Just wanted to get the forums opinion on a stone

[Acadiamonds]

2.2 Ct Oval EGL USA report
SI1
I color

Measurements: 9.67 x 7.62 x 4.82 mm

Depth: 63.3%

Table: 60%

Crown: 14.7%

Pavilion: 46.1%

Girdle: Thin to very thick faceted

Culet: Very Small

Polish: Excellent

Symmetry: Very Good

Fluorescence: Faint


Asking price $8,500

 

[Lorelei]

Do you have any images or photos of the diamond? Or have you seen it in person?

 

[Acadiamonds]

For some reason it wont let me upload pictures...

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 4/30/2009 11:06:01 AM
Author: Acadiamonds
For some reason it wont let me upload pictures...

Name it something unique with no unusual characters and make sure the image is sized correctly. If this doesn''t work then email admin who will post it for you.

 

[Acadiamonds]

Heres a try

 

[Acadiamonds]

one more

 

[Acadiamonds]

last one

 

[Lorelei]

Date: 4/30/2009 11:15:50 AM
Author: Acadiamonds
last one

Yay you did it!

Actually I think it is a very pretty oval. I would check carefully to see if it has much in the way of a bow tie, many elongated shape diamonds will show this to a certain extent however it can be minimized. The diamond looks to be showing a touch of warmth in the pics. What I would suggest if you like this one, get an independant appraisal and make the sale final on the diamond checking out to your satisfaction in all aspects ( get this in writing).

Appraiser tool - https://www.pricescope.com/appr_list.aspx

This page explains about bow ties. http://www.goodoldgold.com/ShapeTutorials/ShapeTips1/

 

[Acadiamonds]

Great. Thanks a lot for the reply and all your help.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Ditto to Lorelei!
It looks like a very nice looking stone.

The only caution I''d advise is making sure you understand that a grade issued by EGL is completely different from one with a GIA report.
The type of stone you''re looking at- I color- should already be on the lower priced side- so if you understand what you''re not getting here ( a lab report trusted by dealers)- and you''re comfortable with the seller, it might be just fine.

 

[Acadiamonds]

I know GIA is the most trusted, but I''ve always been under the impression that EGL second next to GIA and still reliable.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Date: 4/30/2009 8:23:25 PM
Author: Acadiamonds
I know GIA is the most trusted, but I''ve always been under the impression that EGL second next to GIA and still reliable.

T\I only say this for your protection, but that is not an accurate impression.
Since the price of a diamond is based on the specific grade, dealers won''t trust anything but a GIA or an AGSl report- period.
It''s not as if dealers have a specific rule- discount EGL reports by one grade, for example- it''s simply too long a slippery slope.
Either it''s GIA /AGSL, or dealers don''t trust the grade.
It''s safe to assume that if you''re buying this form a store or website, they understand this. I feel that it''s incumbent upon a professional seller to disclose this to buyers.

 

[jstarfireb]

Looks like a pretty stone! I don''t know much about ovals, so I can''t comment on the proportions.

EGL is known to be soft on color and clarity, so I would get an independent appraisal to make sure it''s the equivalent of a GIA I/SI1. That way you know you got what you paid for. You have the advantage of an EGL-USA cert rather than Israel or Europe - USA is thought to be the most reliable of all their labs.

 

[Rockdiamond]

An appraisal might be reassuring but it will not solve the problem of owning a diamond without a GIA report.
Just ask any consumer who''s trying to sell a diamond. The very first question a potential buyer ( if he''s a dealer) will ask is "Where''s the GIA report?"
NO appraisal will serve that same purpose on a stone such as this. This means that even if the best apprasier feels the EGL grade is accurate, you will still be holding the short end of the stick.
I''m not suggesting people buy diamonds as an investment- but if they own them, and need to sell them, they''ll find out what I''m talking about. Of course it''s better to know this stuff before you buy......

 

[diagem]

Date: 4/30/2009 11:58:18 PM
Author: Rockdiamond

Date: 4/30/2009 8:23:25 PM
Author: Acadiamonds
I know GIA is the most trusted, but I''ve always been under the impression that EGL second next to GIA and still reliable.

TI only say this for your protection, but that is not an accurate impression.
Since the price of a diamond is based on the specific grade, dealers won''t trust anything but a GIA or an AGSl report- period.
It''s not as if dealers have a specific rule- discount EGL reports by one grade, for example- it''s simply too long a slippery slope.
Either it''s GIA /AGSL, or dealers don''t trust the grade.
It''s safe to assume that if you''re buying this form a store or website, they understand this. I feel that it''s incumbent upon a professional seller to disclose this to buyers.

Here you go again with your general statements..., dealers as ''where''? 47th. St., NY, USA, EU, Far East or perhaps Russia or.........

GIA already has a stain on their reputation with some key dealers..., no?

I rather believe Gem dealers trust their professional knowledge in the field opposed to trusting a gemologist (employed by any lab.) they never met or dont even know....

 

[Rockdiamond]

I was referring to anywhere in America , Antwerp Belgium, Ramat Gan Israel specifically.
I've done a lot of business in all those places.
Never Japan, China or Moscow.
If you have experience buying or selling polished goods there and can offer other evidence, I will stand corrected regarding the Far East and Russia.

But honestly, I am having trouble understanding your point.
Are you suggesting consumers rely on an EGL report ( ANY EGL) the same way they treat a GIA report?


BTW, I'm not suggesting people buy blindly based on a GIA report- but sellers pushing stones with EGL reports- this is common here in the US, and in the UK- are generally doing so to confuse consumers.
Do you disagree?


IN terms of Gem Dealers- my experience is that they will grade the stone themselves. If they disagree with GIA, they either won't buy it, or negotiate a lower price. But no matter how they feel about the grade, they're going to need that GIA grade to get the price from another dealer, or a smart consumer if it's a valuable stone.

 

[Acadiamonds]

So it could be a possible J color SI2 or even worse. I will have to think about it more now, maybe say I will offer that price if he can get a GIA appraisal that says the same as the EGL.

 

[Rockdiamond]

HI Acadiamonds- your question is a common one- and actually illustrates the confusion many buyers face.
For one thing, GIA does not issue appraisals.
A GIA report identifies a diamond- but does NOT offer a monetary value - EGL does offer such values. This is part of the confusion- and part of the reason EGL reports are deceptive.

IN the case of a 2 carat stone, such as the one you''re looking at, a few grades difference can mean thousands of dollars difference in the price.
Do you think the cutter who sold this stone would simply accept the lower price? Of course not, he''d send the diamond to GIA hoping to get the grade he''s thinking of. Let''s say the cutter thought the diamond was I/SI1.
If GIA gave it J/SI2,many times the diamond will be sent to an EGL who will, in all likelihood, give a softer grade.

The point is, thinking that you can somehow beat this system by having the seller send the stone to GIA is a common thought- but not one which is practical, or likely to get you where you''d like to go ( buying an accurately graded diamond at a good price)


If Diagem is reading this- I am truly interested in your thoughts on this.

 

[mayerice]

I agree with David, specially on a 2ct stone. If i ever sell or buy an EGL stone i will look at it first in order to see what it really is. You can usually downgrade 1 color and 1 clarity on an egl usa.

 

[Acadiamonds]

heres a better closeup

 

[Lorelei]

Its hard to say for sure and not really an accurate way to judge but the diamond has a distinct tint in the photo.

 

[Rockdiamond]

Ditto Lorelei- although it''s not possible to actually grade a diamond from a photo, we can sometimes get some idea of what we''re looking at.
This one seems darker than an I based on the photo- and it looks like there''s more imperfection that we should see in an SI1.

This is such a common occurrence- sellers using EGL reports to sell stones that are over-graded.
If it walks like a duck, smells like a duck, and quacks, in all likelihood it is a duck ( or a misgraded diamond)