Like an EGL certified diamond, but am nervous

[rocksforjocks]

I am looking at a 1.20 ct, VS-2, F diamond. It has 81 facets (called a "forever after" cut--anyone ever hear of this?). It is EGL certified, and the certification says it is an "ideal cut" diamond. Other vitals:
6.89 x 6.85 x 4.21
Total depth: 61.3%
Table: 56%
Crown height: 15%
Pavillion depth: 43%

B&M store is selling it for $7100. I''ve read the comments about EGL and I have a healthy dose of skepticism. So I asked the jeweler if I could have it appraised or certified by someone else before purchsing it, and he said no problem. I guess the second report will speak for itself. But until then, does anyone see anything wrong with any of these numbers? Do you think the price is low because of the 81 facets? Or do you think the more likely explanation is that the second certification will show it''s really an SI-1, G? I am fairly confident that the jeweler didn''t do anything blatantly fraudulent like forge or switch the certification. I looked at the diamond under a loupe and it looked really nice.

Any thoughts or comments would be most appreciated.

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 5/10/2009 9:27:30 PM
Author:rocksforjocks
I am looking at a 1.20 ct, VS-2, F diamond. It has 81 facets (called a ''forever after'' cut--anyone ever hear of this?). It is EGL certified, and the certification says it is an ''ideal cut'' diamond. Other vitals:
6.89 x 6.85 x 4.21
Total depth: 61.3%
Table: 56%
Crown height: 15%
Pavillion depth: 43%

B&M store is selling it for $7100. I''ve read the comments about EGL and I have a healthy dose of skepticism. So I asked the jeweler if I could have it appraised or certified by someone else before purchsing it, and he said no problem. I guess the second report will speak for itself. But until then, does anyone see anything wrong with any of these numbers? Do you think the price is low because of the 81 facets? Or do you think the more likely explanation is that the second certification will show it''s really an SI-1, G? I am fairly confident that the jeweler didn''t do anything blatantly fraudulent like forge or switch the certification. I looked at the diamond under a loupe and it looked really nice.

Any thoughts or comments would be most appreciated.

Well the proportions look good but it is really hard to judge, it sounds like a branded extra faceted cut of some description which I am not familiar with. Definitely get an independant appraisal and make the sale final on it checking out to your satisfaction in all aspects ( get this in writing).

Is the diamond EGL USA or one of the EGL overseas labs such as Israel, Antwerp etc?

 

[rocksforjocks]

The issue of which EGL lab did the certification is an additional concern. The first time I spoke with the jeweler he told me it was USA. But the second time I went back he told me it was EGL-Europe. I specifically asked if it was Israel, and he said no. However, based on my understanding of the certificate numbers, I think the code IS for EGL-Israel (EGL 2903017830). Am I right? (I think the jeweler just didn''t know, rather than trying to defraud me, but maybe I''m being too trusting.)

If it is EGL Israel, I might be looking at a difference of two grades (or more), correct?

The only thing that comforts me is that the jeweler had no problem letting me get a second certification from GIA prior to my purchase. That would be pretty foolish of him if he knew the second report was going to reveal the diamond is crap.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Basically, the seller has two choices
1) let you walk
2) agree to whatever stipulations you''ve suggested.

My advice would not to confuse the motivation here. He has no way of knowing what GIA might say, but the possibility of a sale is clearly more advantageous than simply letting you walk.


A 1.20 graded F/VS2 is exactly the type of stone where a GIA report is absolutely mandatory IMO

What generally happens is that the seller knows this. Usually the lack of the GIA report is because the stone wouldn''t grade that way.
But let''s see how this works for you!
If the GIA does grade the stone F/VS2, and it''s well cut, it''s a great price.

Please let us know what happens!

 

[rocksforjocks]

Thanks for everyone''s responses. The jeweler is sending the diamond to GIA to be certified (at his expense, which I appreciated), and we should get the results in a few weeks. I do like the diamond, so even if it comes back as a G instead of F or SI1 instead of VS2 I plan to go ahead with the purchase (with an appropriate discount).

Assuming GIA''s report is in line with EGL''s, do you think I need to get my own independent appraisal as well? I''m thinking 2 certifications (one being from GIA) is probably good enough, and I''m pretty confident that the price is reasonable.

 

[Dancing Fire]

Date: 5/11/2009 5:43:15 PM
Author: rocksforjocks
Thanks for everyone''s responses. The jeweler is sending the diamond to GIA to be certified (at his expense, which I appreciated), and we should get the results in a few weeks. I do like the diamond, so even if it comes back as a G instead of F or SI1 instead of VS2 I plan to go ahead with the purchase (with an appropriate discount).

Assuming GIA''s report is in line with EGL''s, do you think I need to get my own independent appraisal as well? I''m thinking 2 certifications (one being from GIA) is probably good enough, and I''m pretty confident that the price is reasonable.

sounds great.you got nothing to lose.

 

[rocksforjocks]

The jeweler just called me and told me they don''t actually "own" the diamond, and that the wholesaler wouldn''t let the jeweler part with the diamond for the 3 weeks necessary for GIA to perform their certification.

I then asked if I could buy the diamond, take it to an independent appraiser myself, and return it if it didn''t come back as-advertised. The jeweler said if I purchased the diamond and returned it to the jeweler, the jeweler would own it (i.e., he couldn''t return it to the wholesaler). So basically, he told me I would have to buy it as-is! I guess I know what the jeweler really thinks about the diamond.

 

[jet2ks]

Sorry to hear that things didn''t work out for you.

If you really liked the appearance of the diamond, you might try www.goodoldgold.com They carry 81 facet rounds (Eighternity) and 91 facet rounds (Solasfera) and might be able to help you find something you would like.

 

[zensunnah]

I saw this post b/c I ran the EGl cert online. Are you in NC?

 

[LamborghiniGirl]

Any update on what you will decide to do?

 

[denverappraiser]

So the guy who owns it is unwilling to allow a GIA inspection EVEN AT SOMEONE ELSE’S EXPENSE and even if there’s a sale hanging on the results! Run away from this stone, you've got your answer... It's not correctly graded and whoever owns it knows this. I agree with you that this whole deal is evidence that the jeweler is treating you right and that they deserve your business. See what else they can find. I'm sure they have lots of sources.

Neil Beaty
GG(GIA) ICGA(AGS) NAJA
Professional Appraisals in Denver

 

[rocksforjocks]

The experience pretty much permanently soured me to all things EGL, and I don''t think I would even bother looking at another one of their diamonds. Unfortunately, all of the jeweler''s GIA/AGS diamonds are all much more expensive than online sites, so I''m probably going to go the online route (I started another thread on a diamond I found at James Allen).

 

[LamborghiniGirl]

Just out of curiosity, if you don''t mind sharing, what jewelry store had the EGL stone you *were* considering?

 

[zensunnah]

I saw this stone at Van Scoy in Greensboro, NC. The women told me it is not Israeli so I checked online and it is the same stone. I should post this on ripoffreport.com. She actually wanted $7900 from me for the diamond. Suffice it to say, she gets zero.