katrina transcripts

[partgypsy]

Has anyone read the transcripts that were released recently about preparations for Hurricane Katrina. I distinctly remember Bush saying they did not anticipate the levees breaching, and these transcripts show not only did he know he was also informed about grave concerns about 1) the size/impact of the hurricane 2) the number of people still in New Orleans (in hospitals and prisons), 3) whether the astrodome was adequate, 4) and whether mortuary services were up for the job!

I get the feeling reading these the president he either had misplaced confidence in the readiness of the federal system to help (though doesn''t seem much was really one in preparation before hand), or (to tell you the truth)
he just didn''t care. Does anyone else find this a little upsetting?

 

[movie zombie]

sorry, but the man is a ''recovered'' drug addict and alcoholic....and has all the behaviors of one. why would i believe anything he says at this point in time given all the lies he''s been caught in? i didn''t believe him when he made the comments re katrina and now the evidence is in....again.


movie zombie

 

[MINE!!]

Where are the transcripts ? I would love to read them.

What I think is interesting is that people forget that after the hurricane had passed the levees were STILL intact. No one thought that they were going to break.

 

[partgypsy]

The article I was referencing was from the associated press

March 1, 2006
Video Shows Bush Was Warned Before Katrina
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
WASHINGTON (AP)—In dramatic and sometimes agonizing terms, federal disaster officials warned President Bush and his homeland security chief before Hurricane Katrina struck that the storm could breach levees, put lives at risk in New Orleans' Superdome and overwhelm rescuers, according to confidential video footage.

 

[strmrdr]

The truth of the matter is that in any emergency the first 3 days are the state''s job.
The state sat on its butt and did nothing then cried because the feds didn’t do things fast enough.
Welfare state at its finest.
Just like the people that sat around and cried for the cameras instead of doing anything to help.

I have a few friends that were in the area one of whom didn’t have a working car and they all got out before the storm and btw they haven’t seen a penny of aid money either.
Another friend of mine headed down to help only to get turned back by the state police and threatened with arrest.

The federal response was on time according to what the policy was.
The state made such a cluster out of it that they couldn’t do anything when they got there.
The governor sat on the paperwork allowing the feds to take control for over 48+ hours making it worse.
Dont here the liberal press complaining about there own do ya?
Naw its Bush''s fault.

 

[MINE!!]

Well said Storm.

 

[partgypsy]

I agree with you storm in the respect I am also angry at the way the local government handled it (or didn''t handle it). However, this is the very kind of emergency that overwhelms state response and federal emergency response needs to step in.
My beef is Bush claims that no one thought that the levees may break, when we now know he was warned repeatedly about that very possibility!

 

[AGBF]

Date: 3/2/2006 1:50:30 PM
Author: strmrdr
The truth of the matter is that in any emergency the first 3 days are the state''s job.

Does that mean if there is a nuclear explosion, terrorist attack on a port, or a tsunami of the size of the one that hits the Indian Ocean the President sits still? When he has had prior warning?

You should know, Storm, that when a disaster hits, communications in the area break down and the rescuers provided by the locality are often the first killed.

Should we blame Bush? No. Let''s blame the victims again. They were "stupid" not to reserve places on the jets flying the wealthier people out of town to stay in luxury hotels out of harms way where they had found themselves rooms.

Deborah

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 3/3/2006 6:02:54 AM
Author: AGBF

Date: 3/2/2006 1:50:30 PM

Author: strmrdr

The truth of the matter is that in any emergency the first 3 days are the state''s job.

Does that mean if there is a nuclear explosion, terrorist attack on a port, or a tsunami of the size of the one that hits the Indian Ocean the President sits still? When he has had prior warning?


You should know, Storm, that when a disaster hits, communications in the area break down and the rescuers provided by the locality are often the first killed.


Should we blame Bush? No. Let''s blame the victims again. They were ''stupid'' not to reserve places on the jets flying the wealthier people out of town to stay in luxury hotels out of harms way where they had found themselves rooms.


Deborah

Yes the first 3 days are the states resposibility in all those events and the feds cant act without the paperwork from the govenor.

The rest of the state was fine and there were a lot of people ready to help but the state said stay home and forced them to stay home.
These were professional rescue people also.

Im not blaming the real victoms for anything other than following and electing stupid leaders.
The leaders arent victoms they were a large part of the problem.
Expesialy considering the millions of dollars in funds that disappeared over the years that were spose to go to repairs.

A liberal cesspool got flooded and the liberals made it worse.
End of story.

 

[colormyworld]

Storm we certainly are luckey to have a person such as yourself who can tell us of lesser understanding how RIGHT world works.
I''ll bet a dollar to a dount one time you were wrong, but then you found out you were mistaken.

 

[E B]

Date: 3/3/2006 5:06:51 PM
Author: strmrdr

A liberal cesspool got flooded and the liberals made it worse.
End of story.

Please expound.

 

[Mr Majestyk]

Sometimes it is not possible to be prepared for a disaster. That is why it''s called a disaster. How do you prepare for a tsunami, or an earthquake? Or a major hurricane? There will be damage and loss of life.

Frankly, New Orleans was a tragedy waiting to happen. A city below sea level, with a river to the south and a lake to the north, depending on a pumping system to remove rainwater...

Bad idea, and it wasn''t Bush''s...

 

[Momoftwo]

Okay, now read the AP corrected version of what was told to the President.

http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/news/14015353.htm?source=rss&channel=thestate_news

Now, as for preparedness, it is the State's responsibility to prepare the state, the people, and the evacuation itself. FEMA and the Federal Government's responsibility is to come in after the fact, once they can to clean up, provide relief, etc. The mayor didn't do his job and let buses sit and flood rather than moving people out. It is totally unfair to place the blame for everyone's failure, including the citizens who refused to leave, on one person's shoulders. Personal responsiblity is something a lot of these "victims" need to learn.

 

[AGBF]

Date: 3/4/2006 1:27:46 PM
Author: Momoftwo
Personal responsiblity is something a lot of these ''victims'' need to learn.

You''re right. Never be poor and black.

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 3/4/2006 2:20:03 PM
Author: AGBF

Date: 3/4/2006 1:27:46 PM

Author: Momoftwo

Personal responsiblity is something a lot of these ''victims'' need to learn.

You''re right. Never be poor and black.

they need to learn to never elect stupid leaders and dont listen to them when you do.
color had nothing to do with it there were plenty of people of all colors who were too stupid to get out.

 

[Mr Majestyk]

Chances are that poor people, black or white, wouldn''t spend money on flood insurance, even if it were available. I''m not sure it was available in all areas. Then there''s the insurance companies who claim that it wasn''t hurricane (wind) damage, but flood damage, or would pay only for part of a destroyed home instead of the whole home. I don''t think these judgments were applied to only blacks and poor people. Poor people are less able to bail themselves out. But that isn''t the Federal government''s fault.

 

[AGBF]

Date: 3/4/2006 4:13:02 PM
Author: Mr Majestyk
Chances are that poor people, black or white, wouldn''t spend money on flood insurance, even if it were available. I''m not sure it was available in all areas.

You thought I was talking about flood insurance??? I was not talking about property, mister. I was talking about loss of life. The rich people flew out in the days preceding the hurricane. We all saw them on TV. Remember those long, long lines of cars (of the rich) backed up on highways on those days, too? It''s nice to own a car!

The people who had no cars and no airfare got to stay and die.

To anyone who blames the victims, I will quote Bob Dylan in, "Masters of War": Even Jesus could never forgive what you do.

 

[fire&ice]

Date: 3/4/2006 4:41:30 PM
Author: AGBF






The people who had no cars and no airfare got to stay and die.

Now, how is this the fault of George Bush & not the fault of Nagin and Blanco? It isn''t FEMA who evacuates - it''s the city, counties & state that have that responsibility - and a FAILED one at that. Having seen evacuations at VA Beach & NC beaches - it''s quite organized. All roads lead out. Transporation is provided for those who wish to leave. Still, you will always have the people who will stay. I witnessed via what limited access I had to TV no organized plan w/ any urgency BEFORE the hurricane.

At the end of the day, New Orleans has dodged SO MANY bullets. I think you get the caviler attitude about the whole thing. In fact, I have a friend whose husband decided to stay in one of the coastal towns in Miss. This is an Graduate level white person making a good salary w/ transportation available. There house was serverly damaged and one of few standing.

The ironic thing about FEMA is that they are the organization that prevents development along flood plains, wet lands, etc.

 

[Mr Majestyk]

Well, then AGBF, what precisely should have been done, and who should have done it?

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 3/4/2006 4:41:30 PM
Author: AGBF

Date: 3/4/2006 4:13:02 PM

Author: Mr Majestyk

Chances are that poor people, black or white, wouldn''t spend money on flood insurance, even if it were available. I''m not sure it was available in all areas.

You thought I was talking about flood insurance??? I was not talking about property, mister. I was talking about loss of life. The rich people flew out in the days preceding the hurricane. We all saw them on TV. Remember those long, long lines of cars (of the rich) backed up on highways on those days, too? It''s nice to own a car!


The people who had no cars and no airfare got to stay and die.


To anyone who blames the victims, I will quote Bob Dylan in, ''Masters of War'': Even Jesus could never forgive what you do.

Remember the yellow submarines that no one even bothered trying to use?
Is that Bush''s fault too?

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 3/3/2006 6:12:31 PM
Author: colormyworld
Storm we certainly are luckey to have a person such as yourself who can tell us of lesser understanding how RIGHT world works.

I''ll bet a dollar to a dount one time you were wrong, but then you found out you were mistaken.

If you think Im right wing then you are sadly mistaken.
Im a constitutionalists who believes in people helping people and the gov just makes it worse and keeps the con men in business because they buy off the .gov.

But you are right about the last part :}

 

[Gemklctr]

Date: 3/4/2006 1:27:46 PM
Author: Momoftwo
Okay, now read the AP corrected version of what was told to the President.

http://www.thestate.com/mld/thestate/news/14015353.htm?source=rss&channel=thestate_news

Now, as for preparedness, it is the State''s responsibility to prepare the state, the people, and the evacuation itself. FEMA and the Federal Government''s responsibility is to come in after the fact, once they can to clean up, provide relief, etc. The mayor didn''t do his job and let buses sit and flood rather than moving people out. It is totally unfair to place the blame for everyone''s failure, including the citizens who refused to leave, on one person''s shoulders. Personal responsiblity is something a lot of these ''victims'' need to learn.

I don''t usually get involved in these types of debates, but this one is so clear cut that I''ll take the risk. Not only are you and Storm right, but in fact (1) the networks were reporting the risk of "overtopping" in the days before Katrina, so they knew the difference between that and a breach but apparently intentionally misreported the substance of the transcripts, and (2) another video shows the La. governor stating the levees are fine 3 hours after they were breached. The real scandal here is the way the press twisted the reports and then failed to give the same play to their "corrections" that they gave to the initial headlines. Whatever your political persuasion, everyone should be concerned that the major press organizations have their own political agenda and allow it to infect their reporting, thereby failing to properly serve their role of contributing to an informed, as opposed to misinformed, citizenry.

 

[moon river]

Has anyone else heard this....? It is alleged that the levees DIDN''T break, but that they were broken down in the poorer areas so the better off neighborhoods wouldn''t suffer as much damage. I can''t remember where I heard it but I believe it may have been on BET on a discussion panal.

 

[strmrdr]

Date: 3/5/2006 5:42:05 PM
Author: moon river
Has anyone else heard this....? It is alleged that the levees DIDN'T break, but that they were broken down in the poorer areas so the better off neighborhoods wouldn't suffer as much damage. I can't remember where I heard it but I believe it may have been on BET on a discussion panal.

yea and sposedly high explosive traces were found from a 2 thousand pound bomb and elvis is alive and well living in NYC and the aliens are running the goverment and Busch shot JFK!!

Some idiot who wanted some publicity was spouting that garbage when the truth is they were undercut.
The material under them was washed out then they calapsed down and were pushed aside once they split.
Mother nature won against mans attempt to hold it back.
moving water is one of the strongest forces on earth it cut the grand canyon.
It exerts force like a solid because its not compressable at the same time finding every small hole and going thu it.
Then it acts as a grinding compound opening the hole up larger and larger.

Remember high pressure water can cut the hardest steel.

 

[strmrdr]

sorry for being so harsh to you moon river.
All the untruths and rumors and the whining along with the misuse of funds has me a little annoyed with the whole situation.

 

[partgypsy]

I stand corrected. The expert said that there was grave risk the levees would be overrun, not breached. However I fail to see how anyone could not anticipate the possibility that an overrun levee could turn into a weakened and breached levee.

My 2 cents. The hurricane is obviously not Bush''s fault, only he can take responsibility for his actions and attitude in response to the disaster. There was considerable evidence that this was going to be a big one affecting a large US city but he did not delay his vacation or even make it a priority after his vacation was over to find out exactly what was going on down there.
His strange lack of curiorisity and attention to the matter to me is what is disturbing, especially considering the number of Americans that were affected.

There will always be some that say Bush can do no wrong, but if this is not a sign of poverty of leadership I don''t know what is.

 

[fire&ice]

Date: 3/6/2006 12:18:04 PM
Author: part gypsy
My 2 cents. The hurricane is obviously not Bush''s fault, only he can take responsibility for his actions and attitude in response to the disaster. There was considerable evidence that this was going to be a big one affecting a large US city but he did not delay his vacation or even make it a priority after his vacation was over to find out exactly what was going on down there.
His strange lack of curiorisity and attention to the matter to me is what is disturbing, especially considering the number of Americans that were affected.

I concur - however the responsibility does still fall squarely on the local elected officials.

 

[moon river]

Date: 3/6/2006 1:16:22 AM
Author: strmrdr
sorry for being so harsh to you moon river.
All the untruths and rumors and the whining along with the misuse of funds has me a little annoyed with the whole situation.

No problem strmrdr. It was just something I heard. Just curious if anyone else heard it too.

I still think you''re the bomb diggity!!

 

[chickflick]

I grew up in New Orleans and we knew back then, twenty years ago, that the city was a disaster waiting to happen. We were all told it would just take a strong storm for the levees to fail and the city to flood. Private citizens knew it and the Army Corps of Engineers definitely knew it. This should have been anticipated the moment a Cat 5 looked like it was bearing down on the city. All governments failed, city, stated and local, with no excuses. This was predicted, anticipated, and ignored. The whole situation is very disturbing, especially since I now live just to the west in Houston and we know again that the city will flood in a major storm, just as we thought was going to happen when Hurricane Rita hit last September. We cannot count on our governments to help us.