Moving back to East Coast. MD or NC top options.

[Gypsy]

So I've FINALLY got my DH on board to move us out of Northern California. YAY!

We don't have kids, and don't plan to have them so school systems aren't that much of a concern.

Our options are Baltimore, MD area or Wake Forest, NC area as my company has offices in these areas and I could keep my current job.

Even though we have lived in the DC area and loved it Baltimore is not first on our list for a couple reasons. The area is not expensive but not inexpensive either. We'd be at or over $250,000 for a townhouse in an area we would want to live in and that's not going to let us pay down debt significantly, and add to our retirement/savings. And we couldn't buy right when we moved, so we'd have to rent for a few years, and the rents are not that much lower than what we pay now. Finances are REALLY important to us,and the SOLE reason we are moving. DH doesn't particularly like the Baltimore area and isn't excited about moving there. The biggest advantages for us about Baltimore is that Maryland is that it's a Blue state whereas North Carolina is a Red state. My DH is very concerned as I am very liberal and he doesn't know if I could live in a Red State. The other advantage is that the summer is milder than North Carolina's and it near the ocean (I've always lived on coasts, never inland).

Wake Forest, North Carolina has 3 seasons of lovely weather including mild winters. Hot summer, but great for growing a vegetable garden (something that DH loves). It is inland, which will be strange but it is very close to Falls Lake and it's a really nice natural area with lovely beaches (some man made) that are not like other muddy North Carolina lakes. The best thing is the home prices. We can get a REALLY nice townhome for under 150,000 in a very nice area of town. We would be able to buy a house immediately. It would let us save a lot of money both in home owners tax breaks and the mortgage would be less than 1/2 our rent is now. We could pay down our debt and save up. There is one big disadvantages though: Red State. The Wake Forest area/Triangle is liberal however, and if you look at last two presidential elections you can see that the state is more "purple" than red. But there are still laws on the books that make me see "red" in the state.

The disadvantage of BOTH over Nor Cal is that while in Nor Cal I pretty much have my pick of jobs, in either area I will be at a disadvantage if I lose my job. I do need to be near a tech area, and the Triangle does have positions though, and if we were in MD, if we had to we could move to VA where there is a strong tech corridor if we have to. Neither are as good for me as Nor Cal is. BUT... I do love the company I am at and I do see myself working here long term. And my company has offices in both areas (which is why we are limiting our move to these areas).

Your thoughts and advice and impressions would mean a lot to me. I'm struggling with this decision and we need to make some plans soon as if we CAN I'd love to TRY to move this year.

Both have significantly lower cost of living than Nor Cal though. So either move will help us financially.

 

[Sky56]

I'd recommend North Carolina. I know several people who moved there and they absolutely love it! If I were you, I'd move there without hesitation, with a big no to Baltimore. Also, the red state/blue state factor is one I wouldn't worry too much about. There is always a good mix of Liberals, Conservatives and Moderates wherever you go...

 

[asscher_girl]

Awww, Gypsy! You're thinking of moving?? We'll miss you out here. I can't give much advice on those locations, although having lived in GA (Atlanta) for many years, I couldn't see myself moving back to that area of the country. However warmth is very important to me so I'd pick NC. But having job options is extremely important, what if your company's offices out East aren't as enjoyable as the one here? Have you visited those offices yet? As far as tech goes, if you want to stay in that industry (I'm assuming with your background you could work for a non-tech firm, correct?) it sounds like being closer to the Triangle makes sense. Will your husband be able to find work in both cities?

As for cost of living, have you guys thought of moving to a more reasonable area around here? Like Livermore or down south to Morgan Hill/Gilroy? Of course if you have to commute long distances, it might not be worth it. Just a thought.

Good luck with your decision, let's make sure to have a farewell GTG before you leave though, would love to see you before you head east.

 

[missy]

Congratulations Gypsy! I would choose NC because of the mild 3 seasons and lower cost of living though I too would miss being close to the ocean. However you aren't too far for a car trip to the water and as you wrote there is water near you albeit not ocean.
The red/blue state thing would be a concern to me too but as long as you are near an urban center you should be OK though I am not familiar with either area in terms of people who live there. I know my dh has ruled out a number of areas for us to move to because he doesn't think we would fit in based on our liberal views on social issues (though fiscally conservative).

Good luck with your decision and congrats again!!!

 

[Mayk]

NC!!

Milder weather... Less expensive, closer to DS!! And of course that southern hospitality!!

 

[marymm]

I've spent time in DC/VA but not Wake Forest or anywhere near that area, but based on your posts I'd be inclined to say WF seems more up your alley. Have you and your DH ever been to WF? If not, maybe take a long weekend trip just to get a sense of the vibe?

2 things about WF that I personally would want more info on:
#1. "The population was 30,117 at the 2010 census,[4] up from 12,588 at the 2000 census. In 2007, the town was listed by Forbes magazine as the 20th fastest growing suburb in America, with a 73.2 percent increase in population between 2000 and 2006.[5]"

The above is from Wikipedia -- I looked it up because I had vaguely remembered the Forbes 73% pop. increase stat. That's a lot of new people, and my assumption would be it is continuing its rapid growth - I'd want to be assured that WF has addressed/is addressing the increased demands on the city/infrastructure related to this pop. expansion.

#2. Per Wikipedia, the demographics say the area is 80% white -- absolutely nothing wrong with that -- it is what it is -- but I've lived in California (North up until I was 22, and then South since then) with a couple of years in NYC thrown in -- and I've spent some time in Madison, WI which is a beautiful place also with 80% white demographics -- after a couple of days in Madison the relative absence of other races/cultures is really apparent to me and I personally view it as a con (against many, many positives of the area). Not sure what your POV may be but thought I'd bring it up.

 

[smitcompton]

Hi Gypsy,


I moved to a county that would today be called red, red , red. However, as more people moved out to the suburbs, looking for cheaper housing, the area became more blue. It is still a republican area, but we elect people like democrat Tammy Duckworth, and enough democrats to keep us happy.

I would choose North Carolina. When you are settled in your job and new home, you can have some fun in picking some issues you could work on changing.

I became involved in politics, even was appointed to an office to take the place of an elected official in my party. It was fun. I was a committeemen for a time.


Don't be afraid. There are normal Republican, and tea party members as well. Go For It.


Annette

 

[movie zombie]

Gypsy, I really can't help you with any advice but you and I are very much alike so I will say this: there is no way I could live in a red state. even a pocket of blue within the red wouldn't work for me. given your personality, well, I think certain things will wear thin with you very quickly and I think your hubby is right to be concerned.....he does know you very well, right?! good luck!

 

[isaku5]

Our Gypsy has itchy feet again. I'm not surprised, although I did read in a recent post that both you and John were doing well in California. Did I mis-interpret that?

If memory serves, you moved to California to be close to your relatives. I haven't read anything at all about them lately. Are they still a priority? Do they need your help?

I know that CA is an expensive place to live, and due to that, retirement saving is virtually impossible.

There's a big chunk of your lives that I've missed. John had a difficult time securing a job in CA. Now, he has one and is somewhat more secure. I haven't heard how your relatives are doing other than Grandpa's passing. Your mom, is she being well taken care of? Grandma too?

I'm not surprised that John has dug in his heels until now. I can still picture him travelling cross country with the menagerie of pets. That would be filed under 'nightmares' in my life.

I can empathize about saving for retirement, but isn't it John's turn to choose where he wants to live? He left his relatives to follow you, and now you're on the move again. Be very careful, or you may be moving alone. Just saying.

 

[AprilBaby]

I would choose NC. As more northerners move there near the triangle politics change. Good housing prices, low crime, beaches not too far. Given my druthers, I want to move to virginia.

 

[february2003bride]

Gypsy- I live in Northern VA and love it here. But, if you are moving for financial reasons, then I would chose NC. Is this a forever, permanent move? Or rather a, pick one and possibly in 5 years move again? If it's the latter, I would definitely choose NC for now, buy an inexpensive townhome or condo, get debt free and then save. Then reassess when those financial goals are met. NC is 6 hours from DC, so you can always easily move up here if you change your mind. A much easier move than the one you are about to do. Good luck!

 

[Gypsy]

So many thoughtful responses!

Sky, you've summed up my own thoughts very well. Plus it will be nice to be in a state where our vote might mean something.


Asscher_girl. I know, I'm REALLY going to miss you all. I have SO MANY wonderful friends here and leaving them to go so far away is going to be tough. The thing about my DH is he'd rather move to NC than Livermore or Gilroy. When I say that he likes Nor Cal what I really mean is he likes the mid peninsula area ONLY. Which of course, is the most expensive part of the entire area. He won't move to Livermore or Gilroy, he hates commuting and heat. So he has to have heat he'd rather go to NC where at least we can buy a house for 150k and get our finances in order. We should definitely have a GTG before we leave. I am still trying to figure out if we can manage the move this year. I haven't visited NC yet though and yes, that is on the list.

Thank you very much missy for your thoughts, I really appreciate them!

Thanks Mayk!
Marymm-- I will DEFINITELY look into the infrastructure issue. GREAT point. I've been researching everything else but missed that. Thanks so much!

Smit/Annette. Thanks so much for posting your experiences, I have to say that I would be happy to be a part of turning a red state purple.

MZ-- YES. I know. You and I are very similar, and that is my concern. I don't have good filters, if I think someone is a bigoted red neck, that's what comes across. Fortunately (or unfortunately) I'm not very social. And I'm not thinking this is permanent. Maybe 5 or so years, then if I am out of patience we can move again.

Isaku, my friend, yes up to 18 months ago John and I were happy here. But the last 18 months have increased our debt even though we are making more than we have before, we are bringing home less and less. He is constantly worried about finances and so am I. Our quality of life is compromised and the stress is affecting our health. My grandfather is dead, and my grandmother is as well, in all but body (catatonic most days). There is nothing we can do for them. Mom is okay and my parents are supportive of the move now that we've explained our reasoning. And if things go well, my parents can move near us if they want to. John's main objection is that in this 30 mile radius expanse of the move expensive area of North America is his weather nirvana, not to hot or too cold. But his goldilocks weather quirks aside, and apart from the pain of leaving dear friends that we will miss greatly, there is nothing holding us here. And he knows that. I am not the one driving this, I don't have itchy feet at all, if it was feasible to stay here we would. But it is not, and it is our finances that are driving this, and he knows and understands that. I won't lose my husband, and I expect that with the stress of making ends meet is relieved and the move is done, I'll have a much happier and healthier husband.

Hi April, thank you so much for your thoughts.

Feb03Bride- It might be permanent or just for 5 years. If we don't like it there, we can move again. If we do...we'd be happy to stay. I think that's key. Living somewhere that allows us to save up money, and pay down debt will allow us to have flexibility down the line, and that's important.

 

[arkieb1]

I think you answered your own question in that post. NC seems like the best scenario for getting in front financially. I am a liberal thinker - "lefties" we call them here in Australia and most of my husband's friends are boringly conservative, but I think you can find like minded people where ever you go if you look hard enough

 

[decodelighted]

Hey Gypsy,
I *think* I'm going down to the Triangle area next week ... to check it out and see how it feels for us down the road. If it happens, I'll try to remember this thread and come back to report general feelings etc. From your choices, I'd think NC would accomplish more goals for a 5 yr. period. EVERYWHERE you go you're going to run into some kind of bigots. Just part of life to deal with. But part of the reason I have a def. preference for the Carrboro/Chapel Hill area - which I'm told is the most liberal pocket of NC. (I grew up in Virginia - which flips red/blue - and has pockets of each. But I'm used to the North East after 20+ years here.) We're kind of deciding whether to move *back* into NYC, stay put, or go to NC .... eventually if not now.

 

[Art Nouveau]

Gypsy, I am really sorry to hear that you and your husband are considering moving back east. You are a key member of our Pricescope group in Northern California and it won't be the same without you. You are the one that I can always count on to have the latest contact inform for everyone. We will miss you. Definitely need a 'farewell' GTG before you leave.

I understand your reasons for moving. The cost of living here is getting out of hand. I have never lived in the east coast, so I cannot offer any advice, but NC seems better to me than MD. Good luck to your search for a new place to call 'home'.

AN

 

[zoebartlett]

I'd recommend NC, although I can't speak to the WF area specifically. The weather's awesome, the people are very, very friendly, and it's just such a different vibe from what you might be used to. That's what surprised us, anyway. Southern hospitality is alive and well and I loved it when we lived in NC. The red state/blue state issue, well, I know what you mean, but I wouldn't let it deter you. We definitely noticed a difference sometimes but we liked the new experience.

I'd recommend spending a few days at least in both places. It may help to meet with a Realtor who specializes in relocation. That's what we did, and the woman we met with was really helpful. We flew down to Charlotte, stayed in a hotel, and spent a few days touring the area with her. She helped steer us towards a specific section of Charlotte, and eventually found us a rental. It was great to rely on someone who lives there to point out certain things, and one who knows the real estate market so well.

 

[SB621]

Edit:

I removed my long post because I don't want to offend.

Run away from NC if you don't want to be mobbed my political and religious crazies. Stay in MD. I have lived in both places and would choose MD every.single.time. Though I do have children and would not want them raised in NC and my skin isn't as thick as yours, so you might have better luck then I did. I'll leave it at that.

 

[MarionC]

Edit:

I removed my long post because I don't want to offend.

Run away from NC if you don't want to be mobbed my political and religious crazies. Stay in MD. I have lived in both places and would choose MD every.single.time. Though I do have children and would not want them raised in NC and my skin isn't as thick as yours, so you might have better luck then I did. I'll leave it at that.

This surprises me. We moved from NY to NC and it's been very good to us. I think what you bring to a place is what you experience there. No offense meant, but I have found it to be true. I don't know what part of NC you have experienced, but Chapel HIll and Carrboro are wonderful.

 

[MarionC]

So I've FINALLY got my DH on board to move us out of Northern California. YAY!

We don't have kids, and don't plan to have them so school systems aren't that much of a concern.

Our options are Baltimore, MD area or Wake Forest, NC area as my company has offices in these areas and I could keep my current job.

Even though we have lived in the DC area and loved it Baltimore is not first on our list for a couple reasons. The area is not expensive but not inexpensive either. We'd be at or over $250,000 for a townhouse in an area we would want to live in and that's not going to let us pay down debt significantly, and add to our retirement/savings. And we couldn't buy right when we moved, so we'd have to rent for a few years, and the rents are not that much lower than what we pay now. Finances are REALLY important to us,and the SOLE reason we are moving. DH doesn't particularly like the Baltimore area and isn't excited about moving there. The biggest advantages for us about Baltimore is that Maryland is that it's a Blue state whereas North Carolina is a Red state. My DH is very concerned as I am very liberal and he doesn't know if I could live in a Red State. The other advantage is that the summer is milder than North Carolina's and it near the ocean (I've always lived on coasts, never inland).

It would be fun to have you in NC, Gypsy. One nice thing about the area you are considering is that it's between the mountains and the beach. I'm near Chapel Hill and it's a couple of hours to either one...so you can even make a day trip to either...best of both worlds : )

 

[yennyfire]

I live in a suburb outside of Atlanta and I do think that when you are in more rural parts of Southern states, the views of the majority can be less than liberal (I'm trying to be "Southern sweet and nice" here). However, in a larger city and/or an area with a well educated population/college town, I think you can find like minded people.

I will say that you need to check out the schools in Wake Forest if you think you may have children. That's the one area where you DO have to be careful if you plan to use public schools....

I will say that the summers can be oppressive (here at least, not sure about WF)....I really don't go outside much in August if I can help it...so keep that in mind if climate is really an issue for DH.....

Best of luck as you make this decision. It's hard to think about pulling up roots and starting over somewhere fresh, but there are a handful of us PSers in the area and we'd love to have you down here!

 

[SB621]

Edit:

I removed my long post because I don't want to offend.

Run away from NC if you don't want to be mobbed my political and religious crazies. Stay in MD. I have lived in both places and would choose MD every.single.time. Though I do have children and would not want them raised in NC and my skin isn't as thick as yours, so you might have better luck then I did. I'll leave it at that.

This surprises me. We moved from NY to NC and it's been very good to us. I think what you bring to a place is what you experience there. No offense meant, but I have found it to be true. I don't know what part of NC you have experienced, but Chapel HIll and Carrboro are wonderful.

Jimmianne, no offense taken but I personally don't care for someone telling my 2 year old they are going to hell (this was a daycare provided at a TOP daycare, 5 star blah blah blah), I don't care for the casual use of calling someone the N word or F word, and the oppressive theme of being told that women are good for nothing except making "pudding." We lived about an hour outside the triangle area. It wasn't even those being offensive but really it was others who so readily just accepted that weare in the south and it is ok, to let it roll off of them vs. saying something. That was my biggest issue. So yes I would run, not walk, away from NC. I give this advise to Gypsy because on PS she is well known for being outspokent and doesn't back down on her political views. She isn't your typical Southern bell to smile and nod. That is why I answered the way I did.

 

[movie zombie]

that is my fear [for Gypsy], too, SB, and for the same reasons..........
a southern belle our Gypsy ain't......and I'm dang glad of that!
nothing wrong with being a southern belle....I just like knowing that there is someone on here that is pretty much cut out of the same cloth as I am....

 

[SB621]

that is my fear [for Gypsy], too, SB, and for the same reasons..........
a southern belle our Gypsy ain't......and I'm dang glad of that!
nothing wrong with being a southern belle....I just like knowing that there is someone on here that is pretty much cut out of the same cloth as I am....

Seriously!!! It was someone else I wouldn't have commented but I know when you are passionate about red vs blue then a move into the opposite can be band for your mental health.

 

[isaku5]

So many thoughtful responses!

Sky, you've summed up my own thoughts very well. Plus it will be nice to be in a state where our vote might mean something.


Asscher_girl. I know, I'm REALLY going to miss you all. I have SO MANY wonderful friends here and leaving them to go so far away is going to be tough. The thing about my DH is he'd rather move to NC than Livermore or Gilroy. When I say that he likes Nor Cal what I really mean is he likes the mid peninsula area ONLY. Which of course, is the most expensive part of the entire area. He won't move to Livermore or Gilroy, he hates commuting and heat. So he has to have heat he'd rather go to NC where at least we can buy a house for 150k and get our finances in order. We should definitely have a GTG before we leave. I am still trying to figure out if we can manage the move this year. I haven't visited NC yet though and yes, that is on the list.

Thank you very much missy for your thoughts, I really appreciate them!

Thanks Mayk!
Marymm-- I will DEFINITELY look into the infrastructure issue. GREAT point. I've been researching everything else but missed that. Thanks so much!

Smit/Annette. Thanks so much for posting your experiences, I have to say that I would be happy to be a part of turning a red state purple.



Hi Gypsy

Now that I can read about the last 18 months, I understand your reasoning. If you're losing money every year, something has to be done so that you don't jeopardize your funds for retirement. In many posts you have emphasized following a budget and that's what's not being made possible by living in California - even though you both have good careers.

It is indeed time to pull the trigger and move to a less expensive area as peace of mind is priceless (in my books anyway).
MZ-- YES. I know. You and I are very similar, and that is my concern. I don't have good filters, if I think someone is a bigoted red neck, that's what comes across. Fortunately (or unfortunately) I'm not very social. And I'm not thinking this is permanent. Maybe 5 or so years, then if I am out of patience we can move again.

Isaku, my friend, yes up to 18 months ago John and I were happy here. But the last 18 months have increased our debt even though we are making more than we have before, we are bringing home less and less. He is constantly worried about finances and so am I. Our quality of life is compromised and the stress is affecting our health. My grandfather is dead, and my grandmother is as well, in all but body (catatonic most days). There is nothing we can do for them. Mom is okay and my parents are supportive of the move now that we've explained our reasoning. And if things go well, my parents can move near us if they want to. John's main objection is that in this 30 mile radius expanse of the move expensive area of North America is his weather nirvana, not to hot or too cold. But his goldilocks weather quirks aside, and apart from the pain of leaving dear friends that we will miss greatly, there is nothing holding us here. And he knows that. I am not the one driving this, I don't have itchy feet at all, if it was feasible to stay here we would. But it is not, and it is our finances that are driving this, and he knows and understands that. I won't lose my husband, and I expect that with the stress of making ends meet is relieved and the move is done, I'll have a much happier and healthier husband.

Hi April, thank you so much for your thoughts.

Feb03Bride- It might be permanent or just for 5 years. If we don't like it there, we can move again. If we do...we'd be happy to stay. I think that's key. Living somewhere that allows us to save up money, and pay down debt will allow us to have flexibility down the line, and that's important.

 

[movie zombie]

that is my fear [for Gypsy], too, SB, and for the same reasons..........
a southern belle our Gypsy ain't......and I'm dang glad of that!
nothing wrong with being a southern belle....I just like knowing that there is someone on here that is pretty much cut out of the same cloth as I am....

Seriously!!! It was someone else I wouldn't have commented but I know when you are passionate about red vs blue then a move into the opposite can be band for your mental health.

glad you spoke up, SB........and very sorry you learned it the hard way.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

NC!!

Milder weather... Less expensive, closer to DS!! And of course that southern hospitality!!

I wouldn't be so concerned about this red state thing. NC went for Obama by a small margin in 2008 and Romney by a small margin in 2012. I think the state is pretty much like the country and that is fairly evenly split politically. We kind of alternate governors, but that works out pretty well actually! That way they can't go to far off one end or the other with term limits! Anyway, if you live anywhere near the Chapel Hill, Duke University area, you'll find a much higher percentage of people who may agree with you politically if that is important to you.

 

[Gypsy]

Everyone has so many great insights and thoughts, this thread has been very helpful!

Arkieb-- Yes, I am pretty sure this would by far be the best move for us financially. It's going to cost close to 10k to be move out there ALONE though so I have to be pretty sure.

Deco, I am so glad you hear you will be visiting the area. I'm going to want to do so myself as soon as I figure out if we can move NOW or if we have to wait till next April.

AN-- I REALLY wouldn't move if we had any other choice. But just to get a condo out on the peninsula $400,000. And anything else leaves us with a bad commute. And my husband is 41 and I'm 38. We need to start building equity and seriously saving money. And it's nearly impossible out here. Especially with the amount of student loan/etc. debt we have. Thank you so much for your kind words, I will miss you all so much if we move.

Hi Zoe, I've spent a lot of time in Baltimore, I used to have a good friend that lived there and I used to take sewing lessons there. So I don't think I need to visit there. But I do think that NC is going to have to go on the list of places to visit before making any drastic choices.

SB, your post highlighted my concerns about the area. I can tell you FLAT OUT that if I had kids we would not move to a red state. I cannot and will not have my kids indoctrinated by the mentality of the area. I am both thick skinned and thin skinned. And above all I am confrontational and outspoken. As MZ and you have noted, I am the antithesis of a Southern Belle. I am very sorry for your miserable experience though, and I do hope that you are happier now!

Jimmianne, It would be nice to be bear you and other NC PSers. The PSers in Nor Cal have very much been a second family to me. Neatfreak's kids are the closest things I have to my own and the list of other PSers that we spend time with with us honestly too long to list here. I'd love to have a nice network of friends already in the area to meet and socialize with.

Yennyfire, Hi my dear. It was so lovely to meet you in Vegas last year and I'd love to be closer to you! We've been researching the weather in Wake Forest quite a bit. I do think the summers are going to be a challenge for DH but, like I said it doesn't have to be a permanent move. If we have issues then we can move away again and DH agrees with that.

MZ-- I agree, and feel the same way about you. It's nice to know someone out there is a quirky as I am. But you are much more fiscally stable that we are, and you just paid off you house!!! I know it's a big risk and if I visit and it just seems untenable we won't do it.I have never learned the lesson that Discretion is the better part of Valor though, so who knows this move may teach me that lesson, finally.

 

[diamondseeker2006]

SB, I am shocked and disappointed to read your post. I am very sorry you apparently had some bad experiences, but I can assure you, I have never encountered such a thing in my life. I am very disappointed that you would paint such a broad brush to put down everyone in NC because of a FEW. There are jerks everywhere, if you haven't noticed. You effectively just did what you accused others of doing, actually.

We live in an area outside of a large city where there is a big lake, and for the most part, this is a small town with a very upscale housing area because of the lake. I have no idea of percentages, but MOST of the people here are not from here. I can't tell you how many people are from the north! They love it and would never move back!!!

But that is okay, we are happy and so are all our friends from other parts of the country, many of whom have beautiful houses ON the lake because they sold houses elsewhere and could easily buy prime property here. We definitely don't care to share the secret of how good it is to live here with too many people, or else it may get too crowded and prices might go up too much.

(Anyway Gypsy, you can see that I am just a little insulted, but I do wish you the very best in your search for a place to live!)

 

[movie zombie]

LOL, Gypsy! but you are right. I am very much older than you and we are not starting out but rather dotting the eye's and crossing the t's on our goals.

I have learned many lessons in that school of hard knocks and one of them is that each one has to learn their own lessons.....and as much as we are alike I'm sure we are also dissimilar........but I'm also betting neither of us learns that discretion/valor thing!

 

[february2003bride]

Edit:

I removed my long post because I don't want to offend.

Run away from NC if you don't want to be mobbed my political and religious crazies. Stay in MD. I have lived in both places and would choose MD every.single.time. Though I do have children and would not want them raised in NC and my skin isn't as thick as yours, so you might have better luck then I did. I'll leave it at that.

This surprises me. We moved from NY to NC and it's been very good to us. I think what you bring to a place is what you experience there. No offense meant, but I have found it to be true. I don't know what part of NC you have experienced, but Chapel HIll and Carrboro are wonderful.

Jimmianne, no offense taken but I personally don't care for someone telling my 2 year old they are going to hell (this was a daycare provided at a TOP daycare, 5 star blah blah blah), I don't care for the casual use of calling someone the N word or F word, and the oppressive theme of being told that women are good for nothing except making "pudding." We lived about an hour outside the triangle area. It wasn't even those being offensive but really it was others who so readily just accepted that weare in the south and it is ok, to let it roll off of them vs. saying something. That was my biggest issue. So yes I would run, not walk, away from NC. I give this advise to Gypsy because on PS she is well known for being outspokent and doesn't back down on her political views. She isn't your typical Southern bell to smile and nod. That is why I answered the way I did.

I will add to SB's bolded- My DH lived in Charlotte, NC briefly and at a baseball game was called the N-word by someone who didn't want him to sit next to them (my DH's Indian). DH lived in Charlottle, NC for about 14 months before he moved back to the DC area because of the racism he saw towards others and that was directed at him. But, this was 14 years ago and when we drove through Charlotte last August, he commented that he hoped it had become more open minded since then. If he didn't have such a bad experience living in NC, he said he would want to move back to NC (not specifically Charlotte) because of the cost of living.