looking for.

Rock #1:
Crown: 14%
Pavilion: 44.20
EGL Report #: US 85134904D

Rock #2:
Crown: 14%
Pavilion: 41.6
GIA Report #: 16319203

Also, it is funny that you mention the pendant. The upper scale jeweler has offered to put the old stone into a pendant if I didn''t like the $1000 trade in value. I would still need to purchase a chain, but the setting would be free. The old ring is a .70 carat. Comparable pendants run around $2000-2500.

-Merc
Click to expand...
this stone and i have the same problem....too much weight below the belt.
9.gif
Click to expand...
Still have a thick girdle then presumably DF?
31.gif
 
yep!
9.gif
 
Thanks for the added comments all. $5500 is pretty much my limit, so that $6300 stone isn''t an option.

-Merc
 
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