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Need Advice On Engagement Ring

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Loren

Rough_Rock
Joined
Apr 15, 2008
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Hi Everyone. I have been looking for an engagement ring for the past three months and have learned a lot in the process (I knew nothing when starting). I have narrowed the search down to three possible rings. Can anyone give me their opinion on the choices? Thanks. (By the way the recent price increase in diamonds was a huge bummer...they went up across the board...any advice on if now is an OK time to buy would also be appreciated)

1. http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?__fun_frm=i&track=btntext_viewselect&elem=img&pid=LD01229100&filter_id=0

2. http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?__fun_frm=i&track=btntext_viewselect&elem=img&pid=LD01179591&filter_id=0

3. http://www.bluenile.com/diamonds_details.asp?__fun_frm=i&track=btntext_viewselect&elem=img&pid=LD01149219&filter_id=0

Number one is the largest and most expensive of the three. Any opinions or advice??? Thanks so much....

Loren
 
Hello!!!!
I am NOT an expert AT ALL, but I am wondering why you are looking at such high colors?
What about dropping down in color, staying at the same size and spending about 10k less?
 
Nice collection of stones there!

1. Strong blue fluorescence is the only real issue I'd have with this one. If you're paying for a D colour, I wouldn't want fluorescence interfering. 1.4 on the Cut Advisor, so it falls within AGS 0 ranges.

2. Again, not sure about the strong blue fluorescence on this one. 1.4 on the Cut Advisor.

3. I prefer AGSL certificates if shopping online. Negligible fluorescence. My one concern is that the AGSL certificate is from August 17th 2007. That's 8 months old. I'd want a more recent certificate. It scores 2 on the Cut Advisor, the lowest of the three diamonds, but still not bad.
 
Yea, I''m not an expert either but I was wondering the same thing. But apparently if you go down in color it will still face up really white if it''s really well cut.
 
Thanks for the quick reply. I started with the "price you are supposed to pay for an engagement ring....i.e. two months salary....but I don''t like the really big engagement rings that I see a lot of girls with today and neither does my girlfriend...so I moved up in color and clarity until I hit my price range with the right size. I know that its not worth it to get D color or VVS1 but that''s where the stones fit my range.....besides, its kind of nice to have a really nice ring but have it not be too showy.....my opinion at least.
 
Thanks for the input Splinter.....what is the cut advisor? I assume that 0 is good and two not as good.

As far as fluorescence goes...I read an article where they did a double blind study that found that fluorescence didn''t affect the way the stone looked whatsoever.....you think I still should avoid a strong fluorescence stone if getting D color? Thanks.
Loren
 
Date: 4/15/2008 10:12:57 AM
Author: Loren
Thanks for the quick reply. I started with the ''price you are supposed to pay for an engagement ring....i.e. two months salary....but I don''t like the really big engagement rings that I see a lot of girls with today and neither does my girlfriend...so I moved up in color and clarity until I hit my price range with the right size. I know that its not worth it to get D color or VVS1 but that''s where the stones fit my range.....besides, its kind of nice to have a really nice ring but have it not be too showy.....my opinion at least.
Click to expand...

Ok, firstly, without starting up a huge debate, the whole two months salary thing? Marketing gimmick made up by De Beers to get people to spend more money on diamonds. To quote:

A conventional buying price ranging from two to three months wages for a ring guideline originated from De Beers marketing materials in the early 20th century, in an effort to increase the sale of diamonds.
Click to expand...

So you can safely ignore it. Shop according to what you want to buy, not what you think you should spend.

I agree with you on getting a better quality ring that''s not too showy. I''m going that route for my girlfriend''s ring. But you can certainly drop some criteria (keep cut at AGS 0) and still get a stunning stone. Put the money towards a nice trip away for the two of you?

The Cut Advisor is a tool that can roughly estimate the quality of the cut. It''s available from the Tools menu at the top of the page. The lower the number, the better the stone. This is only a rough guide though. Lots of factors can change the value of the stone.

As far as the fluorescence goes, for higher colour stones, strong fluorescence can cause a milky effect.
 
Date: 4/15/2008 10:12:57 AM
Author: Loren
Thanks for the quick reply. I started with the ''price you are supposed to pay for an engagement ring....i.e. two months salary....but I don''t like the really big engagement rings that I see a lot of girls with today and neither does my girlfriend...so I moved up in color and clarity until I hit my price range with the right size. I know that its not worth it to get D color or VVS1 but that''s where the stones fit my range.....besides, its kind of nice to have a really nice ring but have it not be too showy.....my opinion at least.
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I think that whole 2/3 month salary thing is a gimmick... I think you can go for the lower color range and save the money and put it towards your honeymoon!
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The Cut Advisor is a tool that can roughly estimate the quality of the cut. It''s available from the Tools menu at the top of the page. The lower the number, the better the stone. This is only a rough guide though. Lots of factors can change the value of the stone.

Sorry Splinter, but I will have to disagree with you on this point for accuracy sake. I think the idea of the HCA is anything below 2 is worth further consideration - just because a stone gets 0.5 instead of 1.2, doesn''t make it any better. But yes, like you mentioned it is onlt one tool and there are alot of other, usually more important factors.
 
Date: 4/15/2008 10:22:48 AM
Author: Splinter

As far as the fluorescence goes, for higher colour stones, strong fluorescence can cause a milky effect.
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Sorry to leap in here Splinter, but it is rare that strong blue fluorescence does have this effect on a diamond, although it is always prudent to check with your vendor regarding any diamond with strong blue, it isn't often apparently that it will have an adverse effect.

Also regarding the HCA, a score lower than another under 2, doesn't mean a diamond is better than another. It should be used as an elimination tool, rather than one to select stones.
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Date: 4/15/2008 10:41:14 AM
Author: arjunajane
Sorry Splinter, but I will have to disagree with you on this point for accuracy sake. I think the idea of the HCA is anything below 2 is worth further consideration - just because a stone gets 0.5 instead of 1.2, doesn''t make it any better. But yes, like you mentioned it is onlt one tool and there are alot of other, usually more important factors.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that''s what I meant.
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You can''t say that one stone is better than another based purely on their respective scores. It''s more of an elimination mechanism.

And Lorelei raises an excellent point I should have mentioned. If in doubt, get a pro to eyeball the diamond. If it''s from a respected PS vendor, then you can trust in their judgement.

P.S. arjunajane, sorry about my Aussie joke in the other thread. I was definitely kidding!
 
Date: 4/15/2008 10:55:22 AM
Author: Splinter

Date: 4/15/2008 10:41:14 AM
Author: arjunajane
Sorry Splinter, but I will have to disagree with you on this point for accuracy sake. I think the idea of the HCA is anything below 2 is worth further consideration - just because a stone gets 0.5 instead of 1.2, doesn''t make it any better. But yes, like you mentioned it is onlt one tool and there are alot of other, usually more important factors.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that''s what I meant.
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You can''t say that one stone is better than another based purely on their respective scores. It''s more of an elimination mechanism.

And Lorelei raises an excellent point I should have mentioned. If in doubt, get a pro to eyeball the diamond. If it''s from a respected PS vendor, then you can trust in their judgement.

P.S. arjunajane, sorry about my Aussie joke in the other thread. I was definitely kidding!
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Thanks Splinter!
 
No prob, Lorelei.

From what I''ve read, the milky effect is not only rare, but only happens in certain lighting conditions? I seem to recall something about direct sunlight? Any further info you have about fluorescence?
 
Date: 4/15/2008 11:00:54 AM
Author: Splinter
No prob, Lorelei.

From what I've read, the milky effect is not only rare, but only happens in certain lighting conditions? I seem to recall something about direct sunlight? Any further info you have about fluorescence?
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To the best of my knowledge, yes, the effects of oiliness/ milky/ cloudy/ can best be seen in sunlight. I remember a story from one of the experts, who has been selling diamonds for many years. He posted once that with all the diamonds he has sold through the years, only a handful of the ones with strong blue fluorescence have showed a negative effect.

I will post you some of my fave links for fluorescence, back in a bit...!

Here is a video on fluoro here - http://diamondscope.pricescope.com/

Here is a good link from GOG - Fluorescence

And a thread of PS ladies with rings with strong blue fluorescence below.

https://www.pricescope.com/community/threads/show-me-your-strong-blue-fluorescence-diamonds.42423/
 
I am not a diamond expert either, but have been researching furvently for the past 6 months.

It is very admirable that you want to get your future fiance the best that your money can buy, but I honestly do not think that going that high in color and clairty (just to spend 2 months salary) is worth it. In my honest opinion I don't think the $8,000-$10,000 difference between a say E or F (still colorless grade) diamond and a D color stone is worth it.

Also to the eye there shouldn't be a difference between ideal cut VVS's and VS1's.

I just hate to see people waste money when it isn't necessary. I know I would be mad if my b/f spent an extra sum of money for an almost non existant (visual wise) difference. Do you think your fiance will be upset if you save $10,000, especially when there isn't much visual difference between D-F and VVS-VS? I mean $10,000 could go a long way toward something........JMHO.

Now if she wanted a larger stone or ring I could see spending a little more if you can afford it, but in this case I would see if I could get an ideal cut stone in the same carat range....and lower the color and clarity just a tad.

Best of luck in this process
emsmile.gif
 
Date: 4/15/2008 11:24:03 AM
Author: Splinter
Not sure how I missed this. Has a photo of the milky effect.

Fluorescence page on Pricescope
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Yes, I knew that pic was around somewhere, but couldn''t remember where....
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But it is an excellent pic!
 
Thanks everyone. I know that I could boost the size and cut on color or clarity but I don''t want anything bigger than 1.5 at the largest and would prefer to stay around 1.25. I just don''t like the look of really big engagement rings- I think they look gaudy. Plus she has to wear it everywhere and its just too showy to have a really large stone.

Anyways....lets say you are looking at these three stones...any preferences????
 
Splinter:

Sorry, I'm a noob. Why do you prefer an AGSL cert and a recent one when buying online?
 
What a lucky gal with a generous guy! If you feel the need to lavish that much on her, and don''t want anything much bigger around than 7mm (1.25ct), why not spend the excess on a fabulous vacation in the middle of wedding planning?

It''s funny - I started my search for D-F, VVS1-VS1, with not nearly enough attention to cut. Since doing a little more looking, I''m about 99% sure I''m going to end up with this I color, SI2 (!!!) stone with a fantastic cut:

http://www.whiteflash.com/diamonds/Diamond_Details.aspx?idNo=636624

I''m very glad my guy did not surprise me with a 10,000 EUR ($15,800) ring - for one, he knew very little about jewelry, so would have been at the mercy of the local jewelers, and secondly, I don''t even think you could find such a ring in our city (or not one that SHOULD be pruchased for 10,000 EUR). But mostly, I can think of so many other ways I''d like him to spend the $10,000+ not going into my ring. My guy offered to spend what is probably 2 months'' gross salary as well (in a country with a high income tax rate!), but I would prefer he hold onto 2/3 of that for our true shared passion: travel. I''m still getting a pretty ring and feel quite spoiled!
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Loren,

I just wanted to ask a couple of question to better understand your situation. They are in no way meant to be intrusive or abrasive.
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Why are you set on spending two months salary, when less than that will buy you a totally excellent stone at the carat size that you want?

Is your girl set on a D color VVS1? Has she seen a D VVS1 compared next to a say E VS1 or F VS1 Ideal/Excellent cut?

Have you looked at stones and compared ideal cut D''s to E''s VVS''s to VS''s?

What type of setting are you looking to set your stone in?


If it is about purity of the stone I can understand somewhat, but it is just ashame that you can''t see much of a difference for all that extra cash spent

As far as the market is concerned for round cut diamonds, I had a conversation with my jeweler last week about this. He said that he thinks that the price increase in diamonds will probably coninue to escalate, especially since the demand for ideal round diamonds has greatly increased worldwide and the U.S. dollar value continues to decline.

Hope this helps a little bit.
 
Thanks Mandy.... That''s the impression I got about the current market as well. Time to buy.

As far as your questions go, Ya, I''ve looked at some diamonds around local jewlers and no I can''t tell any difference between most of the colors or clarity grades. Even the cuts often look very similar to me. In my opinion the whole thing is a bit crazy...to spend this amount on a small rock (no offense all you diamond lovers on this site) but that''s what we all do isn''t it?
 
Two months salary - boy those marketing gurus at De Beers must be worth their weight in diamonds let alone gold by now...
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If you want to spend $X, could I suggest a matching pair of earrings?

I think most girls would go for a drop in colour for more bling.

I like smaller rings myself (but then I''m in the UK) so I get your thinking. Pair of earrings equals same spend for better value and without buying a bigger stone.
 
OK....so it seems everyone recommends scrapping the higher quality stuff and going lower.....any recs then starting from scratch...here''s what I know

She wears a size 6, likes plantinum setttings, wants a round cut stone, and doesn''t like anything too big...what qualities in a diamond would you guys hold in highest importance?
 
I think it might be a guy thing. Looking at my own guy, being able to say "I got her the best diamond I can get", or even just knowing that seems to be a huge thing
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I am actually the one trying to convince him that I''d be perfectly happy with a lower color, lower clarity ring.

If you''re set on spending a set amount of money, what about the setting? I had initially wanted a very simple setting for my ring but has recently fell in love with a more antique style intricate design, which of course costs more too. Perhaps she''ll like a designer setting that''ll make her ring more unique and personal? Just a thought.

And a pair of matching earrings sound great too
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Date: 4/15/2008 1:11:56 PM
Author: Loren
OK....so it seems everyone recommends scrapping the higher quality stuff and going lower.....any recs then starting from scratch...here's what I know

She wears a size 6, likes plantinum setttings, wants a round cut stone, and doesn't like anything too big...what qualities in a diamond would you guys hold in highest importance?
Click to expand...
Firstly cut. That is what gives a diamond it's beauty, so it is well worth getting the best cut you can. This is accomplished more easily by searching amongst AGS0 cut grade and GIA Excellents, and sticking to in house stones, so a vendor can talk you through the whole process and ' be your eyes.' Then opinions may vary here, but colour to me is the next consideration. Some prefer colourless, some near, or even the warmer colour grades, but a sweet spot for some can be F G or H. Then clarity. VVS some consider to be overkill but of course it depends on preference. So VS1, VS2 or even a clean SI1 can be a good middleground. I hope this gives you some ideas.

You can search using the tool above, enter your specs and search by choosing cut quality search.
 
I'm certainly no expert but if I were you, I'd focus on the cut first since all the other variables are undetectible to the human eye. I'm going for a smaller diamond as well and since I can afford move up on the chart for the other C's, I've decided to first focus on cut. I'm going to get an branded H&A (maybe an Isee2 from GOG) so I know I'm getting the best of what my eyes can see - brilliance and fire.
 
Loren,

1. Go for the best cut possible....check with Good Old Gold or Whiteflash....they seem to be the most highly regarded for round brilliant H&A ideal cuts

2. I would go with color second........maybe drop to E, F, or even G (E and F still colorless and for less $$) The best cut diamonds will face up brilliantly white, even at a lower color than D.

3. Clarity would be my 3rd criteria.....It is the least important to me because as long as the stone is eye clean (for me that is no visible inclusions at 3-4 inches from the eye) I don''t care if it is a VS1 or an SI2. I actually would never consider anything higher than VS1 in clarity because you just can''t see any difference. I am currently only considering eye clean VS2-SI2 stones because I want some tiny inclusions that aren''t visible to the eye so that I can identify my stone.

I have a friend who took her e-ring to be cleaned at a reputable jeweler and when she got it back she asked to check it with the loupe. Long story short she noticed that the diamond in her ring was different because she knew her inclusions (though they aren''t eye visible). Turns out they changed her stone out without telling her after they cracked it. So as long as inclusions aren''t visible I think they can be valuable.
 
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