Mueller’s Conference today

[Calliecake]

Mueller: If we had confidence the President clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so.

 

[Tekate]

I heard this on the radio, had to laugh, Trump should be embarrassed (he won't be) but BARR now there is a bad actor, I mean we all know that Trumpsters hold their noses and vote for and support him, but Barr, he was attorney general under Bush Jr. How embarrasing for Barr, whom I despise

Mueller: If we had confidence the President clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so.

 

[AGBF]

Given the comments above, maybe I should place a link from this thread to the thread about William Barr's reputation and how it will be affected by his foray into Trumpland...but I won't bother.

Deb

 

[Tekate]

Hey Deb, I have read all I can about Barr in the last few months, and I know that Barr was really jeered by his fellow lawyers (not that it bothered him at all, as all Barr does is shill for Trump).. but Barr saying that Trump was cleared is just spin.. Pathetic group.

Given the comments above, maybe I should place a link from this thread to the thread about William Barr's reputation and how it will be affected by his foray into Trumpland...but I won't bother.

Deb

 

[AGBF]

Believe me, Kate, you are preaching to the choir. William Barr is a lawyer, so he knows exactly what he is doing. He cannot claim ignorance as Trump-the-Stupid might be able to. He doesn't care about the Constitution or the law. He is beneath contempt.

Deb

 

[Dancing Fire]

Mueller: If we had confidence the President clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so.

Then impeach him!. What are the Dems waiting for?? . All

and no action.

 

[Calliecake]

@AGBF and @Tekate, They had a news clip today of a reporter asking Barr “Why did you say Trump was exonerated in the Mueller report? The reporter followed up with “he was not exonerated”. Barr didn’t say a word. He turned around and walked away. The man doesn’t have an ounce of integrity.

@Dancing Fire, My husband bought a copy of the full Mueller Report. Would you like me to send it to you when we are finished reading it?

So much winning for America

 

[Dancing Fire]

@Dancing Fire, My husband bought a copy of the full Mueller Report. Would you like me to send it to you when we are finished reading it?

Did you find any collusion with the Russians?

 

[Dancing Fire]

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/willia...d-whether-trump-obstructed-justice-exclusive/

 

[arkieb1]

Any other country would not have tolerated the things in Trumps past and the things he did to win that election..... as previously stated he was refused entry into Australia because he is a criminal before he became President.

You should all be embarrassed as a country that your system allows such a poor choice of human being to become your leader, I'm not an American and I'm embarrassed for you.

 

[monarch64]

Any other country would not have tolerated the things in Trumps past and the things he did to win that election..... as previously stated he was refused entry into Australia because he is a criminal before he became President.

You should all be embarrassed as a country that your system allows such a poor choice of human being to become your leader, I'm not an American and I'm embarrassed for you.

Believe me, we are embarrassed. We don't ALL need to be shamed constantly and told how much better other countries (Canada and Australia, esp) are NONSTOP. We have to deal with this bullshit every day. As evidenced by the lack of conservatives who participate in Hangout/on political threads, you are preaching to the choir. As an American, I am acutely aware of the problems my country has. I have never, not once, looked down my nose at any other country and thought (let alone said aloud) that we have it so much better than anyone else in the world, nor do I know many fellow citizens with that attitude. Not all of us are the bumbling idiots many outside the U.S. seem to think we are. I did not choose to live here; I was born here and have no actual reason to leave. I'm also not selling some American Dream to anyone outside the U.S. since I know firsthand what its shortcomings are. I'm really sick and tired of non-Americans telling me how embarrassed and ashamed I should be, especially when I did not vote for this person and was particularly active and vocal about my views during the last election process. Nothing good came of Hillary calling certain conservatives "deplorables." When you insult people intending to get them to see your point of view, it doesn't work. Ever. It pushes people away and your message is lost. If we have learned anything from the last election results, I hope it is that we need to treat each other better and more kindly, on a local and global scale, period.

 

[AGBF]

Believe me, we are embarrassed. We don't ALL need to be shamed constantly and told how much better other countries (Canada and Australia, esp) are NONSTOP. We have to deal with this bullshit every day. As evidenced by the lack of conservatives who participate in Hangout/on political threads, you are preaching to the choir. As an American, I am acutely aware of the problems my country has. I have never, not once, looked down my nose at any other country and thought (let alone said aloud) that we have it so much better than anyone else in the world, nor do I know many fellow citizens with that attitude. Not all of us are the bumbling idiots many outside the U.S. seem to think we are. I did not choose to live here; I was born here and have no actual reason to leave. I'm also not selling some American Dream to anyone outside the U.S. since I know firsthand what its shortcomings are. I'm really sick and tired of non-Americans telling me how embarrassed and ashamed I should be, especially when I did not vote for this person and was particularly active and vocal about my views during the last election process. Nothing good came of Hillary calling certain conservatives "deplorables." When you insult people intending to get them to see your point of view, it doesn't work. Ever. It pushes people away and your message is lost. If we have learned anything from the last election results, I hope it is that we need to treat each other better and more kindly, on a local and global scale, period.

I don't feel the same way you do, Monnie. I find it reassuring when someone from another country says that what I experience here in the United States is not ubiquitous. I have come to be so depressed and disillusioned that I tend to be despondent rather than hopeful about our country.

When I saw the Town Hall Rrepublican Congressman Justin Amash held (God bless him) and saw one woman be astonished at that all he explained had been going on under her nose, I despaired more. She had heard Donald Trump and Bill Barr say that there was no collusion and she told Congressman Amash (I am going from memory here) that she thought Trump had been exonerated.

I feel that Trump has hold of the media here in the United States and that far too many people, us, are under his sway. Why else would Nancy Pelosi be afraid to impeach him?

AGBF

 

[elizat]

@AGBF I think part of the issue is that so many people do not read anymore to draw a conclusion. So many people take what is put in magazines/newspapers that are actually opinion pieces (and labeled as such) and opinion shows- on both sides of the aisle- as fact. So many people cannot be bothered to spend the time to read it for themselves and think. I see the issue with opinion shows/writings on both sides- conservatives with Sean Hannity, Jeanine Pirro, Tucker Carlson and those on the other side with Rachel Maddow and Don Lemon for example (and I'm a Democrat). Maybe people will get mad that I say this, but there's a huge problem with confirmation bias with all these opinion shows and writings due to the 24 hour news cycle. It doesn't help that some of these programs present themselves as news and have "reporters" that their own networks have even told the hosts to stop referring to as reporters.

Everything today is fast. You get instant gratification on Twitter and can say what you want. You want take out from a drive through, but don't want to leave home? Fine, Ubereats or whatever. We have a fast culture of instant gratification and I think it spills into everything. I clearly sound cranky today as well.

 

[AGBF]

I clearly sound cranky today as well.

Actually, to me you sounded thoughtful. Are you being drawn into more political threads, [B]elizat[/B]?

Deb

 

[JPie]

@monarch64 I felt defensive after reading arkie b’s post too. Then I clicked “Show Ignored Content” and assumed she was responding to DF’s trolling.

 

[arkieb1]

Believe me, we are embarrassed. We don't ALL need to be shamed constantly and told how much better other countries (Canada and Australia, esp) are NONSTOP. We have to deal with this bullshit every day. As evidenced by the lack of conservatives who participate in Hangout/on political threads, you are preaching to the choir. As an American, I am acutely aware of the problems my country has. I have never, not once, looked down my nose at any other country and thought (let alone said aloud) that we have it so much better than anyone else in the world, nor do I know many fellow citizens with that attitude. Not all of us are the bumbling idiots many outside the U.S. seem to think we are. I did not choose to live here; I was born here and have no actual reason to leave. I'm also not selling some American Dream to anyone outside the U.S. since I know firsthand what its shortcomings are. I'm really sick and tired of non-Americans telling me how embarrassed and ashamed I should be, especially when I did not vote for this person and was particularly active and vocal about my views during the last election process. Nothing good came of Hillary calling certain conservatives "deplorables." When you insult people intending to get them to see your point of view, it doesn't work. Ever. It pushes people away and your message is lost. If we have learned anything from the last election results, I hope it is that we need to treat each other better and more kindly, on a local and global scale, period.

I'm not attacking America - it's a great country. I'm attaching a political system that allows any president to not have a suitably high level of accountability. I can only think of third world countries that allow that to happen ie they turn a blind eye to corruption and the misdeeds of their leaders. I'm sorry if it stings, but our media and other politicians would create such an uproar if we had anyone similar, that the person in question would be forced to resign, does that make us better than you? Probably not, but I personally think someone that runs a country as powerful as American should be a decent human being able to quote your own words, "to treat each other better and more kindly both on a local and global scale" Trump simply isn't that person.

Like it or not a system that allows someone like that to become their President is inherently broken and the more people that keep calling it out (particularly to the masses that voted for the man, not you specifically) the more likely hopefully something will change.

If me stating on here or anywhere else that Trump is a national embarrassment and spelling out why repeatedly means one less person votes for him next time (even if that person is just DF & his wife) then as far as I can see, mission achieved.

 

[JPie]

Like it or not a system that allows someone like that to become their President is inherently broken and the more people that keep calling it out (particularly to the masses that voted for the man) the more likely hopefully something will change.

PREACH. We’re under the tyranny of the minority and they’re idiots, charlatans, and snake oil salesmen all mixed up.

 

[arkieb1]

PREACH. We’re under the tyranny of the minority and they’re idiots, charlatans, and snake oil salesmen all mixed up.

When he got elected I was as sad as many of you were, it's not just embarrassment for the US, I feel a deep sadness, that a return to conservative values (which is happening across Europe and many parts of the world) means that he was the best option - to me (and I'm married to a staunch conservative) he doesn't represent decent conservatives any better than he does the average American.

The fact he has remained untouchable, & completely unaccountable, that's what I find astonishing.....

 

[AGBF]

If me stating on here or anywhere else that Trump is a national embarrassment and spelling out why repeatedly means one less person votes for him next time (even if that person is just DF & his wife) then as far as I can see, mission achieved.

I am not sure that you will be able to change even one person's vote away from Trump, although I certainly hope that you do, but your perspective built the morale of this supporter of the rule of law who has felt oppressed by Trump. That is meaningful in my eyes.

 

[AGBF]

When he got elected I was as sad as many of you were, it's not just embarrassment for the US, I feel a deep sadness, that a return to conservative values (which is happening across Europe and many parts of the world) means that he was the best option - to me (and I'm married to a staunch conservative) he doesn't represent decent conservatives any better than he does the average American.

The fact he has remained untouchable, & completely unaccountable, that's what I find astonishing.....

It isn't that astonishing. He has control of Fox news and reaches his constituents via State TV. With Bill Barr intercepting the Mueller report he has an insider managing The Ministry of Propaganda, too. He achieved what every fascist dictator needs to achieve.

 

[arkieb1]

It isn't that astonishing. He has control of Fox news and reaches his constituents via State TV. With Bill Barr intercepting the Mueller report he has an insider managing The Ministry of Propaganda, too. He achieved what every fascist dictator needs to achieve.

Basically, my comparison to having a leader more like a 3rd world country isn't that far off the mark. No accountability, great media control and lots of propaganda. And I'm a bad person for saying that I'm embarrassed for you because you thusfar can't get rid of him, I'm still sad and embarrassed for the US - (no doubt this will enrage a few of you), - when you have a system that cannot at any point in time hold it's highest office bearer accountable then it's broken..... RIP democracy.

 

[elizat]

Actually, to me you sounded thoughtful. Are you being drawn into more political threads, [B]elizat[/B]?

Deb

I try to stay out of the politics threads, because it just makes me mad and honestly, sad. I used to listen to the news on my way to work and home, but stopped because it makes me angry. Instead I try to listen to it minimally now. However, I read the news everyday. The talk radio makes me feel like I'm going to start yelling.

Where we are today with a president that acts as he does, with cabinet officials that act as they do and the divisiveness is alarming. The pettiness is astounding. I know many people disagree with the idea that leaders should be role models, but I think they should. I think that people look at the leaders of any type of entity- whether it is a country, a private company or even a chamber of commerce president in a small town and that sends a message and a tone. And the message and behavior standards that are being broadcasted is appalling.

An example that is off track off this thread is Mitch McConnell's position that you can now conduct hearings for SCOTUS in an election year and then fundraising off it, when they wouldn't even give Merrick Garland the courtesy of a hearing. I know that power drives people that are many times in politics, but the lack of any baseline courtesy and lack of conscience doesn't have any excuse whatsoever.

 

[Tekate]

@arkieb1 I'm embarrassed by Trump, I'm embarrassed that America people no longer believe in right and wrong, but in Trump, 2.5million more people voted against Trump and for Clinton, yet we have him as a president, yet the people who voted for him are aghast that we, the majority can't stand him, but for a technicality in our form of government Clinton would be president. It's disconcerting to say the least. Painful at my core.

Redwood said once a few years ago that she felt that her beliefs and convictions were not supported by Obama, that Obama was weak on the international front and weak on the homefront with illegal immigration. She said she supported the electoral college because it was set up to ensure that the smaller population states were not overwhelmed by larger ones. I thought very long and hard about this and it made me think long and hard about my country and what it means to be an American. I came to the conclusion that it's unfair to be ruled by one or the other WITHOUT compromise, when our constitution was written America was a small country full of in my opinion radicals who came here for freedom from a monarchy, freedom for religion worship, etc, they were total radicals. But today we have all this. So I find that, to me, the electoral college does not work in the modern America. Change is very difficult for people and white America is fearful to say the least of assisting Hispanics running from terror, they are unwilling to compromise and educate themselves. I do not know how Americans can support Trump when he is an unkind man to say the least, BUT he does support many of the conservative agenda, so to my mind I don't see compromise, take McConnell and his merry little statement on the Supreme Court justice nomination, I cannot think of a democrat who would do this, actually to have stopped Garland's nomination either. This is what people who vote for Trump support, no matter what they say, they support an America we have not had in my lifetime or what I learned in schoool..

So many of us are embarrassed and ashamed and sad, and very very angry, just like the people on the other side who had to live under the Obama presidency, they were very angry for sure.

 

[soxfan]

Any other country would not have tolerated the things in Trumps past and the things he did to win that election..... as previously stated he was refused entry into Australia because he is a criminal before he became President.

You should all be embarrassed as a country that your system allows such a poor choice of human being to become your leader, I'm not an American and I'm embarrassed for you.

Spot on! Yes, I am embarrassed, and I don't blame any one in other countries for being embarrassed for us!

I'm glad you get it!!!!

 

[smitcompton]

Hi,

Unfortunately, I think Arkieb1 has gotten to the crux of the matter. The political system is broken. Republicans and Democrats no longer know how to govern. The electorate is showing that Americans are not what they used to be. When 40% favor DT and will vote for him again it is cause for alarm. Our values have changed. This did not happen over-nite I, too am depressed and despondent over what has happened and what will happen in the future.

It s rather farcical to me to have a country wait for a report to tell them whether or not this President has committed crimes uncovered during this Russia probe only to find the investigator has refused to assert his opinion on the merits of crime or not. Mueller is just a fact finder and is preserving the evidence and never since the inception of this probe was considering whether or not to charge the President. He followed Justice Dept guidelines, being the bureaucrat that he is. He wishes not to speak and thus gives AG Barr the opportunity to present the case any way he wants. Did not we all see "Obstruction in plain sight"

Ken Starr, Leon Jarvorsky ,sp all spoke publicly after their report was done. Jerry Nadler fought tooth and nail to prevent Starr Report(on Clinton) to become public. He was the fox News personality for Clinton during that time. Jerry Nadler does not impress me.

Democrats are weak. I hope the new lot is better. I do despair

Elizabeth Warren looks better and better to me. I may have to become a socialist.
Annette

 

[Karl_K]

Some times the idea of liberal compromise goes something like this:
Lets punch you in the face
No thanks
How about we just compromise and just slap you in the face.
No thanks!
Conservatives wont compromise!
Well many conservatives have reached the point of just saying shove off.

As far as not responding to the threads really whats the point?
You want to rant about Trump.
Go for it I will just sit back and shake my head about all the energy being wasted.
Myself I would rather put my energies to helping people so see yas all in RT.

 

[partgypsy]

Karl, I think your example would be quite appropriate if you switch liberal and conservative. McConnell would not even let Garland be nominated let alone get seated, though he was a qualified and nonpartisan pick. Not so the picks of Trump. not only is Kavanaugh far less qualified, he has already shown to be a lier if you compare how he answered questions in front of the house, and how he is adjudicating. He is an activist judge in the worse sense, ignoring case law and precedent to push an agenda.

Liberals want transparency and election free from interference. Conservatives are apparently OK with the fact that Russia and possibly China interefered in our election. And, despite all we learned no interest from this administration to prevent it from happening again. That is the damming thing. Ditto for voter id and other laws to restrict voting. ditto for gerrymandering. Ditto for the latest crop of anti abortion laws, which not only being illegal based on Roe vs. Wade, is NOT the majority view in the US, it is cramming radical minority views on the rest of constituents, as well as eroding a fundamental aspect of our constitution, the separation of church and state. I agree things are really messed up. And like what others have said, the many many things that Trump has done, more than qualify as impeachable offenses. We now have a government that is so flawed, that we cannot get rid of a leader who has been shown to put his own self-interests over that of the country. And that is wrong and dangerous.

Ps THIS is our commander in chief. This is the man in charge of sending troops into potentially another armed conflict. Do you trust him to make the right decisions, to have appropriate judgement, and restraint? I as sure hell don't. He doesn't even know what country he is talking about half the time.
http://on.theatln.tc/1B7wb7O?fbclid=IwAR2_4kybch7pczCcXKo5VnrnpH_Rt4bHgkH3vtwBbe-qCRnGNbT2ucIPW_0

 

[JPie]

Some times the idea of liberal compromise goes something like this:
Lets punch you in the face
No thanks
How about we just compromise and just slap you in the face.
No thanks!
Conservatives wont compromise!
Well many conservatives have reached the point of just saying shove off.

Buddy, your party dominates all three branches of the government. You don’t need Democrats to support your agenda to make things happen. You don’t get to whine about liberals not compromising while Republicans are bending them over backwards and giving it to them repeatedly with Kavanaugh, the tax “reform,” and now the assault on reproductive rights.

I know snowflakes gonna whine and play victim but this is ridiculous.

 

[OreoRosies86]

Buddy, your party dominates all three branches of the government. You don’t need Democrats to support your agenda to make things happen. You don’t get to whine about liberals not compromising while Republicans are bending them over backwards and giving it to them repeatedly with Kavanaugh, the tax “reform,” and now the assault on reproductive rights.

I know snowflakes gonna whine and play victim but this is ridiculous.

Ditto.

 

[redwood66]

Why on earth would conservatives respond to some of what is posted here? I do because sometimes I just DGAF, but mostly it's like Karl said, a waste of energy. Besides, what difference does it make?